How Do You Backup Your RAID

[Corrupt_Liberty]

So you have a shiny new RAID 5 array. Terabytes upon terabytes of storage at your disposal. Only you start to run low on space. Easy enough, add another hard drive right? RAID expansion is a risk though, better backup my data first...

 

But where the hell do you put 10 terabytes of data? 

RAID 0 two 5Tb drives? 

Seems a bit expensive...and flaky.

 

What if I'm out of space for drives and want to turn my 8x 2Tb array into an 8x 5Tb array? 

 

These are the things that keep me up at night.

[TheKDub]

Pretty much your best option would be two 5+TB drives in RAID 0.

 

Or pick up one of these: https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA2F84DK4930

[ShadySocks]

You could ask a friend for some temporary space?

[Corrupt_Liberty]

2 minutes ago, TheKDub said:

Pretty much your best option would be two 5+TB drives in RAID 0.

 

Or pick up one of these: https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA2F84DK4930

Very pretty, I bet I could break that. Problem is it costs almost as much as my entire server, RAID included.

[TheKDub]

1 minute ago, Corrupt_Liberty said:

Very pretty, I bet I could break that. Problem is it costs almost as much as my entire server, RAID included.

 

Yeah, you could always just say screw it and try putting the additional drive in anyways.

[tt2468]

10 minutes ago, Corrupt_Liberty said:

So you have a shiny new RAID 5 array. Terabytes upon terabytes of storage at your disposal. Only you start to run low on space. Easy enough, add another hard drive right? RAID expansion is a risk though, better backup my data first...

 

But where the hell do you put 10 terabytes of data? 

RAID 0 two 5Tb drives? 

Seems a bit expensive...and flaky.

 

What if I'm out of space for drives and want to turn my 8x 2Tb array into an 8x 5Tb array? 

 

These are the things that keep me up at night.

>Makes raid0 of 2 drives

>Talks about how he doesn't want to lose his data

[Corrupt_Liberty]

1 minute ago, TheKDub said:

 

Yeah, you could always just say screw it and try putting the additional drive in anyways.

It just might come to that. Lol. I was just curious what others recommend or have tried. I can't be the only one needing to backup large arrays. Mine is actually quite small atm. Small enough to be manageable. But I could possibly upgrade my server to handle 16 total drives. It has 8 slots on the backplane now but another 8 are available. 

[TheKDub]

Just now, Corrupt_Liberty said:

It just might come to that. Lol. I was just curious what others recommend or have tried. I can't be the only one needing to backup large arrays. Mine is actually quite small atm. Small enough to be manageable. But I could possibly upgrade my server to handle 16 total drives. It has 8 slots on the backplane now but another 8 are available. 

I'd probably consider switching from RAID 5 to RAID 10 in the future, it'll eat up drives a little more, but it should be easier on the disks overall, and you'll always have an exact clone of each set of drives.

[Corrupt_Liberty]

4 minutes ago, TheKDub said:

I'd probably consider switching from RAID 5 to RAID 10 in the future, it'll eat up drives a little more, but it should be easier on the disks overall, and you'll always have an exact clone of each set of drives.

Well ultimately I'd like to do RAID 60. But that's a bit further down the road. Right now I have 5x 2Tb in RAID 5 and considering a sixth drive. This thread is mostly hypothetical to feed my curiosity. Almost everything on my RAID is replaceable. Most of the space is used by Plex. I didn't throw away all my DVD's and Blu-ray's after ripping them. Although it did take me close to a month to rip them all with my desktop, laptop and server.

[W-L]

-Topics Merged- 

[Corrupt_Liberty]

7 minutes ago, W-L said:

-Topics Merged- 

Thank you kind sir.

...or ma'am.

Edited March 7, 2017 by Corrupt_Liberty
Edited for clarification

[Corrupt_Liberty]

20 minutes ago, tt2468 said:

>Makes raid0 of 2 drives

>Talks about how he doesn't want to lose his data

> Doesn't read thread

> Comments anyway

[SCHISCHKA]

cloud? tape? whatever you choose its not going to be cheap.

[Corrupt_Liberty]

8 minutes ago, SCHISCHKA said:

cloud? tape? whatever you choose its not going to be cheap.

Cloud would be hilarious. 10Tb at 5mbps...4888 hours (10% overhead for giggles) or just over 203 days.  And tape? For that money as might as well just keep a backup server for my backups.

[scottyseng]

2 hours ago, Corrupt_Liberty said:

-snip-

Is it hardware RAID? If so, just expand it. I've expanded my arrays (RAID6) from 4 -> 6 -> 9->10 drives without issue. It takes a really long time though (It took mine 7 days 24/7 to expand). I wouldn't do it without a UPS unit of course.

 

Though, originally I had RAID10 of four drives with my WD Reds, and as you know, you can't expand RAID 10. So I had to actually buy two WD Reds to hold my data as my second array got built. I would recommend RAID6 if possible, had two drives die out of nowhere...array is still alive. haha.

 

But yeah, I backup to a second array (Still keep forgetting to buy a external hard drive). I have two arrays of RAID6, a six 4TB array of WD Reds and a ten 4TB array of WD Re drives.

