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wanderingjoe

Stuck deciding on a laptop... should I just wait for something else?

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Hey guys, I was looking to buy a new laptop recently, but none of them fit all my needs and wants.  I was looking for a UHD screen, HDMI 2.0, Thunderbolt 3, Displayport(more on this*), M.2, SD card reader, and optical drive... but there doesn't exist such a laptop.  I was going to spend up to $3K, but it pains me to spend that much money on a laptop that doesn't give me everything I want.  I've looked at these so far:

 

The GT73VR, like the rest of the MSI stuff, only has HDMI 1.4 and DP 1.2, no optical drive, and I hate the flamboyant red accents.

 

The Alienware 17 R4 at least has HDMI 2.0, but only DP 1.2, and no optical drive, no SD card reader!!!, only 2 RAM slots, and only 2xUSB 3 ports, and seems to have QC and thermal problems and light bleed that may or may not be resolved yet.

 

The Clevo/Sager NP9873 has awesome I/O, HDMI 2.0, 2xDP 1.3, 2xThunderbolt 3, 4xUSB 3.0, but no optical, and the laptop body alone weighs more than 12 pounds, include the brick and it's over 14 pounds.

 

I came so close to buying the Sager, but since it'll actually be on my lap when I'm in bed, the 12 pounds gave me cold feet; and a lesser problem is that battery life is awful, but I fully expected that for what it is.  OK, so it looks like the manufacturers are getting rid of optical drives, I really really hate that, but I can still deal with it.  But getting rid of SD card readers is so stupid.  That automatically rules the Alienware out, with only 2xUSB 3.0 ports, one of them will have to be a SD reader, and the other has to be shared between optical drives and wireless mouse/keyboard, and whatever else; otherwise I have to buy and carry around an addition USB C/3 adapter, or buy a new bluetooth mouse/keyboard; b/c of all this inconvenience, IMO the Alienware is overpriced.  So the MSI seemed like a nicer(cheaper) all-around, except that HDMI 1.4 is a non-starter for me.  Why does MSI put only HDMI 1.4 even on their flagship GT83?  That's like getting a Ferrari with a plastic trim and polyester upholstery.  Is MSI on the verge of any new releases with updated I/O?

 

So now I'm thinking of just waiting until something comes out with DP 1.4, and wishfully an optical drive(however unlikely).  Are there any laptops out right now with DP 1.4?  Or do you know of any new models coming out?  I'd hate to shell out $3K and find a new model a month later with DP1.4.  I/O is so important to me.  As for the guts, the CPU and GPU, their offerings are all sufficient for me, so no complaints there; just the I/O sets them apart.  Am I crazy b/c I want an optical drive, am I alone in this regard?  Thank you for sharing your thoughts on any of this.

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How about a p70 Seems to check all the boxes and built like a tank.

 

DVD drive, sd card, 4x usb 

 

 

16 minutes ago, wanderingjoe said:

 HDMI 2.0

Don't see the point, dp 1.4 is the same bandwidth.

 

18 minutes ago, wanderingjoe said:

But getting rid of SD card readers is so stupid

I don't see the point of a sd card. For cameras, I don't use SD, I use CF, and thats being replaced with cfast. A usb card reader makes much more sense for what i do.

 

19 minutes ago, wanderingjoe said:

Why does MSI put only HDMI 1.4 even on their flagship GT83?

Optimus. The hdmi is running of the igpu, not the dgpu.

 

19 minutes ago, wanderingjoe said:

I'd hate to shell out $3K and find a new model a month later with DP1.4.  

Do you have a screen that will use it. I don't see the point. If you want dp 1.6 when it comes out, just run a egpu via thunderbolt.

 

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1 hour ago, wanderingjoe said:

 I was looking for a UHD screen, HDMI 2.0, Thunderbolt 3, Displayport(more on this*), M.2, SD card reader, and optical drive

these are your only demands? really? 

1 hour ago, wanderingjoe said:

I'd hate to shell out $3K and find a new model a month later with DP1.4.  I/O is so important to me.  As for the guts, the CPU and GPU, their offerings are all sufficient for me, so no complaints there;

by sufficient you mean GTX 1070 or 1080? CPU? please don't take this as a offence but Alienware 13 has a OLED screen picture quality is really good in that and i would suggest you get that. Its $1000 cheaper and more portable. IF those are your only demands. I strongly suggest a Alienware 13 or something cheaper instead of spending $3,000 maybe a $1500? 

