New PC, looking for input (Wall of text)

[FiveNine]

Hello regulars of the LTT forums. I'm new here, technically, although i have been visiting this place before for advice and information. I'm currently in the process of building (assembling) a new computer and i'd like some opinions. I can't use pcpartpicker since the prices differ a lot (I'm from Serbia and we buy from third party sellers that import goods so prices fluctuate) so i'll just list the current situation and some options i have.

 

228€ CPU: i5-6600k 

145€ MoBo: Asus Z170-A

236€ GPU: Sapphire RX 480 Nitro+ 4GB 11260-02-20G

125€ PSU: EVGA SuperNova G2 750W 

133€ Case: NZXT s340 Elite White

69€ CPU Cooler: Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT 

95-120€ RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX or G.Skill Ripjaws V (speed anywhere from 2400-3200) undecided depending on the color availability and price, i really want white ram  

95€ SSD: Samsung 850Evo 250gb

45-48€ HDD: Toshiba/WD/Seagate 1tb 7200RPM (have no idea what's the difference between them, they look identical to me)

30-35€ 2x Case fans: Noctua NF-P14s 1500 redux (for intake)

 

Grand total would be about 1200€ (A lot of money for my location, 3 monthly salaries as it stands) I plan to use the PC for a few years 4-5+, maybe swap out the GPU eventually since i feel everything else is somewhat "future-proof" (can't really future-proof PC's  )

 

There are still some minor things bugging me which is why i'm here to ask about them. First of all i think the case is just flat out overpriced here, but on the other hand - everything is. The regular s340 is 100€ and my other options in that price range would be the Corsair 400c, Fractal Design Define R5/S/C, or maybe a Phanteks 400S or Enthoo Pro M Acrylic but they don't look nearly as good as the s340 Elite (subjective, i know, i love the tempered glass though), same price, similar quality, so i guess i just wrote this sentence to explain my reasoning behind the choice

 

The PSU is also a bit on the expensive side i think but the price curve is really bad. For example, at 100€ the best unit i could get would be a Corsair RM550X (looking for full modular PSUs), bellow 100€ there are only bad CoolerMaster, or Corsair CX, ThermalTake Smart SE, AntecVP and so on. I can get a Seasonic M12 Evo II 520W for 80€ but i feel like that's pushing it a bit? And i'm not sure if the cables are fully stealth-sleeved. There are also EVGA G1 and GQ for 100€ but i think the quality drop is bigger than the price drop... like i said the availability is really poor  There is 10 years warranty on the G2 and PSU is the most important part of the PC so i guess it's an ok investment and i won't go wrong. Again, explaining my reasoning, not really asking any questions so far, sorry  

 

I have no idea about SSDs. I can't imagine the real world performance difference between models/manufacturers at same capacity being noticable, but like before, the quality drop of the part is much higher compared to the price drop. I can save 10-15€ max by cheaping out here. Is it worth it?

 

The CPU cooler is where i banged my head against the wall the most. I have all types of AIO's available to me, but the warranty is mostly a laughable 12 months and i'm paranoid about the pump dying or something leaking or breaking so i think an air cooler is definitely superior noise-to-cooling-to-price ratio wise. First i wanted to get a Phanteks ph-tc14pe or a Be Quiet Dark Rock Pro 3, but then i saw RAM clearance issues so i gave up on that idea because i couldn't find any low profile RAM and after seeing white modules i decided that i wanted my RAM to be visible. I threw Noctua out the window because = ugly (sorry Noctua) and this is where my options became limited. Cryorig as a brand can't be bought here at all (sadface) so the only real two options i had left with RAM clearance and good cooling were the Macho and Dark Rock 3 (non-pro). They are about the same price and i think Macho is superior so i went with it (i plan to OC the 6600k to 4.5Ghz with lowest possible stable voltage, i won't go higher than 4.5). 

