Worse Noctua fan quality after moving production to China

[Ventus]

Recently there have been post by Kendalf on Reddit about the differences in manufacturing differences between Noctua fans that were made in Taiwan and China.

 

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I recently purchased three Noctua NF-A14 PWM fans from one online retailer, to add to 2 of the same fans purchased previously from another retailer. I was surprised to discover that the three NF-A14 fans I received were made in China, whereas the 2 fans purchased previously (as well as multiple other Noctua fans and CPU coolers I have purchased in the past) have all been made in Taiwan.

He then goes on visual differences of the fans. They can be seen by a naked eye. He also provides some pictures to back up his words.

Quote

Noted differences:

1. The fan blades on the Taiwan made fans are noticeably smoother and more rounded than the ones made in China, which have rough edges at points.

2. The "Flow Acceleration Channels" on the blades of the Taiwan fans are much more defined than the channels on the made in China fans; the channels on the Chinese fans are barely raised from the blades.

3. The "Inner Surface Microstructures" of the made in Taiwan fans have a distinct waterdrop shape, whereas the made in China fans just have a shallow triangular cutout.

4. The "Stepped Inlet Design" is sharp and distinct in the fans made in Taiwan, whereas the Chinese fans are rounded and less cut out.

5. There is a noticeable difference in frame color. The problem with the difference is that the fans do not match the other Noctua case and CPU cooler fans in the 3 builds that I am putting together, as all the other fans were made in Taiwan.

6. The made in China fans have a noticeably louder drone when spinning at the same RPM as the other fans. See this video--Chinese fan on the left, Taiwan fan on the right, though the difference is more audible in person, and isn't captured as well by my poor phone mic.

He states that he reached out to Noctua with those issues but they responded that "the differences are within their manufacturing tolerances and do not affect performance". He didn't include the email exchange in his post, though.

 

Links to pictures:

http://imgur.com/aDIf8Um

http://imgur.com/COL22hp

 

There's also video comparing sound quality:

 

Source:

 

[MegaDave91]

Gamers Nexus recently covered this in a Q&A video. Steve plans to conduct testing to see if the difference is negligible or significant.

 

 

[Bananasplit_00]

Wow. This is pretty bad. The Chinese made fan litteraly looks like a cheap knockoff... 

[Valentyn]

Well that Chinese one looks somewhat glossy and that oozes cheap compared to the soft matte of the original. Even the silicone vibration pads are a different colour and glossy.

 

I'm a big noctua fan, but those look funky.

 

Hopefully some in depth testing will be done to see if these are actually up to snuff.

[SCHISCHKA]

im not a fan of any manufacturing going to china. They just regularly screw up quality for negligible savings of retail price

[rn8686]

Doesn't look good for Noctua, but I dont think it would really affect performance much (Need testing to be done, cant judge until then). Most of it is probably due to imperfections in the mold, dont think its the manufacturing its self. Dont know why there would be a colour change though, the proportions should all be the same. 

[Bcat00]

Oh crap i better have a look at my new noctua fans which i bought during prime day.

 

Well then, just had a look at my two fans, seems one of them is made in china.

Time to play around with them and see if there's really any difference. if there is, i'll let you guys know

 

K i've just finished tinkering with my noctua fan that's from china and compared it with the other one from Taiwan, both are the NF-P12 model.

Just to be clear, this is not conclusive or anything just my results so don't hate.

 

Other than the color being a tinge darker, almost neglectable because i had to use my phone's light to flash on it to tell, there's not much difference.

 

I've tried taking both fans out and running them side by side at

600RPM / 700RPM / 800RPM / 900RPM / 1000RPM

 

Simply couldn't hear it. They sound about the same.

[Bananasplit_00]

8 minutes ago, Bcat00 said:

Oh crap i better have a look at my new noctua fans which i bought during prime day.

 

Well then, just had a look at my two fans, seems one of them is made in china.

Time to play around with them and see if there's really any difference. if there is, i'll let you guys know

Nice, make a thread about it and tag me. 

 

31 minutes ago, rn8686 said:

Doesn't look good for Noctua, but I dont think it would really affect performance much (Need testing to be done, cant judge until then). Most of it is probably due to imperfections in the mold, dont think its the manufacturing its self. Dont know why there would be a colour change though, the proportions should all be the same. 

I think there can be a minor difference, but it's mainly the looks I'm concerned about. 

[Mooshi]

Real shame. I used to praise Noctua for having the best customer support in the tech industry, but if they are now telling customers Chinese knock-offs are within tolerance, that says a lot.

