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NF-F12/ NF-A14, ML120/140 Pro, SilentWings 3

The_Legionnaire
Go to solution Solved by WoodenMarker,
5 hours ago, The_Legionnaire said:

To respond to the unknowns; I'm building in a define mini c, and getting new fans because the old ones i had are going bad. 

I dont have any HDD in the system for silence. im running the fans at the lowest possible rpm (sub 700).

The case is completely free of obstructions to inhibit airflow. 

Im going for as quiet as i can go, yes im aware the fans  seem stupidly expensive for my budget but im just going to get the best i can now instead of upgrading again later.

If the stock fans are going bad, you should be able to contact Fractal Design for replacements.

If you didn't find them quiet enough, PW2's would be cheaper options that are still very quiet. Unless you're replacing your psu and graphics card fans as well, I don't see much sense in spending more.

https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/product/4GsKHx/be-quiet-case-fan-bl047

https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/product/fkCwrH/be-quiet-case-fan-bl046

I'm looking to upgrade my case fans and cant decide between these 3. I'm not worried about the color. I'm just look for some help for picking which set to go with. Price isnt much of a fact since they are so close in price.

For context (if needed) I have an EVGA 1060 6gb ftw, i-5 6500 on a 212 evo. Thanks in advance.

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None of those are really case fans, and you don't need more case fans for a build like that. 

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Just now, Nimrodor said:

None of those are really case fans, and you don't need more case fans for a build like that. 

I have one fan working right now.... I need a new ones and I'm a bit of a silence freak.

 

 

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Silent wings 3's are pretty damn good imo. And stay decently quiet at theyre highest rpm.

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CPU: R5 3600 || GPU: RTX 3070|| Memory: 32GB @ 3200 || Cooler: Scythe Big Shuriken || PSU: 650W EVGA GM || Case: NR200P

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1 minute ago, Nimrodor said:
  Reveal hidden contents

120mm Fans by dBA

The Arctic F12's have the best unrestricted airflow acoustic efficiency (CFM/db) of any fan on this list, making them the quietest case fans. They also have FDB bearings and are absurdly cheap at less than $25 for 5.

You have experience with these fan? Not just reviews and product descriptions?

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Just now, The_Legionnaire said:

You have experience with these fan? Not just reviews and product descriptions?

 

Yes, I have two of these fans. Huge step up from my old Enermax TB's which were inaudible but pushed no air. 

 

Also, if you don't trust an anemometer and microphone, what can you trust? 

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Just now, Nimrodor said:

 

Yes, I have two of these fans. Huge step up from my old Enermax TB's which were inaudible but pushed no air. 

 

Also, if you don't trust an anemometer and microphone, what can you trust? 

I was more getting at the reliability of the fans, I am looking at various reviews of the right now. It's more of just being skeptical of a brand I've never heard of before.

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26 minutes ago, Nimrodor said:

None of those are really case fans, and you don't need more case fans for a build like that. 

They're case fans--any fan that uses standard case mounts fits in that category.

24 minutes ago, The_Legionnaire said:

I have one fan working right now.... I need a new ones and I'm a bit of a silence freak.

What case and case fans are you currently using and what speed are you running them at?

NF-A14's and SW3's would be the quietest from the list. NF-A14's perform a bit better if you're running minimal rpm and SW3's perform better for the noise at high rpm.

NF-F12's don't sound as smooth and NF-S12A's are better suited if you want to replace the 212 Evo's stock BladeMaster.

13 minutes ago, Nimrodor said:

Yes, I have two of these fans. Huge step up from my old Enermax TB's which were inaudible but pushed no air. 

Also, if you don't trust an anemometer and microphone, what can you trust? 

An anemometer and microphone don't simulate human hearing and the fans in the test are running at high rpm. Anyone who's aiming for silence should be running them at lower rpm. I prefer most noctuas below 600rpm if not 450rpm. I've had experience with them and Arctic F12's aren't nearly as quiet as NF-F12's, NF-A14's, or SW3's. They're alright fans but far from the quietest.

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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17 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

They're case fans--any fan that uses standard case mounts fits in that category.

What case and case fans are you currently using and what speed are you running them at?

NF-A14's and SW3's would be the quietest from the list. NF-A14's perform a bit better if you're running minimal rpm and SW3's perform better for the noise at high rpm.

NF-F12's don't sound as smooth and NF-S12A's are better suited if you want to replace the 212 Evo's stock BladeMaster.

An anemometer and microphone don't simulate human hearing and the fans in the test are running at high rpm. Anyone who's aiming for silence should be running them at lower rpm. I prefer most noctuas below 600rpm if not 450rpm. I've had experience with them and Arctic F12's aren't nearly as quiet as NF-F12's, NF-A14's, or SW3's. They're alright fans but far from the quietest.

Was talking Airflow vs Static Pressure for case fans.

