Apple tells a judge their phones are only guaranteed to work for 365 days

[JoostinOnline]

Just now, Master Disaster said:

And lets say someone came back to you after 45 days and told you that as a direct result of something you had done their computer was no longer working would you just say "Tough shit, see you again next time?"

One person, no.  Enough people to end my business?  I'd have to.

[Master Disaster]

16 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

One person, no.  Enough people to end my business?  I'd have to.

Apple is amongst the top 5 richest corporations on the planet, that's simply not a factor for them.

 

They could, quite literally, give everyone in America a free iPhone and still not even be close to bankrupt.

 

323 million people x $1,000 per unit is $323B.

 

Apple is worth $800B

[JoostinOnline]

9 minutes ago, Master Disaster said:

Apple is amongst the top 5 richest corporations on the planet, that's simply not a factor for them.

 

They could, quite literally, give everyone in America a free iPhone and still not even be close to bankrupt.

 

323 million people x $1,000 per unit is $323B.

 

Apple is worth $800B

That's not just extra money they've got lying around.  It goes towards paychecks, research, advertising, etc.

[Master Disaster]

7 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

That's not just extra money they've got lying around.  It goes towards paychecks, research, advertising, etc.

LMAO, so the $500 Billion Dollars extra from my sums wouldn't cover those things? And anyway, it was a hypothetical situation, where their money is just is not relevant.

 

I don't understand how you can try to defend a company worth $800 billion who are currently refusing to fix around 10 to 15 phones because of something they did wrong at the design stage?

 

Its genuinely no wonder Apple pull this shit all the time and get away with it.

[JoostinOnline]

Just now, Master Disaster said:

LMAO, so the $500 Billion Dollars extra from my sums would cover those things?

 

I don't understand how you can try to defend a company worth $800 billion who are currently refusing to fix around 10 to 15 phones because of something they did wrong at the design stage?

 

Its genuinely no wonder Apple pull this shit all the time and get away with it.

10 to 15 phones?  Where are you getting that number?  Way more people were affected around the world.  I need to tell one of my friends he has one of the rarest phones in the world!

 

Replacing everything would be an enormous blow to the company.  A lot of people would be fired to retain profits.  If we're being realistic, the people at the top aren't going to take paycuts.  What I don't understand is how you can find this the least bit surprising, when any other manufacturer would do the same.

 

You posted the fact that iPhones have a 1 year warranty in the news section.  You're 10 years too late on that "news".  Anyone who has ever looked at the warranty could tell you that.  It's like announcing that iPhones don't have expandable storage.

[Master Disaster]

37 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

10 to 15 phones?  Where are you getting that number?  Way more people were affected around the world.  I need to tell one of my friends he has one of the rarest phones in the world!

 

Replacing everything would be an enormous blow to the company.  A lot of people would be fired to retain profits.  If we're being realistic, the people at the top aren't going to take paycuts.  What I don't understand is how you can find this the least bit surprising, when any other manufacturer would do the same.

 

You posted the fact that iPhones have a 1 year warranty in the news section.  You're 10 years too late on that "news".  Anyone who has ever looked at the warranty could tell you that.  It's like announcing that iPhones don't have expandable storage.

Its a class action suit brought to Apple by around 15 affected users (the suit is only for people affected in America), thats it. Its 15 fucking phones and yet Apple still refuses to fix them because of its greedy corporation ways. I mean you do realise it would have been cheaper for them to fix the fucking phones than it would have been for them to fight this case?

 

FTR around 400 American iPhone 6+ users were affected according to Google (I cant find numbers for the base model though) so even if the Judge forces them to fix them all, 400 screen replacements against an $800B company.

 

Jesus please actually understand what you're commenting on before you comment.

[JoostinOnline]

1 minute ago, Master Disaster said:

Its a class action suit brought to Apple by around 15 affected users (the suit is only for people affected in America), thats it. Its 15 fucking phones and yet Apple still refuses to fix them because of its greedy corporation ways.

 

FTR around 400 American iPhone 6+ users were affected according to Google (I cant find numbers for the base model though) so even if the Judge forces them to fix them all, 400 screen replacements against an $800B company.

