Microphone Recommendations

[nickl]

Hi All,

I was wondering what microphones you all would recommend for the high school class that I'm helping set up. You can read more about it here and here. We will be setting up a small recording space and we need microphones for it. We will mainly use it to record voice overs, maybe some foley, but others will probably want to use it for music and vocal recording once they realize that we have something like this. My main question is what models/kinds of microphones would be best for this use. We will be getting the Tascam US 20x20, or a similar audio interface. The US 20x20 has 8 microphone inputs, with switchable phantom power in groups of 4. What microphones would you recommend getting? I would like to get a variety of kinds and maybe brands to expose the students to a wide range of mics.

/summon @ALwin (I know you've already addressed this question somewhat, any more input that you may have would be appreciated )

[Naeaes]

My musician friends swear by Shure SM58.

[nickl]

Just now, Naeaes said:

My musician friends swear by Shure SM58.

We will be getting some SM 58's, but they aren't great for every situation, so we would like to get some more variety.

[Goodman2265]

AT2050, MXL 770, BLUE YETI

[ALwin]

6 minutes ago, nickl said:

Hi All,

I was wondering what microphones you all would recommend for the high school class that I'm helping set up. You can read more about it here and here. We will be setting up a small recording space and we need microphones for it. We will mainly use it to record voice overs, maybe some foley, but others will probably want to use it for music and vocal recording once they realize that we have something like this. My main question is what models/kinds of microphones would be best for this use. We will be getting the Tascam US 20x20, or a similar audio interface. The US 20x20 has 8 microphone inputs, with switchable phantom power in groups of 4. What microphones would you recommend getting? I would like to get a variety of kinds and maybe brands to expose the students to a wide range of mics.

/summon @ALwin

Hi Nick, I actually considered the Tascam 20x20 sometime ago when I was thinking about getting an audio interface.  In the end I removed it from my short list of choices for various reasons.  Better are Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 or the Clarett, or even Zoom UAC/TAC 8.

 

For mics, it all depends on what you want to record and the type of mics you want, with some examples below.

• Dynamic vocal mics for singing: stuff like the Shure SM58, Rode M1
• Indoor dialog recording: Sennheiser MKH 50 or Audio-Technica AT4053b which are short pencil mics with super/hyper cardioid patterns
• Stereo matched pair mics:  Rode NT5, NT55, M5
• medium and long shotguns: Rode NTG2, NTG3, NTG4/4+, NTG8, Sennheiser MKE600, MKH 416, MKH 8070 etc.
• large condenser mics: NT2000, Sennheiser MK8, etc.

Brands like Rode, Sennheiser, Audio Technica, Schoeps, Sony, Shure, AKG, etc. all make fantastic mics.  The most versatile ones I own and use 95% of the time are my MKH 416 and NTG3, along with two sets of Sennheiser wireless lav kits.

[ALwin]

For the on camera mics, I recommend you buy a selection of NTG2 or NTG4+, as these are dual powered shotguns and can also be boomed outdoors and indoors including foley work.  The NTG2 uses either an AA battery or Phantom Power from a source and the NTG4+ has a built in rechargeable battery or takes Phantom Power.

 

Along with that, get a couple of SM58, and perhaps a condenser hand held mic for ENG work in a situation where a reporter is asking people questions using a hand held mic.

 

Also, keep in mind you can have various different mic setups for recording different instruments and situations.

[nickl]

Just now, ALwin said:

For the on camera mics, I recommend you buy a selection of NTG2 or NTG4+, as these are dual powered shotguns and can also be boomed outdoors and indoors including foley work.  The NTG2 uses either an AA battery or Phantom Power from a source and the NTG4+ has a built in rechargeable battery or takes Phantom Power.

 

Along with that, get a couple of SM58, and perhaps a condenser hand held mic for ENG work in a situation where a reporter is asking people questions using a hand held mic.

For the camera kits, we will be getting NTG-2's and RodeLink wireless kits (they are cheaper than the Sennheiser equivalent, but we could get either), and for 3 of the 6 kits, we will be getting either Rode Reporters (dynamic omni ENG mics) or Sennheiser MD46's (dynamic cardoid ENG mics)

 

We will get SM58's.

[nickl]

18 minutes ago, ALwin said:

Better are Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 or the Clarett, or even Zoom UAC/TAC 8

Just as a sidenote, I completely forgot that Focusrtite released a second generation of their 18i20, and was staying away since their firmware was not listed as OS 10.11 or Win 10 compatible... I think we will go with that instead then.

[ALwin]

10 minutes ago, nickl said:

For the camera kits, we will be getting NTG-2's and RodeLink wireless kits (they are cheaper than the Sennheiser equivalent, but we could get either), and for 3 of the 6 kits, we will be getting either Rode Reporters (dynamic omni ENG mics) or Sennheiser MD46's (dynamic cardoid ENG mics)

 

We will get SM58's.

The RodeLink wireless kits are good, make sure you buy at least one block that can turn any mic with an XLR connection wireless too.

I have used both the Rode Reporter and the MD46, both are good mics though I like the omni of the Rode, you don't have to worry about forgetting to aim the mic properly.

 

If you want mic setups for recording drums, pianos, etc. let me know and I can guide you.

[nickl]

2 minutes ago, ALwin said:

The RodeLink wireless kits are good, make sure you buy at least one block that can turn any mic with an XLR connection wireless too.

I have used both the Rode Reporter and the MD46, both are good mics though I like the omni of the Rode, you don't have to worry about forgetting to aim the mic properly.

