General Intel HEDT Xeon/i7 Discussion

[MaratM]

Just sold p6t with x5680 and old thermaltake 850w psu for $160, not the best deal but was a cash in hand sale

[TopHatProductions115]

I want to get a pair of X5690's and a new GPU for the T7500. But the OEM PSU might not be able to handle a beefy card for all I know. Currently using a GTX 1060 6GB. Any suggestions?

[Crunchy Dragon]

15 minutes ago, TopHatProductions115 said:

I want to get a pair of X5690's and a new GPU for the T7500. But the OEM PSU might not be able to handle a beefy card for all I know. Currently using a GTX 1060 6GB. Any suggestions?

I'd aim for somewhere in the area of 700-750W.

[Slayer3032]

3 hours ago, TopHatProductions115 said:

I want to get a pair of X5690's and a new GPU for the T7500. But the OEM PSU might not be able to handle a beefy card for all I know. Currently using a GTX 1060 6GB. Any suggestions?

Ebay seems to suggest it has a 1100w PSU, if it doesn't handle two 150w CPUs and a 200w GPU I'd be impressed they can get away with ripping off customers. I'd go for a 750-850w 80+ Gold depending on whatever is on sale, any higher end modular PSU should have at least two 8 pin EPS connectors. I definitely wouldn't call a 1060 beefy, Fermis and Vegas would easily use twice as much power.

 

I'd also make sure that it doesn't use any proprietary connectors or wiring though before you buy.

[Pasi123]

3 hours ago, TopHatProductions115 said:

I want to get a pair of X5690's and a new GPU for the T7500. But the OEM PSU might not be able to handle a beefy card for all I know. Currently using a GTX 1060 6GB. Any suggestions?

It seems to have a 1100W PSU so it's more than enough.

 

 

http://i.dell.com/sites/content/business/solutions/engineering-docs/en/Documents/Precision-T7500-T5500-Technical-Guide.pdf

[TopHatProductions115]

@Crunchy Dragon @Slayer3032 @Pasi123 Not to cause confusion, but this is what I was referring to:

• https://www.dell.com/community/Precision-Fixed-Workstations/Dell-Precision-T7500-PCI-slots-properties/td-p/7188369
• https://www.dell.com/support/article/us/en/04/sln291193/precision-t7500-desktop-workstation-specifications?lang=en#Video

Are they saying per-card, or for all cards? Also, the GPUs that they listed are all workstation cards from 2011-2014. The expected power draw for those cards sat at around 250W for something like a Quadro 6000 (Fermi) or AMD FirePro V7900. Though the PSU is stated to be 1100W, so you are correct on that part:

• https://www.dell.com/support/article/us/en/04/sln291193/precision-t7500-desktop-workstation-specifications?lang=en#Power

 

[andreweddy]

On 6/5/2019 at 5:05 PM, Zando Bob said:

Looks decent for sure, the PSU and mobo are the main things driving the price. Air 540 isn't that expensive new, the i7 is basically useless other than tinkering, and DDR3 is cheap. 

i run x58 asus p6t pro ws with an x5670, runs fine and oc's 4 ghz + no issues

[Zando_]

15 hours ago, andreweddy said:

i run x58 asus p6t pro ws with an x5670, runs fine and oc's 4 ghz + no issues

X5670 is an excellent CPU. They're about half what X5675s usually are (normally $30, X5690s are $60, I got my '70 for only $14), and OC pretty well, they're only a slightly worse bin. At 1.45v mine does 4.54Ghz solid, 4.74Ghz will pass CB15 but not CB20. Need to boot up my bench and fiddle around again tbh. 

[Slayer3032]

On 6/14/2019 at 7:23 AM, Zando Bob said:

X5670 is an excellent CPU. They're about half what X5675s usually are (normally $30, X5690s are $60, I got my '70 for only $14), and OC pretty well, they're only a slightly worse bin. At 1.45v mine does 4.54Ghz solid, 4.74Ghz will pass CB15 but not CB20. Need to boot up my bench and fiddle around again tbh. 

X5670's are definitely a really good buy right now. My buddy who bought the EVGA board asked me what cpu to get for his HTPC build with it. They were $12.99 last night and had a $3 off $3.01 or more coupon but when he logged into a new ebay account it gave him a $5 off code so he got one for $7.99 lol. His board also came a C0 stepping i7 920 which is perfect for updating X58 boards, still need to do the QPI mod though.

 

I'm really curious to see how it compares up against his 6600k using his GTX 970 in both but I think he's going to need a much better cooler than the Arctic Freezer 7 that came with it.

[Pasi123]

40 minutes ago, Slayer3032 said:

I'm really curious to see how it compares up against his 6600k using his GTX 970 in both but I think he's going to need a much better cooler than the Arctic Freezer 7 that came with it.

