Buying Ryzen? Confused about ram? Read here

[Calico Morgan]

So your information suggests that 4x8gb RAM Isn't so great as of a couple months ago. Is this still the case? I'd like to get 4x8gb G SKill Trident RGB, but if four dimms isn't so hot atm, would you suggest getting 2x8gb and waiting to fill those other two slots until a suitable bios update releases? It's not ideal, but if it's my only option I can do that if you think it's best. 
I'm planning on a B350 MicroATX (MSI for now as it has the fan headers I need) and I really want to fill those four RAM slots with RGB goodness. 

BTW, @stealth80, great post, great data, it was a huge pleasure reading that very informative post. I greatly appreciate it. 

[Jon Jon]

This is a great thread!

 

I have had people around here try to call me crazy for pushing DDR4 3200 for Ryzen!

28 minutes ago, Calico Morgan said:

So your information suggests that 4x8gb RAM Isn't so great as of a couple months ago. Is this still the case? I'd like to get 4x8gb G SKill Trident RGB, but if four dimms isn't so hot atm, would you suggest getting 2x8gb and waiting to fill those other two slots until a suitable bios update releases? It's not ideal, but if it's my only option I can do that if you think it's best. 
I'm planning on a B350 MicroATX (MSI for now as it has the fan headers I need) and I really want to fill those four RAM slots with RGB goodness. 

BTW, @stealth80, great post, great data, it was a huge pleasure reading that very informative post. I greatly appreciate it. 

Do you really need more than 16GB of RAM?

 

I would wait if it isn't necessary.

 

Also, I wouldn't get an MSI Ryzen board, especially not a B350 one!

[Columbo]

54 minutes ago, Jon Jon said:

This is a great thread!

 

I have had people around here try to call me crazy for pushing DDR4 3200 for Ryzen!

Do you really need more than 16GB of RAM?

 

I would wait if it isn't necessary.

 

Also, I wouldn't get an MSI Ryzen board, especially not a B350 one!

I have a Ryzen B350 Gaming Pro Carbon. MSI is one of the big 3 motherboard manufacturers. ASUS, MSI and Gigabyte. The AM4 platform is brand new. They release bios updates regularly. I bought a R3 1200 as a test processor for the AM4 platform. I have a Team Dark Pro 8GB kit rated @ 3200mhz. I have it dialed in @ 3200mhz with timings of 16-17-17-38 with the voltage ticked up to 1.38V. The rated speed is 16-16-16-36 @ 1.35v.

 

True some of the early bios of specific motherboards are bad but with new bios versions. Things change a great deal. My kit is not a Ryzen approved/endorsed kit. With bios updates essentially every kit should run at their rated speeds. I am quite happy with the performance of the Ryzen platform right now. 

 

Ideally for OCing ram you want no more than two sticks of ram. Motherboards are not as stable in the ram department with 4 sticks. They still work at the rated speeds but usually lack the headroom for Ocing or require looser timings to achieve desired ram speeds. 

[JohnStone]

I was wondering if i could use 2x single and 2x dual ranked ram,both at 2400mhz ( it's gonna be a waste of the single ranked ram's frequency since it can support up to 2667mhz but my motherboard only has 4gb sticks available on 2667mhz at it's qualified ventor's list and i'm not so sure if they could work properly if i would buy 2x4gb single ranked 2667mhz and later on 2x8gb dual ranked 2400mhz..it might just work with the lowest frequency but maybe won't recognise them at the system at all )
In case they're working together,i'm just gonna go with them and possibly overclock them.
I hope you guys keep it like that!!

[Calico Morgan]

20 hours ago, Jon Jon said:

This is a great thread!

 

I have had people around here try to call me crazy for pushing DDR4 3200 for Ryzen!

Do you really need more than 16GB of RAM?

 

I would wait if it isn't necessary.

 

Also, I wouldn't get an MSI Ryzen board, especially not a B350 one!

Lots of people are saying don't use MSI Ryzen boards, but offer no reason why. The MSI board I'm going to be using is the only Micro ATX AM4 board with the headers I need for my build, so without extremely convincing reasons, I can't ditch it.
Also, I have to get a B350, as the X series AM4 mobo's aren't out in Micro ATX for some reason. My build is specifically a Micro build.

