FBI could hack anonymous computers, regardless of their physical location.

[Link81]

7 minutes ago, Technic77 said:

It absolutely boggles my mind that so many people willingly give up their privacy because "they don't do anything wrong".

The more people stop worrying about their right to privacy, less privacy for all. Governments all work the same way, advance against citizens' rights, if the majority doesn't say anything then they move a little more, when you realize that is too much, it will be too late to go back.

[TidaLWaveZ]

Saying "If you're not breaking the law then you have nothing to worry about" isn't really a valid argument in this situation.  If there is a warrant for information on your PC, you should be notified, not just have your computer ransacked remotely.  Since they have access to your system, what's to stop them from altering information? You can still have extremely sensitive information on your computer that's not illegal.  People invest a lot of money and time into securing their information. This whole thing is just another way for the government to get away with breaking the laws that everyone else, taking our rights away little by little until we have no more.

[RexinOridle]

Watch all the fucked up porn you can and flood their system with bullshit.

[Sauron]

2 minutes ago, Orangeator said:

Also never, ever use your own wifi. Connect to your neighbors wifi (not recommended) or public wifi (recommended) that has no security cameras in the area.

Literally that is it. That is how to become 99% anonymous and untraceable even to the NSA. Also change/spoof your wifi mac address.

Public, aka unencrypted wi-fi is more secure than my own wpa2 network? I beg to disagree... besides for it to make any difference you'd have to move around every time, otherwise you still become traceable.

 

There is no such thing as untraceable once you're on the internet, and even if you aren't that doesn't mean you're 100% "safe". A wise man once said that the only secure computer is one that is turned off. In fact, you can literally decode the radio waves emitted by your KEYBOARD to find out your password as you type it.

 

The problem is not that systems are exploitable, the problem is that there should be laws against it. And in this case, there should be US laws against it. If the UN or NATO had any power, these laws could be forced upon them, but as it stands the US government does what it wants and that is not acceptable when it means they reach over to data they have no business touching in another country.

[PlayStation 2]

20 minutes ago, I need a better name said:

i hope hentai featuring little girls isn't illegal

insert obvious loli joke here

[vanished]

30 minutes ago, Okjoek said:

I presumed the USA since that's the FBI's country of origin and where I live.

Exactly.  So now what if someone living somewhere else does something that's fine where they live but would be illegal in the USA ?  They can now go after anyone in the world I presume... Of this is actually true, which I question.  It wasn't explained in the op how technically speaking this would be accomplished.

[Orangeator]

1 minute ago, Sauron said:

Public, aka unencrypted wi-fi is more secure than my own wpa2 network? I beg to disagree... besides for it to make any difference you'd have to move around every time, otherwise you still become traceable.

 

There is no such thing as untraceable once you're on the internet, and even if you aren't that doesn't mean you're 100% "safe". A wise man once said that the only secure computer is one that is turned off. In fact, you can literally decode the radio waves emitted by your KEYBOARD to find out your password as you type it.

 

The problem is not that systems are exploitable, the problem is that there should be laws against it. And in this case, there should be US laws against it. If the UN or NATO had any power, these laws could be forced upon them, but as it stands the US government does what it wants and that is not acceptable when it means they reach over to data they have no business touching in another country.

Um you missed the point. The point is to use public WiFi through whonix. So by the time (which takes a while) the government finally figures out where your location is, it is at some random coffee shop with no security footage of you. So what you do is you connect to the wifi, do what you need to do anonymously, then leave. Never would the NAS/FBI be able to figure out or prove who it was if you follow the above guide to a tee. If you did this same thing but at your house... Well then you are just stupid. 

[patrickjp93]

32 minutes ago, Sauron said:

Not only that, it's also 100% unnecessary. Not ONCE have they caught a terrorist or what have you before the act through these supposed "security" systems. It's all happened thanks to good old fashioned detective work.

I redirect you to my previous post here, where I ask to which country's law you refer by that.

Actually they've caught quite a few this way. Where do you get your news? Fox?

