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Andk1987

AMD not supporting Zen3 on older motherboards :(

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Posted · Original PosterOP

 

Quote

so we just want to clear this up with extra information that we've been told when we asked some clarifying questions on this, as it stands right now AMD will NOT be supporting Zen3 processors on 400 and 300 series motherboards

 

Hardware unboxed asked the question specifically, and AMD seem to have replied that all future AGESA code for Zen3 will not support anything but 5xx series motherboards, this doesent seem to be like in the past when vendors have added support for A320 boards, but more like when AMD updated the AGESA to lock out pcie 4 on X470 boards, this is very dissapointing especially when compounded with their delayed B550 motherboards, i myself purchased a 3600 and B450 higher end board on launch because i didnt want to pay more for my motherboard than the processor :/ was planning a zen3/ampere upgrade early next year but yeah..... looks like AMD has bowed down to the motherboard manufacturers :/

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Oh I got kind of confused for a second, because you title and post both mention Zen2 not being supported on 300 and 400 series boards. It's Zen3 not being supported on these.

Zen 2 = Ryzen 3000 (mostly).

Zen 3 = Ryzen 4000

 

Kind of a shame and with the fact that B550 took so long to release, I had hoped at least B450 would have been compatible.. Kind of a shame.

This will certainly create an 'LGA 1151' situation; where a board and a CPU could both be AM4, but still not compatible (just like how 100 and 200 series LGA 1151 don't work with 8th and 9th gen CPU's).


"We're all in this together, might as well be friends" Tom, Toonami.

Sorry if my post seemed rude, that is never my intention.

"Why do we suffer a lifetime for a moment of happiness?" - Anonymous

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP

Yeah sorry, edited and added quote for clarification

1 minute ago, minibois said:

Oh I got kind of confused for a second, because you title and post both mention Zen2 not being supported on 300 and 400 series boards. It's Zen3 not being supported on these.

Zen 2 = Ryzen 3000 (mostly).

Zen 3 = Ryzen 4000

 

Kind of a shame and with the fact that B550 took so long to release, I had hoped at least B450 would have been compatible.. Kind of a shame.

This will certainly create an 'LGA 1151' situation; where a board and a CPU could both be AM4, but still not compatible (just like how 100 and 200 series LGA 1151 don't work with 8th and 9th gen CPU's).

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
1 minute ago, Raptor_Fawr said:

is this official or is it just speculation? they might change their minds in the future when the CPUS are released in the market

looks like hardware unboxed asked the specific question, i hold out hope the same as everyone else, but its pretty scummy, as i said i was hoping to upgrade to a 4000 series cpu on my B450 gaming pro carbon AC early next year with Ampere GPU to play VR really well

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As I am running a 3950X on an X370 board, I feel I got plenty of value out of it compared to my Z270 board. So overall, I am satisfied with how AMD has done it so far.

 

Given that the original promise was that "AM4 will be supported until 2020" I wouldn't be surprised if Zen3 was on a different platform all together. And even then they would have still kept to their original word

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4 minutes ago, Andk1987 said:

looks like hardware unboxed asked the specific question, i hold out hope the same as everyone else, but its pretty scummy, as i said i was hoping to upgrade to a 4000 series cpu on my B450 gaming pro carbon AC early next year with Ampere GPU to play VR really well

AMD only ever promised support of AM4 until 2020, it's 2020 and by the time Zen3 product come out it'll be end of or in to 2021. So they aren't over promising and it's good that AM4 is getting Zen3 as AMD are well within their right to have withheld Zen3 until 2021 and released it on a new socket.

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3 minutes ago, leadeater said:

AMD only ever promised support of AM4 until 2020, it's 2020 and by the time Zen3 product come out it'll be end of or in to 2021. So they aren't over promising and it's good that AM4 is getting Zen3 as AMD are well within their right to have withheld Zen3 until 2021 and released it on a new socket.

Also the little issue that in 2016, when AMD was planning this, DDR5 was supposed to be ready and Zen3 would have launched with it. DDR5 ended up a tad late and DDR4 got a lot longer life than expected.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
1 minute ago, leadeater said:

AMD only ever promised support of AM4 until 2020, it's 2020 and by the time Zen3 product come out till be end of or in to 2021. So they aren't over promising and it's good that AM4 is getting Zen3 asm AMD are well within their right to have withheld Zen3 until 2021 and released it on a new socket.

