Debating custom loop for starting competitive OC

[porina]

System I want to cool is 1st in my sig below. In short: 6700k (not currently OC beyond 4.2, Corsair AIO), 980Ti (reference blower, thermal throttles easily). I just fancied having a go at competitive OC/benching, leaning towards the GPU side more than CPU. The 980Ti might now be last generation, but it still holds up there with a decent overclock, and I really want to see what mine does with better cooling. So, that means a return to water. Secondarily any further noise reduction over current would be a plus.

 

Case is Corsair Air 540. After a lot of measurements and thinking, I think a 360 in front + 240 on top is the best balance as other options involving a 280 start to make thickness a problem.

 

Below is a random basket I not so quickly threw together to get a feel for things. Price is not insignificant, I could almost get a 1080 for that! I'm using the P360 kit as a starting point, adding a 2nd rad and GPU block, plus more bits to implement a drain. I did add one too many extra fans, and decided not to go for the matching GPU backplate.

 

Any comments on this? My next task is to see how the P360 kit compares to the sum of its parts as I'm not sure that adds up.

 

I'm not stuck on EK by any means and would consider either replacing some or all parts. Basically, is there anything that'll do the same for cheaper? Or, would do better for the same kind of price?

 

[Julian5]

28 minutes ago, porina said:

System I want to cool is 1st in my sig below. In short: 6700k (not currently OC beyond 4.2, Corsair AIO), 980Ti (reference blower, thermal throttles easily). I just fancied having a go at competitive OC/benching, leaning towards the GPU side more than CPU. The 980Ti might now be last generation, but it still holds up there with a decent overclock, and I really want to see what mine does with better cooling. So, that means a return to water. Secondarily any further noise reduction over current would be a plus.

 

Case is Corsair Air 540. After a lot of measurements and thinking, I think a 360 in front + 240 on top is the best balance as other options involving a 280 start to make thickness a problem.

 

Below is a random basket I not so quickly threw together to get a feel for things. Price is not insignificant, I could almost get a 1080 for that! I'm using the P360 kit as a starting point, adding a 2nd rad and GPU block, plus more bits to implement a drain. I did add one too many extra fans, and decided not to go for the matching GPU backplate.

 

Any comments on this? My next task is to see how the P360 kit compares to the sum of its parts as I'm not sure that adds up.

 

I'm not stuck on EK by any means and would consider either replacing some or all parts. Basically, is there anything that'll do the same for cheaper? Or, would do better for the same kind of price?

 

If you want competitive temps, I reccomend you add another RAD and do push pull for best temps.

[porina]

3 minutes ago, Julian5 said:

If you want competitive temps, I reccomend you add another RAD and do push pull for best temps.

The above proposal has a 360 and 240 already, both 38mm thick. I don't think there's room in the case to go push-pull without going thinner rad, but this isn't something I've worked in detail. 

[Limecat86]

Well, there is also AlphaCool. They make good radiators.

 

8 minutes ago, Julian5 said:

If you want competitive temps, I reccomend you add another RAD and do push pull for best temps.

He already has planned a 360 + 240 rad. Well he might be able to put a 280 rad on top instead of a 240 but there is only space left for a single 120 or 140 rad in the rear...

[Katsunaka]

Overclock it on the AIO, 5ghz on a H100 with push pull is what I managed.

[porina]

Just now, Limecat86 said:

Well, there is also AlphaCool. They make good radiators.

 

He already has planned a 360 + 240 rad. Well he might be to put a 280 rad on top instead of a 240 there is only space left for a single 120 or 140 rad in the rear...

I did debate a 280 on top, but once you factor in fans and where the 360 will end up, I think it'll conflict unless I limit myself to a 30mm 360. Again, there isn't much space between the rear mount and top, so I didn't think that worth the effort to try and squeeze another one in there. As an estimate, there's only about 5% rad volume difference between 240+360 at 40mm as proposed, 280+360 but thinner, and mixed thickness 2x280.

 

1 minute ago, Katsunaka said:

Overclock it on the AIO, 5ghz on a H100 with push pull is what I managed.

The main reason for doing the loop is cooling the GPU. Out of interest, what voltage and temps (with what load) do you get at 5 GHz?

[Limecat86]

22 minutes ago, porina said:

I did debate a 280 on top, but once you factor in fans and where the 360 will end up, I think it'll conflict unless I limit myself to a 30mm 360. Again, there isn't much space between the rear mount and top, so I didn't think that worth the effort to try and squeeze another one in there. As an estimate, there's only about 5% rad volume difference between 240+360 at 40mm as proposed, 280+360 but thinner, and mixed thickness 2x280.