 

Optical Drives - is dead. I know its sad but they are dead. time to move on. We can put a grave in your back yard but they are dead. IF you want one you can get one for like $50 max. I have a apple and a HP one and they don't get used.

 

Micro SD - They are dead... well that is what apple is saying. But i would suggest getting a USB type C micro SD card reader. I know two dongles but people are trying to make there laptop thinner and keep them cooler. IF that Micro SD card is not being used by 90% of the community they will removed it and use that space to make a better cooling system or make the laptop thinner.

 

Alienware 17 (get Alienware 15 its cheaper and lighter.) = fix it yourself but furture proof

MSI = wild card, but $200 cheaper than Alienware

Clevo/ Sager = no innovation but not MSI or Alienware. 

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2 hours ago, NA_NotAvailable said:

these are your only demands? really? 

by sufficient you mean GTX 1070 or 1080? CPU? please don't take this as a offence but Alienware 13 has a OLED screen picture quality is really good in that and i would suggest you get that. Its $1000 cheaper and more portable. IF those are your only demands. I strongly suggest a Alienware 13 or something cheaper instead of spending $3,000 maybe a $1500? 

 

Optical Drives - is dead. I know its sad but they are dead. time to move on. We can put a grave in your back yard but they are dead. IF you want one you can get one for like $50 max. I have a apple and a HP one and they don't get used.

 

Micro SD - They are dead... well that is what apple is saying. But i would suggest getting a USB type C micro SD card reader. I know two dongles but people are trying to make there laptop thinner and keep them cooler. IF that Micro SD card is not being used by 90% of the community they will removed it and use that space to make a better cooling system or make the laptop thinner.

 

Alienware 17 (get Alienware 15 its cheaper and lighter.) = fix it yourself but furture proof

MSI = wild card, but $200 cheaper than Alienware

Clevo/ Sager = no innovation but not MSI or Alienware. 

It's called Function over Form. It's an engineers dream PC. It works as intended while being easy to maintain and the parts are readily available for years after the product is no longer in production. It's more innovative than Alienware could ever dream of being and more people will agree with me than you. Either here or on NBR. Take your pick.


S.K.Y.N.E.T. Reborn

i7-8750H | 32GB DDR4 2666 | 6GB GTX 1060 | 15.6" 1080P 144Hz IPS Panel | 256GB Phison M.2 SSD | 500GB Samsung 840 Pro SSD1TB Western Digital NVMe SSD | Intel Wireless-AC 9560

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4 hours ago, wanderingjoe said:

The GT73VR, like the rest of the MSI stuff, only has HDMI 1.4 and DP 1.2, no optical drive, and I hate the flamboyant red accents.

This has HDMI 2.0 in the new revision. 

https://www.msi.com/Laptop/GT73VR-7RF-Titan-Pro.html#hero-specification

 

4 hours ago, wanderingjoe said:

Is MSI on the verge of any new releases with updated I/O?

Yes read above.

 

4 hours ago, wanderingjoe said:

So now I'm thinking of just waiting until something comes out with DP 1.4, and wishfully an optical drive(however unlikely).  Are there any laptops out right now with DP 1.4?  Or do you know of any new models coming out?  I'd hate to shell out $3K and find a new model a month later with DP1.4

No. Do you mean DP 1.3? We're BARELY at duo-dp 1.3 right now as duo-dp 1.3 can drive 8k. dp 1.4 is a whiles away. like a LONG WHILE. 

 

4 hours ago, wanderingjoe said:

Am I crazy b/c I want an optical drive, am I alone in this regard?

Yes.

 

Also consider http://www.eurocom.com/ec/configure(2,384,0)ec if you want 15in. Has everything you want cept in a 15in form factor. 


Laptop Main

(Retired) Zbook 15: i7-6820HQ, M2000M, 32gb, 512gb SSD + 2tb HDD, 4k Dreamcolor

(Retired) Alienware 15 R3: i7-6820HK, GTX1070, 16gb, 512 SSD + 1tb HDD, 1080p

(Retired) T560: i7-6600U, HD520, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1620p

(Retired) P650RS: i7-6820HK, 1070, 16gb, 512gb + 1tb HDD, 4k Samsung PLS

(Retired) MBP 2012 Retina: i7-3820QM, GT650M, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1800p

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26 minutes ago, Imglidinhere said:

It's called Function over Form. It's an engineers dream PC. It works as intended while being easy to maintain and the parts are readily available for years after the product is no longer in production. It's more innovative than Alienware could ever dream of being and more people will agree with me than you. Either here or on NBR. Take your pick.

some example of Innovation are Alienware External GPU, Razer Core, Cherry MX, Logitech wireless mouse, not something you make that can be copied by everyone else then put a brand on it and BAM its done. before you comment on Cherry, Cherry had the papent on there mechanical keys and they became the market standard. They still make the best affordable keys to date. 

