Who are you voting for?

[diapersarefullofshit]

If I were American, i would vote trump. Obama, Clinton, Bush or anyone else from the same caste (standard republican or democrat politician) will never change anything because it is not in their interest to do so. That is a proven fact for over many years now that they somehow get backed by the same financial powers (koch/wallstreet/techvalleys/etcetc).  Ofcourse trump says alot of dumb stuff but the others do to, but mostly his stuff gets enlarged. All the whining about his wealth I find bullshit because afaik, the wealth multiplied so he did something good with that money somewhere along the line. And if it was that easy as many speak off, why didn't the Clintons or Jeb use the same tactics to multiply their wealth or enlarge their companies. I have never heard any politician speak directly or indirectly about job security for the lower/mediocre "class" as trump does. Yes, his companies will benefit from his infrastructure renovations he has talked about, but many normal people will also benefit. Instead of rebuilding a nation from top-down (wallstreet goes first), i have the feeling trump has a more down-top method (where many normal people also benefit). People are saying he is an awefull person but who sold society out, it were the democrats and republicans year after year. Not trump but your standard politicians created this demon, just look at it, freaking disgusting: http://www.usdebtclock.org/

[Volbet]

23 hours ago, Albatross said:

Yea, he does need someone to work on his website but if you think about it, it isn't all that bad. I kinda like the simplicity of it though. He doesn't need an ultra nice looking site as long as his ideals are supreme. <33

That is very true, but he still needs to sell his message to people that don't know it. Seeing Gary Johnson's stunning portrait as the first thing is not really a good way to sell that message. 

Also, a partially functioning drop down menu makes the programmer inside of me cringe.

 

Atleast it isn't as bad as Clinton's website: https://www.hillaryclinton.com/

Or Trump's https://www.donaldjtrump.com/

Berine Sanders': https://berniesanders.com/?nosplash=true

And don't get me started on Cruz: https://contribute.tedcruz.org/super-tuesday-victory-fund/?recurring=true I know it's not his actual website, but that is the landing page.

 

Johnson is atleast stating his political views and plans on the goddamn landing page of his campaign website. You don't have to dig though donation pages to find it. 

By now, I just think it's a universal rule that political candidates and parties has to have bad websites.

Things fall towards gravitational wells, light travels at 300.000 km/s in a vacuum and politicans have websites that looks like they were made in 1998.

 

And the partial derailing of this thread is on its way.

[Misanthrope]

2 hours ago, SteveGrabowski0 said:

Trump sounds like Goebbels talking about going after the newspapers. His plan to register muslims sounds like Germany and the Jews. Hillary is a truly awful candidate for sure but I don't want someone exploiting racism and turning this country into pre WWII Germany or Japan with all this nationalistic American exceptionalism crap.

And you really think that can happen? Honestly? 

 

That's the thing about Trump: just how many people think that even if he's actually serious that he would actually get away with such nonsense like the wall or registering Muslims. He's not getting to be "President for life" he will have to get a bunch of shit through congress and fight off a supreme court. 

 

He knows all of this and is just pandering, yet you think he's actually serious and things like that could actually happen? No chance.

[stconquest]

8 minutes ago, valdyrgramr said:

A communist socialist and democratic socialist are not the same thing.

 

Do you think we should continue letting public school be free?  Do you believe your gram gram should have social security?  Do you think firemen should put out fires?  Do you like the idea of highways?  If so then you're a democratic socialist like Bernie.  Socialism does not mean communism.  

 

Or, do you believe the rich should get a free ride while everyone gets a big fuck you?  Do you believe that the rich should get tax breaks?  Do you think gram gram shouldn't get social security because the rich want all of their money?  Do you think poor people need to pay for an education?   That would make you a Republican or a member of the Tea Party/Kock Bro supporter.  Now, ironically while you hate socialism!  Their daddy worked for Stalin.  So, what you hate/communist socialism is this group that Trump is also part of!  Ted Cruz is part of!  Oh, and don't target the rich?  How funny when the rich target the poor!  Funny isn't it?  You're supporting the ideology of families who have ties to the USSR and the Third Reich.  Free free free ride for the rich!  It's okay for the rich to go after the poor, and make the poor have to pay for everything!  Why exactly doe the rich get a free ride while everyone else gets screwed over?