[Dionyz]

You guys are missing the whole point. If they can access your remote computer then therefore they can place files. If they want to take you down then it's simple to do. Then we get into politics, where multi million dollar corporations will abuse this to have their political way.

 

Invasion of privacy? They will say that they have portable cause once they insert whatever they want.

[Sauron]

5 minutes ago, Orangeator said:

Um you missed the point. The point is to use public WiFi through whonix. So by the time (which takes a while) the government finally figures out where your location is, it is at some random coffee shop with no security footage of you. So what you do is you connect to the wifi, do what you need to do anonymously, then leave. Never would the NAS/FBI be able to figure out or prove who it was if you follow the above guide to a tee. If you did this same thing but at your house... Well then you are just stupid. 

So, you're telling me you can randomly and vastly change your location at short intervals in a way that makes it impossible to figure out a pattern and the general location where you live? If so, don't you think that the money you'd need to move to achieve that would attract unwanted attention?

6 minutes ago, patrickjp93 said:

Actually they've caught quite a few this way. Where do you get your news? Fox?

Show me which ones, I'd like to know. I think they mentioned that in the wan show recently (but I could be wrong). If it has some effect, all the better, but I didn't really hear of anyone being caught before the act because of information harvesting techniques.

[ThinkWithPortals]

You know what I wasn't thinking when I sat down at my PC a few minutes ago?

 

I wasn't thinking "Gee, I wish I was more paranoid!"

 

And now look what happens.

[Okjoek]

1 hour ago, Sauron said:

The title clearly reads:

 

Oooooh, okay. IDK then I guess. Cyber spying dilemma. Scawwy tiems I guess. Then again it is to be expected. I mean all communications in history have been able to get hacked by governments at some point. Wire tapping for the telephone etc...

 

IDK I'm not losing any sleep though.

[vanished]

So according to the article, this story is just about the FBI being given the legal authority to do this.  Whether or not it is actually possible is a whole other matter - it's not saying that the FBI can easily scan everyone's C Drive or something like that

[Admiral Naismith]

"Saying privacy doesn't matter because you have nothing to hide is like saying free speech doesn't matter because you have nothing to say."

 

Privacy is a critical part of any free society. Its part of the checks and balances between individuals, organizations, governments, etc..

Same thing with every other basic freedom. This sh*t is why history should be taken more seriously. Anyone who thinks the "I have nothing to hide" argument is even semi-reasonable is completely historically illiterate and a fool.

[Xorbot]

1 hour ago, GreezyJeezy said:

If you have nothing to hide it really shouldn't matter. I feel the whole pricey thing but they spy on us already you can't stop it so just comply with it and live your life and you most likely won't have to every deal with that, unless you do stuff you should be 

It does not work that simply.

 

The claim is that if the FBI can access your computer, even if you have nothing to hide, then the implications for the future can be grim.  In the future, there will be easy access to analytics and data collection.  It could be stated, for example, that a person who enjoys watching MasterChef (via web browser history search), Anime (legal digital purchases), and visits Amazon at least 2 times per week is 54% likely to commit a crime in the next 2 years.  While there is no psychological studies which prove this, the analytics and data collection prove this.

 

So in this cheeky example, if you happen to enjoy these 3 things, you might have multiple visits and continued surveillance upon you for a 2 year period.  Do you still have the stance of "even if I liked those things, I am still not going to commit a crime, so they can do surveillance all they want"?  The argument again, is that the FBI in this future example would prevent you from owning/purchasing firearms as is your right, and would prevent you from purchasing other products that would increase the likelihood that you would commit a crime faster.

 

So to enlighten you with an extrapolation to the example, let's say that you also enjoy Melona Bars, which are a tasty ice cream treat.  The analytics data suggests that in addition to those previously stated 3 things, having a Melona Bars in your diet would now increase the likelihood you would commit a crime to 57%.  With this increase in likelihood for you to commit a crime (based purely on inference of data, only -- no psychological study), the FBI and government would ban you from purchasing this product.

 

In fact, these examples of "future crime" potentially never end, and this future scenario is facilitated by your simple view of "if we have nothing to hide, then it really shouldn't matter."

[GreezyJeezy]

3 minutes ago, Xorbot said:

It does not work that simply.

