Bad moves devs, publishers, and companies like AMD and Nvidia over the years on PC gamers (Hoping for a collaborative thread with you guys)

[LeeWonky]

Note: By bad, I mean dick-move kind-of bad. And also the reason I want to keep this on PC's is because I personally think this is where gaming should be. Sorry console-players, I find PC gaming to be a more fitting "de-facto" platform because atleast I can natively be productive in here . The only compromise I see in PC gaming isn't the expense, its that its leaps and bounds more versatile than a console and cost effective. I get to do more things for the dollar. I like consoles, but exclusives have, overtime, made it annoying for me.

 

I wanted to make a compilation with you guys, be it on the first or second page on Google search or not, that talks about the crap that devs, publishers, and guys like AMD and Nvidia have done to make gaming more of a headache gaming had to be in these categories. See spoilers:

 

-Business model in-mind for the product from the get-go (Given that every company has to make their profits, what I'm talking about here is how much they want to nickel and dime its customers in an era in which its not like the arcades anymore where at that time it was fairly acceptable to end up spending a fair ton of money to beat a game if one's not good enough or wants to keep playing. Basically I'm talking about how much a company has cut-off from a product, be it they do it blatantly or discreetly, but still obvious. Also for F2P MMO's on how it cripples a full-free user from reaching end-game content. May also apply to games that have subscription tier benefits and disadvantages because I'm told there are subscription-based games that exist with that business model and give the player an advantage depending on how high that player spends per month based on subscription)
 

-Impact towards the PC gaming community (Well, its more of how far off from what they've advertised the game is in a negative way. Basically how close they get to the point of false advertising. An example I can give of this, though not gaming, is that when I buy a big mac from my local McDonalds store here in my country, they showed how big it is and how much its got inside it. But when I get it... nope, its far from what its advertised. The beef is way smaller than advertised, the lettuce looks like crumpled light-green paper, the buns are small, so on and so forth)

 

-Product's development and support over time after release (Basically talking about how a company cares after selling its product in a good or bad light. In this thread, we're limiting it towards bad light)

 

-Not only limited to just products. May include individuals that are loved by the gaming community that are put into situations that may, will, or have put the gaming community, including said individuals, in a negative situation such as getting fired, demoted, sued, slandered, libelled, assaulted physically/verbally, etc... (Satoru Iwata's death doesn't count because this affected the community in a sad way more than angry. And no, its not also because Nintendo is essentially exclusive to being in the console market for the most of it)

 

 

Cite sources whenever you feel is necessary. You may share info on something that does not have any sources in the form of links (I.E. Like how Dragon Nest isn't a P2W game, but the community can say otherwise... its just that no one has posted a thread or an article about it for some reason.). You may state your opinions about it.

 

 

 

So. I'm starting first (note: what I've cited/linked is just one of the many sources so feel free to Google it yourself for more info). See spoilers (Corrections included):

 

 

Note: Corrections from Enderman (with some of my opinions). Read the posts below regarding it.

The 970 3.5 GB Fiasco: Misleading advertising. IMHO, that miscommunication though... like, what? If we were told on Day 2 after launch that there was a miscommunication or on Day 1, maybe Day 3, that there was a miscommunication about it, I would've accepted it.

Note: Corrections from Enderman. Read the posts below regarding it.
Kepler getting neglected over time: As a 780 Ti owner, this is upsetting. I know from the start that the new line will eat it alive, but after looking how the 290X performs over time with its drivers maturing per driver update... I'm upset. Neglecting driver updates on an older card is pretty much a dick move. There comes a point that it somewhat makes sense that the 9800 GT stops getting its support because its old like nuts, but when the card's barely two years old and gets that treatment... nope.

 

Kojima barred from receiving an award for MGSV: MGSV:TPP deserves to even be considered the game to win as GOTY. I love this game, but I don't want it to win. Why? Konami takes the credit for this despite riding the coat-tails of Kojima. Even though this is universal in gaming since it also affects fans of MGSV who play it on consoles, this affects PC gamers as much as them. By that, I mean fans of the Metal Gear franchise (probably except for that certain Metal Gear game that Kojima had nothing to do with, which was more than a decade ago) in general are pissed about it.