 

Jesus please actually understand what you're commenting on before you comment.

If that was really all it was, they would have settled immediately.  It happens all the time.  It's a way to not spend so much on legal fees and prevent more attention to the fault.  There has to be more to this.  You're right that Apple is a greedy company.  Greedy companies don't waste money.  With how long this has been going, they've definitely spent more than the cost of 400 phones.

[Dabombinable]

58 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

If that was really all it was, they would have settled immediately.  It happens all the time.  It's a way to not spend so much on legal fees and prevent more attention to the fault.  There has to be more to this.  You're right that Apple is a greedy company.  Greedy companies don't waste money.  With how long this has been going, they've definitely spent more than the cost of 400 phones.

This is Apple. By settling immediately they'd have to effectively admit that they'd been lying for uite a while about the iPhone 6 not having a design flaw (lack of underfill under the touch IC-which previous iPhone didn't lack), so they've decided to not settle.

Notice how old the video is.

And the followup from August 2016:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45rRLkjdgrU

[JoostinOnline]

37 minutes ago, Dabombinable said:

This is Apple. By settling immediately they'd have to effectively admit that they'd been lying for uite a while about the iPhone 6 not having a design flaw (lack of underfill under the touch IC-which previous iPhone didn't lack), so they've decided to not settle.

Notice how old the video is.

And the followup from August 2016:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45rRLkjdgrU

That kind of backs up the point I was making.  Apple isn't run by idiots.  They must have determined that settling would have cost them more money.  It wasn't just the cost of fixing iPhones alone.

[LAwLz]

1 hour ago, JoostinOnline said:

That kind of backs up the point I was making.  Apple isn't run by idiots.  They must have determined that settling would have cost them more money.  It wasn't just the cost of fixing iPhones alone.

I doubt fixing the affected iPhones would cost more than the lawsuit.

What I think is happening is that Apple is afraid this might set precedence. If they fix this then they will in effect have to raise the warranty of their phones from 1 year (which is pathetic by the way) to 2 years, and in the long run that will cost them more than this lawsuit (possibly because there are a significant number of phones which do fail on their own within 2 years).

[79wjd]

13 hours ago, Dabombinable said:

This also means BTW that Apple doesn't expect their new $1K USD phone to last more than a year.

10 hours ago, Drak3 said:

No, it means that Apple expects a defective product to fail within a year. Otherwise, they wouldn't offer extended warrantees.

No, that's not what it menas. It means that they don't think offering a longer warranty will affect how many people buy the device, and so they offer the shortest warranty they can (just like every other company in the same market space). It saves them money on any failures after 1 year (which will invariably happen to a percentage of users) and it encourages those that are extra paranoid into buying an extended warranty. Then they offer the extended warranty (like almost all manufacturers do on virtually all products) as it's a great money maker. 

 

Quote

And yet people will still buy it.

Of the thousands of dollars I've spent in electronics over the last decade, my two Macs and two (soon to be three) iPhones are on the short list of 100% non-regretted purchases (and it's not because I didn't think those decisions through out do my due diligence). I've had less issues and enjoyed using my Apple devices FAR more than any competing devices. So, yes, I'm willing to pay more for a better experience. Plus, if you just go to an Apple store you can generally get anything fixed for free -- even outside of warranty. You just have to be slightly persistent. 

[Commodus]

The irony is that many of the people decrying Apple as greedy (I won't rehash what LAwLz and others said about its reasoning) would run into the welcoming arms of Samsung.  You know, the company whose leader was just convicted of bribery and has an extensive history of corruption and nepotism.

 

Apple is a large company out to make a profit.  That doesn't excuse anything and everything, but acting shocked that Apple would do this, as if every other manufacturer you've ever supported wouldn't do the exact same thing?  That's a bit much.

[Dabombinable]

6 hours ago, Commodus said:

The irony is that many of the people decrying Apple as greedy (I won't rehash what LAwLz and others said about its reasoning) would run into the welcoming arms of Samsung.  You know, the company whose leader was just convicted of bribery and has an extensive history of corruption and nepotism.