[randomhkkid]

1 hour ago, SCHISCHKA said:

im not a fan of any manufacturing going to china. They just regularly screw up quality for negligible savings of retail price

The problem doesn't lie with China itself, any country with low quality manufacturers can produce low quality products. Whilst it's true that there are an abundance of lower quality manufacturers there,  it is ultimately the choice of the company to choose (or not choose) them. 

[SCHISCHKA]

44 minutes ago, randomhkkid said:

The problem doesn't lie with China itself, any country with low quality manufacturers can produce low quality products. Whilst it's true that there are an abundance of lower quality manufacturers there,  it is ultimately the choice of the company to choose (or not choose) them. 

Its not just price its about the output. No one does quantity like china. Huge impoverished workforce & one party governance that can bulldoze and entire village at will. No one else on earth, yet, is able to do mass manufacture at the scale and quantity that can match china. India is trying to compete in the race to the bottom, but India has a thing called democracy getting in the way

[Drak3]

Products dropping in quality after moving manufacturing to China. Shocking.

[KWelz]

2 hours ago, Mooshi said:

Real shame. I used to praise Noctua for having the best customer support in the tech industry, but if they are now telling customers Chinese knock-offs are within tolerance, that says a lot.

They are not saying Chinese knockoffs are within tolerance.   That is a pretty strange comment.   These are not knockoffs.  They are made at a different factory for Noctua.   As for if the difference matters.  I will wait and see some real testing.  So far we have a single sample size with no real testing done.  

[GoodBytes]

The problem with many things manufactured in China, is that the manufactures making a product for a company will met specifications at first... once everything passes, then they'll quickly find ways to cut corners... for example they'll replace less the plastic molds, they don't re-calibrate as often their machines, paint or pigments in plastic are cheaped out with different manufacture or reduce the amount put in. In other words, they try and maximize profit on the backs of their clients.

 

So in other words, Noctua gain profits as it cost less to manufacture in China, and can continue to justify their high price due to their reputation and brand value. But if they don't invest a lot in quality control, by verifying everything that is being outputting from Chinese factories than they'll quickly noticed that their fan will turn into those cheap dollar shop fans just colored... washed out beige ('cause they'll cheap on that too). So it is a constant battle with the manufactures. the moment Noctua will turn their back, cheaping out will start.

 

The big question is.... is it worth it? Well, clearly who ever is in charge think so.

In other words, this could be the end of Noctua, unless they are willing to go through the trouble, and all their projected numbers in profit will cut significantly, due to all the returns and constant battle with the manufacture sending teams to pretty much live there to QA everything that is produced (they won't, they go in batch sadly so bad apples will still reach consumer hands).

 

And what complicates thing further is the language barrier. Foxconn no problem.. they are so large that they have the staff, but the fans are certainly not made by them. Noctua probably went with smaller manufactures, as Foxconn order are only in massive amounts. So getting people speaking Austria or English to Chinese is less likely that they have (Very few people speak English in China. Full time professional translators are often required). So communication between the 2 is definitely difficult, and miss understanding due to translation issues is an issue as well to battle.

[System Error Message]

trying to gamble with your brand in all cases will result in it's demise. German car sales down all over the world as they cut quality.

[Misanthrope]

If I was buying cheaper fans I would agree with Noctua here and say if it doesn't affects performance fuck it. But this basically adds up to my main beef with Noctua: fans are so damn expensive and yet ugly. If on top of that I could expect inconsistent finish details it gets even harder for me to justify 25 bucks for a fucking fan. I mean if I needed above average performance for that price I should at least expect it to be damn near perfect otherwise I'd get one with stupid RGB at least.

[Doobeedoo]

Well that is really shame. I guess we also need to see usage comparison. But not good to start cutting corners on premium products. 

[Bananasplit_00]

53 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

The problem with many things manufactured in China, is that the manufactures making a product for a company will met specifications at first... once everything passes, then they'll quickly find ways to cut corners... for example they'll replace less the plastic molds, they don't re-calibrate as often their machines, paint or pigments in plastic are cheaped out with different manufacture or reduce the amount put in. In other words, they try and maximize profit on the backs.

 

So in other words, Noctua gain profits as it cost less to manufacture in China, and can continue to justify their high price due to their reputation and brand value. But if they don't invest a lot in quality control, by verifying everything that is being outputting from Chinese factories than they'll quickly noticed that their fan will turn into those cheap dollar shop fans just colored... washed out beige ('cause they'll cheap on that too). So it is a constant battle with the manufactures. the moment Noctua will turn their back, cheaping out will start.

