Are the people at HP high....?

[Dabombinable]

So, you call anything that is made by someone else an OEM?  that would be everything from phones to cars.  Who would have thought you could call the broncho a ford OEM.  Or the iPhone an apple OEM.  :rolleyes:

 

broken link.

Lets try again (bingo): http://www.rescuecom.com/news-press-releases/computer-reliability-report-2014.aspx

[tmlhalo]

So, you call anything that is made by someone else an OEM?  that would be everything from phones to cars.  Who would have thought you could call the broncho a ford OEM.  Or the iPhone an apple OEM.  :rolleyes:

 

broken link.

So you think grammar nazing is an effective means of avoiding the fact that you messed. That Carey's video is why he doesn't recommend buying a 329 dollar computer. That even on part 2 he says he would never put his name on something so bad. Keep riding that dictionary it might save you.

[MuffinTopMike]

try not to strawman and  keep this in context of the unit we are discussing..

 

You claim HP are using low quality parts, I merely pointed out you have no proof of that, I also linked to an article explaining why you cannot not even know how much the parts cost so making claims about them I.E "If HP can build computers for prices that low and still make the huge profits that they do" are erroneous.  you do not know if they are even making profit of these computers.

 

Why is it so hard to accept?  this specific PC fills a market niche that cannot be filled with any DIY solution.  The fact it is the most basic of pc's does not make it low quality, instead of putting words in my mouth (trying to insinuate I think ALL prebuilds are better value than DIY) how about you find some evidence that these units are failing at a higher rate than any other. I have already linked to an article showing that the branded boxes have a lower failure rate than any other system so it is not actually beyond reason to claim they are of a higher quality in many respects.

Well the truth is that people are not satisfied with their HP computers, and the quality of their components are worse than you think they are. Here is a survey of satisfaction for a number of popular computer brands http://www.pcworld.com/article/244481/desktop_pc_reliability_and_satisfaction_dell_and_hp_home_pcs_get_poor_grades.html. In terms of your argument saying that HP aren't making profit, well of course HP are making huge profits, they are a multinational corporation, and MNC's have one main aim, and that is to maximize profits. If HP can't make a profit off selling a product, then they simply won't sell it. Huge corporations invest large amounts of money into research to see which groups to market products to, and what products are going to sell best.

 

You argue that for that price point a pre-build is the best option, however numerous other members have put together PC's for even less than the cost of that cheap HP, and some of them even have better specs and are using parts from reliable brands.

[mr moose]

So you think grammar nazing is an effective means of avoiding the fact that you messed. That Carey's video is why he doesn't recommend buying a 329 dollar computer. That even on part 2 he says he would never put his name on something so bad. Keep riding that dictionary it might save you.

 

what's your problem?  My opinion on the matter has not changed the whole way through this discussion, I have maintained the same opinions, same claims and provided sufficient sources to support any arguments I make.  You on the other hand have gone from posting a video to citing 6 year old stats about irrelevant products to crying that I am a grammar nazi because you can't construct a suitable reply to articulate whatever you current displeasure is.  Maybe you should just bow out of the discussion before you start making claims that I work for the NSA or something equally irrelevant.

[othertomperson]

I dunno, I used to look at PCs like this and think that HP, Dell, Packard Bell, etc probably made sense for this market and that it wasn't worth building your own but I don't agree with that any more.

 

CPU: Intel Celeron G1620 2.7GHz Dual-Core Processor  (£26.46 @ CCL Computers) 

Motherboard: MSI H61M-P31/W8 Micro ATX LGA1155 Motherboard  (£32.51 @ CCL Computers) 

Memory: Kingston Black Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3-1600 Memory  (£20.99 @ Amazon UK) 

Storage: Sandisk X110 128GB 2.5" Solid State Drive  (£42.83 @ Scan.co.uk) 

Case: Fractal Design Core 1000 MicroATX Mini Tower Case  (£21.17 @ Scan.co.uk) 

Power Supply: be quiet! 300W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply  (£31.64 @ Aria PC) 

Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 (OEM) (64-bit)  (£74.34 @ Aria PC) 

Total: £249.94

 

I think something like this would be absolutely fine for someone who essentially wanted basic productivity functionality. The Celeron could be swapped for an i3 if necessary, but I doubt it would be tbh.

