Marathon Gaming - Twitch under microscope

[mark_cameron]

As reported on WAN Show, 24th February 2017:

 

BBC News covering the sad death of a charity funds raising marthon gamer Brian Vigneault of Virginia, USA who died in February during a live Twitch stream around 20 hours in to his fund raising effort.

 

Questions being asked into continous-gaming safety. The approach of Twitch plus the real case of 'gaming addiction'.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-39232620

 

[Quote\]

Brian Vigneault was a 35-year-old father of three from Virginia, USA who gamed under the alias Poshybird. In February he took on a 24-hour-long gaming marathon, playing World of Tanks to raise money for charity.

The marathon was streamed to a live audience on the website Twitch, which describes itself as "the world's leading video platform and community for gamers".

Twenty two hours in, Vigneault reportedly went outside to take a cigarette break. He didn't return to the screen - and later died.

Vigneault's exact cause of death has not yet been established, or conclusively linked to his streaming marathon. But his friend Jessica Gebauer, who spoke to him on the night he died, told BBC Trending that he looked "extremely tired" and was falling asleep during the stream.

Since Vigneault's death, Gebauer, who is a fellow streamer, says she has questioned the health implications of continuous live-stream gaming. She is not the only one.

[/Quote]

 

I think Linus Tech Tips has always advocated safe gaming... certainly as long as I've been here.

But people are taking things to extremes...

 

But if you are going to spend a weekend gaming (I will tomorrow). Do some sensible things:

1. Regular Breaks.

Every 45 minutes to an hour take a break. Walk around. Get fresh air.

Blood circulation is important.

2. Sleep depravation - kills.

Get some sleep if you're tired.

3. Food and water.

Depriving yourself of food and hydration (water) is not a good thing. Hydrate.

Caffeine makes you dehydrated.

[tlink]

4. make sure night theme users don't get a seizure when scrolling trough your post

 

good self care is always important and not exclusive to gaming. lots of people die in the office from overtime or stuff like that yet we don't talk about that because it isn't an outlier. shit happens, everybody dies. not that that takes away that we should monitor it but this probably will get used by some people to shame gaming as a whole.

[Doobeedoo]

I mean he must had bad health in general, doesn't do exercise or stretch.

I played WoW and Diablo 3 for way longer periods of time for days. Barely any sleep. And did it for years. If i'd go outside for an hour it would be exercise not drinking coffee. When doing short pause at home it would be stretching and such.

[S w a t s o n]

Yea staying awake for 20 hours isn't normally going to kill a person, people linking this to his stream are dumb.

[zMeul]

it's not Twitch's fault when shitheads can't/don't care about their own well being

want to plug a for in the wall socket? go ahead! one less idiot the planet needs to worry about

 

Quote

Cam Adair, who is founder of Game Quitters - the largest online support community for people with gaming addiction - says Twitch and other streaming platforms have a duty of care to their users: "I'm not saying that companies need to be policing their users, but they could simply reach out and say 'Hey, I've seen you've been playing 15 hours today which is different to what was going on before. Are you OK?'"

are you an adult? then fuck off

[mark_cameron]

9 hours ago, tlink said:

4. make sure night theme users don't get a seizure when scrolling trough your post

 

good self care is always important and not exclusive to gaming. lots of people die in the office from overtime or stuff like that yet we don't talk about that because it isn't an outlier. shit happens, everybody dies. not that that takes away that we should monitor it but this probably will get used by some people to shame gaming as a whole.

Sitting and staring at a screen for 20 or 24 hours is not normal though is it?

 

The point is people are not looking after themselves.

 

Imagine you're on twitch and someone dies mid stream as you watch?

 

Do you think you would be happy seeing that?

 

There seems to be an awful lot of aggression in response to this story. See the other posters to date.

 

I'm a little puzzled as to why.

[mark_cameron]

3 hours ago, Swatson said:

Yea staying awake for 20 hours isn't normally going to kill a person, people linking this to his stream are dumb.