 

By innovation I mean something you can't make yourself. They spent a lot of money engineering a new heat sink MSI and Alienware. Alienware  then moved to make a external GPU. I wanted this from Origin PC and yes i was a fanboy of there's till they utterly disappointed me thus i focused on there design. Clevo/ Sager aren't innovative BUT they are reliable they are as innovative as a Toyota Corolla and as reliable. They won't have any overheating problems out of the box. you wouldn't have to do tests to make sure everything works properly. 

 

there is pros and cons to every laptop and that is clevo/ sagers biggest con. They are not innovative.

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48 minutes ago, NA_NotAvailable said:

some example of Innovation are Alienware External GPU, Razer Core, Cherry MX, Logitech wireless mouse, not something you make that can be copied by everyone else then put a brand on it and BAM its done. before you comment on Cherry, Cherry had the papent on there mechanical keys and they became the market standard. They still make the best affordable keys to date. 

 

By innovation I mean something you can't make yourself. They spent a lot of money engineering a new heat sink MSI and Alienware. Alienware  then moved to make a external GPU. I wanted this from Origin PC and yes i was a fanboy of there's till they utterly disappointed me thus i focused on there design. Clevo/ Sager aren't innovative BUT they are reliable they are as innovative as a Toyota Corolla and as reliable. They won't have any overheating problems out of the box. you wouldn't have to do tests to make sure everything works properly. 

 

there is pros and cons to every laptop and that is clevo/ sagers biggest con. They are not innovative.

External GPUs are NOT new dude. Also, the only laptops that support Thunderbolt these days ALREADY HAVE A FULL FLEDGED GPU INSIDE. What's the point of having a thunderbolt 3 port when you have a damned GTX 1060 in your laptop already?

 

eGPUs will be a success, commercially, when they start releasing quad core CPUs without a dGPU and add in a thunderbolt port. So you can get that high processing power setup you need for on-the-go work if you need it and then tap into a more powerful option at home for gaming. THAT would be innovative. But is there money in it? Uh... actually yes. I'd ditch my current setup to jump into something like that. In a heartbeat I would!


S.K.Y.N.E.T. Reborn

i7-8750H | 32GB DDR4 2666 | 6GB GTX 1060 | 15.6" 1080P 144Hz IPS Panel | 256GB Phison M.2 SSD | 500GB Samsung 840 Pro SSD1TB Western Digital NVMe SSD | Intel Wireless-AC 9560

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Just now, Imglidinhere said:

External GPUs are NOT new dude. Also, the only laptops that support Thunderbolt these days ALREADY HAVE A FULL FLEDGED GPU INSIDE. What's the point of having a thunderbolt 3 port when you have a damned GTX 1060 in your laptop already?

 

eGPUs will be a success, commercially, when they start releasing quad core CPUs without a dGPU and add in a thunderbolt port. So you can get that high processing power setup you need for on-the-go work if you need it and then tap into a more powerful option at home for gaming. THAT would be innovative. But is there money in it? Uh... actually yes. I'd ditch my current setup to jump into something like that. In a heartbeat I would!

Externnal GPU isn't new but something in that size is. It was out for Mac's People made it but then the entire bottom of your laptop has to stay open. MSI made one. If i remember you had to dock your laptop on it. Alienware put it in a form factor for your average consumer.

 

Custom PC makers like Origin PC and Maingear still haven't created a laptop which takes full advantage of it. (i prefer mine without using thunderbolt 3) that is because there laptops are bases on Clevo, or something you can make yourself.

 

Know what I want. I was really hoping Origin PC would have made it for there 2015 CES because I though them to be innovative. I was hoping they would make a laptop with dedicated graphics like a 1080 BUT have a external GPU that has SLI support for up to 2 GPU's

 

SO when you are hope you will have a desktop CPU and a Desktop GPU. THAT is the dream. I told Origin PC this in 2015. This is 2016 and they failed to come up with anything like it. (mind you i am looking to buy so IF they did that i will be like fuck alienware. THEY suck ORIGIN PC is the best lol did yous see there SLI support external GPU?)  this being said...