Dragon Nest's business model (specifically Shanda Games International's handling of the game under Cherry Credits): A ton of experienced players who are impartial towards the game will most likely tell you how pay to win the game is. The business model after a certain period in the level 50 cap era basically made the game so pay to win that only hardcore fanboys of the game, or have a large enough sentimental attachment to it, will defend it and say it isn't pay to win. Well, with an RNG-based progression paired with a fatigue system in the game, adding in the limitations of how many times you can run certain nests, dungeons, etc... also having an imbalance in PVP, its only saving grace is its gameplay. I never minded the art style or the graphics. I cared about how well a game is in gameplay. So, this game expects you to make an effort of playing it 8 hours a day, whether you are in a guild or not, everyday to keep up with the acceptable standards due to how much power creep it has. They've given it more than enough artificial difficulty like making something tanky as fuck anyways or have a broken mechanic, its pushed players to spend time, money, or even both at the same time.

Star Wars: Battlefront: I think this is self explanatory. Cutting off content that should've been in the game... like Titanfall as well, IMHO... and some other shady EA practices. Angry Joe explains it well, despite being rather informal anyways and somewhat questionable credibility to some people (I heard half of his subscribers don't find him very credible, but oh well. On this one, yeah, cutting of content was self explanatory.
 

(Note: May need more clarification and added support)

I have several ideas for this thread, Intel bribing PC manufactures to not include AMD counterparts, Intel making compilers use unoptimized code when anything but an Intel chip is used, Nvidia over tessellating Crysis 2 to sabotage performance in AMD and older Nvidia cards as well as tessellating water underneath a city for the same effect, there are probably more but I don not know of them.

Source I dan find for this one

 

Thats all I can contribute for now. To those who contributed, I will quote you and add it to this thread.

So... why the thread? Well, its more of informing each other in this light of gaming. Feel free to correct me on what I've shared as well.

[Castdeath97]

This thread will turn into a flamewar, you have my guarantee!  

[LeeWonky]

This thread will turn into a flamewar, you have my guarantee!  

How so? Fanboys will come in and argue on which is which and what is what? I'm just asking out of curiosity.

[Tagiau]

This thread will turn into a flamewar, you have my guarantee!  

This thread will be locked because of said flamewar

[Starelementpoke]

AMD cards are a heater: No clue how it started, really annoys me. Yes they run hotter than NVidia cards, but they aren't actually that hot. Pisses me off even more when people are like, "I don't want an AMD card cause I don't need an extra heater," or something similar.

[Guest Kloaked]

How so? Fanboys will come in and argue on which is which and what is what? I'm just asking out of curiosity.

 

No. It'll mostly consist of people just saying "inb4 lock" before a mod comes to lock it.

 

Threads like this have a history of turning into flame wars because hardly anyone knows how to follow a simple rule that's in the CoC, which is be excellent to each other.

[Morgan MLGman]

Kepler getting gimped over time: As a 780 Ti owner, this is upsetting. I know from the start that the new line will eat it alive, but after looking how the 290X performs over time with its drivers maturing per driver update... I'm upset.

 

MGSV:TPP deserves to even be considered the game to win as GOTY.

As for Kepler based GPUs, I feel bad for people that bought a top-of-the-line GTX 780Ti for shittons of cash just to see it lose to a GTX 970 which is half the price, just released a bit later. R9 290X is still going strong, it's even getting better with each driver update.

As for the MGSV part, it's a good game but duuuuude. The Witcher 3 = GOTY. /thread

[Castdeath97]

How so? Fanboys will come in and argue on which is which and what is what? I'm just asking out of curiosity.

Someone will call out a bad move from a company.....a fanboy from that company will fight with him...thread gets locked.

[DevilishBooster]

This thread will turn into a flamewar, you have my guarantee!  

[skyler_mertz]

AMD cards are a heater: No clue how it started, really annoys me. Yes they run hotter than NVidia cards, but they aren't actually that hot. Pisses me off even more when people are like, "I don't want an AMD card cause I don't need an extra heater," or something similar.

 

Agreed. Albeit, a 290(X) idles in the 60's and is designed to run HOT. So I can see it. However Nvidia is no ice cooler either. The Fermi cards would cook too. (insert "the way its meant to be grilled".gif) Titan X get pretty hot as well. I think by now, most people that say that shit are just poking fun instead of giving a legitimate critique of the card.

[rcarteraz]

I see this thread getting locked...

[Morgan MLGman]

Agreed. Albeit, a 290(X) idles in the 60's and is designed to run HOT. So I can see it. However Nvidia is no ice cooler either. The Fermi cards would cook too. (insert "the way its meant to be grilled".gif) Titan X get pretty hot as well. I think by now, most people that say that shit are just poking fun instead of giving a legitimate critique of the card.

No idea what 290X idles in the 60's cause mine is 35-40 with fans @18% ;-;

[LeeWonky]

No. It'll mostly consist of people just saying "inb4 lock" before a mod comes to lock it.

 

Threads like this have a history of turning into flame wars because hardly anyone knows how to follow a simple rule that's in the CoC, which is be excellent to each other.

