How can I fix my room? Subwoofer position?

[Jonathan=PC]

 

Front Speakers: Polk: T50
Center Speaker: Polk: T30
Bookshelf speakers: Edifier c3x
Subwoofer: Onkyo SKW-208
Reciever: Denon AVR-X1400H
TV: LG OLED55B6V

Issue:
Bass doesn’t feel as impactfull as I want…

What do I want?
- To find a way to feel the sound as in a cinema.
- Better positioning
- Advice on anything that I can improve in terms of audio quality

Budget
I am a student, so i don’t have more then 200 euro to spare at the moment.
But I would save up some more money, if it would drastically improve the experience…

[jaslion]

Turn up the base?

[Jonathan=PC]

13 minutes ago, jaslion said:

Turn up the base?

Wouldn't make such a detailed post if that was an option

I think it has to do with room acoustics, that's why i mapped out the whole room..

 

[tikker]

4 hours ago, Jonathan=PC said:

I think it has to do with room acoustics, that's why i mapped out the whole room..

Room acoustics can have an effect. You can try doing a sub crawl: https://www.audioholics.com/home-theater-connection/crawling-for-bass-subwoofer-placement

 

4 hours ago, Jonathan=PC said:

Advice on anything that I can improve in terms of audio quality

From Dolby spec the surrounds are at a less than ideal place, but you have to work with what you've got. The fronts are actually pretty much bang on considering distance from the sofa and tv.

 

You can also try running the Audyssey room correction to see if that improves your overall sound.

[circeseye]

as tikker said. do the sub crawl

[harryk]

+1 for doing the sub crawl

+1 for running Audyssey setup if you haven't already

 

In addition, do not just arbitrarily turn up the bass unless you want a boomy horrible mess of sound. As long as you've setup Audyssey correctly it will determine the proper cross over point and gain levels. This may sound contradictory, but if you can hear the subwoofer then it is not setup correctly. It should meld into the whole sound so seamlessly you never go, "Oh there's the bass."

 

AudioCheck.net has a fantastic artificial test for subwoofer setup, along with many other system tests you can use to fine tune your speaker setup.

 

Unfortunately if you're really looking for cinema levels of impact, there is only one solution, and it's called a giant subwoofer. Like one from SVS for example.

 

If you want better sound in general, then room treatment should be your next step. 

[Bombastinator]

Old fashioned conventional wisdom was low frequency sound travels right through most things and for absurd distances so it didn’t really matter all that much where one put the sub. You could hide it under a bed and the sound would still get where it was going more or less.  I have found this to be only partially true myself.   There are still things that can absorb low frequency sound but bounce high frequency.  They tend to be things like sheet metal though. 

[tikker]

12 hours ago, Bombastinator said:

Old fashioned conventional wisdom was low frequency sound travels right through most things and for absurd distances so it didn’t really matter all that much where one put the sub.

This still holds. For stuff like absorption and reflection the size of the object compared to the wavelength matters. Low frequencies have long wavelengths so you need big objects to absorb or scatter them. There just are some details you touch on next.

12 hours ago, Bombastinator said:

You could hide it under a bed and the sound would still get where it was going more or less.  I have found this to be only partially true myself.

The other part you mention here and what may be OPs problem is that because of the placement, reflections from the walls and such create peaks and throughs in sound level. Perhaps a such a trough now coincides with the listening position, creating a lesser experience there. This you can try to fix by adding more subs or changing the position

[Bombastinator]

2 hours ago, tikker said:

This still holds. For stuff like absorption and reflection the size of the object compared to the wavelength matters. Low frequencies have long wavelengths so you need big objects to absorb or scatter them. There just are some details you touch on next.

The other part you mention here and what may be OPs problem is that because of the placement, reflections from the walls and such create peaks and throughs in sound level. Perhaps a such a trough now coincides with the listening position, creating a lesser experience there. This you can try to fix by adding more subs or changing the position

The specific example was a dance party in a basement.  Adding more subs was necessary. It turned out the metal ductwork was absorbing it.  After the additional sub it worked again, but you could literally see the metal move.

[JZStudios]

I'm not super big on sound wave placement, but if it were me I'd pull the sofa closer the TV and free up some space around the bed. I'd also ceiling mount the surrounds closer to the sofa. Most media sources are based on the ITU standard which gives you a pretty good feel for sound placement. I made a ~6'/2m radius around my desk with my seating position in the middle following the ITU standard. The sound placement is spot on. The frequency response most assuredly isn't flat, but it's not going to be any worse than it is now.

 

Trying to room treat a room for surround sound (or even stereo) just seems like a complicated mess of bullshittery and "good 'nuff." My buddy has a music studio that he tried doing calculations and room treatment for stereo, but after he just bought a Sonarworks Reference 4 it now actually has a flat response and the room treatment requirement drastically decreased (stayed the same with foam panels in key areas) and his music mixes suddenly got a lot better. The bitch is there's apparently just not actually a calibration tool for surround. You can try hacking the Reference 4 by calibrating it in stereo pairs and putting the EQ output into PEACE or the receivers limited built in EQ.

[Ahoy Hoy]

Im not 100% sure by what you mean with cinema sound as most cinemas have multiple subs for a reason. 

Like one person said subs in a small room have peaks and troughs so that means theres loud spots and quite spots in the room. Play a constant noise and walk around and if its louder if one spot then move the sub a bit. Normaly the zones are no bigger then your head so the left side of the sofa may be quiter then the right side.

But if you just want a louder low frequencies. One trick is that low frequencies bounce off walls and are addictive when the source is close enough to the wall (distance to the wall has to be less then 1/4 of a wave length same as if merging to subs together). Off the top of my head its called the greenhouse effect
Long story short. For every surface near a subwoof you they get loud (sorry i cant remember the amount i think its 6dB per surface). So youve already got the floor. Put it up against the wall thats two surfaces. in the corner of your room thats three. Hello desk is that 4 surfaces. If my memory is remembering correctly thats a increase of around 24dB by just sticking the sub under your desk in the corner of the room. (that number increase doesnt sound right and i cant find the paper on it due to global warming but which ever way more walls more loud)


Another trick is just be closer to the sub. Every time you double the distance from your speaker you lose 3dB. So if that sub is 90dB at 1m by the time it reaches you its around 88.5ish dB

Another thought is install a bass shaker to the sofa. That will give you a real what for.

My final idea is turn the bass up in the settings or the amp or what ever you have.

[Delta-Force]

On 9/15/2020 at 9:43 PM, Ahoy Hoy said:

Every time you double the distance from your speaker you lose 3dB. So if that sub is 90dB at 1m by the time it reaches you its around 88.5ish dB

Slightly wrong. Double the distance loses you not 3 but 6dB.

[Guest]

I always liked my subs right behind me. Closer the better. If it vibrates the couch, it adds a physical sensation.

Try the speak facing the couch and try it facing away from the couch. 

[Ahoy Hoy]

On 10/2/2020 at 12:38 AM, Delta-Force said:

Slightly wrong. Double the distance loses you not 3 but 6dB.

My bad. 3dB is a line source good spot.

[s_k]

I'm not a subwoofer fan, but there's a good answer to how to 'feel' sound from a sub.

 

[VoidX]

The crawl is a good thing, calibration is a must, but you can easily measure the best position. Open REW's RTA, set it to full spectrum, play pink noise, and move the sub around. Look for the position with the lowest number of notches and overall flattest curve. This is the best you can do for free.