 

This is exactly why I don't support American politics nor the government because the Koch Bros fuel this bs.  Yet, what you hate is what you support.  I just find that funny.  But, ya let's trust the ideology of a family who worked for Stalin and Hitler.  They're just the best people for what America needs.

 

 

Super Tuesday is coming.  We will get a better glimpse of how smart/dumb the US population is.

 

Running against Clinton is Trump's only hope in a general election. 

 

I have a good tolerance for religion, having grown up with it all around me.  Seeing church groups rally behind Clinton drives me nuts.  What a waste of communal efforts.

[Albatross]

3 hours ago, Volbet said:

That is very true, but he still needs to sell his message to people that don't know it. Seeing Gary Johnson's stunning portrait as the first thing is not really a good way to sell that message. 

Also, a partially functioning drop down menu makes the programmer inside of me cringe.

 

Atleast it isn't as bad as Clinton's website: https://www.hillaryclinton.com/

Or Trump's https://www.donaldjtrump.com/

Berine Sanders: https://berniesanders.com/?nosplash=true

And don't get me started on Cruz: https://contribute.tedcruz.org/super-tuesday-victory-fund/?recurring=true I know it's not his actual website, but that is the landing page.

 

Johnson is atleast stating his political views and plans on the goddamn landing page of his campaign website. You don't have to dig though donation pages to find it. 

By now, I just think it's a universal rule that political candidates and parties has to have bad websites.

Things fall towards gravitational wells, light travels at 300.000 km/s in a vacuum and politicans have websites that looks like they were made in 1998.

 

And the partial derailing of this thread is on its way.

 

That's certainly true. In an age people want good looking no matter the person behind that something. That's actually probably one of Gary's biggest setbacks; the younguns. He doesn't know how to make his message appeal to the general public (and I don't mean changing what he believes in like the rest of the politicians). Too bad the big media won't give non-Reb/Dems a chance at getting their message out there, giving the American people a larger pool of people to select (and not the same old same old), otherwise Gary would probably be leading this thing by a landslide. I mean he's pro-choice and pro-life, for legalizing weed, pro-equality for all, pro-separation of church and state, pro-whateveryoudoordontbelieve, for fair immigration change and border control (not too Liberal not too conservative), won't let people violate our Constitutional rights (and is heavily against spying on the American people), and a zillion more things. I mean how is it even possible such an outstanding candidate exists to run for our president but people ignore him in favor of hard views of their own parties? You'd think there were more logical people out there...

 

And holy hell, Sanders and Cruz have the worst of the lot. The laziness and staleness behind them is staggering.

[Albatross]

3 hours ago, valdyrgramr said:

A communist socialist and democratic socialist are not the same thing.

 

Do you think we should continue letting public school be free?  Do you believe your gram gram should have social security?  Do you think firemen should put out fires?  Do you like the idea of highways?  If so then you're a democratic socialist like Bernie.  Socialism does not mean communism.  

 

Or, do you believe the rich should get a free ride while everyone gets a big fuck you?  Do you believe that the rich should get tax breaks?  Do you think gram gram shouldn't get social security because the rich want all of their money?  Do you think poor people need to pay for an education?   That would make you a Republican or a member of the Tea Party/Kock Bro supporter.  Now, ironically while you hate socialism!  Their daddy worked for Stalin.  So, what you hate/communist socialism is this group that Trump is also part of!  Ted Cruz is part of!  Oh, and don't target the rich?  How funny when the rich target the poor!  Funny, isn't it?  You're supporting the ideology of families who have ties to the USSR and the Third Reich.  Free free free ride for the rich!  It's okay for the rich to go after the poor, and make the poor have to pay for everything!  Why exactly does the rich get a free ride while everyone else gets screwed over?

 

This is exactly why I don't support American politics nor the government because the Koch Bros fuel this bs.  Yet, what you hate is what you support.  I just find that funny.  But, ya let's trust the ideology of a family who worked for Stalin and Hitler.  They're just the best people for what America needs.

 

 

 

We've been through this before, I do believe. I know they aren't the same thing. I never once said they were nor implied it.