 

lets stick to the topic. I really don't think he needs a $3000 laptop for those specs. but that is me.

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3 hours ago, Imglidinhere said:

External GPUs are NOT new dude. Also, the only laptops that support Thunderbolt these days ALREADY HAVE A FULL FLEDGED GPU INSIDE.

I'm 100% sure it's a corporate effort to not make such laptops I swear. ONLY the Thinkpad T470p in the entire new Thinkpad lineup doesn't have TB3 but it just so happens that it also has a quad core.

 

3 hours ago, Imglidinhere said:

eGPUs will be a success, commercially, when they start releasing quad core CPUs without a dGPU and add in a thunderbolt port.

Yes I agree. TB3 enclosures are still worse than AGA solutions. Sigh. 

 

2 hours ago, NA_NotAvailable said:

It was out for Mac's People made it but then the entire bottom of your laptop has to stay open.

Nooo....you had Bizon Box's that ran TB2

 

2 hours ago, NA_NotAvailable said:

I was really hoping Origin PC would have made it for there 2015 CES because I though them to be innovative. I was hoping they would make a laptop with dedicated graphics like a 1080 BUT have a external GPU that has SLI support for up to 2 GPU's

Origin has never made anything in their life. They just buy stuff from other people and put it together. And also TB3 enclosures will never support SLI simply due to the Optimus based tech they use, and neither will the AGA given it's a MUX switch and doesn't have a bridge between the GPUs needed for this kind of thing.

 

2 hours ago, NA_NotAvailable said:

SO when you are hope you will have a desktop CPU and a Desktop GPU. THAT is the dream.

These things exist. I linked them in my post above. Also desktop CPUs don't support power saving features and ends up with terrible battery life. While there are those who prefer socket hardware everything, I prefer battery life over socket hardware. This is just a personal opinion though as I'm well aware of the downsides of BGA. I just hope that one day intel can bake in mobile power saving features onto their desktop machines, or revert back to the Haswell generation of socket mobile hardware (which I 100% know will not happen cause of my job). 


Laptop Main

(Retired) Zbook 15: i7-6820HQ, M2000M, 32gb, 512gb SSD + 2tb HDD, 4k Dreamcolor

(Retired) Alienware 15 R3: i7-6820HK, GTX1070, 16gb, 512 SSD + 1tb HDD, 1080p

(Retired) T560: i7-6600U, HD520, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1620p

(Retired) P650RS: i7-6820HK, 1070, 16gb, 512gb + 1tb HDD, 4k Samsung PLS

(Retired) MBP 2012 Retina: i7-3820QM, GT650M, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1800p

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I'm in the Exact same boat as you. One thing that I can tell you is to stay away from dell/alienware.

 

Which leaves you with the GT73VR 7RF Titan Pro -VS- Sager NP9873

 

GT73VR 7RF: 

 

Intel Core i7-7820HK Quad Core Processor 2.9 GHz

17.3" Full HD 1920 x 1080 @120Hz 5ms, Matte, G-Sync (Anti Glare) TN Panel Screen (very high quality - IPS Level)

Mobile Intel® CM236 Express Chipset 

32GB DDR4 2400MHz RAM

512GB (2x 256GB SuperRAID) SSD + 1000GB 7200RPM HDD

GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Graphics

USB3 | HDMI | Bluetooth | DisplayPort | SD Card Reader | Thunderbolt 3 / USB Type C

Killer Wireless-AC 1535 + Bluetooth 4.1 Combo Card

Killer Gaming E2500 Gigabit Ethernet Controller

Full Colour Backlit Keyboard

 

Sager NP9873

 

Intel Core i7-7700K DESKTOP Quad Core Processor 4.2GHz

17.3" QHD 2560x1440 @120Hz 5ms, Matte, G-Sync (Anti Glare) TN Panel Screen (very high quality - IPS Level)

Mobile Intel® CM236 Express Chipset 

16GB DDR4 2400MHz

256GB M.2 SSD  + 1000GB 7200RPM HDD

GeForce GTX 1080 8GB Graphics DESKTOP

USB3 | HDMI | Bluetooth | DisplayPort | SD Card Reader | Thunderbolt 3 / USB Type C

Killer Wireless-AC 1535 + Bluetooth 4.1 Combo Card

Killer Gaming E2400 Gigabit Ethernet Controller (RJ45)

Full Colour Backlit Keyboard

 