 

If you want mic setups for recording drums, pianos, etc. let me know and I can guide you.

I was going to get blocks for each one, but on second thought, we wouldn't really need blocks for the ones that don't have the ENG mic...

[ALwin]

17 minutes ago, nickl said:

I was going to get blocks for each one, but on second thought, we wouldn't really need blocks for the ones that don't have the ENG mic...

How about having a couple of portable recorders, like a Zoom H1, H5/H6 or Tascam 701D?  A Scarlett interface is for a studio setup, stationary in one location.

[nickl]

31 minutes ago, ALwin said:

How about having a couple of portable recorders, like a Zoom H1, H5/H6 or Tascam 701D?  A Scarlett interface is for a studio setup, stationary in one location.

We will get one of those. I have used the H6, and its amazingly useful.

[ALwin]

8 hours ago, nickl said:

We will get one of those. I have used the H6, and its amazingly useful.

Nick, I know you said you would get the NTG2's but I think you should reconsider the NTG4+'s a bit more and it is also a dual powered shotgun mic.  They are a newer model and I would say an upgrade of the NTG2. The main reason I suggest them is because their mic capsules' audio pickup quality would be better than the NTG2.  I own the NTG2 and while it is a good mic, compared to something like the NTG3 the audio pick up of the NTG2 isn't really good.  I own the NTG3 and Sennheiser MKH 416 which are comparable to each other.

 

When I got the NTG3 and 416, I did a comparison test to the NTG2, using my F8 field recorder.  I connected all three mics to the recorder,  set them up next to each other and set the gain on the recorder to the same level.  Every setting I could control for the mics and recorder was the same.  I stood at 1m, 2m, 5m distances away from the mics and started talking.  At 1-2m distance all three mics picked up almost the same level of audio, but beyond 2m the audio recorded by the NTG2 was noticeably quieter.

 

Here's something I recorded with the MKH 416.  I was in a park, with people walking around chatting, playing with their pets, etc.  This bird is on a tree about 15m away from me.  The audio pickup, directional focus, background noise rejection are quite remarkable.  The NTG3 should be the same, though I hadn't received mine when I filmed this.  I think the NTG4/4+ should also be comparable.

 

Rode's NTG line of mics from top end to low:

NTG3 (and I think the NTG8 also sits at this level)

NTG4/4+ (yes the NTG4/4+ sits below the NTG3, the 4/4+ are an upgrade over the NTG2, not NTG3)

NTG2

NTG1

 

 

If you get the Zoom H6 (or any other portable recorder) you can get a bag for the recorder and a boom pole for a mic so that the students can also learn how to work as a location sound recorder.

 

 

And of course, don't forget to invest in several sets of headphones.  I recommend something like the Sony MDR 7506.

[nickl]

21 hours ago, ALwin said:

snip

 

If you get the Zoom H6 (or any other portable recorder) you can get a bag for the recorder and a boom pole for a mic so that the students can also learn how to work as a location sound recorder.

 

And of course, don't forget to invest in several sets of headphones.  I recommend something like the Sony MDR 7506.

Very good thoughts, thank you. We were planning on getting every camera kit a 7506. I already posted in the audio thread about that decision. I was thinking of getting 1-2 (or maybe even more) H6's. Would something else like an F8 be better suited to the full bag setup? I completely understand that it is very nice to have a big bag as it enables you record your audio as well as operate a boom.

 

ATM, I think I have bigger problems... with 3 weeks from school starting, we have finally talked to the teacher who's going to be actually teaching this thing, and he is planning on buying 12 HDSLR kits. I know, its nuts... I can't imagine having to teach 36 students how to connect up, use and troubleshoot HDSLR rigs. (as well has how to use them with tripods, shoulder mount kits, and steadicam's, etc.) I don't even like doing it myself, and I don't know how he imagines he can teach it either.

He is also supported by the theater teacher who has a connection in the film education world who have gotten HDSLR kits, as well as full RED kits both of which have been used by students that actually care and are dedicated to the art, so that works out... He also has the idea for the students to use iPads to film and use iMovie on them to introduce the students to storytelling (for a week, so it isn't that bad)...

Its gonna be a tough nut to crack before we pull the trigger on $50K+ of equipment, which the Director of Tech wants to do soon to get the class off of the ground. Help.

 

P.S.: I've been working on a giant list and spreadsheet of everything that we might need to get for the class, and you (ALwin) probably have seen my tons of threads here about how to do this whole thing. I completely understand that I can't run this thing nor can I dictate purchasing decisions, as I won't be teaching it, but I think I should sit down and talk with the teacher about these decisions.

[ALwin]

1 hour ago, nickl said:

snip

I doubt you need a Zoom F8, or even several of them.  A couple of H5/H6 or Tascam DR 701Ds should do.  A Zoom F8 would be just too advanced for them and it would be too much of an investment.  Both a H5/H6 or 701D can be used with an audio bag.

 

 

For the HDSLR thing, while having a couple of HDSLR kits might sound like a good idea to have, I don't know if using only HDSLR kits sounds like a good idea.  It depends on the course curriculum.  If I were running a course that covered many topics, including broadcasting, I wouldn't use only HDSLR kits.  I might have a couple on hand, but also have a mixture of other cameras (including cheap camcorders, possibly BM cinema cameras, and a few low end professional camcorders like the X70).

 

Using an iPad or iPhone to learn story telling is not a bad idea.  It forces the student to focus less on the gear and more on getting the story telling side right.