[tmlhalo]

what's your problem?  My opinion on the matter has not changed the whole way through this discussion, I have maintained the same opinions, same claims and provided sufficient sources to support any arguments I make.  You on the other hand have gone from posting a video to citing 6 year old stats about irrelevant products to crying that I am a grammar nazi because you can't construct a suitable reply to articulate whatever you current displeasure is.  Maybe you should just bow out of the discussion before you start making claims that I work for the NSA or something equally irrelevant.

So nit picking an argument based on wording isn't grammar nazing...? Fooled me. You've made well constructed claims? On what? Insulting Carey to the point you think he rigged the SATA cable cause your vendors can do no wrong?

"No it's not, the point of these videos is to bolster careys viewership.  This computer is no more poorly constructed than any other computer at that price.   The only legitimate complaint he has (sata cable unplugged) is so unlikely it was probably a setup."

 

Yet I am the one about to say you work for the NSA or something... Right...

 

[tmlhalo]

No it's not, the point of these videos is to bolster careys viewership.  This computer is no more poorly constructed than any other computer at that price.   The only legitimate complaint he has (sata cable unplugged) is so unlikely it was probably a setup.  Find me a single other brand that cheap that is better constructed?  In fact try to build one just as cheap, I have yet to find anyone who can. These pc's are being sold in Australia with a 20" monitor for $398.  HP are not ripping the consumer blind with this computer.  Yes all prebuilts have a premium price tag, but that is because someone else put them together and someone else is guaranteeing them.     Carey is quite simply making issues where there are none.

^

[mr moose]

Well the truth is that people are not satisfied with their HP computers, and the quality of their components are worse than you think they are. Here is a survey of satisfaction for a number of popular computer brands http://www.pcworld.com/article/244481/desktop_pc_reliability_and_satisfaction_dell_and_hp_home_pcs_get_poor_grades.html. In terms of your argument saying that HP aren't making profit, well of course HP are making huge profits, they are a multinational corporation, and MNC's have one main aim, and that is to maximize profits. If HP can't make a profit off selling a product, then they simply won't sell it. Huge corporations invest large amounts of money into research to see which groups to market products to, and what products are going to sell best.

 

You argue that for that price point a pre-build is the best option, however numerous other members have put together PC's for even less than the cost of that cheap HP, and some of them even have better specs and are using parts from reliable brands.

 

Yes, I have read that article, 27% of HP caller complaints could not be rectified, probably because it was not a hardware issue. Also I have already pointed out the original source they used for that report:

 

 

It's important to note that our survey results don't necessarily reflect the opinions of a given company's customers as a whole. And because our data comes only from PCWorld readers who chose to take part in the survey,

 

 

 

And lastly my argument is that the prebuilt is the best option for its target demographic (basic requirments, tech illiterate poor people), I have never said it was the best option for anyone who can build their own computer.  My challenge to anyone to beat it was simply because for the price it sells for (particularly here in Aus) we cannot build a cheaper unit.  The cheapest I could do using the cheapest parts from a local online shope was $50 more and used a PSU that I wouldn't give to my enemies.

[mr moose]

So nit picking an argument based on wording isn't grammar nazing...? Fooled me. You've made well constructed claims? On what? Insulting Carey to the point you think he rigged the SATA cable cause your vendors can do no wrong?

"No it's not, the point of these videos is to bolster careys viewership.  This computer is no more poorly constructed than any other computer at that price.   The only legitimate complaint he has (sata cable unplugged) is so unlikely it was probably a setup."

 

Yet I am the one about to say you work for the NSA or something... Right...

