[Mini-News] Apple Giving Away Solo2 to Students Who Buy a Mac

[79wjd]

They're extremely expensive prebuilts. If this were any other company we were talking about, this alone would make everyone here discard the option immediately. Some of them overheat (not nice for a 4k$ machine) and in general, I consider pretty much the whole lineup (if there are exceptions I haven't seen them) terrible value and unsuitable for pretty much anyone, not because they're all bad machines necessarily, but because they are all way too expensive for what you get.

 

MacBook Pros are somewhat better than desktop Macs because laptops are pretty expensive in general and you can't really build your own, so the value is higher; that said, I still consider most of them too expensive for what they offer. Not I said macbook PROs, that's because in my opinion the "macbook" is a 1300$ tablet with a keyboard, with less flexibility than most actual tablets I might add.

 

^of course all of the above is my opinion, and we could discuss about numbers for days, but right now I don't really want to start a flamewar. Feel free to disagree.

Most Macs aren't really overpriced once you consider the build quality, a quality >QHD display, excellent support, PCIE SSD, and Iris/Pro graphics, and that a lot of the MBPs competition (XPS 13, Lenovo LaVie Z for example end up being about the same cost for the same/similar hardware but are also limited to 8gb of Ram -- $1300~).

 

The Macbook (non-air/Pro) is overpriced, but imo is more of a "we could, so why not" rather than anything practical (kind of like the Apple Watch). 

 

The retina iMac used to be a pretty good value, as did the Mac Pro (I'm not sure if that's still the case), while the normal iMac and Mac Mini, are pretty bad in terms of value if you compare them to a full size pre-built, but if you're after ultra small form factors/AIOs then neither are too badly priced. 

 

Now, the upgrades are and always have been far more expensive then they should be, but that's another story altogether -- also the fact that the 15" rMBP is still using Haswell (so Iris Pro 5200) is really disappointing, and really a turn off for me...for right now. 

 

So like you said, it really depends on the model (and the moment). 

 

I really don't get how Apple could partner up with Beats.

Apple is known for being on the kind of expensive side, while still delivering an appropriate build quality and high standard software.

Beats on the other hand just makes overpriced, bad sounding and sometimes even ugly headphones.

Apple bought beats and supposedly brought the quality up quite a bit. 

[Sauron]

Most Macs aren't really overpriced once you consider the build quality, a quality >QHD display, excellent support, PCIE SSD, and Iris/Pro graphics, and that a lot of the MBPs competition (XPS 13, Lenovo LaVie Z for example end up being about the same cost for the same/similar hardware but are also limited to 8gb of Ram -- $1300~).

 

The Macbook (non-air/Pro) is overpriced, but imo is more of a "we could, so why not" rather than anything practical (kind of like the Apple Watch). 

 

The retina iMac used to be a pretty good value, as did the Mac Pro (I'm not sure if that's still the case), while the normal iMac and Mac Mini, are pretty bad in terms of value if you compare them to a full size pre-built, but if you're after ultra small form factors/AIOs then neither are too badly priced. 

 

Now, the upgrades are and always have been far more expensive then they should be, but that's another story altogether -- also the fact that the 15" rMBP is still using Haswell (so Iris Pro 5200) is really disappointing, and really a turn off for me...for right now. 

 

So like you said, it really depends on the model (and the moment). 

 

I have posted countless times on this very forum showing how I could build a better performing desktop AND buy a quality monitor (or two, depending on what I'm comparing it to) for almost half the price, and build quality doesn't mean anything when it makes your components overheat and doesn't really protect your computer from harm any more than any acceptable desktop case. I trust any pc I build by myself just as much (if not more) than anything I could buy from apple. Iris/pro graphics are part of the intel cpu, not something apple exclusively manufactures for their computers. Of course in an industrial scenario the perspective changes as you can't have someone custom build all pcs, but that's another matter entirely.

 

As for the laptops, there are competitors that do it much better tha the ones you mentioned in my opinion. Of course weight can be a factor too, but something like a W series from lenovo packs a LOT more punch for the money, and offer 3k displays for 900$ (iirc) less than the mbp retina. At that price tag you're either looking for a portable workstation or a gaming laptop, and the cheaper macbook pros are neither. They are essentially buffed facebook machines. And if that's what you want, there are far cheaper options that will do it just as well.

