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Zen is faster than Broadwell-E clock for clock

13 minutes ago, zMeul said:

O'really!?

so how come AMD hasn't tested their ZEN at the base clock of the Broadwell-E CPU? that would've been a really compelling case for ZEN

 

Mohamed goes to the mountain or the mountain goes to Mohamed?

in this case, AMD brought the mountain to ZEN - why?! the answer is obvious

The CLOCKSPEED doesn't matter, it about the IPC improvements, if AMD wants they probabbly could have tested it higher, but it doesn't matter what frequency the chips run at it could be 100MHz and it wouldn't make a difference.

 

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1 hour ago, zMeul said:

-snip-

You're completely missing the point, CLOCK FOR CLOCK, Zen is supposed to be faster than an i7-6900K. Yes, the higher the clock speed the more total instructions it can process, the higher the inherent efficiency of the architecture the more a CPU will benefit from higher clocks, for example a 5GHz FX-9590 vs a 3GHz i7-6900K, the i7 will be faster due to the superior Skylake architecture, this is also true of GCN vs Paxwell, where GCN is the arguably superior architecture and thus performance scales with clock speed increases much more healthily.

 

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That zen is NOT running at base clock! It's running for now at 3GHz but they say the final product will run at a faster speed.

Might be 3.2GHz, or 4.5GHz, we don't know. Even AMD seems to not know it atm.

 

I'm also suprised they aren't talking about the server CPU they are working on.

A 32C/64T potential monster. For now no benchmarks available but they have shown a working product.

A picture of it can be found here (nothing exiting tbh and dutch source):https://nl.hardware.info/reviews/6925/6/amd-zen-cpu-preview-net-zo-snel-als-broadwell-e-32-core-napels-server-chip-ook-gedemonstreerd 

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19 minutes ago, zMeul said:

O'really!?

so how come AMD hasn't tested their ZEN at the base clock of the Broadwell-E CPU? that would've been a really compelling case for ZEN

 

Mohamed goes to the mountain or the mountain goes to Mohamed?

in this case, AMD brought the mountain to ZEN - why?! the answer is obvious

I already told you this THREE TIMES:

 

Zen is not a finished product, its Engineering Samples, as the one shown in that showcase might not be CAPABLE of hitting 4gHz yet, thus they needed to downclock the 6900K. Did you think of that? Or did your AMD-hate take over too soon?

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2 minutes ago, raphidy said:

If is has lower clocks, I won't buy it.

Are you sure? If a zen chip is for example 300Mhz slower but 200 dollars cheaper you really wouldn't get one?

 

Clockspeed isn't everything, if it has a nice price tag i don't care if it's from AMD or Intel.

 

 

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But also aren't Broadwell E on an older architecture? Meaning that Skylake is still faster AND we have Kabylake releasing soon too? 

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8 minutes ago, Citadelen said:

You're completely missing the point, CLOCK FOR CLOCK, Zen is supposed to be faster than an i7-6900K. Yes, the higher the clock speed the more total instructions it can process, the higher the inherent efficiency of the architecture the more a CPU will benefit from higher clocks, for example a 5GHz FX-9590 vs a 3GHz i7-6900K, the i7 will be faster due to the superior Skylake architecture, this is also true of GCN vs Paxwell, where GCN is the arguably superior architecture and thus performance scales with clock speed increases much more healthily.

 

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Paxwell? Freaking on point, I think I might have to steal that in the future rofl.

 

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4 minutes ago, iDeFecZx said:

But also aren't Broadwell E on an older architecture? Meaning that Skylake is still faster AND we have Kabylake releasing soon too? 

Skylake E is not out.

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10 minutes ago, iDeFecZx said:

But also aren't Broadwell E on an older architecture? Meaning that Skylake is still faster AND we have Kabylake releasing soon too? 

Broadwell-E only came out in Q2 of this year.

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8 minutes ago, iDeFecZx said:

But also aren't Broadwell E on an older architecture? Meaning that Skylake is still faster AND we have Kabylake releasing soon too? 

In terms of actual performance gain per clock, its minimal from generation to generation from intel. The only real tangible improvements they've made in terms of performance has been an increase to faster ddr4 ram, and adding more cores on the enthusiast end.

Other than that; a 6700k and 4790k with comparably fast ddr3 ram, though they are separated by two generations, still perform very similar in a wide array of tests.

