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BlueScope819

Petition and PSA about Userbenchmark

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Posted · Original PosterOP

General background:

 

In my recent months helping both people on forums and in real life, I've constantly had to struggle to overcome the stigma that UserBenchmark applies to Ryzen Processors, and multicore processors in general. I've constantly had to explain that the PC hardware community are not "anonymous call center shills" when I try to recommend a Ryzen CPU. Direct quote from UserBenchmark.

 

This can influence the decisions of novice PC builders negatively and should be mentioned here. Rigged or falsified benchmarks are destructive to the PC ecosystem: builders (and sometimes even entire companies) fall for these fake benchmarks, build worse PCs, and starve out the creators of good hardware. TomsHardware quote: "Userbenchmark ... gives a warning about an "organized army of shills who pump one brand or another and deal in hot air rather than reason." Though we can't say whether or not Userbenchmark is at fault here, their response to critics certainly won't be met with much positivity."

 

This type of behavior is destructive to the core of the community on LTT forum, as LTT being an educational technology channel by design it is to attract novice PC builders and get them interested in computer hardware. Userbenchmark being a company that targets new users with SEO (just google any two processor names and scroll down), provides a source of, at best, misinformation, and at most, intentionally attempting to mislead users into buying computer hardware that is not suited to their workload.

 

What I want done:

 

What I simply ask of the moderators and admins of this forum is to recognize that Userbenchmark is not a reliable source of information for PC builders, for enthusiasts and novices alike. My personal suggestion would be to sticky a post to the top of the New Builds and Planning section in order to educate users about Userbenchmark.

 

Sources:

 

  • TweakTown - "Userbenchmark changes their CPU rating algorithm to push huge focus on single-threaded performance while nerfing multi-threaded performance because 'Ryzen is too fast'"
  • Techspot- "Enthusiasts were taken back by the website's questionable decision to adjust its scoring algorithm in favor of single-threaded performance, inflating scores in such a way that doesn't appear to be entirely representative of the processor in question."
  • TomsHardware - "It doesn't take a degree in computer science to see the obvious disconnect here."
  • Techordeal - "This change penalizes processors which focus on multi-core performance over single and quad-core performance. The result is certainly handy for Intel, who were seeing their rivals offer better performance scores for much lower prices."
  • AMD subreddit - "PSA: Use Benchmark.com have updated their CPU ranking algorithm and it majorly disadvantages AMD Ryzen CPUs"
  • AMD subreddit
  • LTT - "UserBenchmark Adjusts Algorithm to Favor Single-Thread Performance, Causing Strange Results."

 


@BlueScope819 so I can see your post

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Posted (edited)

I don't know that Userbenchmark is necessarily creating huge problems on the forum here, those who try to defend the use of the site are rather quickly shot down with some very reasonable rebuttals, and generally any new user is warned immediately, if they bring up the site, that the figures are unreliable, along with websites such as bottleneck and PSU calculators.

 

As for implementing a ban or some kind of moderation on the forum, I don't know if that would be required or useful, but I certainly wouldn't mind myself.

Edited by Fasauceome

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i can't speak for the regulars, but from the occasional lurking i haven't seen a userbenchmark resource used unironically that often ._. that's already a better alternative when the community knows what to do or not do (without moderator intervention)

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Posted · Original PosterOP
2 minutes ago, Fasauceome said:

I don't know that Userbenchmark is necessary creating huge problems on the forum here, those who try to defend the use of the site are rather quickly shot down with some very reasonable rebuttals, and generally any new user is warned immediately, if they bring up the site, that the figures are unreliable, along with websites such as bottleneck and PSU calculators.

 

As for implementing a ban or some kind of moderation on the forum, I don't know if that would be required or useful, but I certainly wouldn't mind myself.

Thanks for pointing that out, I made the "what I want done" section more clear. I was suggesting a sticky post.

3 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

i can't speak for the regulars, but from the occasional lurking i haven't seen a userbenchmark resource used unironically that often ._. that's already a better alternative when the community knows what to do or not do (without moderator intervention)

It's not just what gets posted to the Forum, but people who try and educate themselves with userbenchmark without stating that their information comes from that source. Also, as I said, I was suggesting a Sticky post, not a word filter or anything unreasonable like that.


@BlueScope819 so I can see your post

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10 minutes ago, BlueScope819 said:

What I simply ask of the moderators and admins of this forum is to recognize that Userbenchmark is not a reliable source of information for PC builders, for enthusiasts and novices alike, and to take steps in order to give the most accurate information we can to our users, in order to make sure that everyone has the right information and is educated to the fullest extent possible about their computer hardware. My personal suggestion would be to sticky a post to the top of the New Builds and Planning section in order to educate users about Userbenchmark.

The moderation Team does not  moderate the accuracy of  information just the rules of etiquette.

Obviously if someone is purposely misleading people we may step in but that is the extent of it.