 

Apple is a large company out to make a profit.  That doesn't excuse anything and everything, but acting shocked that Apple would do this, as if every other manufacturer you've ever supported wouldn't do the exact same thing?  That's a bit much.

I myself wouldn't. I'd be happy with a phone from Motorola or ZTE. Or Asus for that matter if they make phones.

[Commodus]

27 minutes ago, Dabombinable said:

I myself wouldn't. I'd be happy with a phone from Motorola or ZTE. Or Asus for that matter if they make phones.

ASUS does make phones... they're good, not great.

 

You definitely get the idea.  There's this weird tendency for people to hold Apple to an unfeasibly high standard they don't for virtually any other company, roast it when it doesn't meet that standard, and then flock to a company that falls well below that standard.

[LAwLz]

8 minutes ago, Commodus said:

ASUS does make phones... they're good, not great.

 

You definitely get the idea.  There's this weird tendency for people to hold Apple to an unfeasibly high standard they don't for virtually any other company, roast it when it doesn't meet that standard, and then flock to a company that falls well below that standard.

I think the problem is that a lot of people (even on this forum) actually believe that Apple withhold this unfeasibly high standard that some people

 

You can not deny that there is a group (a fairly small one on this forum, but large in general) that sucks Apple's dick an absurd amount and that in turn fuels the other extreme which hates Apple or is just sick and tired of the Apple fanboys being obnoxious all the time. So the two sides feed off each other. The fanboys see the haters and feel a need to defend Apple, which in turn fuels the haters to point out how imperfect Apple really is.

[Commodus]

1 minute ago, LAwLz said:

I think the problem is that a lot of people (even on this forum) actually believe that Apple withhold this unfeasibly high standard that some people

 

You can not deny that there is a group (a fairly small one on this forum, but large in general) that sucks Apple's dick an absurd amount and that in turn fuels the other extreme which hates Apple or is just sick and tired of the Apple fanboys being obnoxious all the time. So the two sides feed off each other. The fanboys see the haters and feel a need to defend Apple, which in turn fuels the haters to point out how imperfect Apple really is.

Yeah, there's a bit of a vicious circle.  I may use a lot of Apple gear, but I don't like it when people talk about it or the company with breathless praise... aside from being unrealistic, it invites the wrath of those people just looking for an excuse to validate their anti-Apple stereotypes.  

 

I suspect part of the hate stems from a belief that opposing Apple somehow makes you counterculture (see: "sheep" remarks), as if rejecting one major multinational tech company in favor of another is going against the grain.  Getting to choose your default browser doesn't make you cooler or less conformist; it just means you're pickier about how you use your phone.

[Dabombinable]

18 minutes ago, Commodus said:

Yeah, there's a bit of a vicious circle.  I may use a lot of Apple gear, but I don't like it when people talk about it or the company with breathless praise... aside from being unrealistic, it invites the wrath of those people just looking for an excuse to validate their anti-Apple stereotypes.  

 

I suspect part of the hate stems from a belief that opposing Apple somehow makes you counterculture (see: "sheep" remarks), as if rejecting one major multinational tech company in favor of another is going against the grain.  Getting to choose your default browser doesn't make you cooler or less conformist; it just means you're pickier about how you use your phone.

My "hate" (its more of a dislike for the products and their decision to dictate what people want) comes simply from the way Apple has been acting and the fact that their products don't seem to go through much real world testing before being sold-which leads to the problems found in the majority of Apple products (the iPad mini seem to be the only line without problems that impact usability in some way)

[Commodus]

Just now, Dabombinable said:

My "hate" (its more of a dislike for the products and their decision to dictate what people want) comes simply from the way Apple has been acting and the fact that their products don't seem to go through much real world testing before being sold-which leads to the problems found in the majority of Apple products (the iPad mini seem to be the only line without problems that impact usability in some way)

They go through plenty of real testing, and I wouldn't say it's the majority of products (certainly not the majority of units).  It's just that Apple's high-end focus and public profile magnifies the attention.  You don't hear about the budget HP laptop with an inherently lousy battery or the low-end Samsung phone with glitches because, hey, they were both rubbish when they left the factory, what did you expect?  It's when you charge $1300 for a laptop and it still has bugs that people get upset.