 

The first thing you might notice is that if i try to shave off some cost from every component i might be able to throw more money at the GPU pile, BUT. Like mentioned before, the prices are trash and the next real upgrade after RX480 and a GTX1060 (which vary up to 100€ in price) would be a GTX1070, the cheapest which is at a whooping 200€ above the RX480/GTX1060 and i don't really need more for 1080p gaming so i gave that idea up. Once more, explaining my reasoning, not really a question

 

And concerning RAM, spending how much more money would be justifiable for the speed? For example, 2400 = 95-100€, 3000+ = 120€ cheapest... I feel like that's a total waste of money

And finally, should i wait for Ryzen/Vega and see what happens or not? (I know the old adage, there will always be something new around the corner)

 

Anyway, that's a huge wall of text lol. I hope there will be some merciful souls out there willing to read through it all and offer some input...

 

In short basically,

PSU - slightly lower price vs proportionally more performance lost (imo)? EVGA Supernova g2 @125€  or g1/gq @~100€ ? (I want full modular/stealthed cables)

RAM - price increase and speed increase, paying how much more for increased speed is justifiable? 2400 = 95-100€, 3000+ = 120€ cheapest

CPU Cooler - choice? Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT vs BQ Dark Rock 3. Would you make the same decision?

SSD - get the cheapest one or not?

HDD - is there a difference between those brands i listed? (price almost identical)

I would have liked to save some money here and there, but i don't want to compromise a lot

 

So finally, thanks to everyone who reads through this, i'm not overly optimistic about it lol  Any and all suggestions, opinions are welcome and if i maybe overlooked something or if there are any compatibility issues please let me know. 

[Energycore]

Don't get a G1 from EVGA it's got bad performance. GQ is fine, GS as well. Fast RAM matters but it's not worth 20% more. The Le Grand Macho RT is one of the best coolers out there, I support it. SSD, the cheapest of the following: MX300, SL308, SP550, CS1311. HDD, cheapest is fine. Save some money getting a cheaper Z170, the Z170-A has no features to justify the additional cost. A gigabyte Z170-HD3 will do the trick.

 

That's all I can say, I think

[Droidbot]

College essay boys

 

G2 is a very good PSU, get a lower wattage - you don't need 750w. 

Do not pay more for faster ram - it does literally nothing.

HDD is identical - get the cheapest one as long as it is 7200RPM

What SSDs are you looking at for cheap?

I'd go Grand Macho over BQ, but they're both pretty good coolers. 

 

And yeah, it's a pretty well-rounded build. Good job researching man. 

[Energycore]

1 minute ago, Droidbot said:

Do not pay more for faster ram - it does literally nothing.

 

[Droidbot]

4 minutes ago, Energycore said:

 

A couple frames difference - again, if it's like 30EUR more, why not put it towards a beefier cooler to get an OC that will even that out, or heck, even towards more memory. 

[ARikozuM]

6 minutes ago, Droidbot said:

College essay boys

The warning only works if we can see it before the horror. 

6 minutes ago, Droidbot said:

G2 is a very good PSU, get a lower wattage - you don't need 750w. 

Agreed, go with a 650W G2, G3, P2, or RMx.

6 minutes ago, Droidbot said:

Do not pay more for faster ram - it does literally nothing.

Bandwidth and CAS do quite a lot for gaming. Better frame-rates and timings are commonly observed and quantified.

6 minutes ago, Droidbot said:

HDD is identical - get the cheapest one as long as it is 7200RPM

HDD speed has no bearing these days and is not an indicator of random seeks. Cache and platter density do much more these days.

 

[Droidbot]

1 minute ago, ARikozuM said:

 

Bandwidth and CAS do quite a lot for gaming. Better frame-rates and timings are commonly observed and quantified.

 

This must be a DDR4 thing - it doesn't do much on DDR3, take a look at Linus's video on the topic. 

CAS latency matters, that's for sure. 

[Energycore]

1 minute ago, Droidbot said:

A couple frames difference - again, if it's like 30EUR more, why not put it towards a beefier cooler to get an OC that will even that out, or heck, even towards more memory. 

