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Delicieuxz

UE 5 demo featuring limitless detail: Gaze upon Unreal Engine's true form!

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7 hours ago, KaitouX said:

How would a RDNA2 GPU with the same amount of CUs of the RX5700 and higher clocks be slower than the RX5700/RTX2060?

5 hours ago, cj09beira said:

rx 5700 is a bit faster than a 2060 stock, the ps5 has the same amount of compute units, but at around 22% higher core clocks, plus whatever rdna 2 brings, its not 2060 like, it should be considerably faster

Ahhh. You are right. When I was looking at the FLOPS rating I accidentally read the half precision rating for the RTX card, and I assume that the FLOPS rating for the RDNA2 card is at full precision, as it's fairly standard to report GPU performance at full precision. I still wouldn't hold my breath, however, as that could be a bad assumption, and I could not find a single search result that labeled that performance claim as being for full precision.

 

Looking at it again, it should be much closer to the 2070/2070 Super range. I still very highly doubt that it has any of the other capabilities of the desktop graphics cards though.


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I've been around for enough console generations to recognize a certain pattern in the console-versus-PC debate:

 

1. Console premieres with impressive tech demo

2. PC diehards insist their rigs already are (or will soon be) capable of more through sheer brute force

3. First year or two of new console shows that optimization matters more, with some games looking better than PC titles

4. PCs eventually gain the upper hand, but the gap in real-world quality isn't as cavernous as they expected

 

The simple reality is that designing for a narrow, finely-tuned set of hardware gives consoles a significant if temporary advantage over PCs, at least in the short term, and the long-term shortfall isn't usually night-and-day.  PCs have lots of raw power and are very flexible, but a significant amount of that power gets wasted due to the limits on possible optimization.  Think about it: how long will it take before PC game developers can assume many players have NVMe SSDs?  Years?  You might see games that take better advantage of SSDs in the near term, but the things you saw in that UE5 demo will be considerably harder to achieve in a shipping PC game than in a PS5 or XSX release.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
2 hours ago, Commodus said:

I've been around for enough console generations to recognize a certain pattern in the console-versus-PC debate:

 

1. Console premieres with impressive tech demo

2. PC diehards insist their rigs already are (or will soon be) capable of more through sheer brute force

3. First year or two of new console shows that optimization matters more, with some games looking better than PC titles

4. PCs eventually gain the upper hand, but the gap in real-world quality isn't as cavernous as they expected

I would agree with that, if not for the FPS and resolution differences, as well as things like ray-tracing and Nvidia GameWorks and other processing-intensive features that don't appear on comparative console generations.

 

While some console games might present visual scenes that rival some of the best PC games available towards the middle and end of a console generation, they do it at lower resolution and far lower FPS than what a PC is capable of. Stuff like God of War and Uncharted 4 run at 1080p and 30 FPS. GoW and Uncharted 4 also feature smaller environments to maximize the available resource to be able to make those small environments as dense with detail as possible.

 

If a PC game targeted those specs, the visuals would be vastly beyond anything seen on consoles. But PC games are doing environments with as much or more detail overall (though perhaps not always as condensed) while at 1440p or 4k, with superior AA techniques applied and at higher intensities, sometimes much larger texture resolution scaling (if a game has that option), and potentially a lot of other graphical features.

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2 minutes ago, Delicieuxz said:

I would agree with that, if not for the FPS and resolution differences, as well as things like ray-tracing and Nvidia GameWorks and other processing-intensive features that don't appear on comparative console generations.

 

While some console games might present visual scenes that rival some of the best PC games available towards the middle and end of a console generation, they do it at lower resolution and far lower FPS than what a PC is capable of. Stuff like God of War and Uncharted 4 run at 1080p and 30 FPS. GoW and Uncharted 4 also feature smaller environments to maximize the available resource to be able to make those small environments as dense with detail as possible.

 

If a PC game targeted those specs, the visuals would be vastly beyond anything seen on consoles.

Oh, I don't doubt that resolutions and frame rates can be higher. But you're not really missing out on the core experience, and early on (I figure roughly the first year or two) PC gamers sometimes have to look on with a bit of envy.  And until late in the console cycle, getting those higher resolutions and frame rates can be prohibitively expensive for some.  Yeah, the rumored 3080 Ti might well outrun the PS5's GPU in most respects, but it'll likely cost twice as much as the entire PS5.

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40 minutes ago, Commodus said:

Oh, I don't doubt that resolutions and frame rates can be higher. But you're not really missing out on the core experience, and early on (I figure roughly the first year or two) PC gamers sometimes have to look on with a bit of envy.  And until late in the console cycle, getting those higher resolutions and frame rates can be prohibitively expensive for some.  Yeah, the rumored 3080 Ti might well outrun the PS5's GPU in most respects, but it'll likely cost twice as much as the entire PS5.

