WARNING: RANT!! why can't computers ever just be reliable

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

i'm seriously getting frustrated now. if i build a computer no matter what i get issues. my current pc (i3 8100, Z370-P, 16GB Ram and a few ssd's), is having super weird problems and i'm just sick of this custom pc space at this point. 

 

basically, i was getting some graphical glitching which went away and recenty came back, and it won't stay in sleep reliably. if i do that it'll turn on in the middle of the night. now, that doesn't sound like a big deal. i'm not expecting a dead gpu, since i can play the witcher 3 for hours with no crashing, lines on the screen or weird color glitching. however, it's recently developed a new fault. if i turn it on, there is a chance it'll beep at me that i don't have displays connected, even when i do have displays connected and it won't boot. i then need to unplug and plug displays back in until it decides it wants to work. also, the main screen does not turn on if i boot the machine. i have to turn it off from standby and turn it back on before it decides it's connected. 

 

i'm so sick of it. if this was an 8 or 10 year old computer sure, i'd expect issues. but this is a modern machine still!!! i'm just so done with this whole thing. i need a reliable computer, i have things to do. a machine that randomly decides it doesn't want to work anymore is unacceptable for me. 

 

i'm jsut so sick of it. why msut it be like this? i'm not even talking these issues specifically now, also Windows just deciding to break my gpu driver and i have to spend an hour to get it back to normal is just... why? why do we as customers accept this? 

 

i'm just at the point where i don't trust pc's anymore. at all. even if i build them myself and i know i didn't make a mistake, i just cannot rely on them. 

 

my only option right now is to unplug my pc entirely and plug my macbook pro into my setup. i don't want to do that, as my macbook pro is 8 years old and certainly not the fastest computer in the world anymore. however, say what you want about macbooks, but i got this one used 2 years ago. it's been in my backpack every day for 1.5 years to school, where it ran heavy compute tasks like VM's which would let it sit at 100% utilization for hours at a time. it's been my main computer for a while before when the pc i had at the time broke, so it was at school all day running heavy tasks and then plugged into my main setup at home and used heavily again. it's been through hell, dropped various times, sat in a damp backpack after a heavy rainstorm more than once, used on trains with loads of vibration while running at 90+ degrees if i had to finish schoolwork on my way home.... and it's still working flawlessly. it's only stopped working once which was my mistake, i broke the drive cable when swapping drives into it. apart form that which was a €10 and 15 minute fix, it's never let me down once. 

 

how do pc customers still accept that machines that are 3 or 4 years old get unstable, need OS reinstalls, whatever else, when the competition exists? how? 

 

sorry for my rant, i'm jsut annoyed that i put a bunch of money into a computer that's just a doorstop at this point. i cannot rely on it therefore it's useless. i'm currently living in a temporary situation and i don't have easy access to spare parts, because at my parents house i've started with packing up all my things. 

 

i'm just so lucky to own some apple products, which are the only thing that are ever reliable for me for some weird reason. i don't know if it's a curse or what, but i'm just done.

 

i will keep my pc and i will try to diagnose it but i'm just sick and tired of needing to practically babysit and cuddle my computer all the time, putting hours every month into fixing problems and bugs, when i have a macbook pro that has never let me down before and i can know for a fact when i press the power button that it will start up. i no longer have that confidence in my pc. 

 

so, the current pc i have will likely be my last. until it dies completely i will continue to play games on it, but i'm gonna just start saving up and buy a console when it inevitebly dies.

[Haro]

i mean, i dont know i just built one and have no issues, in fact, it went so smooth even automatic driver installer installed the latest drivers for me...it's relatively fine from my experience.

as for issues like XMP, ram,BSOD etc.. they can be fixed..as to why it happens.. many reasons but for the most part, sometimes it's easily fixable. 

[Max1996LTT]

Just now, TofuHaroto said:

i mean, i dont know i just built one and have no issues, in fact, it went so smooth even automatic driver installer installed the latest drivers for me...it's relatively fine from my experience.

as for issues like XMP, ram,BSOD etc.. they can be fixed..as to why it happens.. many reasons but for the most part, sometimes it's easily fixable. 

Same.

[Guest]

This seems more about your patience and tolerance than the PC space being the issue. You've already identified your ideal environment, so of course using something you prefer less will continue to eat at you. You'll find many don't share your specific frustration, and if they do... they use something they do like.

[18358414]

The only times I've had issues like these is when I try to push my PC "to the max" with overclocking and 'performance mode' driver settings.  When I run stuff at stock it's always been reliable, which is probably why they call it stock.  Not to say you wouldn't encounter occasional driver issues, just that my experience has been very different. 

[dfsgsfa]

14 minutes ago, Ashley said:

8100, Z370-P,

lol, better do more research next time

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

3 minutes ago, dfsgsfa said:

lol, better do more research next time

i got that board form a friend for €20 and the cpu was used as well and didn't cost much more. it was about price here. 

[gloop]

7 minutes ago, dfsgsfa said:

lol, better do more research next time

lol, how about making an actually contributive comment to the discussion next time.

[wall03]

Basically: buy Apple.

