Windows 10 sends your PC data 5500 times to Microsoft and Non-Private IPs

[dragosudeki]

5 hours ago, Misanthrope said:

"No lock or security system is perfect and you can bypass any lock, henceforth I will live with all of my doors and windows wide open!"

I find this analogy quite funny. Even if you want to make your house more secure, you can install "security cameras" which in a sense invades the privacy of people coming to your house. Therefore, in reality, there is no way to make your house more secure without having some form of breach of privacy (even fingerprint scanners are a little bit worrying in terms of privacy). Yeah, you can also lock your door, but that's useless if someone chooses to break your window. The real solution to your analogy is to move your house to an isolated space, have no doors/windows, and make walls using the strongest materials. If you don't want to accept that sad solution, then you would have to deal with the fact that some aspects of privacy will be sacrificed, especially when the current world revolves around information.

[Trik'Stari]

The simple fact is, this is the Enterprise grade version of Windows 10, and it is doing things that you have no control over. As a result, it is not secure, and no Network Admin with any kind of intelligence is going to suggest using it.

[stconquest]

I don't understand why MS would need to effectively monitor EVERY single PC using their OS in a constant manner.  Why everyone?  Why not the 5 million(arbitrary number) that choose to be part of a program and leave the rest be?  Piracy?  Good luck. 

 

In order to sustain the security of the OS, and further improve the software, there is absolutely no reason to ninja peoples data.  Millions would voluntarily commit their metadata if asked in a proper manner.

 

As others have mentioned:  It is the bypassing of client permission that should be troubling to us.  What are they trying to accomplish that can't be done voluntarily with a test group of millions of users?

[2FA]

People forget they buy a licence to use the product and not outright ownership of the product. Microsoft is technically the owner of your OS and may do whatever it wants with its property. 

 

As for why they do it, why does any company collect data? Its valuable, metadata tells you what consumers are interested in and the companies therefore create products that please the consumer. Gotta love capitalism!

[stconquest]

11 minutes ago, DeadEyePsycho said:

People forget they buy a licence to use the product and not outright ownership of the product. Microsoft is technically the owner of your OS and may do whatever it wants with its property. 

 

As for why they do it, why does any company collect data? Its valuable, metadata tells you what consumers are interested in and the companies therefore create products that please the consumer. Gotta love capitalism!

 

*tin foil hat alert!

 

I know it may seem that way on the surface, we live in a shitstorm of spin.  Terrorism is dressed as some kind of new threat this place has never dealt with before.  Having candidates for presidency referring to their plan to ask Bill Gates to "shut down the internet until we can figure out what the hell is going on", and that idea being defended by even a small portion of the population, scares me a little.

 

It would not surprise me if MS was being pressure to actively join the fight against terrorism, under the command of the US Intelligence groups.  I am not saying that is what is happening, just that it is not even remotely far from the realm of possibility.

[2FA]

Just now, stconquest said:

 

*tin foil hat alert!

 

I know it may seem that way on the surface, we live in a shitstorm of spin.  Terrorism is dressed as some kind of new threat this place has never dealt with before.  Having candidates for presidency referring to their plan to ask Bill Gates to "shut down the internet until they can figure out what the hell is going on", and that idea being defended by even a small portion of the population, scares me a little.

 

It would not surprise me if MS was not being pressure to actively join the fight against terrorism, under the command of the US Intelligence groups.  I am not saying that is what is happening, just that it is not even remotely far from the realm of possibility.

The government isn't forcing them to collect data. Companies collect it in the first place because it valuable, in fact a single person's metadata is valued at around $1200 to advertising industry, thousands of people's data is worth billions. The government just takes advantage of this.

[stconquest]

2 minutes ago, DeadEyePsycho said:

The government isn't forcing them to collect data. Companies collect it in the first place because it valuable, in fact a single person's metadata is valued at around $1200 to advertising industry, thousands of people's data is worth billions. The government just takes advantage of this.

You are still on the capitalism/marketing kick.

 

I am talking about X-Files/population control shit. 