Plus I've seen a LOT of data suggesting the differences between the two board types are basically negligible, as long as you don't care much about the audio, and expansion. OCing seems to be identical on both board levels. I believe Hardwarecanucks did a video on this.

 

Regardless, unless someone can link to me an X series board that comes in Micro ATX form factor, I think I'm sticking with the MSI B350.

 

(32gb isn't necessary...but it's a pretty number...and stuff...)

 

19 hours ago, Columbo said:

I have a Ryzen B350 Gaming Pro Carbon. MSI is one of the big 3 motherboard manufacturers. ASUS, MSI and Gigabyte. The AM4 platform is brand new. They release bios updates regularly. I bought a R3 1200 as a test processor for the AM4 platform. I have a Team Dark Pro 8GB kit rated @ 3200mhz. I have it dialed in @ 3200mhz with timings of 16-17-17-38 with the voltage ticked up to 1.38V. The rated speed is 16-16-16-36 @ 1.35v.

 

True some of the early bios of specific motherboards are bad but with new bios versions. Things change a great deal. My kit is not a Ryzen approved/endorsed kit. With bios updates essentially every kit should run at their rated speeds. I am quite happy with the performance of the Ryzen platform right now. 

 

Ideally for OCing ram you want no more than two sticks of ram. Motherboards are not as stable in the ram department with 4 sticks. They still work at the rated speeds but usually lack the headroom for Ocing or require looser timings to achieve desired ram speeds. 

You're talking about overclocking the RAM specifically, right? I'm not interested in squeezing every last drop of power and speed from my RAM, so should I be okay getting RAM that is rated for, say, 2666Mhz out of the box? If I get 4x8 2666Mhz, will it run at 2666 but not OC any further? I can live with that. I don't want to get 2666 RAM that will run at 2133 or something. 

Sorry, I'm very new to all of this. This particular matter confuses me greatly. I started out feeling confident, based on other people's reviews, that I could buy any RAM and have it work. Now I feel trapped by the MSI compatibility chart (the RAM I really would like to have is not on there). 

[Columbo]

46 minutes ago, Calico Morgan said:

Lots of people are saying don't use MSI Ryzen boards, but offer no reason why. The MSI board I'm going to be using is the only Micro ATX AM4 board with the headers I need for my build, so without extremely convincing reasons, I can't ditch it.
Also, I have to get a B350, as the X series AM4 mobo's aren't out in Micro ATX for some reason. My build is specifically a Micro build.

Plus I've seen a LOT of data suggesting the differences between the two board types are basically negligible, as long as you don't care much about the audio, and expansion. OCing seems to be identical on both board levels. I believe Hardwarecanucks did a video on this.

 

Regardless, unless someone can link to me an X series board that comes in Micro ATX form factor, I think I'm sticking with the MSI B350.

 

(32gb isn't necessary...but it's a pretty number...and stuff...)

 

You're talking about overclocking the RAM specifically, right? I'm not interested in squeezing every last drop of power and speed from my RAM, so should I be okay getting RAM that is rated for, say, 2666Mhz out of the box? If I get 4x8 2666Mhz, will it run at 2666 but not OC any further? I can live with that. I don't want to get 2666 RAM that will run at 2133 or something. 

Sorry, I'm very new to all of this. This particular matter confuses me greatly. I started out feeling confident, based on other people's reviews, that I could buy any RAM and have it work. Now I feel trapped by the MSI compatibility chart (the RAM I really would like to have is not on there). 

I have a MSI B350 Gaming Pro Carbon. I heard what some said about MSI motherboards but disregarded it completely because the bios on the AM4 platform are brand new. The platform is only 5 or 6 months old and motherboard manufacturers have been releasing bios updates every couple of weeks. My motherboard is a high end B350 but the B350 is the mid grade motherboard. Higher end VRM's and components but a middle of the road chipset. 

 

Your ram will default to 2133mhz. Do not try the XMP profiles because the bios and AM4 platform probably at this time will not boot. Make sure before you change any settings, core clock or ram speed and timings to update the bios to the latest version. MSI makes it easy, a blank USB stick (with bios file) and push the M-flash button in the bios. After that you should be able to get your ram speed up to 2666mhz. But doing it manually with loose timings is a must and then you tighten the timings as close to rated timings on your ram stick with each reboot. 