I'm not sure but I'd guess that cooler is good enough to cool the X5670 at least at 4.0GHz 1.3v just fine.

[Xa3phod]

It won't come anywhere near a 6600K in gaming. The IPC is way lower on those Xeons. I did extensive benchmarking a little while ago. Let me try to paste a comparison between a 6700K and a X5690. It was a pretty good bunch of benchmarks. I did a lot of testing with a lot of CPU/GPU combos and overclocking. The Xeons are barely half as fast as the Skylake CPUs in single core operations.

 

Benchmarks Spreadsheet.ods

[r2724r16]

11 minutes ago, Xa3phod said:

The Xeons are barely half as fast as the Skylake CPUs in single core operations.

My Xeon X5675 and Core i7 6700 get the same Cinebench R20 multi-threaded score. Don't remember single-threaded scores though.

[Xa3phod]

8 minutes ago, r2724r16 said:

My Xeon X5675 and Core i7 6700 get the same Cinebench R20 multi-threaded score. Don't remember single-threaded scores though.

Can't compare multi-threaded. My X5690 is 6 core 12 thread while my 6700K is 4 core 8 thread.

[MaratM]

Even with 6 cores and 12 threads these old xeons lack ipc compare to modern cpu’s. Even stock 6700 runs most games better than x56xx chips oc’d.

[Zando_]

1 minute ago, MaratM said:

Even with 6 cores and 12 threads these old xeons lack ipc compare to modern cpu’s. Even stock 6700 runs most games better than x56xx chips oc’d.

What clock do you think you'd need to push on an X56xx to make up for the IPC diff between it and a stock 6700? 

[r2724r16]

19 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

What clock do you think you'd need to push on an X56xx to make up for the IPC diff between it and a stock 6700? 

I happen to have an i7 6700. I might be able to do some testing when I find some time.

[MaratM]

49 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

What clock do you think you'd need to push on an X56xx to make up for the IPC diff between it and a stock 6700? 

I have 8700k now, it scores above 200cb points (r15) at 4.8 ghz (6700 and 8700k are more the less the same gen) so 6700 in single core score will score up to 170 cb points at its stock turbo 4.0 ghz

my 5680 scored 125 at 4.4 ghz in order to match single core performance of 6700 x56xx must be clocked at least at 6ghz however cpu performance is not linear function, on top of that we have generation improvements such as different instruction sets and cashe and memory speed and latency and so on.

the only way is to downclock modern cpu to x56xx performance and calculate back the theoretical speed of x56xx

On top of that multi thread utilization has increased over past few years and some applications (especially games) can utilize more threads and they become less clock dependent. 

Probably the easier way to compare is to use x56xx and 8700k just because it has same number of cores and threads. If i get some performance figures of x56xx with gtx1080ti I can downclock my 8700k to same level of performance as x56xx (if we assume that pci-e 2.0 and 3.0 make no difference)

something like assassins creed odisey, shadow of tomb raider at 1080p will be sufficient to get the overall picture

[khalid410]

I can get a gigabyte GA-x58a-UD3R for 50 USD locally. 

Would it be worth picking it up and pairing with an x5675 off AliExpress + an RX 580 or is the x58 platform just too far gone ? 

 

[bimmerman]

21 minutes ago, khalid410 said:

I can get a gigabyte GA-x58a-UD3R for 50 USD locally. 

Would it be worth picking it up and pairing with an x5675 off AliExpress + an RX 580 or is the x58 platform just too far gone ? 

 

Better question, what are you looking to do with the system once finished?

 

High refresh rate gaming? No. Maybe 1080p potato.

High resolution 60fps gaming? Not with RX 580, maybe on Low/Medium settings.

1440p 60+fps? Maybe.

1080p high/ultra 60 fps? Probably.

 

For reference, I have that motherboard, an X5675 OC'd to 4.5 GHz, a 1080ti, an NVMe 950 Pro, and I struggle to get 60fps on medium high - high settings at 3440x1440 in recent (non competitive shooter) titles. My solution? I turned down the details in games I needed to, turned on vsync, turned off the FPS counter, and have fun. 

 

If you're interested and if I can find time, I can re-run benchmarks for 1920x1200 as a stand-in for 1080p, but I think the results will be pretty obvious. Better than 60fps, but probably not enough for both high refresh and high details.

 

The platform is aged, there's no way around the IPC deficit and PCIe 2.0 (effectively 3.0 x8). However, if you keep your expectations in check on resolution/details/refresh rate, it can be a great budget platform. My build not included, but I've iterated on it for nearly 10 years....I long ago quit caring about 'budget'.

