Why are we lacking computer programmers?

[redspart]

I tried to learn basic HTML and just found myself frustrated and bored so I found out that it just wasn't for me. Even though I find the genre of technology fascinating it just didn't really give me a spark of excitement if you know what I mean. The only thing I've really per say "mastered" is building computers and becoming heavily accustomed to the Windows 7/8.1 OS all because of my interest of gaming really. Although my interest in gaming as a whole has died as well sadly because I can't find anything that entertains me personally.

 

Just to let you know that HTML is not a programming language it is a markup.

[Art Vandelay]

 

1. Social Reliability: The people who make the best programmers think like a computer, or at least understand how a computer thinks. Invariably these people love computers because computers don't have moods, or bad days. Computers don't say one thing and mean another. Computers are never late, or early, or forgetful. Humans are all of these things, and the more 'into' computers one gets, the less tolerant of human inefficiencies that person typically becomes.

I think you forgot that computers were programmed by humans, sometimes software will just randomly have a bad day or stop working entirely for seemingly no reason. Sometimes they do say one thing and mean another because there's a bug that wasn't handled correctly. 

 

 

Just to let you know that HTML is not a programming language it is a markup.

You can theoretically do Turing complete code with it if you cause a buffer overflow in the html parser and then execute data.

[Art Vandelay]

You know what I mean...

Trying to get started in programming with HTML is like trying to get started in business by learning how to file papers into a cabinet... I don't think anyone's gonna get interested from that.

[SSL]

Trying to get started in programming with HTML is like trying to get started in business by learning how to file papers into a cabinet... I don't think anyone's gonna get interested from that.

 

I did.

[SSL]

It's just the simplest that's the only reason why I started with HTML.

 

Markup languages can actually be complicated, especially when you throw styling into the mix.

[linuxfan66]

Markups can be hell for me. Also programming with code security looks like nightmare in my opinion.

[KRSogaard]

Trying to get started in programming with HTML is like trying to get started in business by learning how to file papers into a cabinet... I don't think anyone's gonna get interested from that.

 

HTML is a GREAT way to start! you will very quickly learn to create something you can see (and touch). And you will very shortly want to move on to make it dynamic, and at that time do you already have something to build on, making the transition easier, then to just plunge in at the deep end.

[Art Vandelay]

HTML is a GREAT way to start! you will very quickly learn to create something you can see (and touch). And you will very shortly want to move on to make it dynamic, and at that time do you already have something to build on, making the transition easier, then to just plunge in at the deep end.

I don't understand at all... and I started with web development...

[TheMissxu]

I took some pretty high level computer science courses in high school, then took a class or two at my community college (which were easy because of the high school classes), and now I'm onto a fairly respected university for CS and Math. I'm pretty excited.

[Shadow Gamer]

I started at 10. However, I have only met one tech savvy person from my town, and he's a hardware guy.

[deviant88]

Programming is just too hard.Achieving anything other than a console doing simple computations is hard thing.

I started self study for fun/hobby to see if i can create videogames and almost a year later the answer is kind of no.

Its too intimidating for begginers to learn any language but even after you get past the intimidating part theres so much to learn and i cant memorize most of what i learn altough i like it and understand most of programming i still hate it at the same time because i cant remember it in detail only basics.

 

People need money to survive,most of us dont have money for education or time to waste (many years) to learn any language that might never get us a job,yes a job.If i start learning how to become a car/truck driver or anything else practicall like painter/construction works i will get good in no time (probably) and higher chances of finding a job but programming man is just ,unless you are very good at it and have a great mind/memory its most likely a waste of time and will never pay your bills,ofcourse you learn programming because you like it,but you still need a job/money afterall.

[linuxfan66]

Programming is just too hard.Achieving anything other than a console doing simple computations is hard thing.

I started self study for fun/hobby to see if i can create videogames and almost a year later the answer is kind of no.

Its too intimidating for begginers to learn any language but even after you get past the intimidating part theres so much to learn and i cant memorize most of what i learn altough i like it and understand most of programming i still hate it at the same time because i cant remember it in detail only basics.

People need money to survive,most of us dont have money for education or time to waste (many years) to learn any language that might never get us a job,yes a job.If i start learning how to become a car/truck driver or anything else practicall like painter/construction works i will get good in no time (probably) and higher chances of finding a job but programming man is just ,unless you are very good at it and have a great mind/memory its most likely a waste of time and will never pay your bills,ofcourse you learn programming because you like it,but you still need a job/money afterall.

In every programming course I did their was people just never got the gist of complex code. So yeah big problem

[Bouzoo]

In every programming course I did their was people just never got the gist of complex code. So yeah big problem

 

There's where just plain reasoning comes in. Some people have a knack for problem solving and understanding what is happening where. Others just can't wrap their minds around what quite simple codes to. First people need to understand what they need to do so they could turn it into code and that is sometimes the hardest part.

