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Is Wireless FINALLY as fast as Wired??

5 minutes ago, Freeman said:

I struggle to understand this chase after transfer speed for home usage. My router can do 40Mb/s, but I´ve even hamstrung it down to 20 so that I can use the second band to DYI a repeater-ish thing from another 8 year old router which is surprisingly enough for 10 room house and surrounding property. I get 20Mb/s transfers when connected to the main router and about 5Mb/s when it has to go though both and I don´t really care. I just say what I want copied and it eventually does it, so who cares if it takes a while, it´s not as if it was me doing it, and if I want to transfer a lot of stuff, even a darn image of a disk, I can queue it up and it will get done eventually, it´s not as if I will ever need to transfer a ton of stuff all day every day.

When you have numerous devices streaming at once, multiple cameras streaming footage to storage NAS, and backups running near constantly, you'll tend to see the need for speed very quickly and "it will eventually get done" doesn't cut it when you backup over 1TB of data on a weekly basis.

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10 hours ago, King_of_Oz said:

I have a 9 dollar USB 2.0 TP-Link wifi adapter. Fight me.

You first need to find an ethernet cable so you can connect.

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10 hours ago, King_of_Oz said:

I have a 9 dollar USB 2.0 TP-Link wifi adapter. Fight me.

I used to have to use a USB wifi adapter, I know your struggle.

 

I'll forever stick to wired products whenever possible, much more reliable than wireless. Tried multiple wireless mice and just kept them plugged into the charger all of the time anyways, so I might as well have had a wired one. My friend uses a wireless Logitech headset and he's frequently having issues where his headset will die on him (in the middle of games, of all times) despite being plugged in. I'd much rather put up with wires than have to deal with my devices dying on me in the middle of games despite being plugged in or having devices that just aren't as fast as wired ones.

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15 minutes ago, dcb-z said:

I used to have to use a USB wifi adapter, I know your struggle.

 

I'll forever stick to wired products whenever possible, much more reliable than wireless. Tried multiple wireless mice and just kept them plugged into the charger all of the time anyways, so I might as well have had a wired one. My friend uses a wireless Logitech headset and he's frequently having issues where his headset will die on him (in the middle of games, of all times) despite being plugged in. I'd much rather put up with wires than have to deal with my devices dying on me in the middle of games despite being plugged in or having devices that just aren't as fast as wired ones.

With the exception of my server, everything of mine is wireless and my network is under a pretty heavy load (20 devices, including about ten that do 720p-1080p bluray streaming simultaneously) and I can still play competitive CSGO just fine (granted I'm only GN2/3, but I don't notice any issues with wifi vs. wired). Wireless is perfectly capable as long as you have good hardware and are reasonable with your setups. 

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7 hours ago, Razor512 said:

For 802.11ac, a single stream 433Mbps PHY connection, will give you about 300-320Mbps real world throughput under ideal conditions.

 

Typically a 3 stream AC1300 connection, will give you around 750-760Mbps under ideal conditions, and quad stream will give about 900-920Mbps. Additional streams do have diminishing returns. Sometimes a router maker can get a higher real world throughput by messing around with how high of an error and re-transmission rate they are willing to accept. Since the built in checks will prevent a corrupt frame from being accepted, some router makers will just accept a slightly higher error rate, that leads too an overall higher real world throughput.

 

It is why on some router reviews, you may see 3 different routers with the same exact WiFi radio, right down to the amplifiers filters, and all other front end components, and 2 of them will be giving about 500Mbps on a 2 stream connection, and one will be giving about 600Mbps. The higher speed is from them preferring a higher transfer rate over a lower error and re-transmission rate.

 

To see how your router behaves with error rates, do a LAN throughput benchmark, you will often see things like the speed starting really high, and then slow down and level off shortly after. During that initial burst, the data received by the benchmarking application is error free, If the device makers wanted, they could set it to just keep that high transfer rate, and just have the ECC work a little harder.

its nothing to do about the bandwidth, as i mentioned before in comparing the usage in low bandwidth situation (like WAN). Its just the inherit nature of wifi, put a load and you get much higher latency. Every difference can be noticed, things like power use and so on. Take a simple example, some websites will load faster on wire than wifi, its just the bandwidth + latency thing.

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13 hours ago, startrekkie1701 said:

The question I have is what laptop out there right now has a card that supports AD speeds? In this video that seems to be a fact that one forgot. As far as we know you're testing AC speeds at 60 Hz.

2.4Ghz = 802.11b/g/n

5Ghz = 802.11a/n/ac

60Ghz = 802.11ad

 

If they have graphs for 60Ghz (and are complaining about the signal failing to go through a box) it's 802.11ad. I think we can be pretty damn sure they're using 802.11ad given that 802.11ac is only on 5Ghz and not 60Ghz. Also the fact that they're complaining about limited options for clients says that they actually found a way to get an 802.11ad compatible client. I think it's fair to say that they found a NIC to get it to work given that they went through the effort of making a video.

