NVIDIA Under Attack Again for GameWorks in The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt

[Majestic]

I remember that too. Mirror's Edge was a really good showcase for PhysX effects, assuming you could run them. I had a 9800GTX at the time and for Mirror's Edge and Arkham Asylum I got a second one.

 

It worked well, if you didn't have mass effect installed. I'm not joking, mass effect broke Mirror's Edge

[Brainless906]

How is nvidia locking out a chunk of the market by providing a service to a developer. Something the developer decides. I'm just not seeing it, nor how that is anti-consumer by nvidia's doing. Their offering of libraries should not be free by default, a company is allowed to charge what they want for proprietary software and it's up to the consumer or userbase to decide whether they're willing to cough up the bucks. That is how the consumer/producer relationship works, atleast as far as luxury products go. This changes when you talk about stuff like medicine, or basic needs like food.

 

If you have to use the word "allegedly" when accusing nvidia for gimping AMD software, maybe you shouldn't really utter the accusation in the first place. Because on the internet, many people making alleged accusations, turns into a truth after a certain critical mass is formed. I'm also not seeing how cinebench is related to gameworks, because the gimping of cinebench was proven, the gimping of AMD cards isn't. You're welcome to investigate, but don't accuse if you haven't a shred of evidence pointing to this. 

 

There's been no real investigation as apparently nobody cares. I may be repeating myself a lot but the Crysis 2 and Batman issues we're very large chunks of "evidence" that something suspicious was going on under the "black box" however the "investigation" went as far as.."oh...its a black box...we cant look at the code and we cant investigate. Guess were done here"

 

So if you cant prove something before investigating don't ever bring it up? Right. Well then. 

[Misanthrope]

Titles that use GameWorks are definitely playable on AMD cards though...just not as well as Nvidia's offerings.

 

Nobody likes having the crappier version. Even if you can buy a card right now and you find a 290x for 50 bucks cheaper than a 970 would you buy it? If its up to cooling it performs just as well on sapphire coolers. It does require more power but you are paying less money for what is spec for spec, muscle per muscle virtually the same power level. But I bet you still would pick the 970.

 

Don't get me wrong the reverse applies: I fully expect a new wave of Eidos games to eventually it the market and I also expect them to be highly more optimized and better on AMD cards and at that point in time you might as well go for AMD. Even if those Eidos games or Frostbite games eventually perform just as well on Nvidia to me there shouldn't be artificial differences at all for either side. 

 

Those Nvidia and AMD logos at the start of virtually every AAA game you launch will eventually erode PC gaming beyond the point were there can be any true competition and lock us in inconvenient, expensive wall gardens of GPU vendors just like Consoles hijack games under the excuse of "exclusive"

[Majestic]

There's been no real investigation as apparently nobody cares.

 

Or maybe there is simply nothing there, and this is just you having a cassandra complex.

[CoolaxGaming]

why the fuck is Nvidia under attack for this? just because AMD is too lazy to make fancy hair posible on their GPUs?

Too lazy?

AMD never got the chance to work on it, their TressFX tech works fine.

But why the fuck would they give it to Nvidia? 

[Nielips]

 

You would think the witcher dev and AMD would have cooperated more seen as both consoles are amd as well

[Misanthrope]

Or maybe there is simply nothing there, and this is just you having a cassandra complex.

 

Maybe but you invite criticism by having the black box to begin with and not being able to definitely refute the claims.

[Brainless906]

Maybe but you invite criticism by having the black box to begin with and not being able to definitely refute the claims.

I've given up. He defends something to death on the stance of "competition so its ok" then attempts to insult me and writes it off.

Whatever. 

 

I know I for one am super-duper excited to decide my next GPU based on which games i can or cannot be locked into

All while making fun of those dirty console peasants arguing between xbox and ps4 like idiots, kek. 

[Majestic]

Maybe but you invite criticism by having the black box to begin with and not being able to definitely refute the claims.

 

The black box is to protect their investment, and you don't refute stuff on the internet. People still think AMD FX CPU's are good value. Whatever the internet thinks, the internet thinks. Also, even if they're totally gimping AMD in the most malicious manner they can think of (THIS IS SPECULATION...before someone quotes this), admitting would open you up to lawsuits. So they're best off not adressing it. It reduces publicity and doesn't make you look like a weak company.

 

 

I've given up. He defends something to death on the stance of "competition so its ok" then attempts to insult me and writes it off.

Whatever. 

 

I know I for one am super-duper excited to decide my next GPU based on which games i can or cannot be locked into 

All while making fun of those dirty console peasants arguing between xbox and ps4 like idiots, kek. 

 

I've not insulted you, and the fact i'm sticking to my guns is because you're making a very weak argument which I poke holes in (don't hold that against me, that's how debate works). I'm not sure what makes you think you can just assume the moral highground here, when you've not been able to make a solid case the whole time. That takes quite a lack of self-awareness.

 

I hope that last bit is meant to be sarcasm, because if you're serious that's some hilarious irony right there.

[Guest Kloaked]

So Nvidia technology for Nvidia GPU's can't be optimized for AMD GPU's and we apparently have a problem with this? What was everyone expecting? Imagine that, a company that makes GPU's made an exclusive technology only for their GPU's... How dare they?

Thinking rationally? That's a paddlin'

[MrRavens]

Nvidia be like "Sorry not sorry."

[Briggsy]

You would think the witcher dev and AMD would have cooperated more seen as both consoles are amd as well

 

Not everyone in a company is aware of what everyone else is doing, especially a company like CDPR. I've seen it said from one employee that they hadn't talked to anyone from AMD since last October, while another source from CDPR says they were discussing things with AMD this March.

