DDR4 3200MHz CL14 vs CL16 any performance difference ?

[arnavvr]

3 minutes ago, mhamrin said:

I'm going with 32gb but I need quad channel. Couldn't find anything. I've been waiting for the 3200 c14 to get back in stock. I've got the 5820k ...so Haswell-e

Try this:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231917&cm_re=Trident_Z_32GB-_-20-231-917-_-Product

[mhamrin]

1 minute ago, arnavvr said:

Try this:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231917&cm_re=Trident_Z_32GB-_-20-231-917-_-Product

I just got the new asus x99 deluxe II MB so I'm going to need quad channel kit. The one you posted is dual channel. Lets just say it was quad channel. In your oppinion...what would be best for haswell. 3200 c14 or 3400 c16? They've actually got the 3200 c15s in stock but would rather wait for the c14.

[arnavvr]

2 minutes ago, mhamrin said:

I just got the new asus x99 deluxe II MB so I'm going to need quad channel kit. The one you posted is dual channel. Lets just say it was quad channel. In your oppinion...what would be best for haswell. 3200 c14 or 3400 c16? They've actually got the 3200 c15s in stock but would rather wait for the c14.

The 3200 C14 and 3400 C16 is the same speed. The one I posted was a Quad Channel Kit, it was four sticks. For DDR4, make sure to get Trident Zs.

[mhamrin]

2 minutes ago, arnavvr said:

The 3200 C14 and 3400 C16 is the same speed. The one I posted was a Quad Channel Kit, it was four sticks. For DDR4, make sure to get Trident Zs.

Yep i've come to the same conclusion about TZs. 

 

Look at specs. It'll say either quad channel or dual channel. The one you posted stated it was dual channel. I think it has something to do the the architecture of the sticks. I would like to know more about this myself. Negg actually has a filter...dual, triple or quad channel.

[arnavvr]

3 minutes ago, mhamrin said:

Yep i've come to the same conclusion about TZs. 

 

Look at specs. It'll say either quad channel or dual channel. The one you posted stated it was dual channel. I think it has something to do the the architecture of the sticks. I would like to know more about this myself. Negg actually has a filter...dual, triple or quad channel.

Are there Quad Channel Tridents?

[mhamrin]

2 minutes ago, arnavvr said:

Are there Quad Channel Tridents?

Absolutely. In TZ 32gb kits there are 13 items.

 

http://www.gskill.com/en/finder?cat=31&prop_2=32GB+(8GBx4)&prop_3=0&prop_4=0&series=2482&prop_6=Quad+Channel+Kit&p=2

[harrynowl]

2 hours ago, mhamrin said:

I just got the new asus x99 deluxe II MB so I'm going to need quad channel kit. The one you posted is dual channel. Lets just say it was quad channel. In your oppinion...what would be best for haswell. 3200 c14 or 3400 c16? They've actually got the 3200 c15s in stock but would rather wait for the c14.

Haswell-E is super unlikely to run 3400 (and you'd need to use a weird blck). 3200c14 better call.

[mhamrin]

4 hours ago, harrynowl said:

Haswell-E is super unlikely to run 3400 (and you'd need to use a weird blck). 3200c14 better call.

That's what i'm going with. You're my ram guru so i've got a question. The 32gb 3200c14 (4x8gb) come in either dual or quad channel. What's the difference? I can run either, i know, but whats the scientific and practical explanations? 

[Nena Trinity]

CL14 is better just grab that unless it is much more expensive...

[Jumper118]

On 23/07/2016 at 5:55 AM, AlphaPolack said:

iGPU, nothing faster than 2666.

Ramdisks, YES faster the better.

 

 

My 32GB Ramdisk (DDR4-3333)

 

On 24/07/2016 at 2:28 AM, Damocles said:

DDR4 at 3000Mhz, with timings of 15-15-15-36 beat his DDR4 at 3333Mhz. Timings are also important and tighter timings in my opinion is more important than higher frequency. Higher frequency tends to help virtualization so keep an eye out for that. Go for Highest frequency + Lowest timings + Least difference between timings.

The ram disk speed in Crystal disk mark will be limited by your cpu,  not the speed of the ram.  Crystal disk mark will only use 1 thread. 

[mhamrin]

4 hours ago, Nena360 said:

CL14 is better just grab that unless it is much more expensive...

It's only about $30 more than the 15s...the problem is its been sold out for about a month. 

[Damocles]

5 hours ago, Jumper118 said:

 

The ram disk speed in Crystal disk mark will be limited by your cpu,  not the speed of the ram.  Crystal disk mark will only use 1 thread. 