 

The retina imac has never been good value for two reasons: 1) I can build a better computer and buy 2 excellent 4k displays for cheaper. Nobody who needs a higher resolution than 4k would be better off with a 5k display instead of 2 4k ones. 2) it's a product for nobody. It doesn't have the power to handle the kind of work that needs such high resolution, and of course it is a terrible gaming machine for the price. It uses mobile gpus that can barely handle such a huge desktop. And as soon as you pay 4k$ for a cpu that could be in a 700$ build, that cpu overheats and throttles leaving you with less performance than said 700$ build.

 

The mac pro has also always been meh for the money, but it was kind of saved by its size at the beginning if you REALLY had no space for your WORKSTATION for whatever reason. It's not the case anymore imo.

[79wjd]

I have posted countless times on this very forum showing how I could build a better performing desktop AND buy a quality monitor (or two, depending on what I'm comparing it to) for almost half the price, and build quality doesn't mean anything when it makes your components overheat and doesn't really protect your computer from harm any more than any acceptable desktop case. I trust any pc I build by myself just as much (if not more) than anything I could buy from apple. Iris/pro graphics are part of the intel cpu, not something apple exclusively manufactures for their computers. Of course in an industrial scenario the perspective changes as you can't have someone custom build all pcs, but that's another matter entirely.

 

As for the laptops, there are competitors that do it much better tha the ones you mentioned in my opinion. Of course weight can be a factor too, but something like a W series from lenovo packs a LOT more punch for the money, and offer 3k displays for 900$ (iirc) less than the mbp retina. At that price tag you're either looking for a portable workstation or a gaming laptop, and the cheaper macbook pros are neither. They are essentially buffed facebook machines. And if that's what you want, there are far cheaper options that will do it just as well.

 

The retina imac has never been good value for two reasons: 1) I can build a better computer and buy 2 excellent 4k displays for cheaper. Nobody who needs a higher resolution than 4k would be better off with a 5k display instead of 2 4k ones. 2) it's a product for nobody. It doesn't have the power to handle the kind of work that needs such high resolution, and of course it is a terrible gaming machine for the price. It uses mobile gpus that can barely handle such a huge desktop. And as soon as you pay 4k$ for a cpu that could be in a 700$ build, that cpu overheats and throttles leaving you with less performance than said 700$ build.

 

The mac pro has also always been meh for the money, but it was kind of saved by its size at the beginning if you REALLY had no space for your WORKSTATION for whatever reason. It's not the case anymore imo.

Yes, but you can't compare an AIO (or any prebuilt for that matter) to a custom built computer. A custom built computer will always be cheaper. And just because you can build a computer (and don't mind a big tower) doesn't mean everyone can and/or wants to have a big tower. While Iris Pro isn't an Apple thing, it's in very few laptops....I think I've only seen one other laptop with Iris graphics. 

 

And again, yes, you could build your own system for less using two 4k monitors, but not everyone wants two monitors -- some people would simiply prefer one bigger/higher res monitor. And considering that the only other 5k monitor at the time was almost just as expensive as the 5k iMac itself, it was a good deal. 

 

Yes, if you're going to compare a prebuilt to a custom build the prebuilt is going to lose everytime....but that's neither a fair nor accurate comparison in determining the value of an item. 

[linuxfan66]

Yes, but you can't compare an AIO (or any prebuilt for that matter) to a custom built computer. A custom built computer will always be cheaper. And just because you can build a computer (and don't mind a big tower) doesn't mean everyone can and/or wants to have a big tower. While Iris Pro isn't an Apple thing, it's in very few laptops....I think I've only seen one other laptop with Iris graphics.

And again, yes, you could build your own system for less using two 4k monitors, but not everyone wants two monitors -- some people would simiply prefer one bigger/higher res monitor. And considering that the only other 5k monitor at the time was almost just as expensive as the 5k iMac itself, it was a good deal.

Yes, if you're going to compare a prebuilt to a custom build the prebuilt is going to lose everytime....but that's neither a fair nor accurate comparison in determining the value of an item.

You go realize prebuilts get no respect on this forum no matter what you do...

Nor does anyone understand operational costs and profit margins...