Welp... shit

 

 

Off-topic: Oh god, please give my thread a chance. I intended this as some form of an educational-kind of thread where we all get to talk about the bad side of gaming to remind us what we gotta fight for as consumers.

[Starelementpoke]

Agreed. Albeit, a 290(X) idles in the 60's and is designed to run HOT. So I can see it. However Nvidia is no ice cooler either. The Fermi cards would cook too. (insert "the way its meant to be grilled".gif) Titan X get pretty hot as well. I think by now, most people that say that shit are just poking fun instead of giving a legitimate critique of the card.

Eh, and the temps are better when you aren't using the stock cooler.

[Starelementpoke]

No idea what 290X idles in the 60's cause mine is 35-40 with fans @18% ;-;

Think he means stock cooler.

[LeeWonky]

As for Kepler based GPUs, I feel bad for people that bought a top-of-the-line GTX 780Ti for shittons of cash just to see it lose to a GTX 970 which is half the price, just released a bit later. R9 290X is still going strong, it's even getting better with each driver update.

As for the MGSV part, it's a good game but duuuuude. The Witcher 3 = GOTY. /thread

Sometimes I wish I bought a 290X.

But yeah, hate to say it, even if Kojima wasn't screwed by Konami, Witcher 3 deserves GOTY. Its kind of those games that I wanna "stop and smell the roses" kind of thing and enjoy the little things that the devs added as a bonus, which in itself is worth it.

[Enderman]

The 970 3.5 GB Fiasco: Sure, that extra 0.5gb of VRAM is there... albeit slower, but here's the thing I don't like about it. How long did it take them to tell us that there was a miscommunication between teams in the company? This counts as false advertising in my book. We were sold a card that has 4GB card, but we got a card that had 0.5gb's of it to be slow enough to the point that when you do ever hit enough VRAM usage that the slower 0.5gb VRAM will make things worse, Nvidia effectively screwed the guys who wanted a GPU that was advertised to natively have that much VRAM at at said-standards of how GDDR5 should perform. I know alot of people who bought the 970 because they wanted a cheaper 980 because of the VRAM for their use. I forgot what it was, but damn. Dick move, Nvidia... dick move.

Kepler getting gimped over time: As a 780 Ti owner, this is upsetting. I know from the start that the new line will eat it alive, but after looking how the 290X performs over time with its drivers maturing per driver update... I'm upset.

 

Clearly you dont understand half of what is going on

 

1) fps drops in games did not happen to everyone who passed 3.5GB of usage

Yes the benchmark used showed it was slower, but there were hundreds of people who showed themselves running games at over 3.5GB and NO PERFORMANCE ISSUES

 

but no, it is still not false advertising, because it has 4GB

there is a huge difference between "false advertising" and "misleading advertising"

 

2) this is just rumours from conspiracy theorists

you've got to be extremely gullible to believe that crap

 

what actually happens is when a new GPU line up is released, driver optimizations are made to improve performance on that new series, in thi case the 900 series

 

at launch the 780ti was better than the 970, not anymore, because they optimized drivers for the 900 series making them perform much better

the 780ti STILL PERFORMS THE SAME, but now the 970 performs much better

 

they did not make the 700 series perform worse, they made the 900 series perform better

this happens with every GPU generation, drivers are optimized for the newest cards, and the old cards are left as they were previously.

[don_svetlio]

Clearly you dont understand half of what is going on

 

1) fps drops in games did not happen to everyone who passed 3.5GB of usage

Yes the benchmark used showed it was slower, but there were hundreds of people who showed themselves running games at over 3.5GB and NO PERFORMANCE ISSUES

 

but no, it is still not false advertising, because it has 4GB

there is a huge difference between "false advertising" and "misleading advertising"

 

2) this is just rumours from conspiracy theorists

you've got to be extremely gullible to believe that crap

 

what actually happens is when a new GPU line up is released, driver optimizations are made to improve performance on that new series, in thi case the 900 series

 

at launch the 780ti was better than the 970, not anymore, because they optimized drivers for the 900 series making them perform much better

the 780ti STILL PERFORMS THE SAME, but now the 970 performs much better

 

they did not make the 700 series perform worse, they made the 900 series perform better

this happens with every GPU generation, drivers are optimized for the newest cards, and the old cards are left as they were previously.

And here we go

[Agent181]

[Citadelen]

I have several ideas for this thread, Intel bribing PC manufactures to not include AMD counterparts, Intel making compilers use unoptimized code when anything but an Intel chip is used, Nvidia over tessellating Crysis 2 to sabotage performance in AMD and older Nvidia cards as well as tessellating water underneath a city for the same effect, there are probably more but I don not know of them.