 

The main reason for doing the loop is cooling the GPU. Out of interest, what voltage and temps (with what load) do you get at 5 GHz?

Well, a 360 + 240 rad will cool both your CPU and GPU pretty well. You can expect your GPU to be around 60C at load. This can be done with a low fan speed.

 

Let me share my own experience: I have currently an i7 5820k + 2x GTX 970 in my loop cooled with an EK Coolstream P360 and a P240. The CPU is overclocked to 4.2Ghz.

Before I added the second card I was able to run the fans on their lowest speed. My setup was dead silent. The single GTX 970 never went hotter than 60C. I did not overclocked the GPU.

 

 

[done12many2]

@porina  With the understanding that you want to start hitting some heavy benchmarking, what are your expectations for temperatures?

[porina]

3 hours ago, done12many2 said:

@porina  With the understanding that you want to start hitting some heavy benchmarking, what are your expectations for temperatures?

This is an unknown for me. Traditionally I've set up my systems to be 24/7 prime95 stable, which is a bit different to pushing harder and only needing to be bench stable. The hope is to provide good enough cooling that it isn't a worry. I recognise that water will only get me towards ambient, and I'm not looking at below ambient cooling at this time.

[Jumper118]

if you are going to do competitive oc then buying a full cover block probably isnt the best way forward. a universal block will fint on most high end gpus that are both new and old, so that would be a better option, then you wont have to buy a new block every time you get a new card. It also allows you to insulate the card if you used chilled water, with a full cover block its very hard. 

 

 

You are also going to need to oc the crap out of that 6700K to stand any chance of getting a good score and tbh in modern benchmarks with physic tests the 6700k is way too slow. It is however perfect for older or very high fps benchmarks where they only use 4 cors and max ipc and frequency is all that matters. 

 

another thing you might want to consider is buying a 980ti with a decent pcb as the ref cards are really bad once you start pushing voltage. 

[porina]

3 hours ago, Jumper118 said:

if you are going to do competitive oc then buying a full cover block probably isnt the best way forward. a universal block will fint on most high end gpus that are both new and old, so that would be a better option, then you wont have to buy a new block every time you get a new card. It also allows you to insulate the card if you used chilled water, with a full cover block its very hard. 

I don't mind getting a new block for each card, since card purchases are so few and far between, and also the cost of a block compared to a card isn't significant. If I were to upgrade, it would be to a hypothetical 1080Ti as I'm not paying XP money, nor do I see the 1080 as sufficient upgrade from the 980Ti.

 

It also sounds like less work to get a full cover block, than having to mod a universal block every time. Going sub ambient isn't on the radar and I'd likely start over with better suited components if I were. This is pretty much a "get the best of what I have" style upgrade before I start throwing silly money at it. I also see watercooling as a one off cost, in that it could be moved to future systems anyway with minimal upkeep.

 

3 hours ago, Jumper118 said:

You are also going to need to oc the crap out of that 6700K to stand any chance of getting a good score and tbh in modern benchmarks with physic tests the 6700k is way too slow. It is however perfect for older or very high fps benchmarks where they only use 4 cors and max ipc and frequency is all that matters. 

I've not looked in that much detail yet but I intend to start trying things on hwbot and see where I go from there. Getting another X99 system is not on my plans right now and my existing Xeon is great on throughput but sucks at single thread, so I'm not using that. If 5820k CPUs drop on the used market, I might consider picking one later on and swapping it out for a bit of fun.

 

I wont have the best kit, but will still want to see how far I can get on what I have. Who knows, even Zen might be an option soon enough. Good or bad, I'll likely get one anyway to play with.

3 hours ago, Jumper118 said:

another thing you might want to consider is buying a 980ti with a decent pcb as the ref cards are really bad once you start pushing voltage. 

I'm keeping an eye out on used 980Ti pricing, but it is still more than I want to spend right now. I'd want to try SLI too if I can get a 2nd one for the right price.

[Jumper118]

3 minutes ago, porina said:

I don't mind getting a new block for each card, since card purchases are so few and far between, and also the cost of a block compared to a card isn't significant. If I were to upgrade, it would be to a hypothetical 1080Ti as I'm not paying XP money, nor do I see the 1080 as sufficient upgrade from the 980Ti.