 

The claim is that if the FBI can access your computer, even if you have nothing to hide, then the implications for the future can be grim.  In the future, there will be easy access to analytics and data collection.  It could be stated, for example, that a person who enjoys watching MasterChef (via web browser history search), Anime (legal digital purchases), and visits Amazon at least 2 times per week is 54% likely to commit a crime in the next 2 years.  While there is no psychological studies which prove this, the analytics and data collection prove this.

 

So in this cheeky example, if you happen to enjoy these 3 things, you might have multiple visits and continued surveillance upon you for a 2 year period.  Do you still have the stance of "even if I liked those things, I am still not going to commit a crime, so they can do surveillance all they want"?  The argument again, is that the FBI in this future example would prevent you from owning/purchasing firearms as is your right, and would prevent you from purchasing other products that would increase the likelihood that you would commit a crime faster.

 

So to enlighten you with an extrapolation to the example, let's say that you also enjoy Melona Bars, which are a tasty ice cream treat.  The analytics data suggests that in addition to those previously stated 3 things, having a Melona Bars in your diet would now increase the likelihood you would commit a crime to 57%.  With this increase in likelihood for you to commit a crime (based purely on inference of data, only -- no psychological study), the FBI and government would ban you from purchasing this product.

 

In fact, these examples of "future crime" potentially never end, and this future scenario is facilitated by your simple view of "if we have nothing to hide, then it really shouldn't matter."

It's good tho, they can gel

 stop crime, I don't care if the go cement can get in my computer and control it because I have nothing to hide. If it can help find bad guys then do it, why would I care if they can see my shit. I live an honest life and I'd happily show them my computer if they knocked on my door with no warrant.

[ThinkWithPortals]

9 minutes ago, Xorbot said:

It does not work that simply.

 

The claim is that if the FBI can access your computer, even if you have nothing to hide, then the implications for the future can be grim.  In the future, there will be easy access to analytics and data collection.  It could be stated, for example, that a person who enjoys watching MasterChef (via web browser history search), Anime (legal digital purchases), and visits Amazon at least 2 times per week is 54% likely to commit a crime in the next 2 years.  While there is no psychological studies which prove this, the analytics and data collection prove this.

 

So in this cheeky example, if you happen to enjoy these 3 things, you might have multiple visits and continued surveillance upon you for a 2 year period.  Do you still have the stance of "even if I liked those things, I am still not going to commit a crime, so they can do surveillance all they want"?  The argument again, is that the FBI in this future example would prevent you from owning/purchasing firearms as is your right, and would prevent you from purchasing other products that would increase the likelihood that you would commit a crime faster.

 

So to enlighten you with an extrapolation to the example, let's say that you also enjoy Melona Bars, which are a tasty ice cream treat.  The analytics data suggests that in addition to those previously stated 3 things, having a Melona Bars in your diet would now increase the likelihood you would commit a crime to 57%.  With this increase in likelihood for you to commit a crime (based purely on inference of data, only -- no psychological study), the FBI and government would ban you from purchasing this product.

 

In fact, these examples of "future crime" potentially never end, and this future scenario is facilitated by your simple view of "if we have nothing to hide, then it really shouldn't matter."

3 minutes ago, GreezyJeezy said:

It's good tho, they can gel

 stop crime, I don't care if the go cement can get in my computer and control it because I have nothing to hide. If it can help find bad guys then do it, why would I care if they can see my shit. I live an honest life and I'd happily show them my computer if they knocked on my door with no warrant.

Plot twist: GreezyJeezy is an undercover government official trying to convince us that FBI spying is good!

Quick, we need more tin foil!

 

[Railgun]

1 hour ago, JAKEBAB said:

“Arguing that you don’t care about the right to privacy because you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don’t care about free speech because you have nothing to say.” — Edward Snowden

AMEN

[Xorbot]

6 minutes ago, GreezyJeezy said:

It's good tho, they can gel

 stop crime, I don't care if the go cement can get in my computer and control it because I have nothing to hide. If it can help find bad guys then do it, why would I care if they can see my shit. I live an honest life and I'd happily show them my computer if they knocked on my door with no warrant.