 

FWIW I'm saving for a Zen3 or ideally TR3 build to replace ol' faithful.

[khalid410]

7 minutes ago, bimmerman said:

Better question, what are you looking to do with the system once finished?

 

High refresh rate gaming? No.

High resolution 60fps gaming? Not with RX 580, maybe on Low/Medium settings.

1440p 60+fps? Maybe.

1080p high/ultra 60 fps? Probably.

 

For reference, I have that motherboard, an X5675 OC'd to 4.5 GHz, a 1080ti, an NVMe 950 Pro, and I struggle to get 60fps on medium high - high settings at 3440x1440 in recent (non competitive shooter) titles. My solution? I turned down the details in games I needed to, turned on vsync, turned off the FPS counter, and have fun.

 

The platform is aged, there's no way around the IPC deficit and PCIe 2.0. However, if you keep your expectations in check on resolution/details/refresh rate, it can be a great budget platform. My build not included, but I've had it for nearly 10 years, so I quit caring about 'budget'.

 

FWIW I'm saving for a Zen3 or ideally TR3 build to replace ol' faithful.

If I go with a GTX 1070 instead would I be able to do 144hz @ 1080p in esport titles?. I don't really care for high refresh rate on AAA titles so 60fps would do.

 

The other option would be to just save up for another 6 months or so for a zen 2 build.

[bimmerman]

6 minutes ago, khalid410 said:

If I go with a GTX 1070 instead would I be able to do 144hz @ 1080p in esport titles?. I don't really care for high refresh rate on AAA titles so 60fps would do.

 

The other option would be to just save up for another 6 months or so for a zen 2 build.

Ha, you beat my edit. I can run some benchmarks for 1920x1200 with the 1080ti to get your answer, but I don't think I have any esports games to benchmark. Send me some title suggestions and I'll see what I can do.

 

Honestly, I'd say save for Zen 2 unless you can get X58 up and running for cheap (mobo + cpu + ram + cooler). I would expect used values to tank pretty soon, so don't spend much money on anything you can't transfer to a new platform. Cheap is relative, but I'd be hard pressed to invest more than $150-200 all-in.

 

....aside from oo shiny cool stuff like the SR-2. I still want one even though I know it's pointlessly outdated. It's just neat.

[khalid410]

30 minutes ago, bimmerman said:

Ha, you beat my edit. I can run some benchmarks for 1920x1200 with the 1080ti to get your answer, but I don't think I have any esports games to benchmark. Send me some title suggestions and I'll see what I can do.

 

Honestly, I'd say save for Zen 2 unless you can get X58 up and running for cheap (mobo + cpu + ram + cooler). I would expect used values to tank pretty soon, so don't spend much money on anything you can't transfer to a new platform. Cheap is relative, but I'd be hard pressed to invest more than $150-200 all-in.

 

....aside from oo shiny cool stuff like the SR-2. I still want one even though I know it's pointlessly outdated. It's just neat.

I didn't really considered the upgradability of the system. Guess it would be better off to go with your suggestion and save up for a newer platform and make upgrades along the road. I really appreciate the help you provided

[Intelfreak]

11 minutes ago, khalid410 said:

I didn't really considered the upgradability of the system. Guess it would be better off to go with your suggestion and save up for a newer platform and make upgrades along the road. I really appreciate the help you provided

Yeah i agreed with bimmerman. X58 is old and outdated. 2019 is the last year for me on X58, as it can no longer provide the gaming exsperince i want and games only become more and more demanding. Metro Exodus and Far Car New Dawn dit that i made the desision to upgrade now.

 

its a fun platform to play with and if you just want some old stuff to mess with. But as told IPC is low and it cant keep up with games any more for what i want.

 

I as well is planning on getting a Ryzen 3000 based PC next year.

[Zando_]

3 minutes ago, Intelfreak said:

Yeah i agreed with bimmerman. X58 is old and outdated. 2019 is the last year for me on X58, as it can no longer provide the gaming exsperince i want and games only become more and more demanding. Metro Exodus and Far Car New Dawn dit that i made the desision to upgrade now.

 

its a fun platform to play with and if you just want some old stuff to mess with. But as told IPC is low and it cant keep up with games any more for what i want.

 

I as well is planning on getting a Ryzen 3000 based PC next year.

Yeah, it's going from a good budget option to a full on enthusiast platform, it's only practical for people who just love tinkering with it, same as LGA775 boyes and their OCable rigs. 

[Crunchy Dragon]

2 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

Yeah, it's going from a good budget option to a full on enthusiast platform, it's only practical for people who just love tinkering with it, same as LGA775 boyes and their OCable rigs. 

Time for us all to move on to X79