[LeeWonky]

Clearly you dont understand half of what is going on

 

1) fps drops in games did not happen to everyone who passed 3.5GB of usage

Yes the benchmark used showed it was slower, but there were hundreds of people who showed themselves running games at over 3.5GB and NO PERFORMANCE ISSUES

 

but no, it is still not false advertising, because it has 4GB

there is a huge difference between "false advertising" and "misleading advertising"

 

2) this is just rumours from conspiracy theorists

you've got to be extremely gullible to believe that crap

 

what actually happens is when a new GPU line up is released, driver optimizations are made to improve performance on that new series, in thi case the 900 series

 

at launch the 780ti was better than the 970, not anymore, because they optimized drivers for the 900 series making them perform much better

the 780ti STILL PERFORMS THE SAME, but now the 970 performs much better

 

they did not make the 700 series perform worse, they made the 900 series perform better

this happens with every GPU generation, drivers are optimized for the newest cards, and the old cards are left as they were previously.

I just have some questions to ask while I agree with you, though.

 

1.) Isn't misleading effectively the same as false?

2.) If that was the case on the 780 Ti being the same, wouldn't it make sense that the least that Nvidia would've done is that the 970 and the 780 Ti perform marginally the same?

 

And here we go

Uhm, what?

[Morgan MLGman]

Clearly you dont understand half of what is going on

 

1) fps drops in games did not happen to everyone who passed 3.5GB of usage

Yes the benchmark used showed it was slower, but there were hundreds of people who showed themselves running games at over 3.5GB and NO PERFORMANCE ISSUES

 

but no, it is still not false advertising, because it has 4GB

there is a huge difference between "false advertising" and "misleading advertising"

 

2) this is just rumours from conspiracy theorists

you've got to be extremely gullible to believe that crap

 

what actually happens is when a new GPU line up is released, driver optimizations are made to improve performance on that new series, in thi case the 900 series

 

at launch the 780ti was better than the 970, not anymore, because they optimized drivers for the 900 series making them perform much better

the 780ti STILL PERFORMS THE SAME, but now the 970 performs much better

 

they did not make the 700 series perform worse, they made the 900 series perform better

this happens with every GPU generation, drivers are optimized for the newest cards, and the old cards are left as they were previously.

I'd say that considering the 780Ti should be faster than a 970 just based by the specs, it should be faster. A 2 years old GPU cannot stop having good drivers cause it's getting ridiculous. R9 290X is actually getting faster from update to update, why couldn't the 780Ti be the same? Nvidia is to be blamed here, nothing else to say here.

[Enderman]

I just have some questions to ask while I agree with you, though.

 

1.) Isn't misleading effectively the same as false?

2.) If that was the case on the 780 Ti being the same, wouldn't it make sense that the least that Nvidia would've done is that the 970 and the 780 Ti perform marginally the same?

 

Uhm, what?

1) no, its actually not

misleading advertising is not illegal

 

false advertising would be telling you it has a graphics card and then you open the box and there is a paper card with some graphics on it

 

2) yeah, I'm not saying that leaving old GPUs behind with no optimization is a good thing

im just saying that all the theories about the old gpus getting "nerfed" are wrong

their performs seems to be going down, when its actually new GPUs performance going up

 

this isnt particularly good practice, IMO they should keep optimizing for older GPUs even when new ones come out, at least for several more years

[LeeWonky]

I'd say that considering the 780Ti should be faster than a 970 just based by the specs, it should be faster. A 2 years old GPU cannot stop having good drivers cause it's getting ridiculous. R9 290X is actually getting faster from update to update, why couldn't the 780Ti be the same? Nvidia is to be blamed here, nothing else to say here.

I'm not saying the 780 Ti should be faster than the 970, but more of the same if not slightly slower than the 970 by maybe a 5% margin (???).

[Enderman]

I'd say that considering the 780Ti should be faster than a 970 just based by the specs, it should be faster. A 2 years old GPU cannot stop having good drivers cause it's getting ridiculous. R9 290X is actually getting faster from update to update, why couldn't the 780Ti be the same? Nvidia is to be blamed here, nothing else to say here.

yeah, except in the world of GPUs specs dont mean anything unless you're comparing identical chips and architectures, for example a 770 and 780ti, or 760 and 770 or whatever

 

nvidia has been able to crank out a lot more performance from the lower core count on the 900 series

 

software has a LOT more to do with performance than people think

and the fact that they are bringing all that performance to the latest generation of GPUs only is disappointing

but no, the 700 series was not nerfed, just left behind