 

 

Does that mean you think unplugged sata cables pop through quality control on every other system?  please.    I didn't state it as an absolute, I just pointed out how unlikely it was and that given Carey's demeanor on the videos it's not an unfair assumption to make.

[-iSynthesis]

My old Compaq (from 2002/2003 - plenty of HP stickers inside it) is thick, fast in everything except games and video editing, and never gets hot even with its Pentium 4 3.2GHz @ 3.9GHz. You got ripped.

Its not that old, Compaq presario with some shitty pentium @ 1.7GHz/dual core, its the worst thing that the world has seen, Someone with an i7 5960x would actually get aids using it.

[Dabombinable]

Ho hum:
23/3/2015
http://www.rescuecom.com/blog/index.php/rescuecom/rescuecom-releases-2015-computer-reliability-report/


25/3/2015
http://www.rescuecom.com/news-press-releases/computer-reliability-report-2015.aspx

[Dabombinable]

Its not that old, Compaq presario with some shitty pentium @ 1.7GHz/dual core, its the worst thing that the world has seen, Someone with an i7 5960x would actually get aids using it.

Those Pentium Dual cores (which as it happens is in the Compaq CQ60 that I upgraded for my Grandmother) are still quite good CPU's compared to more recent Celeron dual cores, they perform a shitload better than the Celeron M that is in this laptop, and use about the same amount of power.

[tmlhalo]

Does that mean you think unplugged sata cables pop through quality control on every other system?  please.    I didn't state it as an absolute, I just pointed out how unlikely it was and that given Carey's demeanor on the videos it's not an unfair assumption to make.

So nothing more than a bunch of ad hominem attacks. Thank you for your contribution. 

 

Do I think quality control is stretchy on a $329 machine? yes. Do I agree with Carey's point that machines in that price range should be avoided? yes. Was that what he was showing off? yes.

[mr moose]

So nothing more than a bunch of ad hominem attacks. Thank you for your contribution. 

 

Do I think quality control is stretchy on a $329 machine? yes. Do I agree with Carey's point that machines in that price range should be avoided? yes. Was that what he was showing off? yes.

 

Really, so you would say to someone with little money and no skills to build a computer to just go without because carey told you HP were shit? glad to know you understand why this product even exists.

 

well done.  not only can't you support your claims, but your entire argument rests on 3+ hours of video by someone who openly berates a product for no other reason than to make himself look good.   Because the end user just can't use a pc put together with anything other than phillips head screws. and an external PSU just won't help them when they are emailing grandma.  Please, so much for critical thinking.

[tmlhalo]

Really, so you would say to someone with little money and no skills to build a computer to just go without because carey told you HP were shit? glad to know you understand why this product even exists.

 

well done.  not only can't you support your claims, but your entire argument rests on 3+ hours of video by someone who openly berates a product for no other reason than to make himself look good.   Because the end user just can't use a pc put together with anything other than phillips head screws. and external PSU just won;t help them when they are emailing grandma.  Please, so much for critical thinking.

If anything he would hope they look at a better model where they don't have to cut corners and that when buying PCs there is more to it than a black box. Almost like he says exactly that between 8:20 - 9:20... Same thing Linus said about the R5 240. Though please keep belittling people and putting words in their mouth. 

[mr moose]

If anything he would hope they look at a better model where they don't have to cut corners and that when buying PCs there is more to it than a black box. Almost like he says exactly that between 8:20 - 9:20... Though please keep belittling people and putting words in their mouth. 

 

So you say it's o.k for Carey to belittle a company but it's not o.k for me to belittle him?  I am not putting words in his mouth they are his exact words.

 

Does it upset you that you need to keep finding different things to argue when your original arguments fall flat?

[tmlhalo]

So you say it's o.k for Carey to belittle a company but it's not o.k for me to belittle him?  I am not putting words in his mouth they are his exact words.

 

Does it upset you that you need to keep finding different things to argue when your original arguments fall flat?

