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What's the appeal of non-competitive games?

7412
2 hours ago, lewdicrous said:

I can tolerate co-op (PvE), especially with the right people like you said, but every time I tried competitive gaming, it always resulted in more stress than fun, doesn't matter what game it was, so I try to stay away from it.

I can play with complete strangers in PvP and relax a bit, but as soon as I play with my son I feel like I'm suppose to be watching his back the entire time...which makes it kinda feel like work.  Playing an RPG with a great f'ing story like RDR2 is just like being in the game...and forgetting about work, bills, responsibility, stress, dinner, sleep, toilet, bathing...

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54 minutes ago, 7412 said:

That's a genuine question I ask myself to be frank. I don't travel, I don't see the point, precisely for the reason you mentioned - even though I'm well aware you did it ironically.

Well, with that logic you may as well never leave your house unless it's for work or grocery shopping.

 

Who needs friends when you can watch videos of people hanging out with their friends? Who needs to get out in nature when you can just look at a picture? Who needs a romantic partner when you can just watch romance movies?

 

Would be a sad way to walk through life. Technology doesn't replace human interaction or real experiences.

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6 hours ago, 7412 said:

I'm interested in understanding other people's take on it though.

Why do people paint? Why do people draw? Why do people build things? Why do people watch TV? Why do people have hobbies? Why do people like to spend time with other people? If you can answer any one of these questions, then you may be one piece closer to solving the puzzle you seek. 

 

There is a lot to life, questions are sometimes answered by other people and sometimes answered by life experiences.  

 

 

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I don't really enjoy playing with other people.  I prefer to get into the story or world and lose myself for a while.  In games with PvP, I usually turn it off as I see it as an interruption.

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16 hours ago, 7412 said:

What's fun in a videogame for me is to be challenged, to see my skill increase, to become better and unlock the ability to outplay a larger number of opponents through skill alone. 

I think it's just what you think you enjoy. Especially since you never played those (or ones that are good at it), so how can you really know?

 

16 hours ago, 7412 said:

I don't see the point of paying $50 or more for a solo campaign that has no replay value. Yeah, you experience the content, you know the story. And then what? What's the point?

@PopsicleHustler already answered a part of it almost exactly as I would.

@Crunchy Dragon took care of the other bit.

Many others gave a lot of good answers as well.

I will add: imagine something made you furious during the day. Then you come back home and launch some highly competitive PvP title. Let's make it worse, Team PvP, like some moba, CS:GO etc. Tell me, what will happen?

On the contrary, what would happen if you launched ABZU, for example?

And now that I look at it, you only mentioned single player/1v1 PvP games/modes. Let that sink in. Reflect on it. What does that tell about yourself? When you come to some conclusion, check out the first question I asked and answer it again.

 

Oh, and to shake your world a bit as well: going by your logic, there's no point in getting good at the game to beat others as well. Maybe apart from massaging your own ego...

It's not really replay value that you go for in those games, hope you see that now.

15 hours ago, Vitamanic said:

Entertainment doesn't need to be competitive.

That. Take a look at this sentence once again and think what it really means. There's nothing more to it than that.

I bet you get it, especially since you have an anime-like avatar, so I guess you do watch shows. What's the point, you would ask, right?

  

12 hours ago, 7412 said:

That's a genuine question I ask myself to be frank. I don't travel, I don't see the point, precisely for the reason you mentioned - even though I'm well aware you did it ironically.

Notice how you decided to answer the one that's easiest for you to address and left others unmentioned?

People decide to see what they want to see. It's easier to stay true to your beliefs rather than really question and reevaluate them.

Try. Notice how there's a lot that holds true in the answers to questions @PopsicleHustler asked.

 

11 hours ago, Vitamanic said:

Would be a sad way to walk through life. Technology doesn't replace human interaction or real experiences.

A whole lot subjective, Vitamanic, wouldn't you say? I'd even go as far as to say narrow-minded.

People are different. Had different upbringing, environment, life experiences, priorities, desires and we could keep on listing...

To simply put it: some people need more interaction with humans, others not so much. And either is fine.

Also: notice how he said he prefers PvP games over single player ones. Isn't it a bit of the opposite (while thinking about someone's character) to prefering to be alone? To prefering a lack of interaction with people?

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23 hours ago, 7412 said:

What's fun in a videogame for me is to be challenged, to see my skill increase, to become better and unlock the ability to outplay a larger number of opponents through skill alone. 

I don't see the point of paying $50 or more for a solo campaign that has no replay value. Yeah, you experience the content, you know the story. And then what? What's the point?