For one, I don't think is is worth 30 more Euros, that much I said in my own post. Then OP is already getting 16GB I don't see the use for more.

 

It's just not right to say that fast RAM doesn't matter. It does, enough that anyone with $1000 budget or more will get 3000MHz RAM recommended by me. (Assuming the cost is reasonable, like the $85 3000MHz 16GB Ripjaws 4 in the US).

[HKZeroFive]

Ah, I see people are (once again) spreading the misconception that faster RAM does not impact performance. I can't be bothered to type it out again so I'm just going to copy and paste a previous post of mine.

Spoiler

2 hours ago, HKZeroFive said:

Wait, judging from this thread, do people seriously think that faster RAM makes little to no difference at all despite the overwhelming amount of evidence online? Yeesh.

 

The bottom line is this; the biggest benefit of faster memory is higher minimum framerates. However, if you're in a CPU-bound scenario/game where the CPU is essentially the bottleneck, you will see that faster memory boosts the average framerate.

 

1080p/Titan X Pascal OC	Core i7 7700K Stock	Core i7 7700K Stock	Core i7 7700K Stock	Core i7 7700K 4.8GHz	Core i7 7700K 4.8GHz	Core i7 7700K 4.8GHz
DDR4 Clock Speed	3000MHz	2400MHz	2133MHz	3000MHz	2400MHz	2133MHz
Assassin's Creed Unity, Ultra High, FXAA	132.2	129.3	125.3	132.9	129.8	126.6
Ashes of the Singularity, DX12, CPU Test	41.9	38.2	36.2	44.1	40.4	37.4
Crysis 3, Very High, SMAA T2x	138.2	135.0	132.8	145.5	140.7	138.0
The Division, Ultra, SMAA	133.8	133.6	132.1	133.9	133.2	132.6
Far Cry Primal, Ultra, SMAA	137.9	127.5	121.2	140.1	134.4	126.5
Rise of the Tomb Raider DX12, Very High, SMAA	126.5	114.9	108.1	131.0	121.1	111.0
The Witcher 3, Ultra, No Hairworks	139.4	125.7	116.6	145.2	130.8	120.2

I'm sorry, but the amount of ignorance here is staggering.

 

[ARikozuM]

Just now, Droidbot said:

This must be a DDR4 thing - it doesn't do much on DDR3, take a look at Linus's video on the topic. 

CAS latency matters, that's for sure. 

His video was poorly done. Take a look at Gamers Nexus for details.

[ARikozuM]

1 minute ago, HKZeroFive said:

Ah, I see people are (once again) spreading the misconception that faster RAM does not impact performance. I can't be bothered to type it out again so I'm just going to copy and paste a previous post of mine.

 

Please put that in a spoiler if you can be bothered to do so.

[HKZeroFive]

3 minutes ago, Droidbot said:

This must be a DDR4 thing - it doesn't do much on DDR3, take a look at Linus's video on the topic. 

CAS latency matters, that's for sure. 

Linus' video was flawed. He used massively GPU-bound settings (4x and 8x MSAA) on a mediocre GPU (GTX 660Ti) and didn't even measure the minimum framerate, the biggest benefit from faster memory.

[Energycore]

5 minutes ago, ARikozuM said:

His video was poorly done.

Classic Linus.

[HKZeroFive]

5 minutes ago, ARikozuM said:

Please put that in a spoiler if you can be bothered to do so.

Alright, just for you.

[brob]

3 minutes ago, FiveNine said:

,,,

 

In short basically,

PSU - slightly lower price vs proportionally more performance lost (imo)? EVGA Supernova g2 @125€  or g1/gq @~100€ ? (I want full modular/stealthed cables)

RAM - price increase and speed increase, paying how much more for increased speed is justifiable? 2400 = 95-100€, 3000+ = 120€ cheapest

CPU Cooler - choice? Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT vs BQ Dark Rock 3. Would you make the same decision?

SSD - get the cheapest one or not?