If you think you're upsetting me, no. Not in a long shot. I said not to tag me but you did. If you have a problem with me giving my opinion now, should follow your own medicine and not post in a public forum. He insults the HP product because he has a list of grievances that he specifically points out. Heck his product wasn't even working when he got it. The sad thing is I don't even care for his videos. Most of your arguments consists of trying to name personal faults in his character. The ones that aren't like that are Torque screws don't matter on a case no one will open and it doesn't matter what's inside if they won't open it. I'll honestly give you the Torque screws, Geforce used them on my card and I never faulted them on that. But gee... I'm not a mechanic so its ok that I am sold a piece of shit car. Better yet if I was a mechanic and pointed out all the reasons why this car (pc) was really bad like the psu, hard drive, and processor in a video. I'm glad I have someone like Mr Moose out there to question my character. PM me if you really want to knock heads over this til the end of time, i'll read it tomorrow when I'm off again.

[Swndlr]

As someone with a Pavilion: Yes, someone must have been high while designing HP PC's. Some of the designs are abstract and cool, while others are crap and "less than ideal".

[MuffinTopMike]

Yes, I have read that article, 27% of HP caller complaints could not be rectified, probably because it was not a hardware issue. Also I have already pointed out the original source they used for that report:

 

 

 

And lastly my argument is that the prebuilt is the best option for its target demographic (basic requirments, tech illiterate poor people), I have never said it was the best option for anyone who can build their own computer.  My challenge to anyone to beat it was simply because for the price it sells for (particularly here in Aus) we cannot build a cheaper unit.  The cheapest I could do using the cheapest parts from a local online shope was $50 more and used a PSU that I wouldn't give to my enemies.

The point being made by Carey in that video, is that there are alternatives. Of course not everyone is going to build their own computer, but PC stores usually have ready made computers that were built in store. For example Centre Com, offer this computer for $329 http://www.centrecom.com.au/centre-com-system-home-budget-intel-celeron-g1840-28ghz2mb-cache-4gb-ram-1tb-hdd-dvdrw-windows-81-no-disc. First of all it has a better CPU and a bigger HDD than the HP, also when you buy it you know its going to work right out of the box because someone physically built it and installed Windows on it. Furthermore, it would have better support than HP, if anything goes wrong you can just call the store and talk to the person who actually built it.

[elecxonica]

The point being made by Carey in that video, is that there are alternatives. Of course not everyone is going to build their own computer, but PC stores usually have ready made computers that were built in store. For example Centre Com, offer this computer for $329 http://www.centrecom.com.au/centre-com-system-home-budget-intel-celeron-g1840-28ghz2mb-cache-4gb-ram-1tb-hdd-dvdrw-windows-81-no-disc. First of all it has a better CPU and a bigger HDD than the HP, also when you buy it you know its going to work right out of the box because someone physically built it and installed Windows on it. Furthermore, it would have better support than HP, if anything goes wrong you can just call the store and talk to the person who actually built it.

Well, to be fair, most people picking up a prebuilt system probably don't know that Center Com exists. 

[mr moose]

If you think you're upsetting me, no. Not in a long shot. I said not to tag me but you did. If you have a problem with me giving my opinion now, should follow your own medicine and not post in a public forum. He insults the HP product because he has a list of grievances that he specifically points out. Heck his product wasn't even working when he got it. The sad thing is I don't even care for his videos. Most of your arguments consists of trying to name personal faults in his character. The ones that aren't like that are Torque screws don't matter on a case no one will open and it doesn't matter what's inside if they won't open it. I'll honestly give you the Torque screws, Geforce used them on my card and I never faulted them on that. But gee... I'm not a mechanic so its ok that I am sold a piece of shit car. Better yet if I was a mechanic and pointed out all the reasons why this car (pc) was really bad like the psu, hard drive, and processor in a video. I'm glad I have someone like Mr Moose out there to question my character. PM me if you really want to knock heads over this til the end of time, i'll read it tomorrow when I'm off again.