 

And in any case their main issue with 802.11ad wasn't the speed. The speeds were decent and if anything probably less than what they could have gotten given the bottleneck of the 1Gbps wired connections. Their issue was with the range, usability and availability. Things which you can verify yourself by complaining on forums about how no laptops are available with 802.11ad built in and knowing just a little bit about the physics of wireless signals.

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5 hours ago, skywake said:

2.4Ghz = 802.11b/g/n

5Ghz = 802.11a/n/ac

60Ghz = 802.11ad

 

If they have graphs for 60Ghz (and are complaining about the signal failing to go through a box) it's 802.11ad. I think we can be pretty damn sure they're using 802.11ad given that 802.11ac is only on 5Ghz and not 60Ghz. Also the fact that they're complaining about limited options for clients says that they actually found a way to get an 802.11ad compatible client. I think it's fair to say that they found a NIC to get it to work given that they went through the effort of making a video.

 

And in any case their main issue with 802.11ad wasn't the speed. The speeds were decent and if anything probably less than what they could have gotten given the bottleneck of the 1Gbps wired connections. Their issue was with the range, usability and availability. Things which you can verify yourself by complaining on forums about how no laptops are available with 802.11ad built in and knowing just a little bit about the physics of wireless signals.

 

There actually is a laptop with built-in AD. Its the Acer TravelMate and if you look you can see that's what they are using :) 

 

http://www.networkworld.com/article/3117803/computers/acer-travelmate-802-11ad-notebook-an-industry-first-you-might-never-need-or-use.html

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TBH , 5ghz already has a hard time getting coverage in my entire home , and 2.4ghz still outpaces the max speed of my connection .

60ghz is fast and all , but i don't see the point of wireless  if i have to be in line of sight from the router .Might have a purpose for business use , but i can't see myself using it in-home.

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On 6/25/2017 at 2:15 PM, King_of_Oz said:

I have a 9 dollar USB 2.0 TP-Link wifi adapter. Fight me.

here ya go

59512372c5fec_USBTo56KbpsRJ11EthernetDialupFaxModem1-1700x1700.thumb.jpg.b96e5f712b457773ab4aaf87f67772cd.jpg

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44 minutes ago, Coaxialgamer said:

but i don't see the point of wireless  if i have to be in line of sight from the router

VR

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1 hour ago, Coaxialgamer said:

here ya go

59512372c5fec_USBTo56KbpsRJ11EthernetDialupFaxModem1-1700x1700.thumb.jpg.b96e5f712b457773ab4aaf87f67772cd.jpg

I have an Ethernet port, just not a wire.

 

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18 hours ago, Lurick said:

When you have numerous devices streaming at once, multiple cameras streaming footage to storage NAS, and backups running near constantly, you'll tend to see the need for speed very quickly and "it will eventually get done" doesn't cut it when you backup over 1TB of data on a weekly basis.

Well, producing 1TB of a data in a week and backing that up is more of a professional setting. And still, I don´t see why you would want to do backups over air. I use wireless when checking integrity of the data, but then the speed isn´t important, it´s rather the number of clients and requests that can be supported at one time and the latency on the requests.

As for the data, I even my network runs on full load less than an hour per day and most of the time, very little is going on, and I even work from home and do regular backups of my documents.

But hey, that´s why I´ve asked, I´m curious about bandwidth utilization of other ppl, what is it your use case then, 1TB/week seems a whole lot.

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38 minutes ago, Freeman said:

Well, producing 1TB of a data in a week and backing that up is more of a professional setting. And still, I don´t see why you would want to do backups over air. I use wireless when checking integrity of the data, but then the speed isn´t important, it´s rather the number of clients and requests that can be supported at one time and the latency on the requests.

As for the data, I even my network runs on full load less than an hour per day and most of the time, very little is going on, and I even work from home and do regular backups of my documents.

But hey, that´s why I´ve asked, I´m curious about bandwidth utilization of other ppl, what is it your use case then, 1TB/week seems a whole lot.

I have a Plex Server, and when ingesting new Blu-Ray rips, getting max speed is very important.

 

Alternatively, having fast WIFI is very important for serving out those Blu-Ray rips over multiple clients at 1080p. I live in a Townhouse where it's impractical to wire up via Ethernet, and the wiring is Aluminum, so Powerline Ethernet is actually slower than Good WIFI.

Granted, Wireless AD wouldn't be much use to me personally, but the strive for faster WIFI in general is most definitely important.

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7 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

I have a Plex Server, and when ingesting new Blu-Ray rips, getting max speed is very important.

 

Alternatively, having fast WIFI is very important for serving out those Blu-Ray rips over multiple clients at 1080p. I live in a Townhouse where it's impractical to wire up via Ethernet, and the wiring is Aluminum, so Powerline Ethernet is actually slower than Good WIFI.

Granted, Wireless AD wouldn't be much use to me personally, but the strive for faster WIFI in general is most definitely important.