[Cvdasfg]

Personally I dont care. While I do think there should be a way to disable all of it, what are we hiding? As long as everything we are doing is legal what are they gonna do? Leak that picture of our dog?

 

 

Obviously there are some situations where this shouldn't be happening, but in those situations linux would suffice

[2FA]

2 minutes ago, stconquest said:

You are still on the capitalism/marketing kick.

 

I am talking about X-Files/population control shit. 

I know what you were talking about, I just roll my eyes at that crap. It's like the illuminate stuff, stop making it out to be something that it isn't. It's just a bunch a rich people trying to get richer.

[stconquest]

2 minutes ago, Cvdasfg said:

Personally I dont care. While I do think there should be a way to disable all of it, what are we hiding? As long as everything we are doing is legal what are they gonna do? Leak that picture of our dog?

 

 

Obviously there are some situations where this shouldn't be happening, but in those situations linux would suffice

You do understand that "legal/illegal" defense works up to the point when someone points their finger at you, right?

[Delicieuxz]

5 hours ago, linuxfan66 said:

I appreciate your practical view of this. It's like dripping tap when there is a burst waterline down the street...

Though the burst waterline in this case is Windows 10, and it's not down the street, but in your home. Google is an off-property dripping tap that can be managed to not drip.

[Cvdasfg]

1 minute ago, stconquest said:

You do understand that "legal/illegal" defense works up to the point when someone points their finger at you, right?

Not sure what you mean by this.

 

If someone points their finger at me I'd ask for actual proof, seeing as I've never done anything Illegal I'd like to see it. 

[Delicieuxz]

6 minutes ago, Cvdasfg said:

Personally I dont care. While I do think there should be a way to disable all of it, what are we hiding? As long as everything we are doing is legal what are they gonna do? Leak that picture of our dog?

 

 

Obviously there are some situations where this shouldn't be happening, but in those situations linux would suffice

So you think that government rules define morality? There are a lot of people in a lot of countries who are persecuted by their country's laws for doing things we accept as rights in our countries. And in our countries, there are things which people are persecuted for which they shouldn't be. And if you become an opponent of the government in the USA, the government will spy on you - but the USA government can't even crack an encrypted phone without having a backdoor pre-prepared for them. So it matters what snooping avenues are available for corporations and governments, and having them or not having them makes a big difference, for everyone.

 

Ideally, you should have everything to keep private from government, because you are an individual, and are not government property. If you feel that you have nothing to hide, and therefore are fine with being completely accessible by government, then you are less than an individual, and are a b!tch of the government.

[stconquest]

Just now, DeadEyePsycho said:

I know what you were talking about, I just roll my eyes at that crap. It's like the illuminate stuff, stop making it out to be something that it isn't. It's just a bunch a rich people trying to get richer.

It is not like the "illuminate" stuff.  It is about the resource economy... what we fight wars over still.

 

Roll your eyes.  What do you want me to say?  You know shit about what really goes on in the world, just like me.  The difference is I understand there is more to war than what I understand and you seem to think you know it all.

[Cvdasfg]

1 minute ago, Delicieuxz said:

So you think that government rules define morality? There are a lot of people in a lot of countries who are persecuted by their country's laws for doing things we accept as rights in our countries. And in our countries, there are things which people are persecuted for which they shouldn't be. And if you become an opponent of the government in the USA, the government will spy on you - but the USA government can't even crack an encrypted phone without having a backdoor pre-prepared for them. So it matters what snooping avenues are available for corporations and governments, and having them or not having them makes a big difference, for everyone.

I'm not saying that they should be doing it.. They shouldn't be allowed to do crap like that..But they do. They make windows so they can spy all they want. If you dont like it then there are alternatives. My point was for the general people and in MOST situations it wont matter in the long run. 

[2FA]

Just now, stconquest said:

It is not like the "illuminate" stuff.  It is about the resource economy... what we fight wars over still.

 

Roll your eyes.  What do you want me to say?  You know shit about what really goes on in the world, just like me.  The difference is I understand there is more to war than what I understand and you seem to think you know it all.