Yet it seems very coinicidental that he was 20 hours into a gaming season when he died?

 

I think that there is something in it. Playing for that length of time puts a strain on the body and the mind.

 

If someone isn't in good health then it could be a significant difference.

[divito]

As common sense would denote, and others have expressed, there must be some other underlying issue. Simply playing on stream for 20 hours is not going to cause death.

[Zodiark1593]

While harsh on body and mind, going 24 - 48 hours without sleep isn't likely to kill you by itself (though from experience, I'd advise not driving unnecessarily under these conditions), though a person that gets little sleep on a regular basis may suffer more so. Lack of sleep may also amplify underlying health conditions, and could well push one past the point of return. 

 

While typically, the body won't easily allow for this, lack of sleep for long enough can indeed kill a person. Fatal Familial Insomnia is one such condition in which sleep becomes impossible due to a malfunction in the Thalamus gland. From a healthy baseline, death occurs within months, though from what is described, is a very tormented and lengthy way to die. 

[79wjd]

8 hours ago, Swatson said:

Yea staying awake for 20 hours isn't normally going to kill a person, people linking this to his stream are dumb.

 

4 hours ago, divito said:

As common sense would denote, and others have expressed, there must be some other underlying issue. Simply playing on stream for 20 hours is not going to cause death.

While that's true, you can get major health issues from sitting for too long (blood clots for example). That being said, the article is the definition of clickbait; streaming is never going to be the reason someone died (and before someone decides to be a smartass, some other death causing event that occurs because someone is streaming doesnt count).

[mark_cameron]

9 minutes ago, Zodiark1593 said:

While harsh on body and mind, going 24 - 48 hours without sleep isn't likely to kill you by itself (though from experience, I'd advise not driving unnecessarily under these conditions), though a person that gets little sleep on a regular basis may suffer more so. Lack of sleep may also amplify underlying health conditions, and could well push one past the point of return. 

 

While typically, the body won't easily allow for this, lack of sleep for long enough can indeed kill a person. Fatal Familial Insomnia is one such condition in which sleep becomes impossible due to a malfunction in the Thalamus gland. From a healthy baseline, death occurs within months, though from what is described, is a very tormented and lengthy way to die. 

 

Do you not think that there is a 'bravado' culture where people try and push themselves longer and longer gaming to stand out?

 

I think there is and by some of the other defensive responses in this thread I would say that there's a fair amount of intentional or otherwise ignorance.

 

Of the negative health effects of trying to play games for overly extended periods in a fairly unhealthy way.

 

Sure. For average Joe. The occasional 24 hour gaming sesion might not be an issue.

 

However. When this becomes a lifestyle. This may make you more prone to health conditions including sudden death.

 

Is what I'm saying.

 

No number of head in sand or aggressive responses (see: zMeul's expletive laden post)  towards people looking at the issue is going to change this.

 

Looking after your health - or life - shouldn't be seen as a negative.

[mach]

Quote

 to take a cigarette break

A smoker....Could be the reason. Everyone knows smoking is bad for hearts right? (and many other organs of course)

[tlink]

14 hours ago, mark_cameron said:

Sitting and staring at a screen for 20 or 24 hours is not normal though is it?

 

The point is people are not looking after themselves.

 

Imagine you're on twitch and someone dies mid stream as you watch?

 

Do you think you would be happy seeing that?

 

There seems to be an awful lot of aggression in response to this story. See the other posters to date.

 

I'm a little puzzled as to why.

well on some jobs it sadly is, for example air traffic control or 911 callworkers. its also not uncommon that nurses have to work 24 hour shifts which involves writing reports a lot. sitting and staring at a screen for 20 to 24 hours isn't ideal but it shouldn't kill you. im sure it contributed to this guys dead but i wouldn't say its the cause of death. it just triggered an underlying condition. just like those people who die from monster energy, they often have a hearth condition that gets triggered by the caffeine.

