water cooling res , rad push pull question

[thrasher_565]

so most loops order will go from

out res

in pump

out pump

in cpu/gpu block

out cpu/gpu block

in rad

out rad

in res

 

or something like that. but in sted of going back to the res you could just go to the pump if you got two out and in to your pump top right? or would this be a problem?

 

out res

in pump

out pump

in cpu/gpu block

out cpu/gpu block

in rad

out rad

(skip res)

in pump

out pump

in cpu/gpu block

out cpu/gpu block

in rad

out rad

in pump and so on.

 

also when doing push pull only the push need  or could use a shroud? the pull dose not need one right?

 

[W-L]

3 minutes ago, thrasher_565 said:

-SNIP-

Loop order makes no real difference in terms of performance, as for the res you want to return it to the res then pump to allow for air bubbles to easily escape during filling. What shroud are you referring to exact for push pull? 

[thrasher_565]

2 minutes ago, W-L said:

Loop order makes no real difference in terms of performance, as for the res you want to return it to the res then pump to allow for air bubbles to easily escape during filling. What shroud are you referring to exact for push pull? 

its just a fan that i cut out so an 120mm 25mm just the fan cut out.

 

i was just wondering if i should plane were i can to use a shroud on the pull so it be

pull fan

shroud

rad

shrould

push fan

 

instead of

 

pull fan

rad

shroud

push fan

 

dose having an pull shroud have any benefit?

Edited July 31, 2017 by thrasher_565

[W-L]

Just now, thrasher_565 said:

its just a fan that i cut out so an 120mm 25mm just the fan cut out.

As in a tube for airflow like this? That is not necessary and doesn't provide any difference, getting good pressure optimized fans would make a bigger impact more than anything else. 

[thrasher_565]

1 minute ago, W-L said:

As in a tube for airflow like this? That is not necessary and doesn't provide any difference, getting good pressure optimized fans would make a bigger impact more than anything else. 

ya like that. i no a better fan is better then a shroud but i all ready have em so...

[W-L]

Just now, thrasher_565 said:

ya like that. i no a better fan is better then a shroud but i all ready have em so...

Return them? It doesn't benefit cooling really as it's all within margin of error, the only thing I see it helping is noise created by the turbulence as it's being placed further away from the fins but even a thick foam gasket can prevent that. 

https://martinsliquidlab.wordpress.com/2012/01/15/radiator-shroud-testing-v2/2/

[thrasher_565]

12 minutes ago, W-L said:

Return them? It doesn't benefit cooling really as it's all within margin of error, the only thing I see it helping is noise created by the turbulence as it's being placed further away from the fins but even a thick foam gasket can prevent that. 

https://martinsliquidlab.wordpress.com/2012/01/15/radiator-shroud-testing-v2/2/

haha i made them i cant return them. i only paid $2.50 for each (and i can put an 5mm led in them...)

 

so that link is basic pointless adding a shroud. push pull works better then just push and a shroud. it also depends on rad and probly fan so.. for now ill just use it for the push and not the pull. thx  

[W-L]

Just now, thrasher_565 said:

haha i made them i cant return them. i only paid $2.50 for each (and i can put an 5mm led in them...)

 

so that link is basic pointless adding a shroud. push pull works better then just push and a shroud. it also depends on rad and probly fan so.. for now ill just use it for the push and not the pull. thx  

It depends on the rad but the difference is very little maybe a degree, but yeah go for it doesn't hurt to add them in if you want to. 

[For Science!]

56 minutes ago, thrasher_565 said:

 

Most pumps only have one input so unless if your pump top specially has multiple inlets you will have to use a T-splitter to have the output of the radiator going into the pump.

 

in theory it is fine I guess, it's like having the reservoir as a bleed tube. But personally it's just more fittings with no clear advantage, since by definition you want time reservoir on top of the pump for correct priming.

[thrasher_565]

1 minute ago, For Science! said:

Most pumps only have one input so unless if your pump top specially has multiple inlets you will have to use a T-splitter to have the output of the radiator going into the pump.

 

in theory it is fine I guess, it's like having the reservoir as a bleed tube. But personally it's just more fittings with no clear advantage, since by definition you want time reservoir on top of the pump for correct priming.

ya so i see having the water go back to the res makes it so air bubbles can escape. but once most of em are out then you could have it just go to the pump. but how would you go from res to pump then switch it to rad to pump with out adding in air haha so it would not work. unless you just used a t line in between the rad and pump.

[For Science!]

1 minute ago, thrasher_565 said:

ya so i see having the water go back to the res makes it so air bubbles can escape. but once most of em are out then you could have it just go to the pump. but how would you go from res to pump then switch it to rad to pump with out adding in air haha so it would not work. unless you just used a t line in between the rad and pump.

Yes it's possible, this is what people used to do before reservoirs were popular.

 

assuming your reservoir is at a high point in the loop. you just need to remove most of the liquid and then carefully unscrew the reservoir and seal the T-splitter. As long as this is a high point in the loop liquid shouldn't pour out or air getting in.

 

 

                          Reservoir

                                !! < remove here

Radiator ==== T-splitter

                                !!

                            pump

 

Alternatively put a ball valve between the T-splitter and reservoir so you can seal the loop and remove the reservoir safely.

 

                          Reservoir

                                !!  <- remove here

                          Ball-valve

                                !!

Radiator ==== T-splitter

                                !!

                            pump

 

but again. I think there is almost no benefit in doing this and a waste of a reservoir. you could just do it with a long piece of tubing inst3ad.

[thrasher_565]

1 minute ago, For Science! said:

Yes it's possible, this is what people used to do before reservoirs were popular.