 

Huh. Kinda what I thought in March before I decided I would build my own computer.

 

But it seems like a bottleneck on your end kinda. 16GB of RAM and a i3 8100 and a Z series mobo? Maybe that was what it was like before I entered the PC world at around the time AMD's stock price be Ryzen (pun totally intended) if you wanted futureproofing.

 

Huh

[Dedayog]

Console - one planned build, optimized to work together

 

PC - various manufacturers, no set path

 

Hmm, a little thinking would have gone a long way.  Your rant is simple logic.

[fuzz0r]

First off real sorry you're having these issues. But I don't know if this is the norm.

I've built a few PCs by now, some for me, a lot for friends and family. None have issues.

 

As for the display issue, are you using displayport? I've had that issue as well with my RTX card. I was used to using DVI but had to switch to Displayport and that's when the issues started. My fix was to enable ErP for S4 and S5. Takes a bit longer to boot up but I don't really care about that since I've got it encrypted with a password through bitlocker so it takes me a while anyway.

 

Quote

Windows just deciding to break my gpu driver

You can turn that off. Win + R, type sysdm.cpl go to hardware and advanced I believe it is. Disable it.

 

If your windows is unstable I would format it, but be sure to download the drivers you need beforehand and place them on a USB.

 

As for the rest of your post I'm sorry but I have a hard time seeing the same issues with any of the systems I've built or friends have built. In fact windows seems pretty decent in it's current state, but that' for me, personally.

 

I hope that some of what I've typed can help you.

Please don't give up on PCs they're fantastic workmates that can do so so much cool stuff.

[Chris Pratt]

It is easier now to build a PC than ever. As long as you do your research, buy good, compatible components, and actually install them properly, it virtually just works without issue.

 

I mean, seriously, it used to be so bad in the past, that I can't even fathom your level of frustration here. We are in a true golden age. Still, if it's not for you, that's fine. Go buy a pre-built with warranty and support. There's no shame in that.

[SolarNova]

'Most' issues a PC has can be tracked back to the user.

 

Thats not to say PC's dont have their unavoidable problems now and then, especially with newer immature hardware and software, but a lot of the time it can be tracked back to the user, be it improper installation (both hardware and software) or compatibility issues that should have been known.

 

In fact some of the time the 'issues' that present themselves may be no direct fault of the user but is the result of a 'risk' that the user 'should' have known they were taking when purchasing a product. Like for example buying a cheap PSU that ends up dying or degrading causing issues, or buying a AIO then ends up clogging or just straight up stops working and the user doesn't know how to diagnose it because they thought it was without risk, or buying a Graphics card that reviews ,had the user checked them, show that the cooler is crap, or buying 'used' hardware,

 

User's can also incorrectly assume that a PC should work flawlessly for many many years without any maintenance. this INCLUDES software (including the OS).

Problems occur now and then, constant installations and uninstalls can leave registries full of crap and included 'bloatware' accidentally installed may be left behind. All this eventually overtime can cause the OS to 'degrade' in many ways. This is why a clean reinstall can be the quickest and easiest method of troubleshooting. A clean OS install is quick and easy nowadays and important files should already be backed up anyway so there is no loss in formatting and starting over.

 

44 minutes ago, Ashley said:

how do pc customers still accept that machines that are 3 or 4 years old get unstable, need OS reinstalls, whatever else, when the competition exists? how?

In the end the answer is simple. PC users who know how to maintain a PC in the most basic of ways dont have to deal with such issues, dont consider a OS install a problem in the 1st place,  and the competition to a PC is a overpriced and anti consumer POS. or deal with a prebuilt PC which has the same maintenance requirements, but rely on the 'customer service' that comes with it.

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

7 minutes ago, fuzz0r said:

As for the display issue, are you using displayport? I've had that issue as well with my RTX card. I was used to using DVI but had to switch to Displayport and that's when the issues started. My fix was to enable ErP for S4 and S5. Takes a bit longer to boot up but I don't really care about that since I've got it encrypted with a password through bitlocker so it takes me a while anyway.

i'm using DVI with known good monitors. 

 

8 minutes ago, fuzz0r said:

You can turn that off. Win + R, type sysdm.cpl go to hardware and advanced I believe it is. Disable it.

until microsoft re-enables it withing a week with an update. 

 

8 minutes ago, fuzz0r said:

If your windows is unstable I would format it, but be sure to download the drivers you need beforehand and place them on a USB.

did that, besides, freezing and glitches also happen in linux. 

 

9 minutes ago, fuzz0r said:

Please don't give up on PCs they're fantastic workmates that can do so so much cool stuff.

for me, Mac's are even more fantastic workmates that can do even cooler stuff lmao

 

7 minutes ago, Chris Pratt said:

It is easier now to build a PC than ever. As long as you do your research, buy good, compatible components, and actually install them properly, it virtually just works without issue.

 

I mean, seriously, it used to be so bad in the past, that I can't even fathom your level of frustration here. We are in a true golden age. Still, if it's not for you, that's fine. Go buy a pre-built with warranty and support. There's no shame in that.

my parts list is compatible (in fact my mobo is overkill so it should be solid) and i have a degree in IT and know my way aroudn building pc's, i've been doing it since i was 10 years old. 