 

The problem with Ryzen has always been memory. Don't waste your money buying Ryzen approved sticks. All the memory sticks will eventually work at rated speeds once manufacturers get their AM4 bios running well. I didn't buy a Ryzen approved kit. I bought Team Dark Pro 3200mhz memory in an 8GB kit because it wasn't the least expensive 3200mhz kit at the time. 

[Jon Jon]

1 hour ago, Calico Morgan said:

Lots of people are saying don't use MSI Ryzen boards, but offer no reason why. The MSI board I'm going to be using is the only Micro ATX AM4 board with the headers I need for my build, so without extremely convincing reasons, I can't ditch it.
Also, I have to get a B350, as the X series AM4 mobo's aren't out in Micro ATX for some reason. My build is specifically a Micro build.

Plus I've seen a LOT of data suggesting the differences between the two board types are basically negligible, as long as you don't care much about the audio, and expansion. OCing seems to be identical on both board levels. I believe Hardwarecanucks did a video on this.

 

Regardless, unless someone can link to me an X series board that comes in Micro ATX form factor, I think I'm sticking with the MSI B350.

 

(32gb isn't necessary...but it's a pretty number...and stuff...)

 

You're talking about overclocking the RAM specifically, right? I'm not interested in squeezing every last drop of power and speed from my RAM, so should I be okay getting RAM that is rated for, say, 2666Mhz out of the box? If I get 4x8 2666Mhz, will it run at 2666 but not OC any further? I can live with that. I don't want to get 2666 RAM that will run at 2133 or something. 

Sorry, I'm very new to all of this. This particular matter confuses me greatly. I started out feeling confident, based on other people's reviews, that I could buy any RAM and have it work. Now I feel trapped by the MSI compatibility chart (the RAM I really would like to have is not on there). 

It's specifically for the VRMs on their boards.

 

There are some issues and concerns with them running Ryzen 7 or even Ryzen 5 with an OC.

 

32GB kits don't really support the higher RAM speeds.

 

From what I've read, since all 16GB DIMMs are dual rank, you will be locked at a 2666mhz max frequency.

 

Unless you need the RAM (which honestly, I would say the majority of the people around here do not, as it seems like most people just game), then get a certified 16GB kit.

 

I run OBS streaming along with my gaming and I can tell you I do not come close to maxing out 16GB.

 

When the time comes where you need more, chances are either motherboards will have better support to compensate for the IMC, or, more probable, Zen 2 will be out with those IMC corrections and you can just upgrade without worry. I will be doing the latter route when I feel this thing can't do what I need it to do anymore.

 

People saying to NOT get a Ryzen certified kit, to me, just like to gamble with their money.

 

When investing into a new platform, I am not big on sparing expenses and cheaping out. You just pay for it or regret it in the long term. If you are making an investment, don't be penny wise and dollar foolish.

 

I bought DDR3 1600 RAM back in 2010 for my Phenom II X4 965 build. I am happy I did, since that RAM went into my Ivy Bridge build two years later, along with another DDR3 1600 kit. That machine lasted me until last month, when I invested in Ryzen. If I cheaped out 7 years ago, I would have regretted it in the long term.

[Calico Morgan]

55 minutes ago, Columbo said:

I have a MSI B350 Gaming Pro Carbon. I heard what some said about MSI motherboards but disregarded it completely because the bios on the AM4 platform are brand new. The platform is only 5 or 6 months old and motherboard manufacturers have been releasing bios updates every couple of weeks. My motherboard is a high end B350 but the B350 is the mid grade motherboard. Higher end VRM's and components but a middle of the road chipset. 

 

Your ram will default to 2133mhz. Do not try the XMP profiles because the bios and AM4 platform probably at this time will not boot. Make sure before you change any settings, core clock or ram speed and timings to update the bios to the latest version. MSI makes it easy, a blank USB stick (with bios file) and push the M-flash button in the bios. After that you should be able to get your ram speed up to 2666mhz. But doing it manually with loose timings is a must and then you tighten the timings as close to rated timings on your ram stick with each reboot. 

 

The problem with Ryzen has always been memory. Don't waste your money buying Ryzen approved sticks. All the memory sticks will eventually work at rated speeds once manufacturers get their AM4 bios running well. I didn't buy a Ryzen approved kit. I bought Team Dark Pro 3200mhz memory in an 8GB kit because it wasn't the least expensive 3200mhz kit at the time. 

