General Intel HEDT Xeon/i7 Discussion

[MaratM]

Actually is there any way to limit the pci-e bandwidth from pci-e 3.0 x16 to x8 in order to make 8700k vs x56xx testing as fair as possible? Except switching the card to x8 slot

[MaratM]

6 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Time for us all to move on to X79

It is a dead end unless you go for e5 1680v2 (8 core 16 thread) but latest ebay prices are almost the same as 8700k

according to latest rumors it looks like intel with 10nm is making a new ipc jump

[bimmerman]

17 minutes ago, MaratM said:

Actually is there any way to limit the pci-e bandwidth from pci-e 3.0 x16 to x8 in order to make 8700k vs x56xx testing as fair as possible? Except switching the card to x8 slot

Yep. Simple way is to cover the rear half of the PCI fingers with a thin sheet of paper.

 

I think GN or Puget Systems did that and showed that on modern systems, there really isn't much difference in PCIe 3 x16 vs x8. Single digit percentages on a 1080ti/Titan speed card.

 

PCIe 2 x16 is essentially the same bandwidth as 3.0 x8, but I do wonder whether there would be a difference vs 3.0x16 if you could IPC-equalize two platforms.

[Crunchy Dragon]

27 minutes ago, MaratM said:

It is a dead end unless you go for e5 1680v2 (8 core 16 thread) but latest ebay prices are almost the same as 8700k

according to latest rumors it looks like intel with 10nm is making a new ipc jump

I thought the 1680v2 was X99? Hmm.

 

The more you know

[FlatBrokeRacing]

1 hour ago, bimmerman said:

Better question, what are you looking to do with the system once finished?

 

High refresh rate gaming? No. Maybe 1080p potato.

High resolution 60fps gaming? Not with RX 580, maybe on Low/Medium settings.

1440p 60+fps? Maybe.

1080p high/ultra 60 fps? Probably.

 

For reference, I have that motherboard, an X5675 OC'd to 4.5 GHz, a 1080ti, an NVMe 950 Pro, and I struggle to get 60fps on medium high - high settings at 3440x1440 in recent (non competitive shooter) titles. My solution? I turned down the details in games I needed to, turned on vsync, turned off the FPS counter, and have fun. 

 

If you're interested and if I can find time, I can re-run benchmarks for 1920x1200 as a stand-in for 1080p, but I think the results will be pretty obvious. Better than 60fps, but probably not enough for both high refresh and high details.

 

The platform is aged, there's no way around the IPC deficit and PCIe 2.0 (effectively 3.0 x8). However, if you keep your expectations in check on resolution/details/refresh rate, it can be a great budget platform. My build not included, but I've iterated on it for nearly 10 years....I long ago quit caring about 'budget'.

 

FWIW I'm saving for a Zen3 or ideally TR3 build to replace ol' faithful.

something seems wrong with that. My X5675 system with a 1080ti will run high refresh rate of over 120fps on ultra settings everything cranked, an will even do over 60fps on 4k gaming on high/ultra with most titles without issue. Im clocked around 4.6 on all cores daily. been a solid rig for the past year since i parted/sold my 4790k system.

[MaratM]

35 minutes ago, bimmerman said:

Yep. Simple way is to cover the rear half of the PCI fingers with a thin sheet of paper.

 

I think GN or Puget Systems did that and showed that on modern systems, there really isn't much difference in PCIe 3 x16 vs x8. Single digit percentages on a 1080ti/Titan speed card.

 

PCIe 2 x16 is essentially the same bandwidth as 3.0 x8, but I do wonder whether there would be a difference vs 3.0x16 if you could IPC-equalize two platforms.

The problem is water. It is not that easy to physically change the pci-e slot

[Intelfreak]

1 hour ago, Zando Bob said:

Yeah, it's going from a good budget option to a full on enthusiast platform, it's only practical for people who just love tinkering with it, same as LGA775 boyes and their OCable rigs. 

Spot on what i would have said my self. X58 has been fun, stable, amazing value even throw it whas not cheap back then but thinking for how long it has lasted, i will say it has been every penny wofh it. But X58 cant run from time and teknologi advancing.

[Zando_]

1 hour ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Time for us all to move on to X79

I'm way ahead, already on X99. X79 is very similar though, the hexacores and 8c boyes are about the same price as the comparable X99 ones and OC as well IIRC (sometimes better), should actually perform pretty similarly. X79 just uses quad channel DDR3 instead of quad channel DDR4. 

7 minutes ago, Intelfreak said:

Spot on what i would have said my self. X58 has been fun, stable, amazing value even throw it whas not cheap back then but thinking for how long it has lasted, i will say it has been every penny wofh it. But X58 cant run from time and teknologi advancing.