In my opinion, 1440p is nice. But there is nVidia DSR for Upscaling on the MSI which might not be Pure 1440p but on a 17" screen, the difference between upscaled 1440p and true 1440p is minimal. I've tested it. In terms of performance, Sager wins because of the true desktop grade CPU/GPU but not by far at all. One thing to keep in mind is that they get hot. Real hot. I mean up to 90* Celsius hot. If you're planning to have this laptop for a while, then consider newer games that will come out and give the 1080 a run for it's money. Running 1440p resolution in a year or two years time, you'll probably have to change resolution to 1080p if you want over 60. From my experience, MSI are built better. And the new chassis with Cooler Boost will remove a good 20C from your gpu/cpu if they get hot. The Audio that MSI has is incomparable. Remember that 1440p on Laptop is still in its early stages. 1080p is well established and the quality on 1080p is near to perfect.

 

I'm in the UK so my only option is to go with MSI, but not sure where you are. If you're in the US then I guess you can get Sager, and if not. Remember that if Sager has a fault, then you'll have to ship it back to the US for repair. Hope this helps.

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10 minutes ago, Irask said:

17.3" QHD 2560x1440 @120Hz 5ms, Matte, G-Sync (Anti Glare) TN Panel Screen (very high quality - IPS Level

This is still cancer to sensitive eyes. Banding issues. Fix should be in Feb or March. 

 

10 minutes ago, Irask said:

One thing to keep in mind is that they get hot. Real hot. I mean up to 90* Celsius hot.

Maybe at bare bone stock. But most users after CLU or Gelid report far lower temps. OCed to 4.5 most people report low 80s with proper tuning.  

 

10 minutes ago, Irask said:

From my experience, MSI are built better.

I'd honestly say they are about the same. I feel like MSI has certain models that are better built. 

 

11 minutes ago, Irask said:

And the new chassis with Cooler Boost will remove a good 20C from your gpu/cpu if they get hot.

Maybe not 20C, but it's the same thing as max fan speed toggle on the Clevos. 

 

12 minutes ago, Irask said:

I'm in the UK so my only option is to go with MSI

Yea, idk why no EU retailer holds the P870DM2/3 with 1 1080. 


Laptop Main

(Retired) Zbook 15: i7-6820HQ, M2000M, 32gb, 512gb SSD + 2tb HDD, 4k Dreamcolor

(Retired) Alienware 15 R3: i7-6820HK, GTX1070, 16gb, 512 SSD + 1tb HDD, 1080p

(Retired) T560: i7-6600U, HD520, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1620p

(Retired) P650RS: i7-6820HK, 1070, 16gb, 512gb + 1tb HDD, 4k Samsung PLS

(Retired) MBP 2012 Retina: i7-3820QM, GT650M, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1800p

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3 minutes ago, Pendragon said:

I'd honestly say they are about the same. I feel like MSI has certain models that are better built. 

 

When it comes to the GT73VR's, they are definitely better built. However, Sager has gotten better over the years.

 

4 minutes ago, Pendragon said:

Maybe not 20C, but it's the same thing as max fan speed toggle on the Clevos. 

 

You need to be in the right environment ofcourse, When I tested it before, GPU was at 83 and wen down to 63-64. But usually a good 12-15C on average

 

6 minutes ago, Pendragon said:

Maybe at bare bone stock. But most users after CLU or Gelid report far lower temps. OCed to 4.5 most people report low 80s with proper tuning.  

 

Too much effort for little gain. And really. OC'ing a laptop to 4.5. In the long run, that's just asking for trouble.

 

7 minutes ago, Pendragon said:

This is still cancer to sensitive eyes. Banding issues. Fix should be in Feb or March. 

 

I just don't trust 1440p yet. Not on laptops. and certainly not a $3000 machine. I'd prefer to have the Perfect 1080p Experience possible, than a mediocre beta 1440p.

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27 minutes ago, Irask said:

When it comes to the GT73VR's, they are definitely better built. However, Sager has gotten better over the years.

Fair enough. I'd agree that the GT73VR is built really well.

 

27 minutes ago, Irask said:

You need to be in the right environment ofcourse, When I tested it before, GPU was at 83 and wen down to 63-64. But usually a good 12-15C on average

Hmmm, never seen it. Cooler boost is nothing special. It's literally a MSI branded fan control. And 63-64C? What were you doing on it? That seems to be on par with a after market worked on LM + FJ padded temp. 

 

29 minutes ago, Irask said:

Too much effort for little gain. And really. OC'ing a laptop to 4.5. In the long run, that's just asking for trouble.