[AraiBob]

Hi, late to this topic.

 

I am a retired programmer, project manager, etc. I graduated with a degree in Computer Science in 1970, and did not meet another CS grad for 10 years. There was no computer I could 'play' with as a child. I stumbled into computer science because my Qualitative Analysis Chemistry lab made me sick every time. Too many allergies.

 

Over the next 37 years I worked almost exclusively on mainframes. I used more than 3 dozen languages in that time. Yes, I could each of the three Assembly languages separately. One was for small IBM computers. One was for Univac mainframes. and one was for Large IBM mainframes. I also used PC assembly, but don't count it as I did not use it on the job.

 

I worked as an O S programmer for a while. As a DBA for a while, but... I discovered there were a lot of technical wizards around (I was one of them, nicknamed "Wizard of OS" in 1977). But not many who could plan a project, make it work, and make it succeed. My last 15 years was mostly about project architecture, project designs, and managing projects.

 

You may have heard this: In the IT industry, two of three projects fail. They fail : miss the deadline, and / or too expensive. The projects I managed succeeded over 95 percent. Yes, a few failed, almost always due to liars.

 

I loved the programming exercise. Great fun. But, I found I consiously worked to 'give my job away'. I purposely used simple programming 'tricks' so that the next fellow could easily maintain it. My goal was to do a good to great job, so that I would get a better job my next assignment.

 

I met a lot of great programmers along the way, but I also met a lot of people in the programming position who hated the job. They would not quit because they made too much money. Far more than whatever their next job would pay. It is from these the term 'Net Negative Producer' came from. Whatever their work, a lot of time was spent by other programmers fixing what they had produced. e.g. they created work (net negative).

 

What I learned was that great programmers are always learning. It helped that I could read quickly. As a junior in high school, I was given a reading test, and scored 3,500 words a minute at 99 percent comprehension. I had no idea that was an interesting number. Ten years later I learned that most university graduates read at 1,100 words a minute. So I had an advantage in that I could 'peruse' a manual and get a lot out of it. I do NOT have photographic memory, nor do I have an eidetic memory. But an amazing amount of stuff would stick and if I needed more detail, I often to go to the section to get it.

 

Learning almost anything helped. Yes programming books were useful. But so were books on industries and applications. As for my success rate in projects, I attribute that to my childhood. In classes related to computers, almost nothing was said about project management or design, etc. My youth was working for my father, and then my step father in construction. My step father was a contractor, and he showed me a lot of things about reading plans, specs, and how to interpret them, and how to cost them, and how to track progress.

 

I turned these unofficial project management lessons into tools for myself and had great success. The first 'trick', do NOT count '80 percent done', EVER. when a door is installed, you don't count it as 80 percent done. You count it ONLY when it has been completely installed and is in use. Yet, I cannot tell you how many times I heard someone say they were 85 percent done, for a month.

 

Back to programming. KISS is the way to go. Yes, there are times you must make something complicated, but I found it easier to take that complicate thing, and make simple steps that together equaled that complicate thing. Worked and was easy to test and to maintain.

[AraiBob]

Before I start I am pursing a computer science degree.

 

Now, back to the question on hand; programming is uncommon because younger kids are taught to memorize, not learn, explore, or even take risks. Take a step back and look at our education system ( US ). At least where I came from it was: memorize these definitions, memorize the spelling, or memorize the parts of a frog...etc. We, as children, are not asked to question the "why, how, and is there a better way?" on fundamental core questions. So it results in a mass that doesn't want a challenge, that would rather let someone else do it for them. They just want the easy money, where easy work == lots of money. Its almost like the education system is creating a "lazy generation". 

 

Programming can be high computational mathematics and logic depending on what you are trying to accomplish. Then what does this require? Thinking, putting in effort, and time to reach a desired outcome. When children see the work that is required to be put it the desire is nullified almost immediately for most. Where there is a huge lack of desire to change something in most highschoolers/children. If something is already done, why would I fix it? This can be tied back to our education system for not encouraging students to challenge something and make it better. I mean look at most phone APPs, if there is a good game, why try to make your own? 

 

Now students who decide to delve into the programming world at a young age hit a wall of where to start. The question should start off as, what do I want to do? or What do I want to fix? But most students are not being challenged ( I keep coming back to that ). The programming community is TERRIBLE at giving advice. People start telling newcomers to use X language because it is better than Y and you will learn more. I beg to differ what does he/she want to do! Yeah every language has its ups/downs but it all varies. I hear arguments in the lab for things like use ASP.NET not Django its better, then when asked why their response is along the lines of " Industry standards ".