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4 minutes ago, The Benjamins said:

Skylake E is not out.

I didnt say Skylake E.

 

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24 minutes ago, iDeFecZx said:

-snip- 

Skylake is marginally faster than Broadwell in terms of architectural improvments, Kabylake is a Skylake refresh, and Cannonlake is meant to be on 10nm. Cannonlake will most likely be delayed, as 10nm will be very difficult to get proper yields from. AMD is meant to be skipping 10nm and going straight for 7nm.

 

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32 minutes ago, samcool55 said:

That zen is NOT running at base clock! It's running for now at 3GHz but they say the final product will run at a faster speed.

Might be 3.2GHz, or 4.5GHz, we don't know. Even AMD seems to not know it atm.

 

I'm also suprised they aren't talking about the server CPU they are working on.

A 32C/64T potential monster. For now no benchmarks available but they have shown a working product.

A picture of it can be found here (nothing exiting tbh and dutch source):https://nl.hardware.info/reviews/6925/6/amd-zen-cpu-preview-net-zo-snel-als-broadwell-e-32-core-napels-server-chip-ook-gedemonstreerd 

Apparently they mentioned something about it. 

 

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10578/amd-zen-microarchitecture-dual-schedulers-micro-op-cache-memory-hierarchy-revealed/4

 

Anandtech stated they got some info regarding the 32C cpu, the dual socket zen server platform, as well as some info on am4 motherboards. If you want info on that you should probably watch out on anandtech for more news about those things. 

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Just now, DocSwag said:

Apparently they mentioned something about it. 

 

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10578/amd-zen-microarchitecture-dual-schedulers-micro-op-cache-memory-hierarchy-revealed/4

 

Anandtech stated they got some info regarding the 32C cpu, the dual socket zen server platform, as well as some info on am4 motherboards. If you want info on that you should probably watch out on anandtech for more news about those things. 

Maybe it's information AMD will tell us during HotChips, they have already told is they will give us more information then.

It's next week btw, not too far away.

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2 hours ago, Katsunaka said:

It's easy to compare the high end Zen chip to a handicapped 6900k to throw more gas on the hype fire.

 

Lets gimp a 6900k, compare to what will be likely the high end Zen chip and post some more hype.

 

I gave up on AMD a long while ago, hype leads you nowhere. 

It's clearly an IPC benchmark . They weren't handicapping anything ; just putting them at equal clocks . The zen ES is already capable of reaching 3.2ghz boost , and the process still has plenty of headroom for higher clocks ...

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I think the most we can take from this is zen is quiet capable, imho, even if it really cant reach more than 3 - 3.5GHz its still a very big improvement over their fx line up. At least we see AMD has a chance to catch up now. If they price it properly, they should start to gain market again.

yes it's still quiet behind intel, but not like 3-4 year behind but one generation behind. That's quiet a success.

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2 hours ago, Dabombinable said:

I still find it funny that when you add the omitted power consumption-the FX 8370 and 9590 just look like shit in comparison.

But it heats my room during the winter! :)

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4 minutes ago, Nena360 said:

But it heats my room during the winter! :)

well yes , but it's the summer....

 

I love my 290X CF setup , but the heat that thing produces ...

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Just now, Coaxialgamer said:

well yes , but it's the summer....

 

I love my 290X CF setup , but the heat that thing produces ...

Depends on where ya life, here it is mostly rain and winter... :(

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R20 score MC: 3688cb | R20 score SC: 489cb