Not really...I have had my 2600k at 5ghz 24/7 stable since when it was released. It depends. If you don't want to OC that's your choice ofc, but it's free performance. 

 

30 minutes ago, Irask said:

I just don't trust 1440p yet. Not on laptops. and certainly not a $3000 machine. I'd prefer to have the Perfect 1080p Experience possible, than a mediocre beta 1440p.

Oh I agree. That QHD panel is cancer for people who have perfect eyesight and can see the banding from a normal using distance. 


Laptop Main

(Retired) Zbook 15: i7-6820HQ, M2000M, 32gb, 512gb SSD + 2tb HDD, 4k Dreamcolor

(Retired) Alienware 15 R3: i7-6820HK, GTX1070, 16gb, 512 SSD + 1tb HDD, 1080p

(Retired) T560: i7-6600U, HD520, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1620p

(Retired) P650RS: i7-6820HK, 1070, 16gb, 512gb + 1tb HDD, 4k Samsung PLS

(Retired) MBP 2012 Retina: i7-3820QM, GT650M, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1800p

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Whoa, big thanks to everyone for all the information.  I got way more help than I even expected, much appreciated.

 

Electronics Wizardy, thanks for your help.

13 hours ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Don't see the point, dp 1.4 is the same bandwidth.

It’s b/c some devices only have HDMI, and I don't want to keep buying every which adapter, and I already have all the cables.  I hate that there’s these multiple standards, it’s so redundant.  Wish they’d just ditch HDMI and keep Thunderbolt and DP.

13 hours ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

I don't see the point of a sd card. For cameras, I don't use SD, I use CF, and thats being replaced with cfast. A usb card reader makes much more sense for what i do.

I only say that b/c most consumer cameras have SD cards, and they’re cheaper and smaller.  Cfast cards require an external reader anyway, but the SD card reader is being taken away.  Why not keep the SD reader there, and just attach a cfast card reader then?  Won’t an internal Cfast card reader add more bulk than an SD reader?

13 hours ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

 

Optimus. The hdmi is running of the igpu, not the dgpu.

That was so mysterious to me, thanks for enlightening me.

13 hours ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Do you have a screen that will use it. I don't see the point. If you want dp 1.6 when it comes out, just run a egpu via thunderbolt.

I just didn’t know what time frame DP1.4 and its support would happen, since desktops are just starting to roll out with them.  I thought it might be weeks or months, but after reading yours and Pendragon’s post I guess it’s much longer.  As for 8K resolution, I know its relevance has been debated to death.  But Sharp had that prototype, and now Dell too, and Windows 10 is going to support it.  And if Japan is pushing for 8K by 2020, I’ll probably still be using this laptop by then, if 8K is rolling out affordably for consumers.  The lack of a DP 1.4 isn’t at all a dealbreaker for me, I was just ignorant of its release timing.  And it’s nice to future proof, if the mxm can even take 8k...

 

Hey NA_NotAvailable thanks for your reply.

12 hours ago, NA_NotAvailable said:

these are your only demands? really? 

No, I meant that the laptops I listed had similar offerings for CPU/GPU, and the I/O really set them apart for me, ie, the Sager had the best I/O.  The OLED 13 is great, but I want screen space, and probably UHD.

12 hours ago, NA_NotAvailable said:

Optical Drives - is dead. I know its sad but they are dead. time to move on. We can put a grave in your back yard but they are dead. IF you want one you can get one for like $50 max. I have a apple and a HP one and they don't get used.

LOL, I’m really sad about the optical drives dying out.  What am I supposed to do with my CD library?  Burning everything onto a HDD is just redundant, that’s exactly what CDs are, storage!  So sad... and external drives just adds more clutter now.  Cables and dongles everywhere... SD reader, optical, nas, mouse/keyboard, on and on...

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Thanks a lot for your help Imglidinhere.

10 hours ago, Imglidinhere said:

It's called Function over Form. It's an engineers dream PC. It works as intended while being easy to maintain and the parts are readily available for years after the product is no longer in production. It's more innovative than Alienware could ever dream of being and more people will agree with me than you. Either here or on NBR. Take your pick.

I agree about the Sager, it’s a beast, there’s nothing out there like it.  The 67/7700K is an awesome feature, and the I/O leaves nothing to be wanted.  I saw HTWINGNUT‘s Youtube video of disassembly, it’s beautiful.  I guess the only real trade off for me was the weight and the power, that 330W brick,  but that understandably comes with the territory.  Great hardware.