[JoostinOnline]

11 hours ago, LAwLz said:

I doubt fixing the affected iPhones would cost more than the lawsuit.

What I think is happening is that Apple is afraid this might set precedence. If they fix this then they will in effect have to raise the warranty of their phones from 1 year (which is pathetic by the way) to 2 years, and in the long run that will cost them more than this lawsuit (possibly because there are a significant number of phones which do fail on their own within 2 years).

That's what I mean.  But given that everything else has a 1 year warranty,  I don't understand why it's pathetic.

[Dabombinable]

1 hour ago, Commodus said:

They go through plenty of real testing, and I wouldn't say it's the majority of products (certainly not the majority of units).  It's just that Apple's high-end focus and public profile magnifies the attention.  You don't hear about the budget HP laptop with an inherently lousy battery or the low-end Samsung phone with glitches because, hey, they were both rubbish when they left the factory, what did you expect?  It's when you charge $1300 for a laptop and it still has bugs that people get upset.

Do you remember the problem where holding an iPhone the "wrong" way would cover then antenna and cause issues with reception? Then there is the iPhone 6 flexing very easily (with the 6S having reinforcement to prevent the bending). And BTW, you hear about it because Apple products cost so damn much and are seen as flagship devices-and its kind of stupid for Apple to have flaws in their products that their competitors budget offerings don't have.

[79wjd]

1 hour ago, Dabombinable said:

Do you remember the problem where holding an iPhone the "wrong" way would cover then antenna and cause issues with reception? Then there is the iPhone 6 flexing very easily (with the 6S having reinforcement to prevent the bending). And BTW, you hear about it because Apple products cost so damn much and are seen as flagship devices-and its kind of stupid for Apple to have flaws in their products that their competitors budget offerings don't have.

That "very easy" flexing wasn't exactly very easy. I actually don't know anyone who had a problem with their 6 Plus bending. Most of the big issues that end up coming up don't end up affecting all that many people. 

[LinusTech]

1 hour ago, djdwosk97 said:

That "very easy" flexing wasn't exactly very easy. I actually don't know anyone who had a problem with their 6 Plus bending. Most of the big issues that end up coming up don't end up affecting all that many people. 

My 6 bent in my backpack last time I was traveling. There's a bulge around the frame now.

 

Haven't been paying attention to this whole thread. Just sayin'

 

The S8 next to it was fine.

[JoostinOnline]

1 hour ago, djdwosk97 said:

That "very easy" flexing wasn't exactly very easy. I actually don't know anyone who had a problem with their 6 Plus bending. Most of the big issues that end up coming up don't end up affecting all that many people. 

It wasn't easy, but it wasn't super hard when compared to other phones either.

 

People (I don't mean you specifically) keep acting like this was an intentional sabotage of their product so people would buy new ones.  I think it's just shoddy design.  As I pointed out with Error 53 (which they tried to call a "security feature"), they aren't above screwing customers over.  I just don't think this is it.

6 minutes ago, LinusTech said:

My 6 bent in my backpack last time I was traveling. There's a bulge around the frame now.

I half wish this was on the WAN Show, because you probably would have followed "bulge" with some kind of sex joke.

[LAwLz]

4 hours ago, JoostinOnline said:

That's what I mean.  But given that everything else has a 1 year warranty,  I don't understand why it's pathetic.

"Everyone else does it too" is no excuse.

A one year warranty is extremely short. Far too short for a 1000 dollar item from a company who prides themselves in saying they have very high-quality products.

[Droidbot]

18 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

"Everyone else does it too" is no excuse.

A one year warranty is extremely short. Far too short for a 1000 dollar item from a company who prides themselves in saying they have very high-quality products.

This is very very true. Here in Australia if you pressure apple with the Australian Consumer Law, they crack. 

 

The law states that products should last for a reasonable amount of time, and for phones that is two years - as mobile phones are sold most commonly on two year contracts. 

 

There's similar in the EU IIRC