While I don´t see why fast ingests are important, yep, good BR has about 35Mb/s bitrate, so if a whole family watches movies at the same time and wants to watch different movies, we are talking 170Mb/s, actually surprising how much that hogs down.

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Just now, Freeman said:

While I don´t see why fast ingests are important, yep, good BR has about 35Mb/s bitrate, so if a whole family watches movies at the same time and wants to watch different movies, we are talking 170Mb/s, actually surprising how much that hogs down.

Fast ingest is because I'm a busy person, and while I'm ingesting, I'm potentially bogging down the network. Plus, I may be ripping multiple Blu-Rays at once. For example, an entire season of a show I bought on Blu-Ray.


Certainly I could just wait and use a slower speed, but why the hell should I do that when there are technologies that can help me do it faster?

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7 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Fast ingest is because I'm a busy person, and while I'm ingesting, I'm potentially bogging down the network. Plus, I may be ripping multiple Blu-Rays at once. For example, an entire season of a show I bought on Blu-Ray.


Certainly I could just wait and use a slower speed, but why the hell should I do that when there are technologies that can help me do it faster?

Well, seems that we implement a different approach. I just set a low priority on whatever thing is about to take a long time, queue everything up and forget about it. Since I really don´t like waiting, even half a minute wait is annoying, so let the machine deal with it...

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3 minutes ago, Freeman said:

Well, seems that we implement a different approach. I just set a low priority on whatever thing is about to take a long time, queue everything up and forget about it. Since I really don´t like waiting, even half a minute wait is annoying, so let the machine deal with it...

True but if I have a lot of other stuff to do, perhaps with that same machine, faster is still better.

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Just now, dalekphalm said:

True but if I have a lot of other stuff to do, perhaps with that same machine, faster is still better.

I also frequently do file transfers, and I personally like to watch the transfer finish otherwise I get paranoid that the copy didn't complete properly. Plus there are also times when Windows Update decides whatever the computer is running isn't important and that it's time for a restart. So, fast transfers are important.....not that I can have that, my wifi is so burdened down with everything on it that I get like 15MB/s max over 5ghz ac. 

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1 hour ago, djdwosk97 said:

I also frequently do file transfers, and I personally like to watch the transfer finish otherwise I get paranoid that the copy didn't complete properly. Plus there are also times when Windows Update decides whatever the computer is running isn't important and that it's time for a restart. So, fast transfers are important.....not that I can have that, my wifi is so burdened down with everything on it that I get like 15MB/s max over 5ghz ac. 

Then you need to take back command of your machine. Don´t let M$ dictate what you do :) .

1 hour ago, dalekphalm said:

True but if I have a lot of other stuff to do, perhaps with that same machine, faster is still better.

Yep, I just assign one thread and 20% lowest priority on the network so it doesn´t really impact anything.

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3 hours ago, King_of_Oz said:

I have an Ethernet port, just not a wire.

that's a 56k dial up to usb adapter

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3 hours ago, djdwosk97 said:

VR

would ad have the throughput and latency for that though?

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24 minutes ago, Coaxialgamer said:

would ad have the throughput and latency for that though?

No idea, but I remember a couple years ago there was a lot of talk about how ad would solve the annoying wired vr issue. Whether or not there was any truth to that talk or just wishful thinking is beyond my knowledge. 

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3 hours ago, Coaxialgamer said:

that's a 56k dial up to usb adapter

Oh. *realises how lucky he is*

 

Since I am to lazy to put something interesting here, I will put everything, but slightly abbreviated. Here is everything:

 

42

 

also, some questions to make you wonder about life:

 

What is I and who is me? Who is you? Which armrest in the movie theatre is yours?

 

also,

 

Welcome to the internet, I will be your guide. Or something.

 

 

My build:

CPU: Intel Core i5-7400 3.0GHz Quad-Core Processor,

 Motherboard: ASRock B250M Pro4 Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard, 

Memory: Corsair 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR4-2133 Memory,

Storage: Seagate Barracuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive, 

Video Card: MSI Radeon RX 480 4GB ARMOR OC Video Card, 

Case: Corsair 100R ATX Mid Tower Case , 

Power Supply: Corsair CXM 450W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply, 

Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 Home Full, 

Wireless Network Adapter: TP-Link TL-WN725N USB 2.0 802.11b/g/n Wi-Fi Adapter, Case Fan: Corsair Air Series White 2 pack 52.2 CFM  120mm Fan

 

ou do not ask why, you ask why not -me

 

Remeber kinds, the only differ between screwing around and scince is writing it down. -Adam Savage.

 

Only two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not even sure of the former. - Albert Einstein.

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7 hours ago, djdwosk97 said:

No idea, but I remember a couple years ago there was a lot of talk about how ad would solve the annoying wired vr issue. Whether or not there was any truth to that talk or just wishful thinking is beyond my knowledge. 

Probably a bit of both. If it's going to happen it'll be with either ad or something along those lines. The question is whether or not the latency would be low enough for it to be usable. No tether would be great but it's of little value if the walls are covered in vomit....

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