 

The problem is the socialist views Sanders has and wishes to implement with nothing more than a "free, free, free, free" attitude. Who is going to pay for this? How is it going to be paid for? What is our country going to suffer through in order to pay for everyone's college, food, housing, cars, medication and the like? And in such a society, how are we to expect people to want to do anything more if the government or richer people will just help them along? Where is the incentive to be a more productive member of society? What gives you or any other person the right to take someone's stuff just because they have more than you do? Of course, we are talking about the same kind of hard-leftists who think raising the minimum wage is going to magically cure or help the people in poverty.

 

And no I don't think the rich should get a free ride. I just don't think it is right to take more from them simply because they have more than you. No, I don't believe they should get tax breaks....you know what, before you go on a rant like this toward me, maybe you should read all of my posts instead of nit-picking something out of it and assuming you know my stance. So no, I'm not saying socialism = horrible death for us all. Taking my posts to the levels of extreme that you have is not going to win your argument for you.

 

So go ahead and find whatever it is you find funny "funny".

[SteveGrabowski0]

36 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

And you really think that can happen? Honestly? 

 

That's the thing about Trump: just how many people think that even if he's actually serious that he would actually get away with such nonsense like the wall or registering Muslims. He's not getting to be "President for life" he will have to get a bunch of shit through congress and fight off a supreme court. 

 

He knows all of this and is just pandering, yet you think he's actually serious and things like that could actually happen? No chance.

If Trump wins in the general election it'll be because voter turnout is low, and thus the Republicans will control the senate too (there is no way they'll lose the house). So he'd have a friendly congress to get laws through.

[Albatross]

3 hours ago, valdyrgramr said:

Where the Communist Socialists only giving the rich a free ride, Republicans and the Tea Party, argue with the slow child Democrat wanting revenge while the one okay guy gets called out for being a Democratic Socialist.  Why?  Because the Communists don't realize that there's a difference between their socialism and democratic socialism.  I'll bring the popcorn to this version of Slaughterama!  

 

The problem is that Sanders is the only one with any actual good ideas.  He's just too old to present them properly.  I don't have a problem with firemen, social security, little Timmy going to school for free, and so on.  The problem is that the rich don't want to pay for anything, and want to force everything on the mid and lower classes aka Republican/Communist Socialism.  The poor and middle class just don't want to be the only ones paying for it, also known as Democratic Socialism.  Both sides are socialst...it's just who should pay and who should get a free ride?  Shouldn't everyone pay taxes rather than the rich getting a free ride?  My only real issue with Sanders other than him being too old to present his ideas, that are actually the most useful, is that be going in as commander in chief.  Now, while he is the best to help the country's problems for the people, he doesn't seem to be the guy with the best military strength.  Which is problematic.  Not one candidate has the ability to be our president.  So, we have a bunch of Koch Bro fueled assholes vs the most useless candidate, Hillary vs the one guy who is only 50 percent of what the country actually needs.  So, there's really no perfect candidate.  As the entire point of this run is based off helping the people over fronting the military.  Am I the only one seeing a problem there?  Also, Ted can eat a dick.  He's not even a true American.  He's a Canadian getting off on the "born abroad" technicality.   So, it doesn't matter who takes office this time as we're all fucked regardless.  

If only good ideas were giant bags of money...

 

No, not all of the rich. Your assumptions come from anti-Republican/Rich politicians like Sanders. Though I do agree there is a problem with the rich class right now, like evading taxes etc etc, the solution is not to tax them more or treat them different (negatively or positively) simply because they are rich. Screw them over in order to help the poor because the rich screws the poor over? Makes no sense nor is it the right thing to do. But again; nothing you are mentioning about the rich I have argued against. I don't believe the rich should get a free ride and I don't believe the poor or middle class should have to carry the weight of this country.

 

How? Explain how he is the best to help us poor people and then explain how he is going to do this magical conversion of the land into the Kingdom of Caring. Not a single pro-Sanders person has yet to explain this to me and I have asked a billion times over, even on this very forum where pro-Sanders people seem to be a majority.

 

And agreed again...sort of. If it is between the Dems and Repus we have now, we are all fucked. But if people like Gary Johnson can get spotlight and get elected, this country has a pretty good chance to turn around for the good. Of course, that's a pipedream. :*(

[Volbet]

Did we really go almost 3 pages without screaming at eachother? Keep up the great work LTT.

Edit: I might have spoken too early.