 

Overall, it all comes back to one main thing the lacking education system. If the education system would embrace teaching rather than memorization we would have more students that want a challenge. Challenge ideals at an attempt to make things better for themselves or society. ( Like is there a better protocol than TCP? Than UDP? Can we make one? Lets try! )

 

Please note this is my opinion that I have inferred from past experiences. 

 

 

Great programmers find a way to succeed, in spite of obstacles. Learning to program is just another such hurdle. It would be nice if teachers and schools could do a better job, but few teachers actually know how to code. And too much of today's kids are 'consensus' driven. Difficult to go on their own, when all around them are 'nattering' the same mantra. I had the same issues, but the programming 'exercise' was so much fun and interesting.

[AraiBob]

Math and Logic are related. I guess it would be more logical than mathematical though.

 

I solved a lot of problems using 'common sense'. Not boolean algebra, or calculus. Too many procedures have 'silly' stuff in them, that get coded, leading to problems. I often found code causing problems had been written to deal with an issue. An issue that no longer existed, but the code was there to interfere with what was really supposed to happen.

[linuxfan66]

One thing learned in a course is you need to read a code language like its a natural language with spelling, grammar, and active sentences. once you know that it's a lot easier.

[redspart]

Great programmers find a way to succeed, in spite of obstacles. Learning to program is just another such hurdle. It would be nice if teachers and schools could do a better job, but few teachers actually know how to code. And too much of today's kids are 'consensus' driven. Difficult to go on their own, when all around them are 'nattering' the same mantra. I had the same issues, but the programming 'exercise' was so much fun and interesting.

 

"Great programmers find a way to succeed"

Not everyone is born a great programmer, or a great basketball player, or a great anything. Looking at socialization as a cyclic process: they first imitate, receive reinforcement, and define it. <- This is how we become "social"/learn behaviors. I would argue this process is how any of us learn. Yes learning to program is the first hurdle, but what happens if they are never introduced to programming, they would have nothing to imitate! If schools would hire new teacher to teach programming, instead of just plain html ( our high-school ), and more OOP like python, C++, or Java it would be a great kickstarter for many programmers. 

[Zinj]

Because you need a thinking human to create a computer program, and because computer programs turn humans into very very dumb beigns.

[burnttoastnice]

Even though I'm strong in C# and HTML, the problem for me getting into a programming job would be that I don't see my skills as professional-grade. Maybe visiting a business that does programming would give me some confidence to join the industry, but at the moment in terms of jobs I'm looking at something like Windows System Administration (yes, I have knowledge of Active Directory & Group Policy etc )

[Stuff_]

Even though I'm strong in C# and HTML, the problem for me getting into a programming job would be that I don't see my skills as professional-grade. Maybe visiting a business that does programming would give me some confidence to join the industry, but at the moment in terms of jobs I'm looking at something like Windows System Administration (yes, I have knowledge of Active Directory & Group Policy etc )

Or information security. Not much programming there (though you will probably have a decent idea of it). 

Instead you'll likely reply on third party software and access to manage your network.

[Hackzzila]

I never really tried to get into it because I thought it would take too much time. I was wrong, you really only have to learn the basics and then just play around, that is how I learned HTML, CSS, SASS and C#

[othertomperson]

Because it's only in the last couple of years that it's even been taught in schools. Until then there was nothing until university level -- you're relying on enthusiasts teaching themselves up until that point. Well sure that'll happen, but not anything like in the numbers we need for 21st century economies and their industries.

[maxib7]

My high school offers no education on the subject. I think it's because it's a very specialized field. For example, I wouldn't think that any high school would teach any form of engineering, architecture, physics (unless your taking an AP class), or anything like that that doesn't have any real use to every day people. It's only useful if you're going into that field. 

 

With that being said, programming isn't very useful unless you want to make things with technology. Your average Joe isn't gonna need to know how to program a binary search algorithm, but he will need to know math, english, and all the other basic classes if he wants to go to college.

 

I made a speech for my computer science club during our first meeting. Everyone there liked and it might be interesting to you https://docs.google.com/document/d/11cHZAWrBd7v9nrlagicAolekPWg8hkfrNcq3pmPiKJM/edit?usp=sharing

[Beskamir]

For me personally it was my lack of dedication and frustration at thinking that I need to learn a lot before I can actually make anything. If you compare programming to other computer rlated hobbies like modeling you'll realise that asides from learning the main controls you can pretty much jump in and start making stuff sure it will take you a lot longer since you don't know all the shortcuts but you don't have to understand/know that much to start having fun. With programming however I had the misconception that I needed to learn a lot more before I could start having fun.

 

Thankfully when i tried to learn programming (again) about a week ago I managed to stay motivated long enough to learn about loops and at that moment I realised just how much I could do with that knowledge and even though my code is really bad in terms of formating and organisation I also managed to gain the nessary motivation to learn how to better orginize and structure my code with stuff like functions and classes.