PS4 Will Have Physx & Apex Support on AMD Hardware.

[TechFan@ic]

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NVIDIA says that by offering the support of its two technologies to the console, PS4 game designers will be able to "create intricate physics-enabled environments", "expand the quantity and visual quality of destructible objects" and "make smoke and other particle-based fluids integral to game play".

"Great physics technology is essential for delivering a better gaming experience and multiplatform support is critical for developers," says PhysX product manager Mike Skolones.

"With PhysX and APEX support for PlayStation 4, customers can look forward to better games."

PhysX support had been available to developers on current-gen consoles but its performance was restricted by the systems' relatively low specs. PlayStation 4's specification, however, should enable developers to use a more advanced form of the technology, such as that found in some PC versions of current multiplatform games.

http://www.engadget.com/2013/03/07/nvidia-rolls-out-apex-and-physx-developer-support-for-the-ps4/

http://news.softpedia.com/news/NVIDIA-Sony-PS4-Has-PhysX-and-APEX-SDK-Support-335297.shtml

[Emkryan]

PhysX on an AMD machine? seems legit

[eshbop]

PhysX on an AMD machine? seems legit

Software PhysX using the CPU, it happens with Radeon cards.

[TechFan@ic]

PhysX on an AMD machine? seems legit

This was exactly my reaction when I read about it.

[Emkryan]

PhysX on an AMD machine? seems legit

Software PhysX using the CPU' date=' it happens with Radeon cards.[/quote']

PhysX on a down clocked cpu? either super low PhysX settings or very seldom times where it shows up or else the game will turn into a slideshow

[EChondo]

If the PhysX is running off the CPU then what's the point? It'll slow down performance, cause more stress on the system, and it's NOT needed on consoles.

[eshbop]

They're offering support for it, doesn't mean anyone will implement it. PS4 games will be deved to run at only 1080p, 30fps and to actually utilize all the cores. Screen shots show launch games run what would be considered medium-high for PC. Considering all this I don't think it's that farfetched.

[vanwazltoff]

If the PhysX is running off the CPU then what's the point? It'll slow down performance, cause more stress on the system, and it's NOT needed on consoles.

if its an 8 core cpu then there will be quite a bit of overhead

[TechFan@ic]

Tom's Hardware wrote up an article about CPU VS GPU PhysX back in 2010, and found that CPU PhysX was extremely competitive with GPU PhysX, but Nvidia kept on creating barriers intentionally in its drivers to force and sell its GPU PhysX to the market.

It's obvious that they'll just make special drivers for the PS4 to run CPU PhysX on it, sooner or later though GPU PhysX will become obsolete.

[SteepGnomeKing]

If the consoles have physx than the pc versions will have physx so people will be more likely to be inclined to buy a Nvidia graphics card for the pc if they keep it exclusive.

[dCode]

Listening to the live stream, Linus has a good point. Nvidia must have had this in the pipeline for a while. So, how could they have known about the PS4/AMD architecture early? I wonder if any of the documents AMD employees allegedly stole as they moved to Nvidia included this information (ref: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2414405,00.asp )? Conflicted now...

[TechFan@ic]

I'm not as worried as Linus is, because I know for a fact that it will be CPU-based PhysX not GPU-based PhysX, so even if nVidia doesn't offer support for desktop CPU-based PhysX people will find a way to make it work, they always do.

I'm also sure AMD is not stupid, they wouldn't have allowed this had they known for sure that it will lead to consolidation on the desktop GPU market.

After all AMD controls the console hardware, if they witness Sony or Microsoft trying something that doesn't sit well with them, they will immediately step in.

Don't forget that AMD already showcased that innovative physics calculations can already be done on their GCN GPU architecture which will be featured on all next-gen consoles.

So I personally believe it will be a matter of whether the game developer is willing to sacrifice GPU horsepower for GPU-based physics like AMD's TressFX, or if they are willing to sacrifice CPU horsepower for CPU-based PhysX.

I really hope Linus & Slick read this.

PS: I was ecstatic when I realized that Linus was actually featuring me on the live stream when I was watching !!

[EChondo]

I do not agree with Linus. PhysX in games is already a niche market, there are what, 10 games that utilize PhysX? Sure the games can benefit from it, but I'd much rather be able to PLAY my game than see visuals.

PhysX takes a lot of processing power, especially with more hardcore games like Borderlands 2. Nobody is going to buy a high end card just to utilize PhysX.

[GoodBytes]

This is a great idea from Nvidia.

The thing that you guys must know is that PhyisX is more than just a physics engine, it's also a physics library of effects. Yes it will run on the CPU, but when they port the game on PC, those with an Nvidia GPU will get a much greater performance out of the game, as PhysX will run on the Nvidia GPU. A smart move. Nvidia needs to do it on the WiiU and XBox 3, to ensure maxmium support of it, so that a majority of games will run better on Nvidia GPU's over AMD's.

[TechFan@ic]

This is a great idea from Nvidia. The thing that you guys must know is that PhyisX is more than just a physics engine' date=' it's also a physics library of effects. Yes it will run on the CPU, but when they port the game on PC, those with an Nvidia GPU will get a much greater performance out of the game, as PhysX will run on the Nvidia GPU. A smart move. Nvidia needs to do it on the WiiU and XBox 3, to ensure maxmium support of it, so that a majority of games will run better on Nvidia GPU's over AMD's.[/quote']

This probably won't happen since the actual hardware (CPU & GPU) are both AMD, you can rest assured that game developers will be developing on AMD's hardware from now on, either through the PC then porting down to consoles or the other way around but in both instances the development hardware will remain that of AMD.