 

I wish there was a lite version with 1xThunderbolt, 1xDP, 1xRJ 45, lighter vapor chamber heatsink for 1 gpu, better battery life.  I could even do with only 2 RAM slots and 1 M.2 2280.  The NP9172 is nice, but only HDMI 1.4, and the reviews about the loud fans is a huge dealbreaker, and adding a UHD with GTX 1070 basically puts it only ~$200 shy of a NP9873 with a GTX 1080.

 

I really don’t get Alienware.  Not even including the QC problems, basically their main selling point was its thinness.  They engineered a “performance” machine around a feature probably only a few people regard as important; and anyway, adding the extra depth for the cooling makes it too big for most bags too.  And the 2 RAM slots are awkward, when they offer 16GB and you want to add, you max out at 32 and have that 16(8x2)left over; whereas the other laptops you add 32 and get 48.  Still, I have to admit, it does look pretty, but too bad for the rest of it.

 

Pendragon thanks for your help.

10 hours ago, Pendragon said:

Hey thanks for that!   I’m giving it a look right now, but I can’t find it on XoticPC or Bhphotovideo or Newegg or Amazon yet.

10 hours ago, Pendragon said:

No. Do you mean DP 1.3? We're BARELY at duo-dp 1.3 right now as duo-dp 1.3 can drive 8k. dp 1.4 is a whiles away. like a LONG WHILE. 

Thanks for the info, I had no idea.

10 hours ago, Pendragon said:

Yes.

 

Also consider http://www.eurocom.com/ec/configure(2,384,0)ec if you want 15in. Has everything you want cept in a 15in form factor. 

LOL.  I do feel a little crazy, I’ve got all these old CDs and DVDs.  And it sucks for Redbox.  I’m only looking at 17 inch screens, I didn’t think UHD on 15 would be worth it.
 

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Thanks Irask, that was super helpful, man.

2 hours ago, Irask said:

I'm in the Exact same boat as you. One thing that I can tell you is to stay away from dell/alienware.

 

Which leaves you with the GT73VR 7RF Titan Pro -VS- Sager NP9873

 

2 hours ago, Irask said:

In my opinion, 1440p is nice. But there is nVidia DSR for Upscaling on the MSI which might not be Pure 1440p but on a 17" screen, the difference between upscaled 1440p and true 1440p is minimal. I've tested it. In terms of performance, Sager wins because of the true desktop grade CPU/GPU but not by far at all. One thing to keep in mind is that they get hot. Real hot. I mean up to 90* Celsius hot. If you're planning to have this laptop for a while, then consider newer games that will come out and give the 1080 a run for it's money. Running 1440p resolution in a year or two years time, you'll probably have to change resolution to 1080p if you want over 60. From my experience, MSI are built better. And the new chassis with Cooler Boost will remove a good 20C from your gpu/cpu if they get hot. The Audio that MSI has is incomparable. Remember that 1440p on Laptop is still in its early stages. 1080p is well established and the quality on 1080p is near to perfect.

 

I'm in the UK so my only option is to go with MSI, but not sure where you are. If you're in the US then I guess you can get Sager, and if not. Remember that if Sager has a fault, then you'll have to ship it back to the US for repair. Hope this helps.

Man, it’s a tough choice, and good to know I’m not alone.  Thanks for all the detailed info.  I think you’re the straw that broke the camel’s back, Alienware 17R4 is officially out of my consideration.  Too many people have had too many problems w/it, it’s underspec’d and overpriced.  Done.  And I’m in the US.  What are your thoughts on the UHD?  The main feature I’m interested in for the UHD it is the 100% Adobe RGB and the IPS.  But you’re saying the TN is pretty good, wish I could see it on a retail floor to compare... 

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24 minutes ago, wanderingjoe said:

Man, it’s a tough choice, and good to know I’m not alone.  Thanks for all the detailed info.  I think you’re the straw that broke the camel’s back, Alienware 17R4 is officially out of my consideration.  Too many people have had too many problems w/it, it’s underspec’d and overpriced.  Done.  And I’m in the US.  What are your thoughts on the UHD?  The main feature I’m interested in for the UHD it is the 100% Adobe RGB and the IPS.  But you’re saying the TN is pretty good, wish I could see it on a retail floor to compare... 

If gaming was not your priority then I found something that you will really like I hope. MSI Claims on their website here that their 4K Displays are IPS and come with 100% Adobe RGB. It's a 60Hz G-Sync too. Also, they have the MSI True Colour software.