Exactly, it's had a good run, and a hella long one for how fast tech advances. The server hardware is still great for basic home stuff like a NAS or minecraft server and such too, since it's much cheaper than the X58 OCing boards. Other than the SR-2 ofc, that's technically a server chipset but it's a little bit more expensive and slightly cooler than your average supermicro. 

[Crunchy Dragon]

3 hours ago, Zando Bob said:

I'm way ahead, already on X99. X79 is very similar though, the hexacores and 8c boyes are about the same price as the comparable X99 ones and OC as well IIRC (sometimes better), should actually perform pretty similarly. X79 just uses quad channel DDR3 instead of quad channel DDR4.

Same actually

[Slayer3032]

I really haven't came across anything that doesn't run great but then again I don't play a lot of recent AAA games or ones with DRM that demolish cpu performance. No Man's Sky was among the worst performing games I've played but the experimental Vulkan branch it nearly doubled my performance in that. Doom Eternal is mostly what I'm looking forward to and if it runs anything like Doom 2016, I already easily exceed 1440p144 Ultra so I can't imagine them wrecking how beautiful it runs on that engine.

 

I'll likely just wait a couple years and skip DDR4 entirely since I still haven't bought any or just buy some used Zen 2 stuff down the road. DDR4 prices are insanely attractive nowadays though. To think I was mere clicks away from making a grave mistake by buying a Ryzen 5 1500X, 16GB of DDR4 and a mid range X370 board for like $500-600 to get away from my i7 930. I generally get higher FPS than my buddy who has a Ryzen 1700 and a GTX 1080 and between all of the hardware I've stuck in this thing since then I'm not even near that even if you count the unrelated upgrades like fans/power supply, nvme, ect. It really helped justify buying nice peripherals, 1440p144, ect.

[Intelfreak]

26 minutes ago, Slayer3032 said:

I really haven't came across anything that doesn't run great but then again I don't play a lot of recent AAA games or ones with DRM that demolish cpu performance. No Man's Sky was among the worst performing games I've played but the experimental Vulkan branch it nearly doubled my performance in that. Doom Eternal is mostly what I'm looking forward to and if it runs anything like Doom 2016, I already easily exceed 1440p144 Ultra so I can't imagine them wrecking how beautiful it runs on that engine.

 

I'll likely just wait a couple years and skip DDR4 entirely since I still haven't bought any or just buy some used Zen 2 stuff down the road. DDR4 prices are insanely attractive nowadays though. To think I was mere clicks away from making a grave mistake by buying a Ryzen 5 1500X, 16GB of DDR4 and a mid range X370 board for like $500-600 to get away from my i7 930. I generally get higher FPS than my buddy who has a Ryzen 1700 and a GTX 1080 and between all of the hardware I've stuck in this thing since then I'm not even near that even if you count the unrelated upgrades like fans/power supply, nvme, ect. It really helped justify buying nice peripherals, 1440p144, ect.

Then try metro exodus, far cry new dawn or BF V with directX 12 enable. Then you will see your pc crying for mercy.

[Zando_]

15 hours ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Same actually

Noice, you did get the upgrade done? Whatcha running? My build is in my sig but I need to update it, lemme paste it here and then go edit that asap. 

 

CPU: 5820K at 4.4Ghz
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15S
Motherboard: EVGA Classified X99
Memory: 32GB (4x8GB) HyperX Predator 3200MHz DDR4
Storage: 250GB 960 Evo, 500GB WD Blue M.2 (on a PCIe riser card), 2x2TB Seagate Barracuda HDDs, have another 2TB Barracuda Compute I plan to put in soon
GPU: Radeon VII
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Evolv ATX TG
PSU: Corsair RM1000i

 

3 hours ago, Intelfreak said:

Then try metro exodus, far cry new dawn or BF V with directX 12 enable. Then you will see your pc crying for mercy.

Assassin's Creed Odyssey is another to add to that list. 40-45 fps in open areas, 30-35 in cities, every now and then it drops a little lower (going off a 4.2-4.5Ghz X5670 or X5675). I will give Ubisoft props though, frametimes are very, very consistent so it's still smooth and a perfectly playable experience. 

[MaratM]

53 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

Assassin's Creed Odyssey is another to add to that list. 40-45 fps in open areas, 30-35 in cities, every now and then it drops a little lower (going off a 4.2-4.5Ghz X5670 or X5675). I will give Ubisoft props though, frametimes are very, very consistent so it's still smooth and a perfectly playable experience. 

It puts even modern cpu’s to their knees. Even in benchmark

[Zando_]

2 minutes ago, MaratM said:

It puts even modern cpu’s to their knees. Even in benchmark

Stock 8700K still holds 60fps everywhere though, but that is a beefy hexacore. 

[Crunchy Dragon]

1 hour ago, Zando Bob said:

Noice, you did get the upgrade done? Whatcha running? My build is in my sig but I need to update it, lemme paste it here and then go edit that asap. 