 

I think there are a lot of smoke and mirrors right now in the press. 

[Guest Kloaked]

All while making fun of those dirty console peasants arguing between xbox and ps4 like idiots, kek.

[Misanthrope]

The black box is to protect their investment

Nvidia didn't have to create their own private API when they knew about Mantle, Vulkan and DX12 all being worked on. Yes it is an investment however it is one that is not necessarily appreciated by PC gamers since it is a walled garden of exclusivity and many of us choose PC gaming to get away from that anti consumer behavior present on consoles

[zappian]

We are walking faster and faster to GPU vendor specific games.

 

You people that defend this type of behaviour have no idea of the ramifications this may bring.

 

The general attitude is " this doesnt affect me I have NVIDIA GPU screw anyone that owns and AMD GPU , doesnt affect me "

 

 

 

The black box is to protect their investment

 

It also makes it super hard to implement optimizations , this market segregation hurts pc gaming as a whole as we should fight it .

[Majestic]

Nvidia didn't have to create their own private API when they knew about Mantle, Vulkan and DX12 all being worked on. Yes it is an investment however it is one that is not necessarily appreciated by PC gamers since it is a walled garden of exclusivity and many of us choose PC gaming to get away from that anti consumer behavior present on consoles

 

Are we still talking about Gameworks here? I missed the part where this was about a private API, which one are you referring to?

 

 

We are walking faster and faster to GPU vendor specific games.

 

You people that defend this type of behaviour have no idea of the ramifications this may bring.

 

 

That's because I don't share your belief it will somehow turn into a proprietary war over a few assets/effects. Developers would stand to lose to much in this, if gameworks (or using a non-existant future AMD version of this) threathens sales, they won't use it. They're not fucking retarded. Therefor, I'm not defending as a malicious movement as you make it out to be. Cassandra.

 

I'm not so quick to make slippery slope fallacies.

[Unhelpful]

So its what AMD did with Tomb Raider? 

[Nineshadow]

Nobody likes having the crappier version. Even if you can buy a card right now and you find a 290x for 50 bucks cheaper than a 970 would you buy it? If its up to cooling it performs just as well on sapphire coolers. It does require more power but you are paying less money for what is spec for spec, muscle per muscle virtually the same power level. But I bet you still would pick the 970.

 

Don't get me wrong the reverse applies: I fully expect a new wave of Eidos games to eventually it the market and I also expect them to be highly more optimized and better on AMD cards and at that point in time you might as well go for AMD. Even if those Eidos games or Frostbite games eventually perform just as well on Nvidia to me there shouldn't be artificial differences at all for either side. 

 

Those Nvidia and AMD logos at the start of virtually every AAA game you launch will eventually erode PC gaming beyond the point were there can be any true competition and lock us in inconvenient, expensive wall gardens of GPU vendors just like Consoles hijack games under the excuse of "exclusive"

About that you're right, but a lot of people are taking AMD's side when they should be blamed as well, not just Nvidia.

[Misanthrope]

Are we still talking about Gameworks here? I missed the part where this was about a private API, which one are you referring to?

Yes technically is not an API since we're not talking about the entire engine. But for the sake of convenience, we can call it a "mini" API so to speak since all those features could have eventually been included on DX12 or Vulkan

[Brainless906]

So its what AMD did with Tomb Raider? 

....did we forget about that part where Tressfx is open source and runs on Nvidia gpus fine? unlike gameworks? 

Yah..so exactly not like Tomb Raider 

[Unhelpful]

....did we forget about that part where Tressfx is open source and runs on Nvidia gpus fine? unlike gameworks? 

Yah..so exactly not like Tomb Raider 

Ah fair enough, forgot about that tbh.

[Guest Kloaked]

We are walking faster and faster to GPU vendor specific games.

You people that defend this type of behaviour have no idea of the ramifications this may bring.

The general attitude is " this doesnt affect me I have NVIDIA GPU screw anyone that owns and AMD GPU , doesnt affect me "

It also makes it super hard to implement optimizations , this market segregation hurts pc gaming as a whole as we should fight it .

You're so wrong that it's amazing. Every single time you give your bullshit spiel someone proves you wrong but don't accept it.

For some reason you have a bone to pick with a graphics vendor that's done nothing to you. "Woe is me, Nvidia is creating graphics technologies while AMD stands by with their thumbs up their ass. Oh Woe is me!"

Jesus.

The lot of us would like AMD to do some something amazing, even those of us that you accuse of being paid by Nvidia.

[Majestic]

Yes technically is not an API since we're not talking about the entire engine. But for the sake of convenience, we can call it a "mini" API so to speak since all those features could have eventually been included on DX12 or Vulkan

 

I'm not willing to place features/assets in the same category as API's. That would be a bit of a misrepresentation and would skew the conversation, since if it was an API it would have had grand impacts and create a divide.\

 

 

....did we forget about that part where Tressfx is open source and runs on Nvidia gpus fine? unlike gameworks? 

Yah..so exactly not like Tomb Raider 

 

That's because it's a silly, and extremely powerhogging, hairmod that nearly noone cared about and is maybe used in... one other game? Tesselation is the preferred method these days, that's why it's open source. And still, the fact it's open-source shows AMD's inability to stand behind their product and/or charge for it like any normal company would. This does not speak in favor of AMD, it speaks of incompetence.

[spartaman64]

Nvidia be like "Sorry not sorry."

translated into japanese that would be gomenaSIKE

[Guest Generallee]

Goddammit this is why 3DFX should have stayed in business

 

fuck this shit i'm gaming on an Intel gm45 from now on IM ENTITLED TO GOOD PERFURMANCE