 

Capture.PNG.09c0f375443385af5c5b76dc1f6a782f.PNG

 

Depends what your priority is, If it is gaming (like me) then I would go with the 1080p 120Hz G-Sync TN (IPS Level) because it's better for gaming. A lot of people bad mouthing MSI but they buy a low priced MSI and they have bad experience then they try to paint their highest best models with the same brush. I've seen the Kaby Lake GT73's and GT72's and they are absolutely beautiful. And I'm not an old man with bad eyes. I'm 27 and I'm also a Computer Engineer / Programmer and a Gamer. 

 

There are other Laptops with 4K Screens. Just google "100% Adobe RGB Laptop" or something to see other models.

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2 hours ago, Irask said:

snip

http://www.notebookcheck.net/MSI-GT73VR-6RF-Titan-Notebook-Review.181123.0.html

http://www.notebookcheck.net/MSI-GT73VR-7RF-Titan-Pro-Notebook-Review.189710.0.html

 

here are the two panels specs embedded in the reviews. the 4k one AUOB173 and the 1080p 120hz TN one. Both are good. @wanderingjoe either choice is fine if you choose to go the GT73VR route. However, I feel like you should still consider the P870DM3 or P870KM1 route more. @D2ultima wats ur opinion on GT73VR vs P870DM3. 


Laptop Main

(Retired) Zbook 15: i7-6820HQ, M2000M, 32gb, 512gb SSD + 2tb HDD, 4k Dreamcolor

(Retired) Alienware 15 R3: i7-6820HK, GTX1070, 16gb, 512 SSD + 1tb HDD, 1080p

(Retired) T560: i7-6600U, HD520, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1620p

(Retired) P650RS: i7-6820HK, 1070, 16gb, 512gb + 1tb HDD, 4k Samsung PLS

(Retired) MBP 2012 Retina: i7-3820QM, GT650M, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1800p

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1 minute ago, Pendragon said:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/MSI-GT73VR-6RF-Titan-Notebook-Review.181123.0.html

http://www.notebookcheck.net/MSI-GT73VR-7RF-Titan-Pro-Notebook-Review.189710.0.html

 

here are the two panels specs embedded in the reviews. the 4k one AUOB173 and the 1080p 120hz TN one. Both are good. @wanderingjoe either choice is fine if you choose to go the GT73VR route. However, I feel like you should still consider the P870DM3 or P870KM1 route more. @D2ultima wats ur opinion on GT73VR vs P870DM3. 

Single 1080 P870DM3 from HIDevolution with delidded 7700K or 6700K and 3000MHz or 3200MHz memory > GT73 in any form.


Clevo P870DM3 (Eurocom) | i7-7700K | 32GB DDR4 2400MHz | GTX 1080N SLI | 850 Pro 256GB | 850 EVO 500GB M.2 | Samsung PM961 256GB NVMe | Crucial M4 512GB | Intel 8265ac | 120Hz Matte screen | 780W PSU

 

THE INFORMATION GUIDES: SLI INFORMATION || vRAM INFORMATION || MOBILE i7 CPU INFORMATION || Maybe more someday

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5 minutes ago, D2ultima said:

snip

Speaking of which, are you getting the P870DM3? P870KM1?


Laptop Main

(Retired) Zbook 15: i7-6820HQ, M2000M, 32gb, 512gb SSD + 2tb HDD, 4k Dreamcolor

(Retired) Alienware 15 R3: i7-6820HK, GTX1070, 16gb, 512 SSD + 1tb HDD, 1080p

(Retired) T560: i7-6600U, HD520, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1620p

(Retired) P650RS: i7-6820HK, 1070, 16gb, 512gb + 1tb HDD, 4k Samsung PLS

(Retired) MBP 2012 Retina: i7-3820QM, GT650M, 16gb, 512gb SSD, 1800p

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1 minute ago, Pendragon said:

Speaking of which, are you getting the P870DM3?

It seems I may be doing so. We'll know in the next couple of days.


Clevo P870DM3 (Eurocom) | i7-7700K | 32GB DDR4 2400MHz | GTX 1080N SLI | 850 Pro 256GB | 850 EVO 500GB M.2 | Samsung PM961 256GB NVMe | Crucial M4 512GB | Intel 8265ac | 120Hz Matte screen | 780W PSU

 

THE INFORMATION GUIDES: SLI INFORMATION || vRAM INFORMATION || MOBILE i7 CPU INFORMATION || Maybe more someday

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