 

I agree with the challenge part, I usually like to be challenged, but sometimes I just want a good story or a different experience. Life is Strange is a good example - its not challenging at all, but it tells a beautiful story and you get involved with the characters and the decisions. Other example is Hellblade: Senuas Sacrifice. The game is not hard, but its an interesting concept and it makes a nice experience.

Alternatively, a lot of games can be challenging, have a ton of replayability AND still be single player. Dark Souls 3 is one of them: you get good, try new builds, do challenges...

Also, I hate how competitive games are toxic in general, and I hate the feeling of "Oh I need to always get better". There will ALWAYS be people better than you, and you can give up everything just trying to get better, and in the end you are just wasting your life. I know, it feels a bit dramatic, but I played Dota 2 for years and it was really a problem, and you know how I solved it? I started playing exclusively single player games.

I found out that I was missing the best part of gaming: the amazing stories, the variety, the exploring, the puzzles, the FUN. Before I played to "win" or "to be good" or some shit like that, now I play because its good, because it brings new and positive stuff for my life.

Divinity Original Sin 2 is one of my favorite games, because it has an amazing story, it is very challenging (but you also can learn to dominate the game), it allows you to get creative, it makes you think about real problems and it also has AMAZING FUN COMBAT.

In the end, I still love Dota 2 as a game, I watch all the competitive scene, but playing it? havent for 4 years, and never will again.

 

 


... Also, about the price: the point is that we are human. paying 50$ for food, for shoes, for a book, for a rollercoaster ride, for drugs, for sex or for anything else is worth it for some and not worth it for others.

Ultra is stupid. ALWAYS.

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Well, The idea of a pvp is kinda nice, but the "tiers" are always unbalanced one way or another, and single player shooters don't transfer well to multi, especually with a sniper, and or casual style of gameplay. The tiers may be top players get sent back to firat after a week, and the newbie to that game has no time to "get good".

and about the 50$ thing. pvp being p2e (pay to enter) as much as story, kinda better to have story long and pcp as an extra if same price.

also other types of single player or relax games like searching are usually maybe less depending on the game. its really prefrence at this point.

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As I got older, I just wanted to relax and chill and enjoy a story more than be competitive. Rather not play with others. 

 

Only online game I am really enjoying right now is destiny 2, but because I play with my son and a couple of friends. 

 

People in general are ass hats. 

I refuse to read threads whose author does not know how to remove the caps lock! 

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On 1/30/2020 at 11:57 AM, 7412 said:

I don't recall ever playing a game that doesn't feature PvP.

My first game was Age of Empires II back when I was 7. Then WoW, I got into arena, I played some StarCraft II, Hearthstone, Mordhau.

 

What's fun in a videogame for me is to be challenged, to see my skill increase, to become better and unlock the ability to outplay a larger number of opponents through skill alone. 

What's the appeal of competitive games?

 

Your skill increased, you're slightly better than the opponent or perhaps slightly more lucky, so what? Congratulations? It's one skill among countless others, you're only slightly good in one, big deal. It's like if you're going to a super school and there are 2 billion subjects, would you spend 2000 hours to prove to others that your score is higher than average in just one of these subjects?

 

I can maybe understand if you have a shot at being the best, if you can say like oh I'm the best in the world at this specific skill, that might be worthwhile. But no, you're only trying to get a little better than average.

Quote

I don't see the point of paying $50 or more for a solo campaign that has no replay value. Yeah, you experience the content, you know the story. And then what? What's the point?

The experience is the point. What's the point of being alive? What are you going to ultimately achieve in the end? You die, that's what you get in the end. It has always been about the experience.

 

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On 1/30/2020 at 11:57 AM, 7412 said:

..,

I don't see the point of paying $50 ....

....

What's the point?...,

I guess looking at it from the opposite angle, is why would you pay $50 to just to play against another human? All the value of the game for you then is placed in it by your opponent.

 

While the strategy may change all the matches are similarly constructed with the same end goal that you repeat ad nauseam. What’s the point?

 

BTW, I do see the value and respect the way you find enjoyment in games.

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13 hours ago, Chen G said:

It's like if you're going to a super school and there are 2 billion subjects, would you spend 2000 hours to prove to others that your score is higher than average in just one of these subjects?

That's kind of what you do though, is it not?

You tend to specialize in one domain of expertise. If you choose to study language, you'll most likely dump mathematics and economics for example.

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On 2/6/2020 at 4:06 AM, 7412 said:

That's kind of what you do though, is it not?

You tend to specialize in one domain of expertise. If you choose to study language, you'll most likely dump mathematics and economics for example.