 

and just report people who are too aggresive, its fine to disagree with eachother but we all should stay respectful. people who can't don't belong here. they probably feel that their hobby is threatened or something like that.

[FPSwithaWacomTablet]

On 3/11/2017 at 4:16 AM, mark_cameron said:

As reported on WAN Show, 24th February 2017:

 

BBC News covering the sad death of a charity funds raising marthon gamer Brian Vigneault of Virginia, USA who died in February during a live Twitch stream around 20 hours in to his fund raising effort.

 

Questions being asked into continous-gaming safety. The approach of Twitch plus the real case of 'gaming addiction'.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-39232620

 

[Quote\]

Brian Vigneault was a 35-year-old father of three from Virginia, USA who gamed under the alias Poshybird. In February he took on a 24-hour-long gaming marathon, playing World of Tanks to raise money for charity.

The marathon was streamed to a live audience on the website Twitch, which describes itself as "the world's leading video platform and community for gamers".

Twenty two hours in, Vigneault reportedly went outside to take a cigarette break. He didn't return to the screen - and later died.

Vigneault's exact cause of death has not yet been established, or conclusively linked to his streaming marathon. But his friend Jessica Gebauer, who spoke to him on the night he died, told BBC Trending that he looked "extremely tired" and was falling asleep during the stream.

Since Vigneault's death, Gebauer, who is a fellow streamer, says she has questioned the health implications of continuous live-stream gaming. She is not the only one.

[/Quote]

 

I think Linus Tech Tips has always advocated safe gaming... certainly as long as I've been here.

But people are taking things to extremes...

 

But if you are going to spend a weekend gaming (I will tomorrow). Do some sensible things:

1. Regular Breaks.

Every 45 minutes to an hour take a break. Walk around. Get fresh air.

Blood circulation is important.

2. Sleep depravation - kills.

Get some sleep if you're tired.

3. Food and water.

Depriving yourself of food and hydration (water) is not a good thing. Hydrate.

Caffeine makes you dehydrated.

While this one might be taken slightly out of context, why haven't people done something about this first?

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/oct/18/death-from-overwork-japans-karoshi-culture-blamed-young-mans-heart-failure

 

Maybe we can complain about video games later once we solve this.

[jasonvp]

On 3/11/2017 at 9:37 PM, mark_cameron said:

No number of head in sand or aggressive responses (see: zMeul's expletive laden post)  towards people looking at the issue is going to change this.

 

Looking after your health - or life - shouldn't be seen as a negative.

I don't think anyone here disagrees with you.  The disagreement comes from whose responsibility is it?  It's not anyone else's responsibility to remind you to care for yourself.  If you're a fully functioning adult, it's your responsibility.  And only yours.  That was zMeul's point that appears to have sailed over your head.

 

 

[OptimisticRealist]

Gaming marathons are stupid as hell.

[Seldszar]

Sure Bravado can be a thing for some people who have no self control. Like any kid in highschool who will chug alcohol to do like the other he thinks are cool.

 

It just realy realy realy irks me when people start blaming the hobby or the vehicle of the problem instead of the person doing it. Because once that kind of thinking takes off, you start regulating and limiting/punishing those who aren't idiots.

 

If he did feel sick/not good ... then I mean ... do you realy need a babysitter to tell you to go to sleep/eat?

 

Its realy sad that it happened

[mark_cameron]

On 13/03/2017 at 0:01 AM, FPSwithaWacomTablet said:

While this one might be taken slightly out of context, why haven't people done something about this first?

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/oct/18/death-from-overwork-japans-karoshi-culture-blamed-young-mans-heart-failure

 

Maybe we can complain about video games later once we solve this.

No one is 'blaming computer games'

 

Merely highlighting an issue with the lifestyle culture.

 

Of marathon gaming.

 

Which also is a well known phenomenon affecting professional esports. Has been known for some time.