 

If you don't want to participate in the discussion then stop posting, it's as simple as that. I am not the one posting stuff then complaining about being tagged.  :rolleyes: 

 

You must watch his videos through rose colored glasses if you believe half of that.

 

The point being made by Carey in that video, is that there are alternatives. Of course not everyone is going to build their own computer, but PC stores usually have ready made computers that were built in store. For example Centre Com, offer this computer for $329 http://www.centrecom.com.au/centre-com-system-home-budget-intel-celeron-g1840-28ghz2mb-cache-4gb-ram-1tb-hdd-dvdrw-windows-81-no-disc. First of all it has a better CPU and a bigger HDD than the HP, also when you buy it you know its going to work right out of the box because someone physically built it and installed Windows on it. Furthermore, it would have better support than HP, if anything goes wrong you can just call the store and talk to the person who actually built it.

 

I don't know what experience you have had with centrecom, but to claim HP have worse support is kind off erroneous because you don't have to go through HP with a warranty claim, you can go back to the shop you bought it from. I personally wouldn't touch centrecom for love nor money and probably for the same reason you don't like HP. i.e Personal experience.   But this is my point, the HP unit is available in office works for 398 with a monitor, keyboard and mouse,  sure you get a better cpu with the centrcom unit but by the time you add the rest the average customer (who won't even notice the difference between cpus) would be better of with the office works deal. 

 

Well, to be fair, most people picking up a prebuilt system probably don't know that Center Com exists. 

 

pretty much my point in all this thread.  The people these systems are aimed at don't know about small shops, which end of a screwdriver to hold, where windows comes from or what websites to avoid.  They just need to go into one shop they know will be there tomorrow and by a complete system that works out of the box.

[atoff]

I have seen worse with HP

 

 

This guy just drones on and on.  10 minute video dragged on for an hour.  

 

But anyway, we all know HP's are garbage, but they play a role.  Average consumer who just wants to surf the web, and wants to pay as little as possible for a PC has the option of just picking one up for $300 or less.  Not everyone has to be into building PC's, and this is coming from someone who's built PC's, both personally and professionally since 1999 or so.

[Hackzzila]

My HP (NOW A nas) has NO sata power and uses molex to sata adapters D:<

[SteveGrabowski]

This guy just drones on and on.  10 minute video dragged on for an hour.  

 

But anyway, we all know HP's are garbage, but they play a role.  Average consumer who just wants to surf the web, and wants to pay as little as possible for a PC has the option of just picking one up for $300 or less.  Not everyone has to be into building PC's, and this is coming from someone who's built PC's, both personally and professionally since 1999 or so.

 

I agree about the 10 minutes. I think he's spot on about quality control and HP being a terrible company though. How could you ever miss that click plugging in the SATA cable?

[Blebekblebek]

I don't know

 

I never bought built up machine(s), except for laptop

 

but judging from the video that carey made (I don't know why entire thread bashing on him for pointing out the obvious)

 

the system that he review is acceptable

while it's not great but it's good enough for daily use

Power Adapter instead PSU is a good move imo

and it's not uncommon for AM1 build

http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/AM1H-ITX/this one use adapter instead ATX Power supply

 

the system it self can fit on mini or small pc case, but no one pointed out that regular MINI ITX case is cost alot more than regular mid-tower case, and the adapter is more reasonable to provide low power system instead wasting 50% or more power to supply the whole system, there are reason why something like Pico PSU exist (and somewhat cost even more than regular ATX 300w PSU), seriously that system doesn't need more than 70w power.

 

can you build better for $350, I'm sure you can

but the main selling point build up machine is convinience

would you do it for $10 to build someone else PC? pick the hardware, QC all parts, assembly (and imaging the hard drive) and provide support for a year (as in if the computer is break down, that person call you to check and claim the warranty/etc)

because that price including support & license software.

 

this thread is going off topic too far, we all know that there are so much people who doesn't even bother to know what machine they use as long it works. if you want to blame the company, blame the people who bought it and keep buying it.