 

assuming your reservoir is at a high point in the loop. you just need to remove most of the liquid and then carefully unscrew the reservoir and seal the T-splitter. As long as this is a high point in the loop liquid shouldn't pour out or air getting in.

 

 

                          Reservoir

                                !! < remove here

Radiator ==== T-splitter

                                !!

                            pump

 

Alternatively put a ball valve between the T-splitter and reservoir so you can seal the loop and remove the reservoir safely.

 

                          Reservoir

                                !!  <- remove here

                          Ball-valve

                                !!

Radiator ==== T-splitter

                                !!

                            pump

 

but again. I think there is almost no benefit in doing this and a waste of a reservoir. you could just do it with a long piece of tubing inst3ad.

oh ya you could use a ball valve. i don't want to remove the res just was easer to go back to the pump then it was to the res.

 

[thrasher_565]

would it not benefit form forcing water in to the pump then gravity feeding?

[For Science!]

1 minute ago, thrasher_565 said:

would it not benefit form forcing water in to the pump then gravity feeding?

in a closed loop this is true anyway because the pressure has to go somewhere. so again no real benefit in removing the res

[thrasher_565]

6 minutes ago, For Science! said:

in a closed loop this is true anyway because the pressure has to go somewhere. so again no real benefit in removing the res

oh ok haha

 

this is what im woring with in case your wondering

 

and i got to do the same on the other side... so much for being clean and ez to empty...

[For Science!]

8 minutes ago, thrasher_565 said:

 

So confused as to what is happening in your loop ?

 

there seems to be multiple reservoirs?

[thrasher_565]

Just now, For Science! said:

So confused as to what is happening in your loop ?

 

there seems to be multiple reservoirs?

ya there's 2 loops. the orange tubing is just an mock set up as im trying to figger out how im going to do it and how to mount the res. the rads are mock too as the just have the shrouds on them. i was trying to see how much space i had.

[thrasher_565]

i tryed to do it "cheaply'' so i cheaped on fitting's. i do have a few male to male 90. but i think im going to have to buy a few 90's. i still have 4 ball vaves to add in as it was saposto be an easey loop to drain. open like 2 or so valves and 95% of the water flows out... dont think that;s going to be the case. insted of me buying 4 pumps i sould have spent that on fittings and valves so i can remove a part in the loop if need too. maybe trying to make it ease im just making it harder haha. 

[For Science!]

Good luck! I think if you get creative with T-splitter in theory you can have 1 reservoir feed 2 pumps. 

[thrasher_565]

Just now, For Science! said:

Good luck! I think if you get creative with T-splitter in theory you can have 1 reservoir feed 2 pumps. 

yep or 1 res feed many pumps. just as long as you don't run the pump dry haha that is.

[thrasher_565]

oh i no how i could do it with out a res is buy using the rad itself. the 2 aphacool rads are crossflow so in one end out the other. well it has ports on both sides so on top i can fill it. then feed it in to the pump. still i guess a t line would be need for air to bleed out.

[Leonard]

5 hours ago, thrasher_565 said:

oh i no how i could do it with out a res is buy using the rad itself. the 2 aphacool rads are crossflow so in one end out the other. well it has ports on both sides so on top i can fill it. then feed it in to the pump. still i guess a t line would be need for air to bleed out.

WOW! is this a science project?

 

You should really sit back with a piece of paper and draw this dual loop showing the flow so you can see if that is what you actually are looking for.

 

You could have easily use the one D5, that is what yours looks like to me, with one longish tube reservoir for this loop, it would be fine. Not saying you can't do your dual loop. Why does your reservoirs have four fittings, have you run this configuration, the swirls on air bubbles in the reservoir will make it almost impossible to get rid of it. At which port are you releasing the pressure build up in the loop, i see no port cap.

 

With dual pumps you better put clamps on the tube at the connections because you are sure to get a leak right away if not, in time.  As W-L stated you could have easily used foam/rubber/silicone gasket to get the same if not better than the shroud. Not knocking your craftsmanship. 

[thrasher_565]

On 7/31/2017 at 5:43 AM, Leonard said:

WOW! is this a science project?

 

You should really sit back with a piece of paper and draw this dual loop showing the flow so you can see if that is what you actually are looking for.

 

You could have easily use the one D5, that is what yours looks like to me, with one longish tube reservoir for this loop, it would be fine. Not saying you can't do your dual loop. Why does your reservoirs have four fittings, have you run this configuration, the swirls on air bubbles in the reservoir will make it almost impossible to get rid of it. At which port are you releasing the pressure build up in the loop, i see no port cap.

 

With dual pumps you better put clamps on the tube at the connections because you are sure to get a leak right away if not, in time.  As W-L stated you could have easily used foam/rubber/silicone gasket to get the same if not better than the shroud. Not knocking your craftsmanship. 

the barbs on top was just and idea i had but for now ill probably just cap it. i no i ordered more clamps just waiting... also waiting on screws too. ya this project got way out of and and should have not been done. so many problems. but what is done is done and have to move on. or wait untell i get more money to do what i want. but im already pushing like $3000. i do have $1360 in parts i need to sell but its an waiting game on that. i relay suck at drawing haha but i should try.

[Leonard]

40 minutes ago, thrasher_565 said:

the barbs on top was just and idea i had but for now ill probably just cap it. i no i ordered more clamps just waiting... also waiting on screws too. ya this project got way out of and and should have not been done. so many problems. but what is done is done and have to move on. or wait untell i get more money to do what i want. but im already pushing like $3000. i do have $1360 in parts i need to sell but its an waiting game on that. i relay suck at drawing haha but i should try.

The drawing will help and it is cheaper....lol, just match your inlet to outlets and it should be fine.

[thrasher_565]