Money = Power. It's literally all about money. Humans are inherently greedy, it's just human nature at work. It's not that I "know it all" it's that I like to get to the point and not dick around with the "what ifs". If you can't see that it's just one big struggle for power behind the scenes, then I... honestly I don't know what. Humans thirst for power over others whether they realize or not.

[stconquest]

On 2/10/2016 at 0:47 PM, Cvdasfg said:

Not sure what you mean by this.

 

If someone points their finger at me I'd ask for actual proof, seeing as I've never done anything Illegal I'd like to see it. 

Yeah, that's how it goes down. 

 

On 2/10/2016 at 0:57 PM, DeadEyePsycho said:

Money = Power. It's literally all about money. Humans are inherently greedy, it's just human nature at work. It's not that I "know it all" it's that I like to get to the point and not dick around with the "what ifs". If you can't see that it's just one big struggle for power behind the scenes, then I... honestly I don't know what. Humans thirst for power over others whether they realize or not.

You just proved my point.  Money does not equal power.  Money equals control.  Control dictates dominance over others.  You don't get to the point, you miss it. 

[Misanthrope]

1 hour ago, dragosudeki said:

I find this analogy quite funny. Even if you want to make your house more secure, you can install "security cameras" which in a sense invades the privacy of people coming to your house. Therefore, in reality, there is no way to make your house more secure without having some form of breach of privacy (even fingerprint scanners are a little bit worrying in terms of privacy). Yeah, you can also lock your door, but that's useless if someone chooses to break your window. The real solution to your analogy is to move your house to an isolated space, have no doors/windows, and make walls using the strongest materials. If you don't want to accept that sad solution, then you would have to deal with the fact that some aspects of privacy will be sacrificed, especially when the current world revolves around information.

So if you have several houses to rob all with equally valuable things would you try the one with security cameras, the one with unprotected windows or the one with THE FRONT DOOR WIDE OPEN?

 

Regardless of other measures you don't dismiss the basics just to win an argument which is what you're doing here: "Oh they can get your information anyway" That doesn't means you should shut up and take it.

[2FA]

Just now, stconquest said:

You just proved my point.  Money does not equal power.  Money equals control.  Control dictates dominance over others.  You don't get to the point, you miss it. 

That is literally the most ridiculous thing I've read all day. Calling a pig covered in shit a rose doesn't make it any less of a shit covered pig. You literally said my point isn't valid because you have a different name for basically the same thing. Those with power are in control, those without power are not. Someone with more money has the resources to be more powerful which in turn allows them to control others. It's more of Money->Power->Control because not everyone with power chooses to control others. 

[stconquest]

1 minute ago, DeadEyePsycho said:

That is literally the most ridiculous thing I've read all day. Calling a pig covered in shit a rose doesn't make it any less of a shit covered pig. You literally said my point isn't valid because you have a different name for basically the same thing. Those with power are in control, those without power are not. Someone with more money has the resources to be more powerful which in turn allows them to control others. It's more of Money->Power->Control because not everyone with power chooses to control others. 

I am not doing this. 

[Cvdasfg]

16 minutes ago, stconquest said:

Yeah, that's how it goes down. 

Um usually yes. In the U.S.A. thats mostly how it works. Obviously there are exceptions.

[vanished]

9 hours ago, Tofuman89 said:

 

This situation somehow reminds me of Skynet from Terminator. What do you guys think of this so-called "extensive telemetry"?

Oh yeah, as soon as I saw that movie I immediately thought of how insanely like Windows 10 it all was

 

But I don't really care.  To the best of my knowledge it's just sending basic system data about usage and performance, so until someone can prove it's sending every URL I visit in chrome, or a copy of every exe I run, or copies of my personal data or something like that, I'm not really concerned.

[suicidalfranco]

be smart: hypervise.

[XTankSlayerX]

Oh boo hoo a company is trying to use users data to make its product better... 

 

It's still going to have to send data somewhere to use somethings from the OS. Cortana, other MS things.... 

[ManIkWeet]

It has to be put against OSX, Ubuntu, CentOS and earlier versions of Windows to make this a fair topic...