[79wjd]

You go realize prebuilts get no respect on this forum no matter what you do...

Nor does anyone understand operational costs and profit margins...

Or that some people are willing to pay a premium for good support, form factor, or consistency.

Take McDonald's for example, it's by no means great (or even good) in terms of quality, but you know that you can go anywhere in the world and eat at a McDonald's and it will taste exactly the same. Now, I'm not saying Apple has bad quality, I'm simply using McDonald's as an example for the benefits of consistency between products/service (maybe I should have used mortons, or Ruth Chris instead...meh, whatever).

[xtroria]

Sure mac is overpriced and so is solo 2. But they are OVERPRICED not BAD.

People who say "solo 2 is beats bad bad bad", you need to get a check on your ears and stop rating something based on its brand.

In certain aspects, solo 2 are better tham M50x.

[Sauron]

Yes, but you can't compare an AIO (or any prebuilt for that matter) to a custom built computer. A custom built computer will always be cheaper. And just because you can build a computer (and don't mind a big tower) doesn't mean everyone can and/or wants to have a big tower. While Iris Pro isn't an Apple thing, it's in very few laptops....I think I've only seen one other laptop with Iris graphics. 

 

And again, yes, you could build your own system for less using two 4k monitors, but not everyone wants two monitors -- some people would simiply prefer one bigger/higher res monitor. And considering that the only other 5k monitor at the time was almost just as expensive as the 5k iMac itself, it was a good deal. 

 

Yes, if you're going to compare a prebuilt to a custom build the prebuilt is going to lose everytime....but that's neither a fair nor accurate comparison in determining the value of an item. 

 

The laptops from lenovo I was talking about include freaking quadros, I don't think they need intel iGPUs. And building a pc, especially recently, doesn't force you to get a "big tower", there are mini itx motherboards and cases everywhere, some of which are slim enough to not really take up much more space than an aio (besides, I have yet to see a scenario where you can fit an aio but absolutely can't fit a mini itx system). I think it is a very fair comparison to make, because we apply it to every OTHER manufacturer without any problem whatsoever. And even then, there are many prebuilts that are cheaper while having comparable hardware and also don't force you to throw away the whole package, monitor included, if you want an upgrade. Also, give me an example of a situation where a single 5k monitor is better than two 4k ones (of the same size).

 

The fact that a lot of people can't build their own doesn't make the product any better, it makes the buyer a person who has no choice and gets milked for it. Besides, there are plenty of small and medium shops whose whole business revolves around building and repairing custom computers for people, and they will often do it with a pretty low overhead depending on how much work it requires. Paying 150$ for assembly and future support is not bad if you're sparing 400$ in parts. As I said, it's a different matter for offices where they HAVE to buy prebuilts and can't afford to have each one of their machines custom built, but for a private user they simply don't make sense at that price point.

[linuxfan66]

The laptops from lenovo I was talking about include freaking quadros, I don't think they need intel iGPUs. And building a pc, especially recently, doesn't force you to get a "big tower", there are mini itx motherboards and cases everywhere, some of which are slim enough to not really take up much more space than an aio (besides, I have yet to see a scenario where you can fit an aio but absolutely can't fit a mini itx system). I think it is a very fair comparison to make, because we apply it to every OTHER manufacturer without any problem whatsoever. And even then, there are many prebuilts that are cheaper while having comparable hardware and also don't force you to throw away the whole package, monitor included, if you want an upgrade. Also, give me an example of a situation where a single 5k monitor is better than two 4k ones (of the same size).

The fact that a lot of people can't build their own doesn't make the product any better, it makes the buyer a person who has no choice and gets milked for it. Besides, there are plenty of small and medium shops whose whole business revolves around building and repairing custom computers for people, and they will often do it with a pretty low overhead depending on how much work it requires. Paying 150$ for assembly and future support is not bad if you're sparing 400$ in parts. As I said, it's a different matter for offices where they HAVE to buy prebuilts and can't afford to have each one of their machines custom built, but for a private user they simply don't make sense at that price point.

So your saying private individuals should understand their PC specs. If you said that about cars you'd be mocked. Planes as well. You fail understand a real world user. If they buy a box and it works that's all they want. And business pcs are business and usage model at all. Support contracts and mass ordering machines for reliability and rapid parts turn around.