Except you're not really specializing on it, you're not becoming an esports athlete.

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It is the only way to experience the gaming medium as a form of art: seeing how the visuals convey (and interact with) the world, seeing and experiencing the story as it unwinds and affects the player and the universe, developing feelings for virtual characters on the account of their narrative and their role in the gameplay, and indirectly interacting with the developers as you interact with their idea behind the product (think leading the player into certain situations, be it scripted or unscripted).

 

On 1/30/2020 at 5:57 PM, 7412 said:

What's fun in a videogame for me is to be challenged, to see my skill increase, to become better and unlock the ability to outplay a larger number of opponents through skill alone. 

I don't see why you would say that. There are tons of non-competitive single-player games that challenge the player and have their skills increase. Have you played Doom 2016 on Nightmare? Or any of the Halo games on Legendary? Even Call of Duty campaigns "strain" your skills if you crank up the difficulty to Veteran. In fact, most single-player games rely on the player having the right kind of skill in order to progress. That is actually how it started; the "non-challenge" part is a relatively recent thing. This is why you see older games like Blood being very challenging even on normal, whereas newer games reserve the challenge for either the toughest difficulty setting or New Game+.

 

On 1/30/2020 at 5:57 PM, 7412 said:

I don't see the point of paying $50 or more for a solo campaign that has no replay value. Yeah, you experience the content, you know the story. And then what? What's the point?

Not really. Plenty of these games are replayable. RPGs especially so. Moddable games can stay relevant for years (Skyrim is a decade old and people still play it). Replayability is not about skill alone. It could be about alternate choices in narrative or mechanics, re-experiencing bits of the game, or just having fun with modding tools. Competitive titles are kind of worse in this regard if you think about it - playing the same few maps over and over (this is why I quit CSGO).

 

On 1/30/2020 at 5:57 PM, 7412 said:

Games like this, I just read a summary of the plot & I watch cutscenes. I wouldn't waste money on that.

It is one thing to watch something, and it is entirely different to experience it. This is why you don't read the summary of a book instead of reading the book itself, and why you don't read the spoilers of a movie instead of seeing it. Moreover, it is also why you can enjoy a book or a movie even if you do know how it ends.

Looking at a cut-scene of US Marines landing on the beaches of Normandy may sound bland, but it is going to feel much different if it is you, the player, doing it, moving from cover to cover and dying over and over in the process. Or having to scrounge for resources in a horror-survival game because otherwise you are not going to survive. This can be made even more engaging if the narrative embellishes the significance of what you do.

I used very general examples here because I don't want to accidentally spoil something for a person who might be reading this, but do know that there are some very specific examples of events in video games that can only make an impact on the player if they get to experience them while playing as opposed to passively watching.

 

It's interesting to see this post, as I have a similar sentiment as yours, but it is reversed, as it is about competitive games, which I've heard others share as well. To me, competitive video games are a waste of time: something in which you can invest and practice as you would any other skill or art (playing an instrument, working out, learning software), except that, unlike those things, it is not a real skill. I've tried to get into competitive gaming, but if I am to practice something daily, I would rather practice my guitar.

So I quit CSGO and only play multiplayer games that have a similar quality as singleplayer. Namely, the experience - like Rising Storm 2, which scratches my itch for feeling the hectic Vietnam death-simulator.

With that said, I understand how much better it feels to defeat an actual opponent (a human player) as opposed to AI, so even though it's not my cup of tea, I can see the appeal of competitive gaming in regards to the pleasure of outplaying an opponent.

 

I hope this clarifies why a lot of us like single-player games and stay away from competitive.

It comes down to personal preference and the kind of time one wishes to invest in the medium, and I will emphasize the fact that, if video games are to be regarded as art, they can only achieve this status through a superb single-player experience as opposed to competitive gameplay (which categorizes them as e-sports).

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On 1/30/2020 at 8:57 AM, 7412 said:

I don't recall ever playing a game that doesn't feature PvP.

My first game was Age of Empires II back when I was 7. Then WoW, I got into arena, I played some StarCraft II, Hearthstone, Mordhau.

 

What's fun in a videogame for me is to be challenged, to see my skill increase, to become better and unlock the ability to outplay a larger number of opponents through skill alone. 

I don't see the point of paying $50 or more for a solo campaign that has no replay value. Yeah, you experience the content, you know the story. And then what? What's the point?

Games like this, I just read a summary of the plot & I watch cutscenes. I wouldn't waste money on that.

 

I'm interested in understanding other people's take on it though.

Some people just want to relax with an easy game sometimes. Competitive games can cause stress, requires that you spend time training and requires you use your head.

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