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Tofuman89

Windows 10 sends your PC data 5500 times to Microsoft and Non-Private IPs

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Do the same test on Windows 7, 8 and 8.1...

 

You send and receive data to Microsoft when you're connected to the internet all the time, and you always have. Is this really news to people?

 

I just have proofs that M$ collect personal data. And worst- they sell that data...

Recently I build new rig, install W10, create M$ account with 100% fake information (let say it's "user X"), than install and register needed software (with same "user X") and start using it mainly for browsing and other simple tasks. On this PC never, NEVER was used Gmail (don't even have a youtube profile) but I receive mails like "Dear "user X", it seems that you are using old version of our software- will you consider upgrading your programs to last version?" in MY Gmail account? 

Try to explain me how the fuck someone connects new hardware/software owned by "X" who never, repeat- NEVER uses Gmail  with my  Gmail account? There are ONLY ONE thing in common- my IP address.

There are no problem if someone knows that I own 5 PC's, but to make connection like that you need to know too many personal things... OK, we don't care about what M$ collects and believe them- just like you... But they SELL your data to others- can you believe THEM? 

 

You have adware/malware/click on too many ads and phishing links. I have literally never received one of those and I give Microsoft all my information.


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2 minutes ago, mstef said:

I just have proofs that M$ collect personal data. And worst- they sell that data...

Recently I build new rig, install W10, create M$ account with 100% fake information (let say it's "user X"), than install and register needed software (with same "user X") and start using it mainly for browsing and other simple tasks. On this PC never, NEVER was used Gmail (don't even have a youtube profile) but I receive mails like "Dear "user X", it seems that you are using old version of our software- will you consider upgrading your programs to last version?" in MY Gmail account? 

Try to explain me how the fuck someone connects new hardware/software owned by "X" who never, repeat- NEVER uses Gmail  with my  Gmail account? There are ONLY ONE thing in common- my IP address.

There are no problem if someone knows that I own 5 PC's, but to make connection like that you need to know too many personal things... OK, we don't care about what M$ collects and believe them- just like you... But they SELL your data to others- can you believe THEM? 

That my friend is 100% impossible.   I doubt they sell the data as I have never gotten any of these emails on the 5 PC's I upgraded to Win 10 with all sorts of data saved on them.  This is confirmation bias.  If your new PC has NEVER had any Google data ever keyed into it, there's no way MS will know what your Gmail address it.  IP's change all the time, and if anything, all other Gmail accounts in the house would have gotten a similar email if you were targeted from your IP.  That's now how the data collection works.

 

And you're the only person I've heard with this story.


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Just now, PerfectTemplar said:

Do the same test on Windows 7, 8 and 8.1...

 

You send and receive data to Microsoft when you're connected to the internet all the time, and you always have. Is this really news to people?

This is my point, we have been under this  for years already, sure we can use Linux and Wine, but let us not kid ourselves are those of us with gaming rigs going to be happy on Linux coping with Open Source Drivers, waiting for support on Wine for a new AAA title? 

 

The question most commonly skipped in these debates before they go onto a quote war over niggles, is what do we currently do about this? as Windows users who want Windows to game on? yes can make accounts with false information but they collect data anyway, even Google collects from your Gmail and targets adverts ( Source : http://royal.pingdom.com/2010/01/08/how-google-collects-data-about-you-and-the-internet/ ) It's a part of the internet now, and I personally believe the only way for us to move on is to accept that we are no longer ninja stealth operators on the internet, but members of a more open network, and treat the internet as again like you was sat in a social situation.


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4 minutes ago, Samfisher said:

IP's change all the time

Seriously? You lost me here... 


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Just now, mstef said:

Seriously? You lost me here... 

You do know 99% of all ISP's use dynamic IP right?  Chances of you getting the same IP again after a modem restart is next to 0.


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On 2/10/2016 at 5:19 AM, Kierax said:

If Windows 10 is Skynet 1.0 or not is academic, the point is for gamers, do we stick to Windows 7 or 8.1 for the rest of time? that means missing out on DX12, and to be frank Windows 7 and 8.1 had telemetry. (source: https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/3g7hr0/removing_telemetry_from_windows_7_and_8x/ )

 

It's a part of OS's these days, we either accept it and treat our computers and the online world as an extension of that bar down your road, or we give up basically, and we all install TalisOS and give up on gaming on AAA titles. 

 

 

Windows 7 and 8 don't have telemetry unless a person has 'automatically install recommend updates' enabled. And if they were installed, people can remove those updates by running the script which my signature links to.

 

Windows 7 and 8 are getting Vulkan support, which accomplishes the same thing as DX12. So why do gamers need to move anywhere to continue playing games, when Wind 7 / 8 / 10 all perform pretty much on par? When you ask if gamers ought to stick with Win 7 forever, keep in mind that Win 10 is basically Win 7 with a different presentation, and minor feature changes. So, unless you're running a DX12 program, you pretty much are still running Windows 7.