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Case: Medion Micro-ATX Case / Case Fan Front: SUNON MagLev PF70251VX-Q000-S99 70mm / Case Fan Rear: Fanner Tech(Shen Zhen)Co.,LTD. 80mm (Purple) / Controller: Sony Dualshock 4 Wireless (DS4Windows) / Cooler: AMD Near-silent 125w Thermal Solution / CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600, 6-cores, 12-threads, 4.2/4.2GHz, 35MB cache (T.S.M.C. 7nm FinFET) / Display: HP 24" L2445w (64Hz OC) 1920x1200 / GPU: MSI GeForce GTX 970 4GD5 OC "Afterburner" @1450MHz (T.S.M.C. 28nm) / GPU: ASUS Radeon RX 6600 XT DUAL OC RDNA2 32CUs @2607MHz (T.S.M.C. 7nm FinFET) / Keyboard: HP KB-0316 PS/2 (Nordic) / Motherboard: ASRock B450M Pro4, Socket-AM4 / Mouse: Razer Abyssus 2014 / PCI-E: ASRock USB 3.1/A+C (PCI Express x4) / PSU: EVGA SuperNOVA G2, 550W / RAM A2 & B2: DDR4-3600MHz CL16-18-8-19-37-1T "SK Hynix 8Gbit CJR" (2x16GB) / Operating System: Windows 10 Home / Sound 1: Zombee Z500 / Sound 2: Logitech Stereo Speakers S-150 / Storage 1 & 2: Samsung 850 EVO 500GB SSD / Storage 3: Western Digital My Passport 2.5" 2TB HDD / Storage 4: Western Digital Elements Desktop 2TB HDD / Storage 5: Kingston A2000 1TB M.2 NVME SSD / Wi-fi & Bluetooth: ASUS PCE-AC55BT Wireless Adapter (Intel)

Vishera-X8-9370 | R20 score MC: 1476cb

Spoiler

Case: Cooler Master HAF XB Evo Black / Case Fan(s) Front: Noctua NF-A14 ULN 140mm Premium Fans / Case Fan(s) Rear: Corsair Air Series AF120 Quiet Edition (red) / Case Fan(s) Side: Noctua NF-A6x25 FLX 60mm Premium Fan / Case Fan VRM: SUNON MagLev KDE1209PTV3 92mm / Controller: Sony Dualshock 4 Wireless (DS4Windows) / Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo / CPU: AMD FX-8370 (Base: @4.4GHz | Turbo: @4.7GHz) Black Edition Eight-Core (Global Foundries 32nm) / Display: ASUS 24" LED VN247H (67Hz OC) 1920x1080p / GPU: MSI GeForce GTX 970 4GD5 OC "Afterburner" @1450MHz (T.S.M.C. 28nm) / GPU: Gigabyte Radeon RX Vega 56 Gaming OC @1501MHz (Samsung 14nm FinFET) / Keyboard: Logitech Desktop K120 (Nordic) / Motherboard: MSI 970 GAMING, Socket-AM3+ / Mouse: Razer Abyssus 2014 / PCI-E: ASRock USB 3.1/A+C (PCI Express x4) / PSU: EVGA SuperNOVA G2, 850W PSU / RAM 1, 2, 3 & 4: Corsair Vengeance DDR3-1866MHz CL8-10-10-28-37-2T (4x4GB) 16.38GB / Operating System 1: Windows 10 Home / Sound: Zombee Z300 / Storage 1: Samsung 850 EVO 500GB SSD (x2) / Storage 2: Seagate® Barracuda 2TB HDD / Storage 3: Seagate® Desktop 2TB SSHD / Wi-fi: TP-Link TL-WN951N 11n Wireless Adapter

Godavari-X4-880K | R20 score MC: 810cb

Spoiler

Case: Medion Micro-ATX Case / Case Fan Front: SUNON MagLev PF70251VX-Q000-S99 70mm / Case Fan Rear: Fanner Tech(Shen Zhen)Co.,LTD. 80mm (Purple) / Controller: Sony Dualshock 4 Wireless (DS4Windows) / Cooler: AMD Near-silent 95w Thermal Solution / Cooler: AMD Near-silent 125w Thermal Solution / CPU: AMD Athlon X4 860K Black Edition Elite Quad-Core (T.S.M.C. 28nm) / CPU: AMD Athlon X4 880K Black Edition Elite Quad-Core (T.S.M.C. 28nm) / Display: HP 19" Flat Panel L1940 (75Hz) 1280x1024 / GPU: EVGA GeForce GTX 960 SuperSC 2GB (T.S.M.C. 28nm) / GPU: MSI GeForce GTX 970 4GD5 OC "Afterburner" @1450MHz (T.S.M.C. 28nm) / Keyboard: HP KB-0316 PS/2 (Nordic) / Motherboard: MSI A78M-E45 V2, Socket-FM2+ / Mouse: Razer Abyssus 2014 / PCI-E: ASRock USB 3.1/A+C (PCI Express x4) / PSU: EVGA SuperNOVA G2, 550W PSU / RAM 1, 2, 3 & 4: SK hynix DDR3-1866MHz CL9-10-11-27-40 (4x4GB) 16.38GB / Operating System 1: Ubuntu Gnome 16.04 LTS (Xenial Xerus) / Operating System 2: Windows 10 Home / Sound 1: Zombee Z500 / Sound 2: Logitech Stereo Speakers S-150 / Storage 1: Samsung 850 EVO 500GB SSD (x2) / Storage 2: Western Digital My Passport 2.5" 2TB HDD / Storage 3: Western Digital Elements Desktop 2TB HDD / Wi-fi: TP-Link TL-WN851N 11n Wireless Adapter