 

CPU: 5820K at 4.4Ghz
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15S
Motherboard: EVGA Classified X99
Memory: 32GB (4x8GB) HyperX Predator 3200MHz DDR4
Storage: 250GB 960 Evo, 500GB WD Blue M.2 (on a PCIe riser card), 2x2TB Seagate Barracuda HDDs, have another 2TB Barracuda Compute I plan to put in soon
GPU: Radeon VII
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Evolv ATX TG
PSU: Corsair RM1000i

Working on finishing the build at the moment(X99 isn't playing nicely with my new GPU for some reason).

 

But I'll be rocking:

i7-5820K + Phanteks TC14PE

Gigabyte X99 SLI

16GB(4x4GB) mixed DDR4-2400

250GB Crucial MX500, 1TB WD Blue

Corsair RM1000x

[Zando_]

2 hours ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Working on finishing the build at the moment(X99 isn't playing nicely with my new GPU for some reason).

 

But I'll be rocking:

i7-5820K + Phanteks TC14PE

Gigabyte X99 SLI

16GB(4x4GB) mixed DDR4-2400

250GB Crucial MX500, 1TB WD Blue

Corsair RM1000x

Nice, so a pretty similar rig. the 5820K is a solid CPU and OCs pretty well in my experience, I haven't hit a limit other than thermals, if I put it on water I can probs give it 1.4v and get it a bit higher. At anything above 1.32v it hits the high 90s in Prime95 small FFT, even with my NH-D15S. 

[Crunchy Dragon]

2 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

Nice, so a pretty similar rig. the 5820K is a solid CPU and OCs pretty well in my experience, I haven't hit a limit other than thermals, if I put it on water I can probs give it 1.4v and get it a bit higher. At anything above 1.32v it hits the high 90s in Prime95 small FFT, even with my NH-D15S. 

5820K OCd pretty well overall from what I recall hearing when it was new.

[Zando_]

2 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

5820K OCd pretty well overall from what I recall hearing when it was new.

Yee, the 5000 series OC well, J-batch 5960Xs especially. IIRC there's quite a few guys running them at 5GHz on water, I'd imagine they're only barely behind a 9900K at that speed. 6000 series is pretty meh from everything I've seen and read on the matter, but they do have the 6950X, which was the first 10c/20t lad on HEDT. 

[Crunchy Dragon]

7 minutes ago, Zando Bob said:

Yee, the 5000 series OC well, J-batch 5960Xs especially. IIRC there's quite a few guys running them at 5GHz on water, I'd imagine they're only barely behind a 9900K at that speed. 6000 series is pretty meh from everything I've seen and read on the matter, but they do have the 6950X, which was the first 10c/20t lad on HEDT. 

I could run a 6950X if I wanted to...

 

I think my board will go up to that 22 core Xeon, actually.

[Zando_]

6 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

I could run a 6950X if I wanted to...

 

I think my board will go up to that 22 core Xeon, actually.

Sadly they're all $700-900 though, which is nuts. 5960Xs spiked to that price too, but most of them have come back down to a more reasonable $300-350. 

[r2724r16]

4 hours ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

I could run a 6950X if I wanted to...

 

I think my board will go up to that 22 core Xeon, actually.

 

4 hours ago, Zando Bob said:

Sadly they're all $700-900 though, which is nuts. 5960Xs spiked to that price too, but most of them have come back down to a more reasonable $300-350. 

How much did you guys pay for your 5820Ks? I'm able to get a 6800K for C$240 locally.

[Crunchy Dragon]

59 minutes ago, r2724r16 said:

How much did you guys pay for your 5820Ks? I'm able to get a 6800K for C$240 locally.

I got mine as payment with the rest of an X99 rig, so no real number on that.

 

They go for between 150 and 200 USD on the used market here.

[XR6]

1 hour ago, r2724r16 said:

How much did you guys pay for your 5820Ks? I'm able to get a 6800K for C$240 locally.

Haven't bought mine yet, but I'm going to be buying one for 110 GBP on eBay soon. £100-150 is the average price for a 5820K on the used market here.

 

[Zando_]

14 hours ago, r2724r16 said:

 

How much did you guys pay for your 5820Ks? I'm able to get a 6800K for C$240 locally.

Got my 5820K for $160, would defo go with one of those over a 6800K. From what I've seen 6800Ks OC terribly by comparison. 

[XR6]

@Zando Bob I've got some questions regarding X99. I'm able to get a 5820K for £110, but for about £30-40 more I'm able to get a 5930K. Do you think it'd be worth the extra money?

Also, how are the temperatures on your 5820K with the NH-D15? I'm going to be using that cooler in my next build so it would be nice to know how it performs before buying.