 

On 2/10/2016 at 5:30 AM, Samfisher said:

That my friend is 100% impossible.   I doubt they sell the data as I have never gotten any of these emails on the 5 PC's I upgraded to Win 10 with all sorts of data saved on them.  This is confirmation bias.  If your new PC has NEVER had any Google data ever keyed into it, there's no way MS will know what your Gmail address it.  IP's change all the time, and if anything, all other Gmail accounts in the house would have gotten a similar email if you were targeted from your IP.  That's now how the data collection works.

 

And you're the only person I've heard with this story.

Microsoft certainly sells the data they collect, just as Google does to advertising groups. The whole purpose of MS collecting data is that it increases their profits, in a variety of ways.

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Just now, Delicieuxz said:

Windows 7 and 8 don't have telemetry unless a person has 'automatically install recommend updates' enabled. And if they were installed, they can remove those updates by running the script which my signature links to.

 

Windows 7 and 8 are getting Vulkan support, which accomplishes the same thing as DX12. So why do gamers need to move anywhere to continue playing games, when Wind 7 / 8 / 10 all perform pretty much on par? When you ask if gamers ought to stick with Win 7 forever, keep in mind that Win 10 is basically Win 7 with a different presentation, and minor feature changes. So, unless you're running a DX12 program, you pretty much are still running Windows 7.

Learn something every day, I had no idea Vulcan was coming for 7 and 8.1, however I need to know more about how supported it will be by the main gaming manufacturers.

 

 


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2 hours ago, Samfisher said:

It's non-specific data anyway, I personally don't care.

We see this argument often. You don't understand (or are willfully ignorant) how meta data and telemetry works. You actually don't need your name and address to know say (in my case) "latino male, 18 to 35 demographic, connects through this 2 locations every day and a mobile device, googles this information, watches this videos, buys this specific items on amazon, has this specific systems" etc. Before you can actually be nearly 100% accurate in identifying you personally without a single item of personal data.

 

And yes google does it too, Facebook does it, doesn't makes it any less fucking justifiable if Microsoft does it on a much deeper level.

 


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1 minute ago, Misanthrope said:

We see this argument often. You don't understand (or are willfully ignorant) how meta data and telemetry works. You actually don't need your name and address to know say (in my case) "latino male, 18 to 35 demographic, connects through this 2 locations every day and a mobile device, googles this information, watches this videos, buys this specific items on amazon, has this specific systems" etc. Before you can actually be nearly 100% accurate in identifying you personally without a single item of personal data.

 

And yes google does it too, Facebook does it, doesn't makes it any less fucking justifiable if Microsoft does it on a much deeper level.

 

Yes, I understand what meta data info includes.  It's still not personally identifiable.  They know a latino male, aged 18-36, 6 feet tall likes to look at basketball news and nike shoes.  They don't know it's you, they just have data that corresponds to that info.  They don't target you, they target groups.  They don't care who you are personally, they want to know what you do so they cal sell ads.  You can be the president for all they care, you get ads appropriate to whatever data they have.


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43 minutes ago, Delicieuxz said:

Windows 7 and 8 don't have telemetry unless a person has 'automatically install recommend updates' enabled. And if they were installed, they can remove those updates by running the script which my signature links to.

 

Windows 7 and 8 are getting Vulkan support, which accomplishes the same thing as DX12. So why do gamers need to move anywhere to continue playing games, when Wind 7 / 8 / 10 all perform pretty much on par? When you ask if gamers ought to stick with Win 7 forever, keep in mind that Win 10 is basically Win 7 with a different presentation, and minor feature changes. So, unless you're running a DX12 program, you pretty much are still running Windows 7.

i dont see vulkan taking off as of yet sorry...


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5 minutes ago, Samfisher said:

Yes, I understand what meta data info includes.  It's still not personally identifiable.  They know a latino male, aged 18-36, 6 feet tall likes to look at basketball news and nike shoes.  They don't know it's you, they just have data that corresponds to that info.  They don't target you, they target groups.  They don't care who you are personally, they want to know what you do so they cal sell ads.  You can be the president for all they care, you get ads appropriate to whatever data they have.

Microsoft might not care who I am personally. We know government agencies request this info through secret courts (or without legal proceedings at all in my case since I live abroad) and they can easily use this data to put my name and personal information to my metadata. Microsoft it's just collecting this information making it extra easy for this inevitable requests.

 

Just as a general security principle, having a centralized collection of all this data is far too dangerous to be a non-negotiable, not explicitly explained "feature" of the entire fucking OS. 

 

Does that means I personally won't use 10? Not really, I already know Google knows enough about me to pick me up from the crowd, Facebook too. That doesn't means I don't find it morally reprehensible that I do not have the option to support political dissidence without knowing my name would (again) end up in a watch list.