So no matter what, games will just work great on AMD's CPUs and GPUs from now on, nVidia will have to spend so much money just to keep optimizing games for its cards, while AMD can get the same results or better without spending nearly as much.

As for GPU PhysX, I keep repeating this, tomshardware.com did a comparison in 2010 between GPU & CPU PhysX and even back then CPU physx was deemed "extremely competitive".

By the time the new consoles are out, we'll have tangibly faster CPUs than what we had back in 2010.

[GoodBytes]

Nha. Because the AMD CPU is super slow, our desktop CPUs massacre that CPU. And GPU are master at doing advance mathematics and physics.

[-ism]

I do not agree with Linus. PhysX in games is already a niche market, there are what, 10 games that utilize PhysX? Sure the games can benefit from it, but I'd much rather be able to PLAY my game than see visuals.

PhysX takes a lot of processing power, especially with more hardcore games like Borderlands 2. Nobody is going to buy a high end card just to utilize PhysX.

I bought Nvidia over AMD for PhysX, but also CUDA.

[TechFan@ic]

Nha. Because the AMD CPU is super slow' date=' our desktop CPUs massacre that CPU. And GPU are master at doing advance mathematics and physics.[/quote']

You're either highly miss-informed or you're being intentionally subjective.

[NeCoNLive]

now when we talk about PS 4 is it comfirmed that it will come with a redray player ??

like

PS1 had CD

PS2 had DvD

PS3 had Blu ray

So PS4 will have RedRay ?

[TechFan@ic]

now when we talk about PS 4 is it comfirmed that it will come with a redray player ??

like

PS1 had CD

PS2 had DvD

PS3 had Blu ray

So PS4 will have RedRay ?

PS4 will have a bluray player.

[Polygon_DDR5]

Ps4 and xbox is good for Pc gamers, even though Ps4 have less power than an high end Pc it can be really optimized and the graphics will surely look good. And because the Ps4 and Xbox will run an x86 platform il bet we will see awseome games on all the platforms. Btw i think the ps4 will run in 60 fps :P not 30.

[GoodBytes]

now when we talk about PS 4 is it comfirmed that it will come with a redray player ?? like PS1 had CD PS2 had DvD PS3 had Blu ray So PS4 will have RedRay ?

"Red ray" is what CD/DVD uses.

PS4 will have Blu-ray. That has been confirmed.

In fact, all 3 new consoles (WiiU, PS4 and XBox 3) is/will be using Blu-ray disks. Except the WiiU will not allow you to play Blu-ray movies, as Nintendo didn't want to pay the high codec fees to have such capability.

[DeViLzzz]

I do not agree with Linus. PhysX in games is already a niche market' date=' there are what, 10 games that utilize PhysX? Sure the games can benefit from it, but I'd much rather be able to PLAY my game than see visuals. PhysX takes a lot of processing power, especially with more hardcore games like Borderlands 2. Nobody is going to buy a high end card just to utilize PhysX. [/quote']

There are more than 10 games that utilize physX and big name titles have had it so it is significant. Borderlands 2 also with Nvidia physX is better than what AMD puts out and so while the PS4 will have physX I wonder if it will be limited in any way.

[TechFan@ic]

I do not agree with Linus. PhysX in games is already a niche market' date=' there are what, 10 games that utilize PhysX? Sure the games can benefit from it, but I'd much rather be able to PLAY my game than see visuals. PhysX takes a lot of processing power, especially with more hardcore games like Borderlands 2. Nobody is going to buy a high end card just to utilize PhysX. [/quote'] There are more than 10 games that utilize physX and big name titles have had it so it is significant. Borderlands 2 also with Nvidia physX is better than what AMD puts out and so while the PS4 will have physX I wonder if it will be limited in any way.

It will be CPU-based so it will definitely be limited, the PS3 & Xbox 360 already have PhysX support but they didn't manage to do much with it due to the hardware limitations.

[EChondo]

I do not agree with Linus. PhysX in games is already a niche market' date=' there are what, 10 games that utilize PhysX? Sure the games can benefit from it, but I'd much rather be able to PLAY my game than see visuals. PhysX takes a lot of processing power, especially with more hardcore games like Borderlands 2. Nobody is going to buy a high end card just to utilize PhysX. [/quote'] There are more than 10 games that utilize physX and big name titles have had it so it is significant. Borderlands 2 also with Nvidia physX is better than what AMD puts out and so while the PS4 will have physX I wonder if it will be limited in any way.

Whoops, guess there are more than 10 games, weird, I have only heard of certain games with PhysX enabled. Never heard of games such as; MStar, Jianxia 3, 7554, Passion Leads Army, Depth Hunter, Gas Guzzlers, etc.

Let me rephrase my statement, there are about 10 games that are GOOD that utilize PhysX.

-Ghost Recon

-Ghost Recon 2

-Unreal Tournament 3

-Mirror's Edge

-Batman: Arkham City

-Batman: Arkham Asylum

-Metro 2033

-Borderlands 2

-Mafia 2

-Alice: Madness Returns

Yeah, it's totally not a niche market, look at all those games!