HDD - is there a difference between those brands i listed? (price almost identical)

I would have liked to save some money here and there, but i don't want to compromise a lot

 

So finally, thanks to everyone who reads through this, i'm not overly optimistic about it lol  Any and all suggestions, opinions are welcome and if i maybe overlooked something or if there are any compatibility issues please let me know. 

 

Good quality psu is worth extra cost. G2, G3,  excellent. So are Corsair RM750X, SuperFlower Leadex Gold 750W. If you do wish to save a bit, consider a 550W or 650W model. Either should provide enough power for the build.

 

Memory speed and timings do make a difference. But the difference is generally only perceptible with jobs that are memory intensive and/or run for a long time. Renders for example. Buy memory that looks good and fits in your budget. Is G.Skill NT memory available? Doesn't have (unnecessary) heat sinks and often well priced.

 

Are you able to get Cryorig cpu coolers? If so, take a look at the H5 Universal.

 

I would not go with the least expensive ssd. Nor would I pick the most expensive. Crucial MX300 seem to be well priced. There are performance differences. Low cost units use slower components.

 

There are differences in hdd. I would not get a Toshiba. In the 1TB size either Seagate or WD 7200 rpm units are fine. Cache/buffer size should be at least 64MB.

[ARikozuM]

2 minutes ago, Energycore said:

Classic Linus.

Not all of his videos are poorly done, but I don't think he asked "what does RAM speed affect".

[Gonio]

Am tired so going to sleep, but for a lot of your qstions you can find answers in my guide in the signature. Also check the PSU tier list if you want to see other good PSU's (if you take tier 3 or higher you atleast know that the type you selected has good quality.

 

For your CPU cooler I can also recommend the Scythe Fuma if available. Noctua performance but for a better price and RAM clearance should be ok.

[Energycore]

2 minutes ago, ARikozuM said:

Not all of his videos are poorly done, but I don't think he asked "what does RAM speed affect".

I guess you're right, he's got a couple well done videos. I liked the super fast camera input lag tests even if they're only comparable between two monitors.

[FiveNine]

6 hours ago, Energycore said:

Don't get a G1 from EVGA it's got bad performance. GQ is fine, GS as well. Fast RAM matters but it's not worth 20% more. The Le Grand Macho RT is one of the best coolers out there, I support it. SSD, the cheapest of the following: MX300, SL308, SP550, CS1311. HDD, cheapest is fine. Save some money getting a cheaper Z170, the Z170-A has no features to justify the additional cost. A gigabyte Z170-HD3 will do the trick.

 

That's all I can say, I think

Thank you all for the fast replies. Sorry for my late response, i made the thread before going to bed Out of the 250gb capacity SSD's i can only get a 750evo samsung (15€ cheaper) or a MX200 / BX 100 for that price as well. 

I saw that the Supernova GQ 750w is 100€ and also fully modular with stealth cables and i think its suitable. There are no models with less wattage unfortunately, only GS 550 but it's 95€ so i think it doesn't pay off. I guess i'll go with the GQ.

Will i be able to achieve the 4.5OC on that giga board? Or Boost the RAM and GPU a bit too? It's 30€ cheaper and black so it fits the theme, i wouldn't mind switching to it if it will do the job  Thank you.

6 hours ago, Droidbot said:

College essay boys

 

G2 is a very good PSU, get a lower wattage - you don't need 750w. 

Do not pay more for faster ram - it does literally nothing.

HDD is identical - get the cheapest one as long as it is 7200RPM

What SSDs are you looking at for cheap?

I'd go Grand Macho over BQ, but they're both pretty good coolers. 

 

And yeah, it's a pretty well-rounded build. Good job researching man. 

The cheapest i can get is A-Data Premier SP550 at 70-75€. Stupid question, does peeling the sticker from the SSD void warranty?  For that same price i can also get a Kingston V300, Kingston UV400, A-Data XPG SX930, SanDisk z400s, Crucial BX200, 750evo (instead of the 850), Toshiba Q300, HyperX Fury. They are all basically hovering around 70-75-80€ compared to the 850evo at 95€. 