Yeah i get that, most of my gripe is with the fact they delayed thier B550 boards so long, people such as myself who purchased a B450 board out of neccesity (spending £200+ on a motherboard to be paired with a £190 CPU at launch) feel pretty miffed at the situation, id have bought a B550 board when i bought my 3600 on launch, had they been available this also means the 5xx boards are guaranteed to be a dead end also, because likely ZEN4 with DDR5 will be likely moving to AM5, so not great tbh :/

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Should be noted that, as long as the board can handle it, pretty much everything sold so far on AM4 can "handle" a 3950X. (Just don't OC it, or you'll melt something on most of the early boards.) That's enough CPU for anything you can reasonably throw at, especially once used prices come down. This is a little annoying, as AMD didn't get B550 out for almost a year after it should have been, so they've lost some CPU sales as a result.

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1 minute ago, Andk1987 said:

 

My perspective is that the fact that they are supporting Zen3 on 5XX boards is overdeliverying on their promise and so there is nothing to have a gripe about. By the end of 2020, AM4 was going to be an obsoleted platform.

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7 minutes ago, For Science! said:

As I am running a 3950X on an X370 board, I feel I got plenty of value out of it compared to my Z270 board. So overall, I am satisfied with how AMD has done it so far.

 

Given that the original promise was that "AM4 will be supported until 2020" I wouldn't be surprised if Zen3 was on a different platform all together. And even then they would have still kept to their original word

I feel confident I could push a stock 3950X on my ASRock board with no issues, due to the testing Ive done on the board (not recommending it, but I think it wouldn't be a problem either) - that's insane value for a socket imho

5 minutes ago, leadeater said:

AMD only ever promised support of AM4 until 2020, it's 2020 and by the time Zen3 product come out it'll be end of or in to 2021. So they aren't over promising and it's good that AM4 is getting Zen3 as AMD are well within their right to have withheld Zen3 until 2021 and released it on a new socket.

Yup

 


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Not a huge deal in my book.

Never understood why people insist on buying new CPUs and use them on Boards that were not designed to use all the fancy features to their full potential.

AM4 has been here forever. Just move on to AM5 or whatever.

 

The more time they need to spend supporting old stuff, the less time they spend on making the new stuff amazing. Id rather see AMD crush Intel some more and beat them a little more, while Intel is on the ground and helpless. When (not a matter of "if" in my book) Intel returns to the competitive market, AMD better have a solid market share and following.

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2 minutes ago, Andk1987 said:

Yeah i get that, most of my gripe is with the fact they delayed thier B550 boards so long, people such as myself who purchased a B450 board out of neccesity (spending £200+ on a motherboard to be paired with a £190 CPU at launch) feel pretty miffed at the situation, id have bought a B550 board when i bought my 3600 on launch, had they been available this also means the 5xx boards are guaranteed to be a dead end also, because likely ZEN4 with DDR5 will be likely moving to AM5, so not great tbh :/

500 and 600 series parts are at the end of a Socket, but AMD could also do a minor refresh in 2021 if Zen4 is going to be pushed back to late 2022.

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1 minute ago, Andk1987 said:

Yeah i get that, most of my gripe is with the fact they delayed thier B550 boards so long, people such as myself who purchased a B450 board out of neccesity (spending £200+ on a motherboard to be paired with a £190 CPU at launch) feel pretty miffed at the situation, id have bought a B550 board when i bought my 3600 on launch, had they been available this also means the 5xx boards are guaranteed to be a dead end also, because likely ZEN4 with DDR5 will be likely moving to AM5, so not great tbh :/

Aren't there some half decent X570 at that same price? Also a socket has to end at some point, it's up to you as the buyer to realize this. You've known how long AM4 has been around so it's not a big surprise that it's ending.

 

B550 delay isn't great, but there are X570 at the price you paid that are worth buying.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
1 minute ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Should be noted that, as long as the board can handle it, pretty much everything sold so far on AM4 can "handle" a 3950X. (Just don't OC it, or you'll melt something on most of the early boards.) That's enough CPU for anything you can reasonably throw at, especially once used prices come down. This is a little annoying, as AMD didn't get B550 out for almost a year after it should have been, so they've lost some CPU sales as a result.

yeah this is the thing, i built my wife an office pc and managed to pickup an MSI A320 max board which supported a 3rd gen for super cheap £41 and it works great, its one of the selling points of AMD platform that you dont need to spend £££££ on a motherboard unless youre planning maybe a ryzen 9 build and you get limited by VRM output

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Just now, leadeater said:

Aren't there some half decent X570 at that same price? Also a socket has to end at some point, it's up to you as the buyer to realize this. You've known how long AM4 has been around so it's not a big surprise that it's ending.

