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Why do people pay for g-sync?

ZenMonkey

Unlike Freesync, g-sync seems to come with a $200-250 premium. However, adaptive sync technology is only useful if the FPS put out by our graphics card is lower than the refresh rate of the monitor, so it's basically we don't think our video cards are good enough to utilize the full refresh rate. Why then, do we still pay an extra $200+ to buy said monitor? Why not instead buy a monitor with a lower refresh rate or lower our graphics settings in the game to boost our FPS?

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Why not play at 800x600 and 2000 fps? People like playing at higher framerates and higher settings. So the only way to do that is to make a lower framerate seem faster, or add more GPU power to get higher framerates. However, there is a finite amount of power that can be added (two 1080Tis) and every time you upgrade you lose those benefits whereas GSYNC's benefits will persist through multiple upgrades. 

 

A solid 144fps on a 144hz monitor > 70-100fps on a 144hz GSYNC >> 60fps on a 60hz monitor. 

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3 minutes ago, ZenMonkey said:

 

Because they made the mistake of buying nvidia and are now stuck paying a premium for adaptive sync :^)

I edit my posts a lot, Twitter is @LordStreetguru just don't ask PC questions there mostly...
 

Spoiler

 

What is your budget/country for your new PC?

 

what monitor resolution/refresh rate?

 

What games or other software do you need to run?

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Streetguru said:

Because they made the mistake of buying nvidia and are now stuck paying a premium for adaptive sync :^)

Meanwhile those in the AMD camp are still waiting for a Pascal competitor ;)

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Just now, djdwosk97 said:

Meanwhile those in the AMD camp are still waiting for a Pascal competitor ;)

Thanks a lot, I was thinking of a witty way to say that but you had to ruin it.

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4 minutes ago, Streetguru said:

Because they made the mistake of buying nvidia and are now stuck paying a premium for adaptive sync :^)

That is the point though, to lock you in to their brand.  Goes both ways, but yeah.

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Just now, Ryan_Vickers said:

That is the point though, to lock you in to their brand.  Goes both ways, but yeah.

yeah but i sense a "physics by aegia" situation. not widely used = not widely supported

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Just now, Ryan_Vickers said:

That is the point though, to lock you in to their brand.  Goes both ways, but yeah.

It doesn't have to at all though, Nvidia already uses free-sync in their laptops, if they supported the open standard for once everyone would have better/cheaper gaming displays. If people just boycotted G-sync at least that might change their minds. Probably not though.

Wasn't intel even going to support it?
 

 

2 minutes ago, djdwosk97 said:

Meanwhile those in the AMD camp are still waiting for a Pascal competitor ;)

But I already flashed my Vega 56 to 64 and got it near the 1080 in performance.

I edit my posts a lot, Twitter is @LordStreetguru just don't ask PC questions there mostly...
 

Spoiler

 

What is your budget/country for your new PC?

 

what monitor resolution/refresh rate?

 

What games or other software do you need to run?

 

 

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I recently got a G-sync monitor, and now wonder why I waited so long. Before that, I have fixed 60 Hz and 120 Hz monitors. Even the 120 Hz monitor wasn't great, as there was no way I can cap consistently at it, and I don't want to run vsync off due to tearing. Now I get variable refresh typically in the range of 90 - 150, it feels really smooth and responsive. I use a single 1080Ti and set high quality. Lesser cards simply wouldn't cope without sacrificing more quality.

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Have you actually used GSync? It makes a massive difference to the smoothness of a game. You could go for higher FPS than your monitor's refresh rate, but then you either get tearing or you get the lag that comes with VSync. It's worth the money IMO. 

 

FreeSync is ultimately the better option because it doesn't come with the price premium, but a lot of people already have Nvidia GPUs. 

 

Just wish Nvidia would take up the AdaptiveSync part of the VESA standard, but they're stubborn. 