 

6 hours ago, ARikozuM said:

The warning only works if we can see it before the horror. 

Agreed, go with a 650W G2, G3, P2, or RMx.

Bandwidth and CAS do quite a lot for gaming. Better frame-rates and timings are commonly observed and quantified.

HDD speed has no bearing these days and is not an indicator of random seeks. Cache and platter density do much more these days.

 

The thing is that the 750 G2 is the lowest wattage available  G3 and P2 can't get, and the RMx 650 is 5-10€ cheaper but warranty is 3 years compared to EVGA 10. I would get the faster ram but it's 20€ more and i'm guessing even if i get a 2400 RAM i can make it run at 3000 with same or a bit worse timings just by giving it more voltage

 

6 hours ago, brob said:

 

Good quality psu is worth extra cost. G2, G3,  excellent. So are Corsair RM750X, SuperFlower Leadex Gold 750W. If you do wish to save a bit, consider a 550W or 650W model. Either should provide enough power for the build.

 

Memory speed and timings do make a difference. But the difference is generally only perceptible with jobs that are memory intensive and/or run for a long time. Renders for example. Buy memory that looks good and fits in your budget. Is G.Skill NT memory available? Doesn't have (unnecessary) heat sinks and often well priced.

 

Are you able to get Cryorig cpu coolers? If so, take a look at the H5 Universal.

 

I would not go with the least expensive ssd. Nor would I pick the most expensive. Crucial MX300 seem to be well priced. There are performance differences. Low cost units use slower components.

 

There are differences in hdd. I would not get a Toshiba. In the 1TB size either Seagate or WD 7200 rpm units are fine. Cache/buffer size should be at least 64MB.

I am not able to get the 650/550 units of the EVGA. I can get the RMx but the cost is 10-20€ max difference and warranty is only 3 years on them compared to 10 of the EVGA. MX300 is sadly not available, nor is Cryorig as a brand (they are the first thing i looked at). The NT memory is not available. I can mostly get the 2 i named and HyperX Fury or Crucial Ballistix, they are within 5-10 eu difference from each other depending on speed

 

6 hours ago, Gonio said:

Am tired so going to sleep, but for a lot of your qstions you can find answers in my guide in the signature. Also check the PSU tier list if you want to see other good PSU's (if you take tier 3 or higher you atleast know that the type you selected has good quality.

 

For your CPU cooler I can also recommend the Scythe Fuma if available. Noctua performance but for a better price and RAM clearance should be ok.

Thanks. The list is really helpful. After looking through it i found very little available from the tier 1 and 2 for me. Would an EVGA GQ 750 be suitable? The ones that are available i have already researched. The Fuma is available for 55€ but it's a bit on the ugly side and i have to slide the fan up to get ram clearance which i don't like that much. Thank you very much for your input.

 

Thanks for the help everyone  

Is there any difference between the Nitro+ card i chose and 
https://www.asus.com/Graphics-Cards/DUAL-RX480-O4G/

They are the 2 cheapest variants i can get and so far Sapphire has been really impressive (+has backplate)

[Droidbot]

SP550 is a decent SSD.

Fury is also pretty good also. 

[FiveNine]

1 hour ago, Droidbot said:

SP550 is a decent SSD.

Fury is also pretty good also. 

So at 70 eu for the SP550 and 75 eu for Fury am i better off getting one of them instead of the 850evo at 95 eu?? It does seem a reasonable price drop if the performance gap isn't big?

[Droidbot]

3 minutes ago, FiveNine said:

So at 70 eu for the SP550 and 75 eu for Fury am i better off getting one of them instead of the 850evo at 95 eu?? It does seem a reasonable price drop if the performance gap isn't big?

The performance gap is little to none. Good modern SSDs are bottlenecked by the SATA bus, but if you do want generally slightly better performance go with the Samsung.