 

Also, Arctic fans are louder per RPM. They also push more air per RPM than Noctuas. An extreme example of this messing up results is with Thermalright's TY-143:

Spoiler

gSXFnGll.jpg

u4ky9yxl.jpg

More fans is more important than better fans in for silence anyways, and five F12's is almost the same price as one more expensive fan.

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3 minutes ago, Nimrodor said:

Was talking Airflow vs Static Pressure for case fans.

Also, Arctic fans are louder per RPM. They also push more air per RPM than Noctuas. An extreme example of this messing up results is with Thermalright's TY-143:

More fans is more important than better fans in for silence anyways, and five F12's is almost the same price as one more expensive fan.

Static pressure is useful for case fans depending on where it's being used. There's no hard and fast rule for the most suitable fan whether it's used in a case or on a heatsink/rad.

RPM is arbitrary. More fans isn't always better for silence. There's a minimum noise level for each fan and a more expensive but quieter fan can be quieter than an Arctic F12 ever could be.

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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Just now, WoodenMarker said:

Static pressure is useful for case fans depending on where it's being used. There's no hard and fast rule for the most suitable fan whether it's used in a case or on a heatsink/rad.

RPM is arbitrary. More fans isn't always better for silence. There's a minimum noise level for each fan and a more expensive but quieter fan can be quieter than an Arctic F12 ever could be.

If you're hitting min RPM's then more fans won't matter, but neither will having a fan at all most likely since you still have a CPU cooler contributing to airflow. If we're talking purely about minimum speeds OP might be looking for EK Vardars, as counter-intuitive as that sounds.

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4 minutes ago, Nimrodor said:

If you're hitting min RPM's then more fans won't matter, but neither will having a fan at all most likely since you still have a CPU cooler contributing to airflow. If we're talking purely about minimum speeds OP might be looking for EK Vardars, as counter-intuitive as that sounds.

Low rpm is where more fans help make up for lost airflow.

CPU coolers don't contribute to airflow at all without fans. 

Why Vardars? Speed/RPM is arbitrary. The point is low noise and Vardars aren't as quiet as SW3's or NF-A14's.

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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1 minute ago, WoodenMarker said:

Low rpm is where more fans help make up for lost airflow.

CPU coolers don't contribute to airflow at all without fans. 

Why Vardars? Speed/RPM is arbitrary. The point is low noise and Vardars aren't as quiet as SW3's or NF-A14's.

Didn't understand the first point, wasn't implying complete passive cooling. Vardars have the lowest minimum speed and noise of any 140mm fans. 

 

In the context of OP though, I don't think anything we're arguing is relevant. He wants to add fans for additional airflow to his case. I think we both agree that the 212 Evo is the acoustic bottleneck. I argue that for a build with a budget like OP's, spending a significant amount on more fans makes little sense, which is why I recommend cheap efficient fans. You correctly argue that there are better fans than the F12's. We dance around acoustic efficiency without stating it outright, then you pick up minimum noise as your main metric for silence. I humor you and point out that the 140mm Vardars (and 120mm Silentwings) are the quietest fans by this measure. You (again) correctly point out that Vardars aren't exactly quiet fans, which is true in general but not in this one specific case.

 

Ignoring the philosophical discussion about what quietness entails, my main argument is that OP shouldn't be spending a lot on fans given the low thermal load, budget, and other louder components of the build. I agree with you that Silentwings 3's are great fans, but I don't think they make sense in the context of this particular situation.

 

 

 

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Just now, Nimrodor said:

Didn't understand the first point, wasn't implying complete passive cooling. Vardars have the lowest minimum speed and noise of any 140mm fans. 

 

In the context of OP though, I don't think anything we're arguing is relevant. He wants to add fans for additional airflow to his case. I think we both agree that the 212 Evo is the acoustic bottleneck. I argue that for a build with a budget like OP's, spending a significant amount on more fans makes little sense, which is why I recommend cheap efficient fans. You correctly argue that there are better fans than the F12's. We dance around acoustic efficiency without stating it outright, then you pick up minimum noise as your main metric for silence. I humor you and point out that the 140mm Vardars (and 120mm Silentwings) are the quietest fans by this measure. You (again) correctly point out that Vardars aren't exactly quiet fans, which is true in general but not in this one specific case.

You mentioned 'having a fan at all doesn't matter since the cpu cooler will be contributing to airflow'. CPU Coolers don't provide any airflow without fans.

 

Out of the list of >1800rpm fans that you listed, Vardars might have the lowest minimum rpm. Compared to other lower rpm quiet fans, Vardars don't have the lowest rpm. http://thermalbench.com/2015/08/11/ek-vardar-f1-140-140mm-fan/3/

I've explained before that rpm is arbitrary. What matters is the acoustics and Vardars aren't as quiet as Noctuas or BeQuiets! Asides from dBA readings, they don't sound as smooth. 