 

B550 delay isn't great, but there are X570 at the price you paid that are worth buying.

Depending on when he was buying, possibly not. X570 prices were pretty high for a while and the early boards below the 250USD/EUR range weren't any better than a good B450.

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1 minute ago, Tristerin said:

I feel confident I could push a stock 3950X on my ASRock board with no issues, due to the testing Ive done on the board (not recommending it, but I think it wouldn't be a problem either) - that's insane value for a socket imho

Yup

 

I'm doing all-core 4.2 GHz on my X370 Crosshair Hero VI, the temps and VRM temps are excellent. The only thing really iffy about it is memory OCing. Even just thinking about it seems to introduce instability for me, I'd like to revisit it, but I left my machine in my office and now I'm locked out for a while bit longer 😮

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13 minutes ago, Andk1987 said:

looks like hardware unboxed asked the specific question, i hold out hope the same as everyone else, but its pretty scummy, as i said i was hoping to upgrade to a 4000 series cpu on my B450 gaming pro carbon AC early next year with Ampere GPU to play VR really well

Not sure i'd say it's scummy, but it is disappointing because AMD promised there would be support until 2020, and since B550 got delayed it's a bit wrong of them to just abandon B450 and push the support onto the mobo OEM's.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
1 minute ago, leadeater said:

Aren't there some half decent X570 at that same price? Also a socket has to end at some point, it's up to you as the buyer to realize this. You've known how long AM4 has been around so it's not a big surprise that it's ending.

 

B550 delay isn't great, but there are X570 at the price you paid that are worth buying.

If im being really honest when i bought my 3600 on launch day i couldnt even find an X570 in stock nevermind one under £200, i didnt have an option on the matter, just stinks really when it was supposed to be one of the selling points of going to AMD that you could upgrade fairly easily.

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Just now, Taf the Ghost said:

Depending on when he was buying, possibly not. X570 prices were pretty high for a while and the early boards below the 250USD/EUR range weren't any better than a good B450.

Doesn't have to be better but if it's not bad for applicable reasons why buy a B450 over an X570? Doesn't make sense. There are bad cheap X570 but not all of them are. Really it comes down to how much less did you pay for the B450 not that both chipsets had equivalent products and prices available. 

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Sounds like “massive public outcry” is needed. A LOT of people bought b450 because it was understood it would support zen3 that’s what the whole “support for am4” was about.

It’s effectively cheating the public because they were led to believe that am4 was am4.  With this am4 is still am4 and it a “we could, but we just won’t” situation.
 This is no time to pull an intel and end-of-life a whole bunch of motherboards.  Intel at least has the decency to change a socket when they do that.  This is actually WORSE than what intel does with its constant socket changes because it’s going to cause a bunch of problems for users.


Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
Just now, leadeater said:

Doesn't have to be better but if it's not bad for applicable reasons why buy a B450 over an X570? Doesn't make sense. There are bad cheap X570 but not all of them are. Really it comes down to how much less did you pay for the B450 not that both chipsets had equivalent products and prices available. 

I bought a B450 Gaming pro Carbon ac @ £120, pretty decent motherboard with excellent VRM reviews so assumed id get at least 1 upgrade cycle out of it and with all the hype around Zen3 assumed itd get to the point where AMD hands down had intel at the top end, paired with a next gen GPU and an Index headset i thought i had a decent plan but :(

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1 minute ago, Bombastinator said:

Sounds like “massive public outcry” is needed. A LOT of people bought b450 because it was understood it would support zen3 that’s what the whole “support for am4” was about.

Well first Zen3 products actually have to release for sale in 2020 before crying can even start. Then there is the whole until issue, it's 2020. Does until have to mean till the end of? The start of? The middle of?

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Posted · Original PosterOP
2 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

Sounds like “massive public outcry” is needed. A LOT of people bought b450 because it was understood it would support zen3 that’s what the whole “support for am4” was about.

It’s effectively cheating the public because they were led to believe that am4 was am4.  With this am4 is still am4 and it a “we could, but we just won’t” situation.
 This is no time to pull an intel and end-of-life a whole bunch of motherboards.  Intel at least has the decency to change a socket when they do that.  This is actually WORSE than what intel does with its constant socket changes because it’s going to cause a bunch of problems for users.

absolutely agreed, i get not supporting them where technically not possible but it should be at least left to the board manufacturers rather than cutting support

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