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1 minute ago, Misanthrope said:

Microsoft might not care who I am personally. We know government agencies request this info through secret courts (or without legal proceedings at all in my case since I live abroad) and they can easily use this data to put my name and personal information to my metadata. Microsoft it's just collecting this information making it extra easy for this inevitable requests.

 

Just as a general principle, having a centralized collection of all this data is far too dangerous to be a non-negotiable, not explicitly explained "feature" of the entire fucking OS. 

 

Does that means I personally won't use 10? Not really, I already know Google knows enough about me to pick me up from the crowd, Facebook too. That doesn't means I don't find it morally reprehensible that I do not have the option to support political dissidence without knowing my name would (again) end up in a watch list.

Then that is the issue with your government, not the company.  MS and Google data collection affects the rest of the world in a much lesser degree than the US/Mexico/wherever you are.


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Just now, Samfisher said:

Then that is the issue with your government, not the company.  MS and Google data collection affects the rest of the world in a much lesser degree than the US/Mexico/wherever you are.

I meant the US Government: all this info goes through American servers, subject to bullshit NSA programs, even (and specially because) I live abroad. And actually it doesn't affects "to a lesser degree" all it takes is the US deciding x group of people have the wrong ideas and are henceforth "terrorists" and fair play.


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3 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

I meant the US Government: all this info goes through American servers, subject to bullshit NSA programs, even (and specially because) I live abroad. And actually it doesn't affects "to a lesser degree" all it takes is the US deciding x group of people have the wrong ideas and are henceforth "terrorists" and fair play.

They do it with or without these data anyway, makes no real difference.  If anything, metadata collection has proven almost totally useless in counter intelligence anyway.


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Just now, Samfisher said:

They do it with or without these data anyway, makes no real difference.

"No lock or security system is perfect and you can bypass any lock, henceforth I will live with all of my doors and windows wide open!"


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1 minute ago, Misanthrope said:

"No lock or security system is perfect and you can bypass any lock, henceforth I will live with all of my doors and windows wide open!"

Except that quote doesn't cover entirely what I said.  The US government doesn't need ANY info and/or reason to go after you, whereas thieves have to make an effort to break into your house if you have locks.  The US gov can decide to do what they want with nothing in their way.  There are no locks.  Or even walls.  They walk through them.


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1 minute ago, Samfisher said:

Except that quote doesn't cover entirely what I said. 

It does, precisely for the reasons illustrated on the analogy: it's easier if my personal information is readily available than to trying to figure out who I am through other means.

 

We're done here I have no patience for people who intentionally misunderstand arguments to avoid them I don't need to repeat myself.


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1 minute ago, Misanthrope said:

It does, precisely for the reasons illustrated on the analogy: it's easier if my personal information is readily available than to trying to figure out who I am through other means.

 

We're done here I have no patience for people who intentionally misunderstand arguments to avoid them I don't need to repeat myself.

Like you said, Google already knows so much about you anyway.  The NSA could just go to Google and get that info, it's still only 1 step for them.  Whether it's MS or Google or FB, all they need is access to 1 company.  MS not having your info doesn't make it harder or more simple.


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Like you said, Google already knows so much about you anyway.  The NSA could just go to Google and get that info, it's still only 1 step for them.  Whether it's MS or Google or FB, all they need is access to 1 company.  MS not having your info doesn't make it harder or more simple.

I appreciate your practical view of this. It's like dripping tap when there is a burst waterline down the street...


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58 minutes ago, linuxfan66 said:

i dont see vulkan taking off as of yet sorry...

What is "taking off"? Neither has DX12, for that matter. But both DX12 and Vulkan are being supported by the same mainstream 3D engine developers: Epic, Unity, DICE. And Valve is supporting Vulkan with no word on whether they'll support DX12. Android is also going to support Vulkan.

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Google only knows so much because you choose to let it know.  Same with Facebook. 

Google and Facebook are services, they can easily be avoided and you can block their cookies.  With a dynamic IP you can also prevent them from using your IP to gather info on their end too. 

Your OS on the other hand can't be avoided.  Well, technically it can, you can always switch to Linux.  But still. 

 

As for Vulkan, seeing as it'll work on all platforms it's a more logical choice than DirectX12.  Game devs probably won't switch from DirectX to Vulkan to please the Linux users, but the OSX users are a large enough demographic to make Vulkan worthwhile. 

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Ive been on win 10 for 5 months and I have no complaints. Its fast, drivers work well (some devices dont even need a driver, wireless adapters).

 

I used some software called "anti-beacon" (Barnecules recommends it and made a video about it in November or so). Does anyone know how much data it blocks ? 


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I've been on Windows 10 also for a long while, I am in two minds of getting 8.1 Pro for my new build.


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There are so many tools out there for disabling telemetry xD yet there's no single 'Nope' tool for all background data collection haha. That'd be nice.

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