Vardars are relatively quiet for the performance delivered but they are far from the quietest fans. 120mm SW2/3's aren't the quietest either--NF-S12A's are better where appropriate.

 

We don't know for certain that the 212 Evo is necessarily too loud. Until confirmed, it could be due to hdd vibrations, case fans, or something else. It could also just be a matter of fan speeds. 

 

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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3 minutes ago, WoodenMarker said:

You mentioned 'having a fan at all doesn't matter since the cpu cooler will be contributing to airflow'. CPU Coolers don't provide any airflow without fans.

 

Out of the list of >1800rpm fans that you listed, Vardars might have the lowest minimum rpm. Compared to other lower rpm quiet fans, Vardars don't have the lowest rpm. http://thermalbench.com/2015/08/11/ek-vardar-f1-140-140mm-fan/3/

I've explained before that rpm is arbitrary. What matters is the acoustics and Vardars aren't as quiet as Noctuas or BeQuiets! Asides from dBA readings, they don't sound as smooth. 

Vardars are relatively quiet for the performance delivered but they are far from the quietest fans. 120mm SW2/3's aren't the quietest either--NF-S12A's are better where appropriate.

 

We don't know for certain that the 212 Evo is necessarily too loud. Until confirmed, it could be due to hdd vibrations, case fans, or something else. It could also just be a matter of fan speeds. 

 

Spoiler

SWRHZyYl.jpg

Quietest minimum.

 

Can you get a review/noise test of the S12A's? I'd love to be proven wrong on this front; I'm always looking for quieter fans.

 

Evo at 655 RPM. HDDs probably also louder than quiet fans at low speeds, at least if you believe SPCR.

Spoiler

fan_noise_25.png

 

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57 minutes ago, Nimrodor said:

Quietest minimum.

Can you get a review/noise test of the S12A's? I'd love to be proven wrong on this front; I'm always looking for quieter fans.

Evo at 655 RPM. HDDs probably also louder than quiet fans at low speeds, at least if you believe SPCR.

Eh, I don't agree with it being the quietest despite the chart. dBA readings are useful but aren't the be-all and end-all of perceived loudness. I personally don't find them as smooth sounding as other non-ball bearing fans. My ears could be wrong.

 

It's a shame that NF-S12A's aren't more popular. There aren't nearly as many tests of them compared to other noctuas. I've even come across reviews that mention NF-S12A's but test every other fan in Noctua's 120/140mm lineup.

Here's an idea of how they perform: http://www.relaxedtech.com/reviews/noctua/nf-s12a/5

Performance is comparable to other 1200-1500rpm fans and they excel at low rpm.

As for noise, they're probably the quietest fans I've come across. I'll need to grab some TrueQuiets again to do a direct comparison though.

I run one on my test bench and can't hear it without my ear an inch away.

 

You can compare the noise to the other popular NF-A14 and NF-F12. The fans start at 0:24, 0:16, and 0:41 respectively.

Spoiler

 

 

Most hdd's are louder than quiet fans. They're even louder than most fans that aren't quite quiet if the vibrations aren't dampened. I'm personally running 3TB Reds which are close to the quietest hdds available asides from smaller capacities of the same model and a select few others. If they weren't suspended in foam molds in my system, there'd be little point running my fans below 600rpm. It's an older photo but you can see them here: 5f08aec8e593632af9e05cb5d2da4296.png

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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To respond to the unknowns; I'm building in a define mini c, and getting new fans because the old ones i had are going bad. 

I dont have any HDD in the system for silence. im running the fans at the lowest possible rpm (sub 700).

The case is completely free of obstructions to inhibit airflow. 

Im going for as quiet as i can go, yes im aware the fans  seem stupidly expensive for my budget but im just going to get the best i can now instead of upgrading again later.

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5 hours ago, The_Legionnaire said:

To respond to the unknowns; I'm building in a define mini c, and getting new fans because the old ones i had are going bad. 

I dont have any HDD in the system for silence. im running the fans at the lowest possible rpm (sub 700).

The case is completely free of obstructions to inhibit airflow. 

Im going for as quiet as i can go, yes im aware the fans  seem stupidly expensive for my budget but im just going to get the best i can now instead of upgrading again later.

If the stock fans are going bad, you should be able to contact Fractal Design for replacements.

If you didn't find them quiet enough, PW2's would be cheaper options that are still very quiet. Unless you're replacing your psu and graphics card fans as well, I don't see much sense in spending more.

https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/product/4GsKHx/be-quiet-case-fan-bl047

https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/product/fkCwrH/be-quiet-case-fan-bl046

If you ever need help with a build, read the following before posting: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/3061-build-plan-thread-recommendations-please-read-before-posting/
Also, make sure to quote a post or tag a member when replying or else they won't get a notification that you replied to them.

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