I'm happy with 2666Mhz. I've seen testing on workloads similar to what mine will be and that speed seems to be near the plateau of cost/speed/latency/etc. So if 32 gigs will more or less cap at 2666Mhz, that's actually what I'd like.
And I just got a fresh USB stick specifically for bios update, so I should be good as far as that goes. 
I think I really don't have any plans to OC all that much, at least not the RAM. I'd like to hit that number, but aside form that, I have no desire to go crazy (yet).
Thanks for the info.

31 minutes ago, Jon Jon said:

It's specifically for the VRMs on their boards.

 

There are some issues and concerns with them running Ryzen 7 or even Ryzen 5 with an OC.

 

32GB kits don't really support the higher RAM speeds.

 

From what I've read, since all 16GB DIMMs are dual rank, you will be locked at a 2666mhz max frequency.

 

Unless you need the RAM (which honestly, I would say the majority of the people around here do not, as it seems like most people just game), then get a certified 16GB kit.

 

I run OBS streaming along with my gaming and I can tell you I do not come close to maxing out 16GB.

 

When the time comes where you need more, chances are either motherboards will have better support to compensate for the IMC, or, more probable, Zen 2 will be out with those IMC corrections and you can just upgrade without worry. I will be doing the latter route when I feel this thing can't do what I need it to do anymore.

 

People saying to NOT get a Ryzen certified kit, to me, just like to gamble with their money.

 

When investing into a new platform, I am not big on sparing expenses and cheaping out. You just pay for it or regret it in the long term. If you are making an investment, don't be penny wise and dollar foolish.

 

I bought DDR3 1600 RAM back in 2010 for my Phenom II X4 965 build. I am happy I did, since that RAM went into my Ivy Bridge build two years later, along with another DDR3 1600 kit. That machine lasted me until last month, when I invested in Ryzen. If I cheaped out 7 years ago, I would have regretted it in the long term.

Yeah, I think I don't need too high speed of RAM, so I'm hoping (as I mentioned above) to just hit 2666Mhz and leave it there. Seems to be a sweet spot for Ryzen 5. I'd like 32 gigs to fill my four slots with RAM that'll feed my 1600 through what will be a crap ton of video editing and production self-teaching + after effects, as well as the usual streaming/gaming/workstation stuff. 

And I TOTALLY agree with you on the investment sentiment. I'm going into this build with the mind set that this is a very serious investment with which I'll be honing new and old skills in a way that (finally) will not have hardware bottlenecks keeping me from moving forward. 
The Ryzen 5 1600 is perfect for me, but my selfish desires are driving me toward 32 gigs of Trident Z lol.

In short, I gotta get those RGB sticks working for me, but I don't want to crap all over my R5 with dimms that just don't work up to spec.

 

Thanks for the info btw. 

[Jon Jon]

1 hour ago, Calico Morgan said:

I'm happy with 2666Mhz. I've seen testing on workloads similar to what mine will be and that speed seems to be near the plateau of cost/speed/latency/etc. So if 32 gigs will more or less cap at 2666Mhz, that's actually what I'd like.
And I just got a fresh USB stick specifically for bios update, so I should be good as far as that goes. 
I think I really don't have any plans to OC all that much, at least not the RAM. I'd like to hit that number, but aside form that, I have no desire to go crazy (yet).
Thanks for the info.

Yeah, I think I don't need too high speed of RAM, so I'm hoping (as I mentioned above) to just hit 2666Mhz and leave it there. Seems to be a sweet spot for Ryzen 5. I'd like 32 gigs to fill my four slots with RAM that'll feed my 1600 through what will be a crap ton of video editing and production self-teaching + after effects, as well as the usual streaming/gaming/workstation stuff. 

And I TOTALLY agree with you on the investment sentiment. I'm going into this build with the mind set that this is a very serious investment with which I'll be honing new and old skills in a way that (finally) will not have hardware bottlenecks keeping me from moving forward. 
The Ryzen 5 1600 is perfect for me, but my selfish desires are driving me toward 32 gigs of Trident Z lol.