 

4 minutes ago, SolarNova said:

and the competition to a PC is a overpriced and anti consumer POS

that may be but at least their stuff works. 

 

5 minutes ago, SolarNova said:

'Most' issues a PC has can be tracked back to the user.

what have i done wrong here?

[fuzz0r]

1 minute ago, Ashley said:

i'm using DVI with known good monitors. 

That is strange. Never had issues with DVI myself.

Are you able to test with a different graphics card? Just to make sure that isn't at fault here.

 

2 minutes ago, Ashley said:

until microsoft re-enables it withing a week with an update. 

That I haven't noticed. I recently formatted so mine was of course set to yes, I have now checked no and I will see if it changes. If it does I'll make sure to not make that suggestion again.

 

3 minutes ago, Ashley said:

did that, besides, freezing and glitches also happen in linux. 

That leads me to a hardware issue.

 

3 minutes ago, Ashley said:

for me, Mac's are even more fantastic workmates that can do even cooler stuff lmao

Well then maybe invest in something like a mac mini?

If you're more comfortable with Macs I won't try and persuade you otherwise.

[AntiTrust]

46 minutes ago, Ashley said:

i'm just so done with this whole thing. i need a reliable computer, i have things to do. a machine that randomly decides it doesn't want to work anymore is unacceptable for me. 

Yeah I can agree with this mentality from the general public. Their tablet or phone doesn't just randomly stop working or lose the display or whatever, so why should their PC. 

 

the problem is, and you pointed it out, is that unless the manufacturer has total control over the OS, hardware and I/O devices (like apple) then there are simply going to be glitches. Windows 10 is the best and easiest version of windows ever and lots of people still have lots of different issues. But thats what happens when there is literally millions of combinations of components and I/O and display devices available to you. 

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

Just now, fuzz0r said:

That is strange. Never had issues with DVI myself.

Are you able to test with a different graphics card? Just to make sure that isn't at fault here.

it won't be a fair test as the spare card i have has only 1 DVI port so one of the screens will use a different connector. 

 

1 minute ago, fuzz0r said:

Well then maybe invest in something like a mac mini?

If you're more comfortable with Macs I won't try and persuade you otherwise.

meh, i don't really like desktop Mac's. if i'm gonna live on macOS i'm gonna just save up for a better macbook pro, since the convenience of unplugging one type c dongle and taking my computer with me is appealing. 

[Kilrah]

51 minutes ago, Ashley said:

how do pc customers still accept that machines that are 3 or 4 years old get unstable, need OS reinstalls, whatever else, when the competition exists? how? 

I have 6 PCs I use regularly and none have issues.

 

6 minutes ago, Ashley said:

what have i done wrong here?

 

32 minutes ago, Ashley said:

i got that board form a friend for €20 and the cpu was used as well and didn't cost much more. it was about price here. 

Probably this, used components in unknown state.

[RejZoR]

Even if hardware is all good, Microsoft will ultimately f**k something up. It's always that I spot some weird shit that used to work isn't anymore after some sort of update. And then you also have the graphics drivers that keep on being wonky...

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

1 minute ago, Kilrah said:

Probably this, used components in unknown state.

they worked fine for like 9 months now. 

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

Just now, RejZoR said:

Even if hardware is all good, Microsoft will ultimately f**k something up. It's always that I spot some weird shit that used to work isn't anymore after some sort of update. And then you also have the graphics drivers that keep on being wonky...

it isn't just microsoft. Linux does it too, although on a smaller scale. 

[Kilrah]

Just now, Ashley said:

they worked fine for like 9 months now. 

And they don't anymore

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

1 minute ago, Kilrah said:

And they don't anymore

correct. but they were in a known good state. because they worked fine. 

[TetraSky]

Half of the time, I find that PC issues are RAM related. Then maybe 20% is Windows/drivers related. 10% is storage related. 10% power supply. 5% motherboard. 5% everything else.

Computer hardware can show up at any moment, it doesn't matter if it worked before, it can still fail.

 

So if you have an issue, the troubleshooting steps that I do is the following

 

0- Get rid of ALL overclock. Only set the RAM to XMP.
1- Test the RAM & CPU with Prime95 on Blend for a quick and dirty way of finding RAM issues (unless there's evidence that the issue might be something else, like PC shutting down completely which indicate a power issue)
2- Follow that up with Memtest overnight for 12 to 24 hours. If all is clean, move on to the next step.

3- If the issue was graphical, test the GPU.

4- Bluescreen? Have the minidump analyzed. No Bluescreen? Enable them because MS disabled them to stop scaring people, but because it's disabled, it doesn't generate a minidump, so you need to enable it for proper analysis.
5- Rollback drivers and/or reinstall windows (after doing a backup of all my data)

6- Install windows on a different drive and test the storage medium with whichever tool provided by the manufacturer
..................
etc.

[kelvinhall05]

I've had absolutely no problems with mine (that weren't easy to fix, anyway) and I have an 11 y/o CPU, RAM, and motherboard.