 

And to return this thread a bit:

31 minutes ago, Albatross said:

 

Spoiler

 

That's certainly true. In an age people want good looking no matter the person behind that something. That's actually probably one of Gary's biggest setbacks; the younguns. He doesn't know how to make his message appeal to the general public (and I don't mean changing what he believes in like the rest of the politicians). Too bad the big media won't give non-Reb/Dems a chance at getting their message out there, giving the American people a larger pool of people to select (and not the same old same old), otherwise Gary would probably be leading this thing by a landslide. I mean he's pro-choice and pro-life, for legalizing weed, pro-equality for all, pro-separation of church and state, pro-whateveryoudoordontbelieve, for fair immigration change and border control (not too Liberal not too conservative), won't let people violate our Constitutional rights (and is heavily against spying on the American people), and a zillion more things. I mean how is it even possible such an outstanding candidate exists to run for our president but people ignore him in favor of hard views of their own parties? You'd think there were more logical people out there...

 

And holy hell, Sanders and Cruz have the worst of the lot. The laziness and staleness behind them is staggering.

 

 

The major problem with candidates like Johnson, is that he is too nuanced. 

His economic politics are distinctly right wing, while his social politics are very much liberal (as in the original greek meaning of the word).

And that is not a package people are used to in politics. People are used to candidates that are either on the middle (people like Kasich or Clinton) or people that incompasses extremes of both social and economic sides of the aisle (people like Sanders or Cruz).

Although, strangely enough it seems like the debate on the Democratic side is very different from the debate on the Republican side this time around.

While the Democrats seems to have focused a lot on economics, the Republicans seems to have focues on the social side, which is probably why a guy like Trump has begun building a religious side to his campaign.

 

What I think I'm trying to say is this, Johnson's problem is that he is alienating people on both sides of the aisle. Republicans wouldn't like his social politics and the Democrats wouldn't like his economic politics. 

 

While I'm far from a Gary Johnson supporter, I can admire that he has stuck to his guns and not let himself pursuade by popular opinion. 

 

Edit: And if you wouldn't mind explaining something for me: How can Johnson be pro-choice and pro-life?

[vetali]

None of them particularly interest me enough to vote. I have a feeling this will be the first one term president since Bush. 

[Albatross]

3 hours ago, valdyrgramr said:

The problem is that a lot of the rich tend to write a lot of things off as  business expenses when they're spending it on crap they don't need.  Didn't Cage get in a ton of trouble for that?  It's not that the rich should pay more, but more that the rich should actually pay their damn taxes over not paying then writing everything off as a business expense.  Also, I'm not supporting Sanders, I'm just saying that he's at least half a candidate while nobody is a true candidate.  However, I do think the poor deserve more of a break than the rich do.  Why further debts when the rich have the money to help?  I'm not saying we should force every rich person, but rather the ones like the Koch Bros and others like Cage who intentionally try to fuck the system by tax dodging.  Also, I wasn't nitpicking at everything you said.  I actually did read what you had to say.  I was just giving you some information on who the people are that fuel that ideology, the Koch Brothers...actual communist socialists.  I don't completely agree with Sanders on wanting to go after the entire rich, but rather ones like Cage and the Koch Brothers.  Why?  Because they try to hurt the economy further than helping.  I think everyone should contribute in some way.  I myself donate to charity and/or volunteer to help those with disorders.  I was simply saying that there is no perfect candidate while explaining the difference of the two sides.  

@ the italic: Acknowledged. My argument isn't to deny the rich are abusing the system/that it happens. I'm aware of it and I believe it should be stopped. aND well initially I was directing Sanders' views, which from the last time I was updated (a few months ago) he was for taxing the rich more instead of forcing them to pay their taxes equally. That's my problem with Sanders and people like him, who have very hard socialist ideals with poor implementation plans and just high hopes it'll turn out good when history shows us it doesn't work as perfectly as imagined.

 

And wait...so you want a punishment system built for the rich who dodge taxes, or something similar? Not that I care what happens to tax dodgers but that seems a bit extreme, though it would probably give them the incentive to pay. 

 

@ the bold: And ah, ah, okay. You were directing my post and commenting on what I was saying so I took it that way. Makes sense now, my bad.

[Speedyv]

Thomas Jefferson, one of the founding fathers was a proponent of separating church and state.

 

And as for conserving the constitution, politicians and their supporters just want to "conserve" the constitution in a way that reflects their agendas. So it's complete bs.   