Wow you're right, I under-clocked my CPU 200Mhz under his 4.2GHz to account for approcimately 6% IPC difference and yielded similar performance. Guess RAM speed is just a number. I tried AIDA 64 Extreme's Memory benchmark. The first one is 4Ghz (The CPU reading 4.7 Isn't true, long story short, a macro lets me toggle 4Ghz vs 4.7Ghz) and the second being 4.7 Ghz yielded no significant change in memory speeds. Maybe we should try AIDA 64

[Jumper118]

14 minutes ago, Damocles said:

Wow you're right, I under-clocked my CPU 200Mhz under his 4.2GHz to account for approcimately 6% IPC difference and yielded similar performance. Guess RAM speed is just a number. I tried AIDA 64 Extreme's Memory benchmark. The first one is 4Ghz (The CPU reading 4.7 Isn't true, long story short, a macro lets me toggle 4Ghz vs 4.7Ghz) and the second being 4.7 Ghz yielded no significant change in memory speeds. Maybe we should try AIDA 64

i found that out when testing with the ram disk in my 771 server with 8 cores and i was only getting 2.5GB/s when in theory ram should be running miles faster than that. even 10GB/s like you are getting is very very slow for RAM.

[Damocles]

Just now, Jumper118 said:

i found that out when testing with the ram disk in my 771 server with 8 cores and i was only getting 2.5GB/s when in theory ram should be running miles faster than that. even 10GB/s like you are getting is very very slow for RAM.

Server ECC RAM is slower, but I didn't think by that much either

[Jumper118]

Just now, Damocles said:

Server ECC RAM is slower, but I didn't think by that much either

ik. but even DDR1 at 400Mhz is 6.4GB/s............  

[done12many2]

11 hours ago, mhamrin said:

That's what i'm going with. You're my ram guru so i've got a question. The 32gb 3200c14 (4x8gb) come in either dual or quad channel. What's the difference? I can run either, i know, but whats the scientific and practical explanations? 

 

For use with x99, you're going to want to get a 4 x 8 or 8 x 8 set certified for quad channel.  

 

The binning process for dual and quad differ.  For example, the IMC on a 6700k (dual channel) is a more forgiving than the IMC on a Haswell-E or Broadwell-E chip, so you can expect that the quality of the dual channel 4 x 8 set to be lower.  The set binned for quad channel is generally of higher grade, which allows it to operate at the spec'd speed, timings, and voltage when combined with a quad channel CPU such as a Haswell-E or Broadwell-E chip.

 

This is not to necessarily say that the IMCs on Haswell-E or Broadwell-E CPUs are inferior to Skylake CPUs, but that handling quad channel especially at higher frequencies is a tough task.  Quad channel provides a great deal more bandwidth than dual channel so that is to be expected.  Buy purchasing a quality binned quad channel set, you're allowing you CPU's IMC and the memory a better chance of performing at or above their advertised speed, timings and voltage.

 

Of course, you can overcome the issues related to lower quality sets through manual adjustment of speed, timings and voltage, but I'm not sure you want to jump into that right off the bat.

 

Additionally, knowing that you have an Asus Deluxe II, another thing to look forward to with regards to performance is the motherboard's topology.  On boards like the x99 Deluxe, RVE, and the like, increasing DIMM slot population from 4 to 8 also effects memory bandwidth in a positive way.

[done12many2]

1 hour ago, Damocles said:

Wow you're right, I under-clocked my CPU 200Mhz under his 4.2GHz to account for approcimately 6% IPC difference and yielded similar performance. Guess RAM speed is just a number. I tried AIDA 64 Extreme's Memory benchmark. The first one is 4Ghz (The CPU reading 4.7 Isn't true, long story short, a macro lets me toggle 4Ghz vs 4.7Ghz) and the second being 4.7 Ghz yielded no significant change in memory speeds. Maybe we should try AIDA 64

 

I would have expected a difference between the two runs do the the 700 MHz cache difference.

[mhamrin]

On 7/25/2016 at 0:33 PM, done12many2 said:

 

For use with x99, you're going to want to get a 4 x 8 or 8 x 8 set certified for quad channel.  

 

The binning process for dual and quad differ.  For example, the IMC on a 6700k (dual channel) is a more forgiving than the IMC on a Haswell-E or Broadwell-E chip, so you can expect that the quality of the dual channel 4 x 8 set to be lower.  The set binned for quad channel is generally of higher grade, which allows it to operate at the spec'd speed, timings, and voltage when combined with a quad channel CPU such as a Haswell-E or Broadwell-E chip.