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Once you go g-sync you can never go back

ƆԀ S₱▓Ɇ▓cs: i7 6ʇɥפᴉƎ00K (4.4ghz), Asus DeLuxe X99A II, GT҉X҉1҉0҉8҉0 Zotac Amp ExTrꍟꎭe),Si6F4Gb D???????r PlatinUm, EVGA G2 Sǝʌǝᘉ5ᙣᙍᖇᓎᙎᗅᖶt, Phanteks Enthoo Primo, 3TB WD Black, 500gb 850 Evo, H100iGeeTeeX, Windows 10, K70 R̸̢̡̭͍͕̱̭̟̩̀̀̃́̃͒̈́̈́͑̑́̆͘͜ͅG̶̦̬͊́B̸͈̝̖͗̈́, G502, HyperX Cloud 2s, Asus MX34. פN∩SW∀S 960 EVO

Just keeping this here as a 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2 minutes ago, porina said:
1 minute ago, Oshino Shinobu said:

 

 

If you have a higher end Nvidia GPU and don't care about power/heat/noise, you can just enable fast sync to get better smoothness on any display

I edit my posts a lot, Twitter is @LordStreetguru just don't ask PC questions there mostly...
 

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Because it's nice? It's clear that you've never used it before OP.

'Fanboyism is stupid' - someone on this forum.

Be nice to each other boys and girls. And don't cheap out on a power supply.

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10 minutes ago, Streetguru said:

It doesn't have to at all though, Nvidia already uses free-sync in their laptops, if they supported the open standard for once everyone would have better/cheaper gaming displays. If people just boycotted G-sync at least that might change their minds. Probably not though

Yeah I've heard nvidia could enable freesync support in existing cards with nothing more than a driver update, which brings me back to what I said:

13 minutes ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

That is the point though, to lock you in to their brand.  Goes both ways, but yeah.

 

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12 minutes ago, Streetguru said:

If you have a higher end Nvidia GPU and don't care about power/heat/noise, you can just enable fast sync to get better smoothness on any display

I understood fast sync was only working if you run frame rates above refresh. As said, I can't guarantee that. Basically, it is still worse than G-sync for latency and has limited usability.

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I'm not anybody's pawn. I'll just put all of the settings except render scale as low as possible.

Checkmate.

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23 minutes ago, djdwosk97 said:

Why not play at 800x600 and 2000 fps? People like playing at higher framerates and higher settings. So the only way to do that is to make a lower framerate seem faster, or add more GPU power to get higher framerates. However, there is a finite amount of power that can be added (two 1080Tis) and every time you upgrade you lose those benefits whereas GSYNC's benefits will persist through multiple upgrades. 

 

A solid 144fps on a 144hz monitor > 70-100fps on a 144hz GSYNC >> 60fps on a 60hz monitor. 

 

There are options other than 60Hz or 144Hz.

 

I'm not saying adaptive sync is a bad thing, but paying a $200-250 premium feels to me like paying more while expecting it to do less. If I never expect to get 144 FPS, then why pay more for the 144Hz monitor and then even more for hardware that lowers the refresh rate to match my card? It's like paying more to buy a sports car you never expect to take over 65mph.

 

 

It makes more sense to me to buy a lower refresh rate monitor or play on lower settings than to pay the premium for g-sync.

 

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7 minutes ago, ZenMonkey said:

 

Or just buy AMD...

 

 

10 minutes ago, porina said:

I understood fast sync was only working if you run frame rates above refresh. As said, I can't guarantee that. Basically, it is still worse than G-sync for latency and has limited usability.

Yup, has to be above the monitor's refresh rate only really an issue for 144hz displays.

I edit my posts a lot, Twitter is @LordStreetguru just don't ask PC questions there mostly...
 

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what monitor resolution/refresh rate?

 

What games or other software do you need to run?

 

 

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Quote

If I never expect to get 144 FPS, then why pay more for the 144Hz monitor and then even more for hardware that lowers the refresh rate to match my card? It's like paying more to buy a sports car you never expect to take over 65mph.

Firstly, your options are 60hz, 75hz, 144hz+. I own a 144hz monitor (without GSYNC), and I notice a big difference around 90fps when compared to 60fps and diminishing returns after that. So if I want to play at 90fps, then my cheapest option is a 144hz monitor -- however you then need to deal with tearing and that's where GSYNC comes in. 

 

Also, as someone who has driven some very fast cars frequently, it's really not about the top speed but rather the acceleration. 

 

Quote

It makes more sense to me to buy a lower refresh rate monitor or play on lower settings than to pay the premium for g-sync.