In short, I gotta get those RGB sticks working for me, but I don't want to crap all over my R5 with dimms that just don't work up to spec.

 

Thanks for the info btw. 

If that's the case, then just go for it!

The Wraith Spire is a solid starter cooler as well.

 

The beauty of AM4 is, further down the road, you do have the option to get an 8 Core Zen 2 chip if needed.

 

I plan to stick with what I have for a few years, with the exception of my video card.

 

When I feel like I need extra horse power, Zen 2 should be here (potentially Zen 3, if it is supported on AM4) for an easy upgrade!

[Calico Morgan]

2 minutes ago, Jon Jon said:

If that's the case, then just go for it!

The Wraith Spire is a solid starter cooler as well.

 

The beauty of AM4 is, further down the road, you do have the option to get an 8 Core Zen 2 chip if needed.

 

I plan to stick with what I have for a few years, with the exception of my video card.

 

When I feel like I need extra horse power, Zen 2 should be here (potentially Zen 3, if it is supported on AM4) for an easy upgrade!

100%. Having that expandibility is kind of everything. In my mind, it's the biggest thing that keeps PC viable. For me, I'm hoping motherboard manufacturers continue to build on their MicroATX technology so that I don't run into problems in the future as far as that expandibility goes. I'll be ready for the coming Zen gens (unless there's a major change in RAM).

I'll try not to go too off topic here, so thanks for the advice, really helps the decision making process. 

[Jon Jon]

10 minutes ago, Calico Morgan said:

100%. Having that expandibility is kind of everything. In my mind, it's the biggest thing that keeps PC viable. For me, I'm hoping motherboard manufacturers continue to build on their MicroATX technology so that I don't run into problems in the future as far as that expandibility goes. I'll be ready for the coming Zen gens (unless there's a major change in RAM).

I'll try not to go too off topic here, so thanks for the advice, really helps the decision making process. 

TBH, I expect the Zen+ to fix the issues we have seen with IMC, so I am expecting far better RAM compatibility from the newer chips.

[Botlike]

I wanted to have 32GB Trident Z RGB to go along with my Ryzen 7 1700. I focused maximum clock over everything else. So I got 2x 16GB DDR4-3600 CL17. My result: It was running nicely @2933MHz, but I was unable to push it ANY higher. So I returned it. Just ordered the same kit, but DDR4-3200 CL14 this time. Maybe I can get it working at 3200. If not: It's not that bad, so I got at least better timings this time.

[stealth80]

Sorry for the delays guys, ive been away with work and couldn't access the site.

 

To summarise, not much has changed since release, only compatibility has got better. Still try and use 2x sticks and single sided where possible for fastest speeds and lowest chances of compat issues

[noktek]

Hi folks, i just freshly registered to ask one question: does all of this apply to threadripper too? I am fairly pc-hardware-naive and i am building a workstation with rendering purposes so im wondering what sort of ram i should throw in. people seem to mention 3200 and above and i really like the reccomendations here but im not sure if its all meant for threadripper too?

[stealth80]

4 hours ago, noktek said:

Hi folks, i just freshly registered to ask one question: does all of this apply to threadripper too? I am fairly pc-hardware-naive and i am building a workstation with rendering purposes so im wondering what sort of ram i should throw in. people seem to mention 3200 and above and i really like the reccomendations here but im not sure if its all meant for threadripper too?

if you can, get CL14 3200 or CL16 3600, remember threadripped is quad channel so you ideally want 4 sticks

[noktek]

Would these be OK? It says Cas latency 18

https://www.digitec.ch/en/Product/6079892

[stealth80]

5 hours ago, noktek said:

Would these be OK? It says Cas latency 18

https://www.digitec.ch/en/Product/6079892

They will work, but you may have issues running 3000mhz on XMP, they will more than likely need some adjustments as per the guide =)

[noktek]

So! Ram installed and everything working and indeed not going past 3066,,, unstable until 3333 where it turns into not booting and a CMOS reset is needed...

ill try fiddling with the V later but im also thinking of maybe just leaving as is...

[stealth80]

3 hours ago, noktek said:

So! Ram installed and everything working and indeed not going past 3066,,, unstable until 3333 where it turns into not booting and a CMOS reset is needed...

ill try fiddling with the V later but im also thinking of maybe just leaving as is...