 

Though if you wanted to get a 8 x 5TB array, you'd probably have to build that first and then move your data over to that. And your old 8 x 2TB array would just sit there...

[SCHISCHKA]

1 hour ago, Corrupt_Liberty said:

Cloud would be hilarious. 10Tb at 5mbps...4888 hours (10% overhead for giggles) or just over 203 days.  And tape? For that money as might as well just keep a backup server for my backups.

I did say there is no cheap way. Your internet speed sucks but I'm sure you knew that. 

[Corrupt_Liberty]

4 hours ago, scottyseng said:

Is it hardware RAID? If so, just expand it. I've expanded my arrays (RAID6) from 4 -> 6 -> 9->10 drives without issue. It takes a really long time though (It took mine 7 days 24/7 to expand). I wouldn't do it without a UPS unit of course.

Yes, It's a hardware RAID.  I may end up doing just that.  My server has another optional 8 bay backplane.  Could just start a second array on that instead of merging the two.  Keep one online and the other I could power up on a schedule for backups.  If I do that I'd need another RAID card.  But that would be the least of the expense.

4 hours ago, scottyseng said:

Though if you wanted to get a 8 x 5TB array, you'd probably have to build that first and then move your data over to that. And your old 8 x 2TB array would just sit there...

Yeah, so build the 8x5, migrate, upgrade old 8x2.  I'm not there yet, but I'll definitely keep it in mind.  

 

4 hours ago, SCHISCHKA said:

I did say there is no cheap way. Your internet speed sucks but I'm sure you knew that. 

It's not really that bad.  My upload is just horrible.  5 up and 60 down.  I'd give anything for symmetrical internet...but I won't do that.

[Helly]

i actually went from 8x2TB to 8x5TB. I put all my data on the 5TB's first. Broke the 2TB's array. Put all the data on the 2TB's. Created the new array with the 5TB's. Copied all the data from the 2TB's to the 5TB's. I had to do it this way as i have only 1 raid card to put the drives on. All the drives were also perfectly fine and ran without problems for 2 years. I had no reason to think they were gonna break suddenly. If you can trust the drives, then that is 1 way to do it :P. although not the safest one of course.

[scottyseng]

4 hours ago, Corrupt_Liberty said:

-snip-

You don't have a SAS expander or a two SAS port RAID card? One RAID card can easily handle two backplane or more.

[Corrupt_Liberty]

7 minutes ago, scottyseng said:

You don't have a SAS expander or a two SAS port RAID card? One RAID card can easily handle two backplane or more.

Probably.  Haven't really looked into it much.  The RAID card is integrated into the motherboard.  This thread was mostly hypothetical musings.  I still have three empty slots so I'm not quite to that point yet.  

[Corrupt_Liberty]

39 minutes ago, scottyseng said:

You don't have a SAS expander or a two SAS port RAID card? One RAID card can easily handle two backplane or more.

Yes, there is an SAS expander available that would allow for up to 24 drives.  Pretty cheap too.

[scottyseng]

2 minutes ago, Corrupt_Liberty said:

Yes, there is an SAS expander available that would allow for up to 24 drives.  Pretty cheap too.

Probably your best bet to let you use several drive backplanes at the same time. You don't need another RAID card.

[Corrupt_Liberty]

Just now, scottyseng said:

Probably your best bet to let you use several drive backplanes at the same time. You don't need another RAID card.

I agree.  I'm pretty new to the server space.  It's mostly just a severely overkill Plex server at the moment.  I got it more as a learning platform.  I can build a gaming rig backwards with my eyes closed but server level equipment, networking, VM's and the like is still pretty new to me.  Would probably help if I had the money to do it correctly.  That RAID card isn't at all happy with my consumer grade SATA drives.  I made it work though.

[scottyseng]

1 minute ago, Corrupt_Liberty said:

I agree.  I'm pretty new to the server space.  It's mostly just a severely overkill Plex server at the moment.  I got it more as a learning platform.  I can build a gaming rig backwards with my eyes closed but server level equipment, networking, VM's and the like is still pretty new to me.  Would probably help if I had the money to do it correctly.  That RAID card isn't at all happy with my consumer grade SATA drives.  I made it work though.

Yeah, I'm pretty reasonably good with server hardware / hardware RAID, but there's quite a lot about networking and server management (windows server, remote connection, VPNs, etc) that I have no clue about.

 

Hmm, what SATA drives did you use? My RAID card is pretty happy with WD Reds.

[Corrupt_Liberty]

1 minute ago, scottyseng said:

Yeah, I'm pretty reasonably good with server hardware / hardware RAID, but there's quite a lot about networking and server management (windows server, remote connection, VPNs, etc) that I have no clue about.

 

Hmm, what SATA drives did you use? My RAID card is pretty happy with WD Reds.

Using Seagate Barracuda ST2000LM015.  The main problem is the controller reports the temperatures wrong for the drives.  It thinks they are over 60c and ramps my fans to full speed.  SMART reports 25-26c.  Apparently it's a known problem with "unofficial drives" on the p410 controller.  HP and their proprietary crap.