 

It also sounds like less work to get a full cover block, than having to mod a universal block every time. Going sub ambient isn't on the radar and I'd likely start over with better suited components if I were. This is pretty much a "get the best of what I have" style upgrade before I start throwing silly money at it. I also see watercooling as a one off cost, in that it could be moved to future systems anyway with minimal upkeep.

 

I've not looked in that much detail yet but I intend to start trying things on hwbot and see where I go from there. Getting another X99 system is not on my plans right now and my existing Xeon is great on throughput but sucks at single thread, so I'm not using that. If 5820k CPUs drop on the used market, I might consider picking one later on and swapping it out for a bit of fun.

 

I wont have the best kit, but will still want to see how far I can get on what I have. Who knows, even Zen might be an option soon enough. Good or bad, I'll likely get one anyway to play with.

I'm keeping an eye out on used 980Ti pricing, but it is still more than I want to spend right now. I'd want to try SLI too if I can get a 2nd one for the right price.

the point of a universal block is that it fits on most cards without being modded  but if your not going sub ambient the you might as well get full cover because it cools the vrm better. 

 

what team are you in on hwbot? 

 

a 5820k would give you a very good performance boost in things like firestrike, otherwise you get beaten by peope with mild oc's and 5960x when you have put all the effort into making it all go fast. 

 

seen a 980ti lightning today for £340 posted.  thats a proper oc card 

[porina]

47 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

the point of a universal block is that it fits on most cards without being modded  but if your not going sub ambient the you might as well get full cover because it cools the vrm better. 

That's what I meant, I'd still have to cool the parts of the card not covered by the block. More work.

 

47 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

what team are you in on hwbot? 

Haven't even signed up yet... I'm leaning towards a team on another forum I frequent. I'd need to gain a minimum score before I can apply. Haven't looked if there's much LTT activity.

 

47 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

a 5820k would give you a very good performance boost in things like firestrike, otherwise you get beaten by peope with mild oc's and 5960x when you have put all the effort into making it all go fast. 

Again, I've not really researched into how much the score is split between CPU and GPU. In theory apart from a 5820k I have everything I need to build a low end X99 OC rig. It was done cheap to drive a 28 thread xeon.

47 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

seen a 980ti lightning today for £340 posted.  thats a proper oc card 

I've seen them from around £350 new as I think some places are clearing out stock, but even that is a bit more than I want to spend on a last gen card. I'm keeping an eye on ebay to see if I can get one sub £300.

[Jumper118]

7 minutes ago, porina said:

That's what I meant, I'd still have to cool the parts of the card not covered by the block. More work.

 

Haven't even signed up yet... I'm leaning towards a team on another forum I frequent. I'd need to gain a minimum score before I can apply. Haven't looked if there's much LTT activity.

 

Again, I've not really researched into how much the score is split between CPU and GPU. In theory apart from a 5820k I have everything I need to build a low end X99 OC rig. It was done cheap to drive a 28 thread xeon.

I've seen them from around £350 new as I think some places are clearing out stock, but even that is a bit more than I want to spend on a last gen card. I'm keeping an eye on ebay to see if I can get one sub £300.

ok. well there is an ltt team but nobody is on it lol. i am in team mlg which is mostly uk based. with overclocking you'll find its better to go with points per £ rather than £ to actual performance  

[porina]

Ok, now the order is in. I should get it ready to attempt a build next weekend. I kept the extra fan anyway as I want to try it on another AIO I have. I also added 1L of premix to save me from having to find pure water to use the bundled concentrate, which can still be a reserve plan if 1L isn't enough. The two rads and res would be around 0.6L, so add a bit for tubes and blocks... hope I wont need more than 1L.

[done12many2]

Just now, porina said:

Ok, now the order is in. I should get it ready to attempt a build next weekend. I kept the extra fan anyway as I want to try it on another AIO I have. I also added 1L of premix to save me from having to find pure water to use the bundled concentrate, which can still be a reserve plan if 1L isn't enough. The two rads and res would be around 0.6L, so add a bit for tubes and blocks... hope I wont need more than 1L.

 

You'll be fine with 1L.    With 5 x 360 rads, 2 x GPU blocks, 1 x CPU mono block, 1 x res and a ton of hose, I'm a little over 2L in fluid. 

 

Good luck with the build.  I look forward to hearing about it and seeing your benchmark scores.

[porina]

Bits arrived today. This is some of them. Nice boxes

[porina]

Assembly complete. I could write a lot more, but will save that for later. Next: leak testing.