Acer Aspire 7738G custom (changed CPU, GPU & Storage)
Spoiler

CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo P8600, 2-cores, 2-threads, 2.4GHz, 3MB cache (Intel 45nm) / GPU: ATi Radeon HD 4570 515MB DDR2 (T.S.M.C. 55nm) / RAM: DDR2-1066MHz CL7-7-7-20-1T (2x2GB) / Operating System: Windows 10 Home / Storage: Crucial BX500 480GB 3D NAND SATA 2.5" SSD

Complete portable device SoC history:

Spoiler
Apple A4 - Apple iPod touch (4th generation)
Apple A5 - Apple iPod touch (5th generation)
Apple A9 - Apple iPhone 6s Plus
HiSilicon Kirin 810 (T.S.M.C. 7nm) - Huawei P40 Lite / Huawei nova 7i
Mediatek MT2601 (T.S.M.C 28nm) - TicWatch E
Mediatek MT6580 (T.S.M.C 28nm) - TECNO Spark 2 (1GB RAM)
Mediatek MT6592M (T.S.M.C 28nm) - my|phone my32 (orange)
Mediatek MT6592M (T.S.M.C 28nm) - my|phone my32 (yellow)
Mediatek MT6735 (T.S.M.C 28nm) - HMD Nokia 3 Dual SIM
Mediatek MT6737 (T.S.M.C 28nm) - Cherry Mobile Flare S6
Mediatek MT6739 (T.S.M.C 28nm) - my|phone myX8 (blue)
Mediatek MT6739 (T.S.M.C 28nm) - my|phone myX8 (gold)
Mediatek MT6750 (T.S.M.C 28nm) - honor 6C Pro / honor V9 Play
Mediatek MT6765 (T.S.M.C 12nm) - TECNO Pouvoir 3 Plus
Mediatek MT6797D (T.S.M.C 20nm) - my|phone Brown Tab 1
Qualcomm MSM8926 (T.S.M.C. 28nm) - Microsoft Lumia 640 LTE
Qualcomm MSM8974AA (T.S.M.C. 28nm) - Blackberry Passport
Qualcomm SDM710 (Samsung 10nm) - Oppo Realme 3 Pro

 

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2 hours ago, Wikiforce said:

Some Rumors say it will only cost 99$ :o

 

$99 sounds more like manufacturing cost of the chip and not its value in the market. It would have to we super bad for it to be priced this low.

Connection200mbps / 12mbps 5Ghz wifi

My baby: CPU - i7-4790, MB - Z97-A, RAM - Corsair Veng. LP 16gb, GPU - MSI GTX 1060, PSU - CXM 600, Storage - Evo 840 120gb, MX100 256gb, WD Blue 1TB, Cooler - Hyper Evo 212, Case - Corsair Carbide 200R, Monitor - Benq  XL2430T 144Hz, Mouse - FinalMouse, Keyboard -K70 RGB, OS - Win 10, Audio - DT990 Pro, Phone - iPhone SE

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Ya, thermals are important. Im happy to see amd made something that has a chance to compete. But, if they want to succeed, they should follow the path of the r9 480x and have the best value product. I want to know if this thing is being compared to a 6900k will it cost as much? Are all 8 cores able to be used at 3 ghz? If this comes in at 300ish range it would be very interesting

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Finally AMD realizes,use freaking SMT instead of CMT

 

Hopefully it has good single core performance benchmarks

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2 hours ago, iDeFecZx said:

So for the AMD CPU to be as fast, the Intel one need to be handicapped?

Given that we do not know the maximum clock of the new AMD chip we cannot say for sure which one was being handicapped.

 

Of course, given that the difference between the two was so small in this single test I also don't think we can say which one is 'faster.'

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