 

if you wish a topic to be pinned, write up a well informed topic and submit it to be pinned, then moderators will discuss and decide. Please bear in mind that is not a guaranty it will be pinned.

 


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Posted · Original PosterOP
Just now, TempestCatto said:

So why don't we just make our own site. With black jack and hookers. But mostly with real world data that isn't messed with.

Because there is a simple solution (making a sticky post) without making a PC forum with porn as an aspect? Like what?


@BlueScope819 so I can see your post

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None of this is needed because people who actually care about these metrics will quickly correct those who attempted to depend on userbenchmark’s results. 
 

There’s nothing moderators would be able to do anyways that isn’t already plastered everywhere else- on here and any other legitimate forum. We’re not here to correct misinformation unless it’s serial, and that is primarily on a single user basis. 
 

Here is a community that knows their stuff, and I trust that people who bring userbenchmark to the table will quickly and easily be corrected. 


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1 minute ago, BlueScope819 said:

Thanks for pointing that out, I made the "what I want done" section more clear. I was suggesting a sticky post.

It could come off as a bit ranty, unfortunately, or maybe just some general disgruntled feelings that aren't necessarily critical. Beginner users who won't bother to do proper research past Memebenchmark are also not gonna read the stickies tbh. 

 

Also, there has been such a decline in links to the site on the forum, might be a problem that solves itself.


I WILL find your ITX build thread, and I WILL recommend the SIlverstone Sugo SG13B

 

Primary PC:

i7 8086k (won) - EVGA Z370 Classified K - G.Kill Trident Z RGB - Force MP500 - Jedi Order Titan Xp - Hyper 212 Black (with RGB Riing flair) - EVGA G2 650W - Black and green theme, Razer branwashed me.

Draws 400 watts under max load, for reference.

 

Linux Proliant ML150 G6:

Dual Xeon X5560 - 24GB ECC DDR3 - GTX 750 TI - old Seagate 1.5TB HDD - Dark moded Ubuntu (and Win7, cuz why not)

 

How many watts do I need? Seasonic Focus threadUserbenchmark (Et al.) is trash explained, PSU misconceptions, protections explainedgroup reg is bad

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Posted · Original PosterOP
Just now, SansVarnic said:

The moderation Team does not  moderate the accuracy of  information just the rules of etiquette.

Obviously if someone is purposely misleading people we may step in but that is the extent of it.

 

if you wish a topic to be pinned, write up a well informed topic and submit it to be pinned, then moderators will discuss and decide. Please bear in mind that is not a guaranty it will be pinned.

 

Thank you, I will do that. Do I submit that to New Builds and Planning or to General discussion and then it will be moved if it is approved?


@BlueScope819 so I can see your post

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"My name is Legion 'Murica Parrot Gang, for we are many."

Mentioned in 8/5/2020 TechLinked

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4 minutes ago, BlueScope819 said:

Thank you, I will do that. Do I submit that to New Builds and Planning or to General discussion and then it will be moved if it is approved?

Post it in the fitting section, benchmarking software would fit under software so that section.

If it needs moved it can be.


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Character is like a Tree and Reputation like its Shadow. The Shadow is what we think of it; The Tree is the Real thing.  ~ Abraham Lincoln

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.  ~ Winston Churchill

Docendo discimus - "the best way to learn is to teach" ~ Benjamin Jantz

 

I am a StarCitizen are you? My ships: Aegis Eclipse, Aegis Sabre, Aegis Gladius, Aopoa Nox, KI P52 Merlin, KI P72 Archimedes and the RSI Constellation Aquila.

 

My Phones are a Nokia Lumia 925 with WM10 and a Microsoft Lumia 950 XL with WM10 running the Fast Ring insider updates. Broke :(

Samsung Note 9 and a Samsung S9+

 

About Myself:   https://linustechtips.com/main/profile/229093-sansvarnic/?tab=field_core_pfield_46

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
3 minutes ago, SansVarnic said:

Post it in the fitting section, benchmarking software would fit under software so that section.

If it needs moved it can be.

Okay, will do. I don't think many users will see it there, you guys can make the decision if you want to move it to New Builds and Planning. Thank you for letting me know what I need to do.


@BlueScope819 so I can see your post

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Mentioned in 8/5/2020 TechLinked

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Probably a little late to this 

But most of the times. People do point out that user benchmark is a load of bs. 

And in all honesty I don't see a lot of people use it ( at least unironically like what @VegetableStu said ).

 

 


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their gpu results are also weird its pretty much general consensus that the 5700 xt performs on par with a 2070 and they trade blows but userbench says the 2070 is 6% faster and the small review thingy they do at the bottom is just insulting. https://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Nvidia-RTX-2070-vs-AMD-RX-5700-XT/4029vs4045 they are probably looking at the stock 5700 xt but why 

i wouldnt be surprised if the CEO of the company that runs userbench is a huge amd short or something

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12 minutes ago, Fasauceome said:

*snip*

Beginner users who won't bother to do proper research past Memebenchmark are also not gonna read the stickies tbh. 