 

This is not to necessarily say that the IMCs on Haswell-E or Broadwell-E CPUs are inferior to Skylake CPUs, but that handling quad channel especially at higher frequencies is a tough task.  Quad channel provides a great deal more bandwidth than dual channel so that is to be expected.  Buy purchasing a quality binned quad channel set, you're allowing you CPU's IMC and the memory a better chance of performing at or above their advertised speed, timings and voltage.

 

Of course, you can overcome the issues related to lower quality sets through manual adjustment of speed, timings and voltage, but I'm not sure you want to jump into that right off the bat.

 

Additionally, knowing that you have an Asus Deluxe II, another thing to look forward to with regards to performance is the motherboard's topology.  On boards like the x99 Deluxe, RVE, and the like, increasing DIMM slot population from 4 to 8 also effects memory bandwidth in a positive way.

 

Absolutely best explanation! 

 

Thanks!

[mhamrin]

On 7/25/2016 at 0:43 PM, done12many2 said:

 

I would have expected a difference between the two runs do the the 700 MHz cache difference.

 

I've got surge protectors that are like 10years old. Do you think it's time to upgrade that item for the new build? What would your recommend? 

[done12many2]

19 minutes ago, mhamrin said:

I've got surge protectors that are like 10years old. Do you think it's time to upgrade that item for the new build? What would your recommend? 

 

Based off of previous conversations, it sounds like you may be doing more important stuff with your rig than I do with mine.  You may want to look into a UPS.  Surge protection is built in and they help maintain cleaner power to your system.  Then there's the whole thing about your computer still running for a few minutes after the power goes out. 

[mhamrin]

yep...you're right. I've got one for my wireless router but a lot of good that'll do if my system shuts down.

[mhamrin]

On 7/25/2016 at 0:33 PM, done12many2 said:

 

For use with x99, you're going to want to get a 4 x 8 or 8 x 8 set certified for quad channel.  

 

The binning process for dual and quad differ.  For example, the IMC on a 6700k (dual channel) is a more forgiving than the IMC on a Haswell-E or Broadwell-E chip, so you can expect that the quality of the dual channel 4 x 8 set to be lower.  The set binned for quad channel is generally of higher grade, which allows it to operate at the spec'd speed, timings, and voltage when combined with a quad channel CPU such as a Haswell-E or Broadwell-E chip.

 

This is not to necessarily say that the IMCs on Haswell-E or Broadwell-E CPUs are inferior to Skylake CPUs, but that handling quad channel especially at higher frequencies is a tough task.  Quad channel provides a great deal more bandwidth than dual channel so that is to be expected.  Buy purchasing a quality binned quad channel set, you're allowing you CPU's IMC and the memory a better chance of performing at or above their advertised speed, timings and voltage.

 

Of course, you can overcome the issues related to lower quality sets through manual adjustment of speed, timings and voltage, but I'm not sure you want to jump into that right off the bat.

 

Additionally, knowing that you have an Asus Deluxe II, another thing to look forward to with regards to performance is the motherboard's topology.  On boards like the x99 Deluxe, RVE, and the like, increasing DIMM slot population from 4 to 8 also effects memory bandwidth in a positive way.

 

N.Egg finally got the ram in stock. I've been checking it several times a day and was able to buy it. Within about a half hour of my purchase it was sold out again. Very high demand stuff!

 

I hope to POST next week. Finally!!! Then to oc'ing. I found something on the Asus board called 5-way optimization. I think it takes like 6 hours but it makes all the Ocing adjustments and fan setting. Do you know anything about this?

[done12many2]

7 minutes ago, mhamrin said:

N.Egg finally got the ram in stock. I've been checking it several times a day and was able to buy it. Within about a half hour of my purchase it was sold out again. Very high demand stuff!

 

I hope to POST next week. Finally!!! Then to oc'ing. I found something on the Asus board called 5-way optimization. I think it takes like 6 hours but it makes all the Ocing adjustments and fan setting. Do you know anything about this?

 

Congrats.  I was literally just reading on a thread on overclock.net that it was available.  Yes. Get it while you can type deal. 

 

Don't use the auto overclock.  They tend to overuse voltage and are not a great means of overclocking.  Great for someone that doesn't have a clue or any friends that are proficient at overclocking, but you don't have that problem. 

[mhamrin]

30 minutes ago, done12many2 said:

 

Congrats.  I was literally just reading on a thread on overclock.net that it was available.  Yes. Get it while you can type deal. 

 

Don't use the auto overclock.  They tend to overuse voltage and are not a great means of overclocking.  Great for someone that doesn't have a clue or any friends that are proficient at overclocking, but you don't have that problem. 

 

Cool....Thanks!

 

I'm going to need some stress test plus other software....correct?

[done12many2]

Yes Sir.

 

I'd look at grabbing OCCT, Asus RealBench 2.43, and AIDA64 as a good start.