No it does not. A 144hz GSYNC monitor at 90fps >>>> 60hz monitor at 60fps, and if settings didn't matter, then you can just forget the GPU and the new monitor altogether and game on integrated graphics on an 800x600 monitor. People obviously care about how their game looks and how their experience feels. 

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1 minute ago, djdwosk97 said:

Firstly, your options are 60hz, 75hz, 144hz+. [...]

A lot more than that really.   60, 75, I think I've seen some in the 80s, 100, 120, 144, 150, 165, 180, and 240 (assuming if I haven't forgotten any or misremembered something existing that doesn't) plus any of those can probably be overclocked a bit to cover a slight range above them

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3 minutes ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

A lot more than that really.   60, 75, I think I've seen some in the 80s, 100, 120, 144, 150, 165, 180, and 240 (assuming if I haven't forgotten any or misremembered something existing that doesn't) plus any of those can probably be overclocked a bit to cover a slight range above them

80-100hz and 165hz+ monitors are all really expensive, 120hz monitors are basically legacy 144hz monitors (for the most part), and I my point is that you can't buy a 90hz monitor, you either have to go low @ 75hz or high @ 144hz. 

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Just now, djdwosk97 said:

80-100hz monitors are all really expensive,

Really?  Why, what's with them? :P

Just now, djdwosk97 said:

120hz monitors are basically legacy 144hz monitors (for the most part),

Tbh I'd rather have 120 so that viewing 60 fps content (which there is a lot of - skyrim for example) doesn't stutter due to the mismatch of fps and monitor refresh rate.

Just now, djdwosk97 said:

and I did say 144hz+.

fair enough :P

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10 minutes ago, ZenMonkey said:

 

I'm not saying adaptive sync is a bad thing, but paying a $200-250 premium feels to me like paying more while expecting it to do less. If I never expect to get 144 FPS, then why pay more for the 144Hz monitor and then even more for hardware that lowers the refresh rate to match my card? It's like paying more to buy a sports car you never expect to take over 65mph.

 

When I had a 60 Hz fixed monitor, I could most of the time brute force output to 60 Hz, turn on V-sync and enjoy consistent tear-free images. Then games started getting more demanding and I found I had to cut down on display quality to keep the 60fps minimum. Things started going downhill.

 

The fixed 120 Hz monitor I had I never really used. I had no way to cap consistently at 120 Hz without making the image quality garbage, and again I hated V-sync off tearing. 

 

The 144 Hz G-sync was a "wow" moment. No tearing. High refresh, and I didn't have to care about maxing at 144 Hz. It might be the top rating, but you don't have to do it all the time. I can now have high quality settings (not necessarily ultra) and maintain a high variable fps.

 

Could I do the same with AMD? Not yet. Not until they have something competitive against the 1080Ti. The savings from going freesync is only a factor for the budget limited, and the still elevated pricing for Vega negates that to a degree.

2 minutes ago, Streetguru said:

Yup, has to be above the monitor's refresh rate only really an issue for 144hz displays.

Now, I wouldn't want to be a filthy 60 Hz peasant. :D

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4 minutes ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

Really?  Why, what's with them? :P

I think they're all professional 14 bit panels. At least that's what PCPP picks up. 

Quote

Tbh I'd rather have 120 so that viewing 60 fps content (which there is a lot of - skyrim for example) doesn't stutter due to the mismatch of fps and monitor refresh rate.

You can run 144hz monitors at 60hz/75hz/120hz/144hz (I think those are the options in display settings). Is the monitor actually able to run at those refresh rates naturally, or is Windows just capping the framerate being output by the GPU? 

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Just now, djdwosk97 said:

I think they're all 14 bit panels. At least that's what PCPP picks up. 

Must be 10 bit... surely?

Just now, djdwosk97 said:

You can run 144hz monitors at 60hz/75hz/120hz/144hz (I think those are the options in display settings). Is the monitor actually able to run at those refresh rates naturally, or is Windows just capping the framerate being output by the GPU? 

Yeah, that's true, and even if they don't offer the setting natively you should be able to set it with the same tool people use for display overclocking, but it would be a pain to switch back and forth imo.

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