*snip*

That's also one of the main issue here, new users don't read forum rules or section's posting guidelines or even section titles (and so often do thread dumping). A sticky about an unreliable website isn't going to change anything if a new member swears by it ;)

 


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24 minutes ago, BlueScope819 said:

What I simply ask of the moderators and admins of this forum is to recognize that Userbenchmark is not a reliable source of information for PC builders, for enthusiasts and novices alike. My personal suggestion would be to sticky a post to the top of the New Builds and Planning section in order to educate users about Userbenchmark.

While this already was answered by others, I still say the same. The expectation of our members is that crowd pressure and good reasoning is enough to sway any bad influence. This includes debunking Userbenchmark as valid source of information if that is what topic needs. Same goes with any news topic or fact. Opinions presented as facts are very close to trolling, as at that point acknowledging that one is wrong might become too big step to take.

 

So please be mindful of your recommendations, suggestions and such.


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24 minutes ago, TempestCatto said:

So why don't we just make our own site. With black jack and hookers. But mostly with real world data that isn't messed with.

I agree with Bender.


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4 minutes ago, spartaman64 said:

 https://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Nvidia-RTX-2070-vs-AMD-RX-5700-XT/4029vs4045 they are probably looking at the stock 5700 xt but why

not consistant with other people showing performance in relation to other GPUs. 

https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-rx-5700-xt.c3339

like what techpowerup does. 

 

then again, just pick your fights and you can tilt results ± 10%

Spoiler

image.thumb.png.77bc02ff238a026b5300c3388d1ecfa1.png

day 1 reviews from hardwareunboxed also put it in the same ballpark. could be tilting the benchark suite to favor someone, but can just as likely just be random based on what is available. 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
1 hour ago, SansVarnic said:

Post it in the fitting section, benchmarking software would fit under software so that section.

If it needs moved it can be.

Here you go.

Any edits for clarify, feel free to make.


@BlueScope819 so I can see your post

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Mentioned in 8/5/2020 TechLinked

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35 minutes ago, BlueScope819 said:

Here you go.

Any edits for clarify, feel free to make.

I (or any of the mod team) wont be making any edits [edits will made by you], this is not my field of expertise but as I said we don't moderate accuracy.


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Character is like a Tree and Reputation like its Shadow. The Shadow is what we think of it; The Tree is the Real thing.  ~ Abraham Lincoln

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.  ~ Winston Churchill

Docendo discimus - "the best way to learn is to teach" ~ Benjamin Jantz

 

I am a StarCitizen are you? My ships: Aegis Eclipse, Aegis Sabre, Aegis Gladius, Aopoa Nox, KI P52 Merlin, KI P72 Archimedes and the RSI Constellation Aquila.

 

My Phones are a Nokia Lumia 925 with WM10 and a Microsoft Lumia 950 XL with WM10 running the Fast Ring insider updates. Broke :(

Samsung Note 9 and a Samsung S9+

 

About Myself:   https://linustechtips.com/main/profile/229093-sansvarnic/?tab=field_core_pfield_46

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
1 minute ago, SansVarnic said:

I (or any of the mod team) wont be making any edits [edits will made by you], this is not my field of expertise but as I said we don't moderate accuracy.

Okay, understood. If you want anything changed before you decide to sticky it or not let me know and I will make them.


@BlueScope819 so I can see your post

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Mentioned in 8/5/2020 TechLinked

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7 minutes ago, BlueScope819 said:

Okay, understood. If you want anything changed before you decide to sticky it or not let me know and I will make them.

Anyhow this is not how you submit it. Please report the topic and place your request in the report, otherwise we would be openly discussing things.

 

For the sake of things I will go ahead and lock this topic. Submit the report and we can go from there.

 

-= Locked =-


Tech News Posting Guidelines - READ BEFORE POSTING | Community Standards | Forum Staff

LTT Folding Users Tips, Tricks and FAQ | F@H Contribution | My Rig | Project Steamroller

 

Spoiler

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Character is like a Tree and Reputation like its Shadow. The Shadow is what we think of it; The Tree is the Real thing.  ~ Abraham Lincoln

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.  ~ Winston Churchill

Docendo discimus - "the best way to learn is to teach" ~ Benjamin Jantz

 

I am a StarCitizen are you? My ships: Aegis Eclipse, Aegis Sabre, Aegis Gladius, Aopoa Nox, KI P52 Merlin, KI P72 Archimedes and the RSI Constellation Aquila.

 

My Phones are a Nokia Lumia 925 with WM10 and a Microsoft Lumia 950 XL with WM10 running the Fast Ring insider updates. Broke :(

Samsung Note 9 and a Samsung S9+

 

About Myself:   https://linustechtips.com/main/profile/229093-sansvarnic/?tab=field_core_pfield_46

 

 CHRISTIAN MEMBER 

 

 

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