[mark_cameron]

16 hours ago, jasonvp said:

I don't think anyone here disagrees with you.  The disagreement comes from whose responsibility is it?  It's not anyone else's responsibility to remind you to care for yourself.  If you're a fully functioning adult, it's your responsibility.  And only yours.  That was zMeul's point that appears to have sailed over your head.

 

 

Not everyone shares the north American view of blame blame blame when it comes to regulation. Plus fear of blame.

 

Which your system of law encourages.

 

In Europe we would prefer to adopt a - stewardship culture.

 

The choice remains the individuals but you are guided to a more healthy and sustainable type of gaming lifestyle.

 

Doing nothing isn't an option.

 

Encouraging a scenario where twitch allows for breaks with adverts or something like specific youtube videos - that a twitch user can pre setup would be ideal.

 

Not force them to sit there for 24 straight hours incase they lose some audience. As present.

[mark_cameron]

13 hours ago, Seldszar said:

Sure Bravado can be a thing for some people who have no self control. Like any kid in highschool who will chug alcohol to do like the other he thinks are cool.

 

It just realy realy realy irks me when people start blaming the hobby or the vehicle of the problem instead of the person doing it. Because once that kind of thinking takes off, you start regulating and limiting/punishing those who aren't idiots.

 

If he did feel sick/not good ... then I mean ... do you realy need a babysitter to tell you to go to sleep/eat?

 

Its realy sad that it happened

This is a classic American response to this issue.

 

Immediately you make it a 'rights of the individual' issue

 

Rather than making small changes to the lifestyle and guiding individuals to a more sustainable approach.

 

That Twitch could help implement. With some features like break periods and so on whilst retaining audience.

 

 

It was the same American response to car seat belts! 

 

No one is saying you can't have a gaming marathon.

 

Just some better features to allow bio breaks and rest periods might be wise! Plus giving people advice to do it safely.

[jasonvp]

6 hours ago, mark_cameron said:

Doing nothing isn't an option.

[clip]

Not force them to sit there for 24 straight hours incase they lose some audience. As present.

Doing nothing is an option.  And it should be the only option.  It isn't up to Twitch to have helped this poorly cared-for (by himself) individual.  It was his  No one forced him to attempt to sit there for 24 hours.  And it wasn't sitting there that killed him, anyway.  Any belief to the contrary is just idiocy at its best.

 

He was an unhealthy individual.  That was his responsibility to have fixed that.  Like it is mine to make sure I stay healthy.  And yours to make sure you stay healthy.

 

Call it "American" all you want.  It just weakens your argument even further because you can't come up with anything else to counter my points.  Try to grow up and take responsibility for yourself.  You'll be surprised how liberating it is.

[mark_cameron]

On 14/03/2017 at 1:15 PM, jasonvp said:

Doing nothing is an option.  And it should be the only option.  It isn't up to Twitch to have helped this poorly cared-for (by himself) individual.  It was his  No one forced him to attempt to sit there for 24 hours.  And it wasn't sitting there that killed him, anyway.  Any belief to the contrary is just idiocy at its best.

 

He was an unhealthy individual.  That was his responsibility to have fixed that.  Like it is mine to make sure I stay healthy.  And yours to make sure you stay healthy.

 

Call it "American" all you want.  It just weakens your argument even further because you can't come up with anything else to counter my points.  Try to grow up and take responsibility for yourself.  You'll be surprised how liberating it is.

 

What evidence is there to say he was 'unhealthy' ?

 

None at present.

 

I've realised why there's been the response to the questioning there has in this thread. It's a geographical related one. Very clearly it is.

 

 

Companies can do their duty by helping customers ensure they can enjoy their products safely.

 

You'll be surprised how easy a few small implementations can make to a product or website or business which has a flaw.

[Bensemus]

4 hours ago, mark_cameron said:

What evidence is there to say he was 'unhealthy'

He died while taking a smoke break. Smoking is unhealthy. He was also doing a 24h stream. Many things unhealthy about that. A single stream won't do anything but add a stream on top of other issues and it can turn into something more serious.