 

The big question, is is it worth it? Well, clearly who ever is in charge think so.

In other words, this could be the end of Noctua, unless they are willing to go through the trouble, and all their projected numbers in profit will cut significantly, due to all the returns and constant battle with the manufacture sending teams to pretty much live there QA everything that is produced (they won't they go in batch).

 

And what complicates thing further is the language barrier. Foxconn no problem.. they are so large that they have the staff, but those are certain not made by them. They probably went smaller ones, and so getting people speaking Austria or English and Chinese is less likely that they have. So communication between the 2 is difficult, and miss understanding is an issue as well to battle.

Your grammar kinda ripped a bit but yah, if there isn't tight control this is going to be costly for Noctua in terms of brand reputation and trust. 

 

26 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

If I was buying cheaper fans I would agree with Noctua here and say if it doesn't affects performance fuck it. But this basically adds up to my main beef with Noctua: fans are so damn expensive and yet ugly. If on top of that I could expect inconsistent finish details it gets even harder for me to justify 25 bucks for a fucking fan. I mean if I needed above average performance for that price I should at least expect it to be damn near perfect otherwise I'd get one with stupid RGB at least.

They need to pay for the excellent customer support somehow I guess. But I will probably not buy anything new from Noctua, all I own that they have made is off the used market because if the prices. 

[Heesleemer]

I have both, i have older Chinese noctua fans. works about the same. a sample size of 1 isn't conclusive. 

[Misanthrope]

26 minutes ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

They need to pay for the excellent customer support somehow I guess. But I will probably not buy anything new from Noctua, all I own that they have made is off the used market because if the prices. 

Excellent customer support is better than nothing but trust me: If you neuter the customer support reps with such kind of policies like "Oh it's fine it won't affect performance!" no matter how many sweet talking Mexicans or Filipinos you put on the case you're not appeasing angry customers.

[dizmo]

Well that's unfortunate. Hopefully they get their shit together and start doing more frequent QA testing, with their own engineers. If they just recently moved to a new factory then I can see there being some initial growing pains. 

5 hours ago, SCHISCHKA said:

im not a fan of any manufacturing going to china. They just regularly screw up quality for negligible savings of retail price

Eh, give it time. It wasn't too long ago people were saying the same thing about Japan. 

5 hours ago, Bcat00 said:

Oh crap i better have a look at my new noctua fans which i bought during prime day.

 

Well then, just had a look at my two fans, seems one of them is made in china.

Time to play around with them and see if there's really any difference. if there is, i'll let you guys know

How did they compare out the box, just based on looks? Could you immediately tell which one was from China, or did you have to check? 

[BuckGup]

5 hours ago, SCHISCHKA said:

im not a fan of any manufacturing going to china. They just regularly screw up quality for negligible savings of retail price

Except 96% of all manufacturing is done in China. The stigma Oh it's made in China is sorta gone considering everything is made their. Doesn't mean it's garbage BUT I will agree China is full of knock offs and cheap parts

[pas008]

for the price they charge I wouldnt be surprised if some people actually receive actual knockoffs

[Ginger_]

4 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

The problem with many things manufactured in China, is that the manufactures making a product for a company will met specifications at first... once everything passes, then they'll quickly find ways to cut corners... for example they'll replace less the plastic molds, they don't re-calibrate as often their machines, paint or pigments in plastic are cheaped out with different manufacture or reduce the amount put in. In other words, they try and maximize profit on the backs.

 

 

I work for a small oem, that we sub contract out a big part of our final product to a company in China. This is exactly what we face. We approve a design, then slowly the quality degrades.

 

Hell one time he had a mould changed because we discovered a lot issue with a power connector coming loose from the battery, our fault because it was our design, so they said they tossed all their extra stock of the old bad pieces and charged us for it. Couple months later we start seeing a device here, device there that they put the old piece in. Plus probably a dozen times they've changed plastics, thinned certain parts etc.. 

 

Apparently from talking to other companies this is quite common from Chinese companies. I can only imagine noctua is going to face the same thing as well and if they don't catch them, as customers were screwed. 

[Dash Lambda]

I'll have to look more into this, but as it stands I'm sure as hell not buying a new Noctua fan until I know I'm not gambling.

I get really sick of this sort of thing. I've got nothing against China, but it seems whenever a company moves manufacturing there quality tanks. I don't even understand why that's the case -After all, China is the only place that makes honest-to-god good speedcubes. It's like companies aren't just moving to China, they're also going with the lowest bidder and putting blinders on their QC...