I kindly ask to stop thinking like an enthusiast when relevant.

[Shakaza]

When you can run Windows on a Mac anyway, it can make sense, but Macs tend to get used specifically for art and movie making. Music is a fickle industry that has moved between Windows and Mac practically by the year.

 

Macs still offer bar none the best track pad there is. Macs offer the same or RAM configurations (I have 32GB in mine actually even though the option's disappeared since I bought last July). Macs offer the best single tier storage options. Macs have beautiful IPS displays with very little backlight bleeding and a very big color gamut that is used by professionals. Macs offer the best of Intel's mobile lineup of CPUs/SOCs. Macs offer the best cooling system in their weight and form factor. The only weaknesses Macs have are price, GPU power for the price point, supporting less than 3 USB ports, and not having full-size up&down arrow keys. Other than that it's pretty tough to find weaknesses

Okay, so this isn't specifically related to Apple at all, and this phenomenon can be found in consumers of all products, but what I don't like is when people say that Apple stuff is objectively better than any Windows device. They don't bother saying why it's superior, but just think "Hey, that's an Apple product. It MUST be better than anything else!!!!" Those same people claim that Apple devices are superior in the quality of the hardware they use, but don't realize they, for the most part, use the same hardware that goes into other products. And then they say that they fail less with only anecdotal evidence to back it up. (Those laptop cases, though. Mmmmmm...)

 

You know what the best example of this crap is? This guy at my high school, to "prove" that Apple devices are superior, says, "You want to know why Apple is better?" *holds up iPhone* I don't remember if my reaction was a facepalm or me walking away in disbelief. Another good one is from my art teacher. He says that "Apple's graphics are better." And the best part is, he even has only a GeForce card in his Macbook.

 

Yes, I know this is silly. Yes, I shouldn't dislike Apple for the stupid people that buy their stuff. But, still, I dislike the mindset they have, and it's impossible to reason with them because they are so set in it.

[79wjd]

Okay, so this isn't specifically related to Apple at all, and this phenomenon can be found in consumers of all products, but what I don't like is when people say that Apple stuff is objectively better than any Windows device. They don't bother saying why it's superior, but just think "Hey, that's an Apple product. It MUST be better than anything else!!!!" Those same people claim that Apple devices are superior in the quality of the hardware they use, but don't realize they, for the most part, use the same hardware that goes into other products. And then they say that they fail less with only anecdotal evidence to back it up. (Those laptop cases, though. Mmmmmm...)

 

You know what the best example of this crap is? This guy at my high school, to "prove" that Apple devices are superior, says, "You want to know why Apple is better?" *holds up iPhone* I don't remember if my reaction was a facepalm or me walking away in disbelief. Another good one is from my art teacher. He says that "Apple's graphics are better." And the best part is, he even has only a GeForce card in his Macbook.

 

Yes, I know this is silly. Yes, I shouldn't dislike Apple for the stupid people that buy their stuff. But, still, I dislike the mindset they have, and it's impossible to reason with them because they are so set in it.

Yeah, I can definitely say that is one very annoying thin about many Apple users. Years ago I bought an XPS 15 and 9 out of 10 people asked why I didn't get a Mac while the one remaining person asked what gpu it had/what games I play. And most of those people who asked why I didn't get a Mac (implying they're always better) never could give me any answer other than "It's a Mac, it's better". 

 

Now, there are two reasons most of those people will think a Mac is superior. Either they've had a better experience with their Macs then the alternatives, or because they just fell into good marketing/good word of mouth from other people. 

[Sauron]

So your saying private individuals should understand their PC specs. If you said that about cars you'd be mocked. Planes as well. You fail understand a real world user. If they buy a box and it works that's all they want. And business pcs are business and usage model at all. Support contracts and mass ordering machines for reliability and rapid parts turn around.

I kindly ask to stop thinking like an enthusiast when relevant.