You seemed to miss the point that YOU become the suspect.  The result of that would be you could no longer purchase products that you like and you would lose certain freedoms, because data analytics suggest that you may be a future criminal based on your daily habits, likes, and dislikes.

[Admiral Naismith]

v

15 minutes ago, GreezyJeezy said:

It's good tho, they can gel

 stop crime, I don't care if the go cement can get in my computer and control it because I have nothing to hide. If it can help find bad guys then do it, why would I care if they can see my shit. I live an honest life and I'd happily show them my computer if they knocked on my door with no warrant.

How come your apathy trumps other's serious concerns? You may be Mr. Average but some people are working on things that can change the world, are journalists, etc.. I don't want shady official #132 being able to look at my plans for a device that can curb global warming. What's stopping them from stealing/seizing/etc. work I've done? Nothing but the hope that they're honest people. Now if they go through the process of starting an investigation, getting  warrants, etc. the game changes. That's how it should work.

 

Your argument works if governments were honest. That. Has. Never. Happened. Governments are full of normal people. People who are manipulative and people who can be manipulated. Expecting more or less is just silly and immature. People are people.

 

You may argue that there are checks and balances/policies that keep the U.S. government and other governments fairly honest and on the straight and narrow. You're right. It's called fucking privacy.

 The are two ways this goes. You have overreaching governments and innocent people suffer to get some bad people. Or you have to let a few bad guys go. I'd prefer to have the innocent stay free. If you start punishing innocent people to protect them.... is it really protection?

[Tech_Dreamer]

FBI pullin out an Antoine Dodson on this shit,

 

He's climbin in yo window, snatchin yo data up, hide yo discs , hide yo drive's..

 

[Kobathor]

2 hours ago, GreezyJeezy said:

If you have nothing to hide it really shouldn't matter. I feel the whole pricey thing but they spy on us already you can't stop it so just comply with it and live your life and you most likely won't have to every deal with that, unless you do stuff you should be 

Humans should have a right to privacy. How would you feel if the govt just walked into your house, planted a few dozen cameras in places you wouldn't be told, then tell you if you mess with them it's a crime?

 

This is the same thing, just with computers instead of your house. The government doesn't care who you are, they're gonna spy on you. And you're okay with that? You sound like you're from the Nanny State United Kingdom, the guys over there don't care how much the government fucks them in their asses.

[TidaLWaveZ]

1 hour ago, GreezyJeezy said:

It's good tho, they can gel

 stop crime, I don't care if the go cement can get in my computer and control it because I have nothing to hide. If it can help find bad guys then do it, why would I care if they can see my shit. I live an honest life and I'd happily show them my computer if they knocked on my door with no warrant.

 

That's fine for someone without any creative, innovative, or individual business aspirations.  Just let anyone have full access to any and all of your creations whether it be a song you made, digital art, programming/apps.  Let them have full access to all your research and development towards that extremely lucrative technological discovery you make.  Lastly let them have complete and total access to all your financial information.

 

Because who cares if everything about you and everything you've worked for can be stripped from you as long as you're living an honest life.

[Bsmith]

wait wait wait

 

so they can litterly search ANY computer REMOTELY even OUTSIDE the US?

well go fuckyourself, time for heavy encryption, no US goverments in my file thanks.

 

Yes I know the things about "blabla if you don't have illegal stuff no worries blabla". But with certain workfields(chemistry in my case) you easily get on all watchlists due to termology and borderline legal compounds that I use on a dailybase.

Call me paranoia, but I am NOT taking the risk.

[Link81]

1 hour ago, GreezyJeezy said:

It's good tho, they can gel

 stop crime, I don't care if the go cement can get in my computer and control it because I have nothing to hide. If it can help find bad guys then do it, why would I care if they can see my shit. I live an honest life and I'd happily show them my computer if they knocked on my door with no warrant.

The funniest thing is that you disagree with people who care about your rights.

1 hour ago, Admiral Naismith said:

Your argument works if governments were honest. That. Has. Never. Happened.

Exactly.