TL;DR : Amazing graphics at 30fps doesnt mean next gen consoles will beat high end pcs.

 

PC doesn`t really need a 3080 ti to beat a ps5

you can already beat it with existing hardware, put the ssd thing aside cause it doesn`t mean alot (pc got 5 gb ssds, but in reality the are just for loading times since pc got more ram and v/ram, ps5 is using the ssd to compensate the 16gb of combined ram/vram), pc was always able to reach the quality of consoles and run better almost always, unless its a low end pc. If u wanna be on the level off consoles u can push everything to high/ultra settings and run on 30 fps, on a medium / low budget pc. my old rig which retired last summer at a age of almost 7 years had a 3rd gen i3 ,8gb ram and a 750ti(i had before it some nvidia gpu  which i bored from a frnd,forgot the model name) which was later upgraded to a 1050ti cause while cleaning the 750ti from dust, it slipped and got damaged. This rig handled most of the games at high 1080p high settings between 40~70 fps , which was already better than current gen consoles from 2013 till the end of summer 2019. Even then i could have kept running the same rig on high/medium settings and go down to 30 fps. But i upgraded to a i5 8600,16gb ram 1 tb nvme,1 tb hdd , room for more storage and a 2070 super which are now running all games at maxed out settings at 120+ fps @1080p, something which consoles could never do, even next gen. Next gen consoles will most probably run on high settings the same as pc, but hit 120+ fps too?? i doubt it.They may have a 120 fps mode that disables some graphic settings to reach it or run on a select number of games. Then again i hope i am wrong, cause each gen i get a xbox for the living room,otherwise i will start using steam link to play on the tv i guess.

 

For me frames are more important. They make a huge difference.One of the easiest ways to notice the difference is set up a racing game on a console and pc , like forza horizon 4 ,on xbone it ran at a 30 fps and driving on high speed was sluggish, meanwhile on pc it ran at 140+ fps on all maxed out settings, graphics looked much better than console and while driving on high speeds it was smooth AF which made the experience better.

 

It`s all marketing, every gen of consoles "OUTPERFORMS THE HIGHEST END PC!!!"

it would run decently, then 1 or 2 years later if u compare the games on all platforms u will see the consoles starting to lag behind pcs more (talking from my own experience)

 

 

  

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1 hour ago, Goliath_1911 said:

But i upgraded to a i5 8600,16gb ram 1 tb nvme,1 tb hdd , room for more storage and a 2070 super which are now running all games at maxed out settings at 120+ fps @1080p, something which consoles could never do, even next gen.

The consoles could do it, the PS5 GPU is likely at worst around the performance of the 5700XT while the XSX one is faster and this time there's no issues with underpowered CPU like it happened with the consoles before. So hardware wise the consoles could reach the performance of your 2070S, the issue is that often console players don't have the option to select high FPS over high resolution as often due to the popularity of 4K TVs the target is likely going to be something closer to 4K60(1440p60 or higher), but that might change with the increase in the popularity of TVs capable of 120Hz, giving more often the option to choose between high resolution or high frame rate.

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On 5/14/2020 at 5:41 AM, StDragon said:

Wow, that's a sick real-time graphics demo like I've never seen before. Looking back, that's better looking than many CGI movie animations in the past, and that took a render farm of weeks to months of computational power (ray traced, I know, raw cycles required, not the same comparison in method). So while this isn't pure ray traced, it's good enough!

 

Well that settles it. It couldn't be more clear. We need a PS5 PCIe card for the GPU. 🤣

 

 

Pixar actually didn't fully raytrace a movie until Monster's University: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/pixar-uses-real-raytracing-for-first-time-in-monsters-university.569821/

Up until then they used a variety of shortcuts to reduce render times.


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2 hours ago, FezBoy said:

Pixar actually didn't fully raytrace a movie until Monster's University: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/pixar-uses-real-raytracing-for-first-time-in-monsters-university.569821/

Up until then they used a variety of shortcuts to reduce render times.

🤯 I had no idea. I assumed it was all ray traced even going back to special 3D effects with reflectivity in the 80's were ray traced. It in fact is a very old method with the downside of requiring lots of general CPU cycles (software only). But, it's an extremely elegant method.

 

So I clicked on that link which lead to jrMan.

 

Quote

jrMan is an open source implementation of the REYES (Render Everything You Ever Saw) algorithm used by Pixar's PhotoRealistic Renderman to render images.

 

Although PhotoRealistic Renderman is used to generate most CGI (Computer Generated Images) in motion pictures, textbooks on computer graphics do not explain how its REYES algorithm works (actually many books do not even mention it!).

 

Learned something new. Thanks for sharing.

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Noice, probably optimized the shit out of the hardware but that's what you get with consoles. I still impressed how well Final Fantasy 7 Remake which use UE4 run on base PS4.


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