 

See: Appointing Supreme Court Justice drama

[imreloadin]

I'm not one for politics but I'll probably vote for Trump just for the chance of seeing the Dems lose their minds the same way the Repubs did when Obama was elected. A lot of them are already making the "I'll move to a different country if he's elected" bs that they condemned the Republicans for when Barry was looking like he was going to win lol

 

 

 

 

 

[shermantanker]

I just don't want sanders anywhere near the Oval office. I despise full blown socialism, and plus he can't seem to enplane how he will pay for all this "free" stuff he keeps talking about.

[Commander_Z]

15 hours ago, Volbet said:

That is very true, but he still needs to sell his message to people that don't know it. Seeing Gary Johnson's stunning portrait as the first thing is not really a good way to sell that message. 

Also, a partially functioning drop down menu makes the programmer inside of me cringe.

 

Atleast it isn't as bad as Clinton's website: https://www.hillaryclinton.com/

Or Trump's https://www.donaldjtrump.com/

Berine Sanders: https://berniesanders.com/?nosplash=true

And don't get me started on Cruz: https://contribute.tedcruz.org/super-tuesday-victory-fund/?recurring=true I know it's not his actual website, but that is the landing page.

 

 

I find it odd that on Ted Cruz's website that $2700 is a default option to donate

 

Edit: after reading further down the page, i can see why

[Volbet]

6 hours ago, Commander_Z said:

I find it odd that on Ted Cruz's website that $2700 is a default option to donate

 

Edit: after reading further down the page, i can see why

@Commander_Z (I need to remember to quote people)

 

I just find the 4-pack of beer sleaves to be fun: https://store.tedcruz.org/product-category/hunters-gear/

That, and the fact that his donation page defaults to donations being a weekly occurrence.

Hopefully, Cruz will use the donations to hire a web designer.

 

But nothing will ever beat the $75 Jeb Bush Guacamole bowl: https://jeb2016.com/shop/lifestyle/guaca-bowle/?lang=en

I fucking love guacamole, but I'll never let my avocados touch that thing. 

[Real_PhillBert]

As of right now it looks like it will be Trump Vs Hillary, so I guess I will vote for Trump. However he is far from my political ideals, just closer than Hillary is. 

[Haswell_rasperry_pi]

Ted Cruz is my choice.  Marco Rubio has a not so good political history and Trump is a joke.  Trump hasnt said anything of sunstance.  Bernie will spend too much and Hillary clinton will do nothing.  Hillary vs Trump, then Trump. Bernie vs Trump, still Trump. 

[shermantanker]

1 hour ago, Real_PhillBert said:

As of right now it looks like it will be Trump Vs Hillary, so I guess I will vote for Trump. However he is far from my political ideals, just closer than Hillary is. 

Yeah I'm in the same boat.

[shermantanker]

1 hour ago, Haswell_rasperry_pi said:

Ted Cruz is my choice.  Marco Rubio has a not so good political history and Trump is a joke.  Trump hasnt said anything of sunstance.  Bernie will spend too much and Hillary clinton will do nothing.  Hillary vs Trump, then Trump. Bernie vs Trump, still Trump. 

Yeah I will be voting for Cruz, but since I am a republican in California my vote doesn't count. Oh how I love the all or nothing electoral college.

[Real_PhillBert]

3 minutes ago, shermantanker said:

Yeah I will be voting for Cruz, but since I am a republican in California my vote doesn't count. Oh how I love the all or nothing electoral college.

I didn't realize there were any republicans left in California

[Howlingwolf101]

Vermin Supreme all the way. Free ponies and he's the only candidate that's out to stop cavities by instituting mandatory teeth brushing in America. Supreme2016

[Real_PhillBert]

7 minutes ago, Howlingwolf101 said:

Vermin Supreme all the way. Free ponies and he's the only candidate that's out to stop cavities by instituting mandatory teeth brushing in America. Supreme2016

He is also the only candidate with a zombie preparedness plan, although it seems to be a poor plan...

[K0MP4CT]

Just a warning to America, if you feel that people dislike you now (not saying I do) just imagine how much worse that will be if Trump wins...oh god.

[Howlingwolf101]

52 minutes ago, Real_PhillBert said:

He is also the only candidate with a zombie preparedness plan, although it seems to be a poor plan...

I Knew I was forgetting something