The performance difference between 2933 and 3200mhz isn't massive. If you have concerns about damaging the ram then leave at 2933mhz as I can not guarantee that over volting wont kill it. Mine is running 1.42v to achieve 3200mhz. 

You could also try increasing tRAS to around 62, mine is very unstable at default 54.

[noktek]

3200 14 14 14 42 seems stable at auto settings (1.35 ddr voltage and 0.9SOC i believe).. i did try to increase ddr and soc V but it kinda didnt have a great effect i believe unless making me a bit nervous and uncomfortable lol! thanks for your help:)

 

edit: and tRas is something really low, like 38 by default i think... does this make any sense? i cant recall if i increased it and cant check because im running memtest856 (successfully!)

[stealth80]

23 hours ago, noktek said:

3200 14 14 14 42 seems stable at auto settings (1.35 ddr voltage and 0.9SOC i believe).. i did try to increase ddr and soc V but it kinda didnt have a great effect i believe unless making me a bit nervous and uncomfortable lol! thanks for your help:)

 

edit: and tRas is something really low, like 38 by default i think... does this make any sense? i cant recall if i increased it and cant check because im running memtest856 (successfully!)

if its stable as is just leave it at that

[stealth80]

15 hours ago, biko24 said:

So my crucial ballistix elite 3466mhz out of the box is running at 3466mhz but timings are 18,21,21,21,49. Do i leave it at this timings or i lover timing and lower speed to 3000mhz?  Thanks for anwser.

You could try and lower the timings at 3466mhz, I have found that my ram on Ryzen is very sensitive to tRAS, lowering that makes it unstable. So you could try say 16-18-18-18-49, if it doesn't work try a little more DDRv. If it is still unstable I would stick at 3466

[ISUther]

Hello,

I am currently looking for parts for my new build.
AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X
I have not selected motherboard or ram.
But i am aiming for 128gb ram

What ram would you sudgest?
(Note!! if i dont gave money to buy instantly 128 gb ram i would go with 64gb but in the way that i can by later extra without throwing allready purchased ones out of pc)
Can you list 1-3 options that i should go for and what mb would you take with that ram?

This is a bit urgent as my old PC is stoping me to do 3D.

I play games also time to time but main focus in 3D

I use Houdini and Houdini uses Mantra renderer. That is CPU rendering engine. I plan also start using V-ray (used CPU and gpu)
I do simulations in houdini that also uses CPU and needs a lot of ram.
 

 

[stealth80]

13 hours ago, ISUther said:

Hello,

I am currently looking for parts for my new build.
AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1950X
I have not selected motherboard or ram.
But i am aiming for 128gb ram

What ram would you sudgest?
(Note!! if i dont gave money to buy instantly 128 gb ram i would go with 64gb but in the way that i can by later extra without throwing allready purchased ones out of pc)
Can you list 1-3 options that i should go for and what mb would you take with that ram?

This is a bit urgent as my old PC is stoping me to do 3D.

I play games also time to time but main focus in 3D

I use Houdini and Houdini uses Mantra renderer. That is CPU rendering engine. I plan also start using V-ray (used CPU and gpu)
I do simulations in houdini that also uses CPU and needs a lot of ram.
 

 

Ok ram:

 

https://pcpartpicker.com/products/memory/#Z=16384002&L=140&s=403200

 

or

 

https://pcpartpicker.com/products/memory/#Z=16384002&L=160&s=403600

 

It aint cheap at the moment and I would still go with Samsung B die

 

as for the board, its really down to preference imo as theres very little between them feature wise, I ilike the X399 Designaire, but I would do some research on VRM's etc

[thanulee]

Hey guys, so im getting a x399 Taichi board for 1950X TR. Is this ram ok https://www.gskill.com/en/product/f4-3200c16q-64gtzsw ? Or this https://www.skroutz.gr/s/8855203/G-Skill-TridentZ-64GB-DDR4-3200MHz-F4-3200C14Q-64GTZ.html?from=favorites_popup ? Both do not appear in QVL. Im far from technical on this so i just need recommendations. Also tell me if this board is ok or if i should look other combos.
I need this for 3d rendering so stability is no1 for me. I dont even know if the 3200 speeds will have advantages when rendering instead of gaming? Any tips/thoughts appreciated! thanks