 

You can't build your own car (not in my country anyway, it's straight up illegal), and yes, people should have SOME idea of what they're buying before they pay. As for planes, if you're rich enough to afford one and you WANT one, it's probably also your hobby and you know exactly what you're buying. I also don't understand why we're on an enthusiast forum, but wherever anyone dares touch apple he can't think as an enthusiast, he must think as someone who knows nothing about tech. On top of that as I stated earlier there are computer repair shops that are SPECIALIZED in building custom computers for you, independently from your knowledge. They'll ask you what you need and they'll make sure they build the best machine for the job at a fair price. Whenever you spend a significant amount of money, a smart customer will at least try to learn something to understand more or less what he's buying and whether he's being scammed or not. People who go in with the mindset of "just give me something that works I don't care how much I pay it" are BEGGING to be screwed over. Of course a 4000$ imac will work as a facebook machine, does that mean it's a good purchase for that use case? As an enthusiast community we should evaluate products for what they are, not think "oh well but these tech illiterates will buy it so it's fine".

 

I said multiple times that businesses are different and aren't part of my argument.

[Sauron]

Now, there are two reasons most of those people will think a Mac is superior. Either they've had a better experience with their Macs then the alternatives, or because they just fell into good marketing/good word of mouth from other people. 

 

99% of them fall into the second cathegory. There was a time where macs were actually better for some workloads thanks to the powerpc architecture, since they switched to intel it's pure marketing. And of course, they'll make sure you won't get a terrible experience so you think the price tag was justified (although the 1100$ imac with a 5400rpm hdd and a dual core ulp i5 must be utterly painful to use).

[Swndlr]

this too

 

Although I am somebody who actually likes the new macbook so there you go

 

 

but a retina air would be amazing

I would like the new MacBook 10X more if Apple would just put a bloody 16x9 display on the damn thing

[Swndlr]

Sure mac is overpriced and so is solo 2. But they are OVERPRICED not BAD.

People who say "solo 2 is beats bad bad bad", you need to get a check on your ears and stop rating something based on its brand.

In certain aspects, solo 2 are better tham M50x.

Yeh tbh idk why people hate on Beats, had a pair of Solo 1's (God bless) and they were GR8 M8, only thing that got to them was their age and the amount I used them, they came everywhere with me and went through a lot

Its quite upsetting that people hear Beats now and they just think "wow shit headphones shit this shit that" when in reality, theyre good looking headphones (better than most, no argument) and sound good, and its not like Beats is charging 10X more than competitors, theyre fairly priced.

[xtroria]

Yeh tbh idk why people hate on Beats, had a pair of Solo 1's (God bless) and they were GR8 M8, only thing that got to them was their age and the amount I used them, they came everywhere with me and went through a lot

Its quite upsetting that people hear Beats now and they just think "wow shit headphones shit this shit that" when in reality, theyre good looking headphones (better than most, no argument) and sound good, and its not like Beats is charging 10X more than competitors, theyre fairly priced.

 

Solo 1 is straight out horrible tbh

[Swndlr]

Solo 1 is straight out horrible tbh

Keep your negative opinions to yourself, please.

[Clyne]

1. Buy MacBook pro

2. Sell Beats for $180

3. Purchase Sony MDR-1A

4. Be happy you just saved $180

5. Realize you spent lots more money on a laptop

6. Shit

 

My brain just actually did this

Ehh MacBook Pro would be fine if you actually need to use a program that would benfit from a MacBook Pro. No idea why my sister wants one but at least i can take her Sandy i5 laptop. 

[Imabigmac]

yup totally agree that's why I'll never recommend a laptop with a ssd as only drive for a student I myself use ssd and hdd on my laptop cause I can't survive the 2 minute wait for it to power on

Buy a SSD that has been proven to last, and back up your data. Problem solved. Yes who knows what kind of SSD HP, ASUS, Toshiba, etc uses but if your upgrading a HDD to a SSD my point still stands. 

 

Backups regardless of the drive type should be expected with any device and any type of user, don't back up your out of luck or at $100 for the recovery + new drive and if one is not tech savy and or the laptop is too difficult to repair then you will have to pay for that too. 

 

Keep your negative opinions to yourself, please.

They are entitled to their opinions, just because it may not be popular opinion doesn't mean they should not post it. However it as worthless as all the other posts that simply say "the headphones are good" because they both lack any reasoning. So disregard and read the useful posts. 

[xtroria]

Keep your negative opinions to yourself, please.

 

Well if you go around and actually try good headphones, you'll get what I mean 

 

 

They are entitled to their opinions, just because it may not be popular opinion doesn't mean they should not post it. However it as worthless as all the other posts that simply say "the headphones are good" because they both lack any reasoning. So disregard and read the useful posts. 

 

Hey, if you think you understand audio better than me. By all means, please enlighten me

[BuckGup]

Pfffff. Way to go Apple. Anyone who says beats sound nice. Take them apart and look at the $3 IC55 Timer and Transistor.

[Swndlr]

Well if you go around and actually try good headphones, you'll get what I mean 

 

 

 

 

Hey, if you think you understand audio better than me. By all means, please enlighten me

Everyone's opinion of good varies, just because I say they sound good doesnt mean you have to try and start it off with me by saying otherwise.

 

Buy a SSD that has been proven to last, and back up your data. Problem solved. Yes who knows what kind of SSD HP, ASUS, Toshiba, etc uses but if your upgrading a HDD to a SSD my point still stands. 

 

Backups regardless of the drive type should be expected with any device and any type of user, don't back up your out of luck or at $100 for the recovery + new drive and if one is not tech savy and or the laptop is too difficult to repair then you will have to pay for that too. 

 

 

They are entitled to their opinions, just because it may not be popular opinion doesn't mean they should not post it. However it as worthless as all the other posts that simply say "the headphones are good" because they both lack any reasoning. So disregard and read the useful posts. 

read above.

[Dabombinable]

No, you get either a mac with $200 off, or a mac with $200 headphones of your choice.

 

Either way is a pretty good deal.

Not if its the mutated (less ports, no keyboard dock with secondary battery etc) Asus transformer prime clone called the Macbook.

[linuxfan66]

You can't build your own car (not in my country anyway, it's straight up illegal), and yes, people should have SOME idea of what they're buying before they pay. As for planes, if you're rich enough to afford one and you WANT one, it's probably also your hobby and you know exactly what you're buying. I also don't understand why we're on an enthusiast forum, but wherever anyone dares touch apple he can't think as an enthusiast, he must think as someone who knows nothing about tech. On top of that as I stated earlier there are computer repair shops that are SPECIALIZED in building custom computers for you, independently from your knowledge. They'll ask you what you need and they'll make sure they build the best machine for the job at a fair price. Whenever you spend a significant amount of money, a smart customer will at least try to learn something to understand more or less what he's buying and whether he's being scammed or not. People who go in with the mindset of "just give me something that works I don't care how much I pay it" are BEGGING to be screwed over. Of course a 4000$ imac will work as a facebook machine, does that mean it's a good purchase for that use case? As an enthusiast community we should evaluate products for what they are, not think "oh well but these tech illiterates will buy it so it's fine".

I said multiple times that businesses are different and aren't part of my argument.

Tech illiterates are most of the market. Most car buyers don't know proportionally that much either. I was not saying all Mac buyers mustn't be enthusiast. I was saying that you should stay least try looking at the product from the other guys perspective for balance sake. I don't get me wrong 4k Facebook machines are stupid

[IMPERIUS]

Ew

[Sauron]

Tech illiterates are most of the market. Most car buyers don't know proportionally that much either. I was not saying all Mac buyers mustn't be enthusiast. I was saying that you should stay least try looking at the product from the other guys perspective for balance sake. I don't get me wrong 4k Facebook machines are stupid

 

I get the other perspective, but I still consider macs bad value.

 

Incidentally I'm looking for a good laptop for university at the moment, and I came across this one (the page is in Italian but the specs are pretty clear) for 900€. To put that into perspective, non-retina mbps don't even HAVE the option of a quad core cpu, not even the 1900€ model. To get a quad core I'd have to pay the extra for a retina model which doesn't even come with a dedicated gpu in the base configuration, let alone a 960m; I'd also be stuck with the 256gb ssd, which while very fast, would feel pretty tight very soon. The acer has an m.2 slot for an ssd, too, and can be upgraded to 16gb of ram to close the gap on that front. It doesn't have the 3k screen and it's made of plastic, but even after adding an ssd it's still less than half the price of a comparable mbp. So yeah, there are a few advantages to the mbps, but they are hardly worth 1200$ more in my opinion. I don't dispute the "experience" is on point, but it's just not worth the price.