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intertan

when are we going to get to the days isp install/activate a jack in your house and that is it.

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Posted · Original PosterOP

reading through local isp twitter accounts, full of nothing but people complaining about wifi coverage and speed. This has got me thinking about way back when we first got high speed after moving away from dial up. We had the modem with just 1 ethernet jack. was fine but we got a 2nd computer then the router came into play.

Now with people not even realizing how wifi works or how to solve it and the mentality that I pay for this service will we see isp be like fine. Here is your jack and have a nice day?

 

Myself would love this as this is in short what I do now.

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7 minutes ago, intertan said:

Myself would love this as this is in short what I do now.

You're just patting yourself on the back for being oh-so-cool. Not everyone has the time or capacity to learn everything and you knowing how to configure your network doesn't make you special. Posts like this just make you an elitist, nothing more.


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Posted · Original PosterOP
3 minutes ago, WereCatf said:

You're just patting yourself on the back for being oh-so-cool. Not everyone has the time or capacity to learn everything and you knowing how to configure your network doesn't make you special. Posts like this just make you an elitist, nothing more.

we are starting to see it, 2 of the 3 isp offer a premium wifi for additional cost. its not that difficult, go to the store buy a router plug router in. isp do offer self serve installs these days and it is basically the same.

I should also add to your comment

I know nothing about wifi/networking but I pay X dollars and I should have X speed and coverage regardless if I am 2 ft away from the modem or 50 ft on my 2nd level.

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3 minutes ago, intertan said:

we are starting to see it, 2 of the 3 isp offer a premium wifi for additional cost. its not that difficult, go to the store buy a router plug router in. isp do offer self serve installs these days and it is basically the same.

It is, actually, like e.g. there are plenty of routers that advertise enormous WiFi-speeds, but then they have only 10/100 ethernet-connectors, meaning that no matter how fast WiFi they have, Internet-speed will be capped to max 100Mbps. That's not something Average Jane or Joe will know or should know, let alone some grandma or grandpa.


Hand, n. A singular instrument worn at the end of the human arm and commonly thrust into somebody’s pocket.

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I'm confused by what you're talking about. Are you saying that you're basically getting paid to install a Router? Pretty standard with modern networking if this is the "jack" you're referring to ISPs have been handing them out for a very long time now.


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I wish ISP's would learn how to properly install and bury cables. When Cox's idiot contractor installed my cable, he was just going to scratch the surface of my gravel yard to "bury" the cable. I told him, "Nope, dig down at least four to six inches to BURY it". Then he wanted to run the cable up the outside of my mobile home's skirting and siding. Again, "Nope, you are going to run it inside the skirting and the wall." He tried to get out of the extra work by saying he didn't have a fish tape. I did plus the other tools needed so guess where the cable wound up being run?

 

There is another cable that runs across the back of my lot and, whenever the idiots have had to rerun the cable, I have had to do battle with Cox to get them back out to properly bury the damned thing!


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12 hours ago, intertan said:

I know nothing about wifi/networking but I pay X dollars and I should have X speed and coverage regardless if I am 2 ft away from the modem or 50 ft on my 2nd level.

Therein lies your problem, you don't understand that this is frankly impossible for an ISP to provide, you are demanding your ISP defies the laws of physics.

 

WiFi is SHARED with everyone else in range who are also using it.  If every frequency is used up, there is NOTHING you can do to fix it, except running an ethernet cable.  As we move into Gigabit speeds, even with WiFi 6, its just not realistic to expect to get those kinds of speed over the airwaves while your neighbours are trying to do the same, even in the same room as the router, let alone in EVERY room.

 

If you live somewhere with no other WiFi at all, you might just be able to pull it off, but not easily or cheaply.  No ISP wants to give you a £350 router, and your average joe is not going to be willing to pay for one out of their own pocket.  Plus even then to achieve whole house coverage of those speeds, not gonna happen, there will always be a compromise over WiFi.


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17 hours ago, intertan said:

Here is your jack and have a nice day?

Firstly many types of internet require a modem. Modems can vary from ISP to ISP and from standard to standard. For example. DSL, its not just one type of service. You have ADSL, VDSL, VDSL2 for example. On the Cable side Docsis 3.0 and 3.1 use channel bonding. Docsis modems have x amount of down stream channels and x amount of upstream channels. With Docsis 3.0 modems coming in 4x4,8x4,16x4,24x8 and 32x8 and Docsis 3.1 modems only being 32x8. So there is a lot of equipment to choose from. Not all ISP's support all the modems and most ISP's dont give you a standard modem, at least in the US and many other parts of the world. You get a gateway (Modem/Router). 

 

Now Fiber on the other hand is a whole diffrent ball game. There are diffrent types of fiber/transevers that can be used. Some providers provide just a media converter while others do a gateway, to be clear Fiber doesnt use a modem per say, but has a converter to change it to copper at the house. So its not that simple to just install a jack and go. 

 

That being said, here in the US, we tend to be able to buy our own equipment. Such as the SB6141 cable modem siting on my desk and the Synology RT2600AC router also sitting on my desk. Not all ISP's are friendly with customer owned equipment, such as charter. So milage will vary. When you use customer owned equipment your ISP CAN NOT help you with technical assiance most of the time, because they are only trained on equpiiment provided by the ISP. 

 

Secondly ISP's at least in the US, are not responsible for wiring in your home. They will likey just install what is nessary to get your internet running, they are not resposible for putting the gateway in the best location, they are not resposible for running wire in your home. They are not resposible for the lack of wireless spectrum in WiFi either. 

 

17 hours ago, intertan said:

3 isp offer a premium wifi for additional cos

They do this because of captialism. They can charge a bull shit rental fee for better equipment and extenders as needed. They have to make a profit some way. 

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52 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

Firstly many types of internet require a modem. Modems can vary from ISP to ISP and from standard to standard. For example. DSL, its not just one type of service. You have ADSL, VDSL, VDSL2 for example. On the Cable side Docsis 3.0 and 3.1 use channel bonding. Docsis modems have x amount of down stream channels and x amount of upstream channels. With Docsis 3.0 modems coming in 4x4,8x4,16x4,24x8 and 32x8 and Docsis 3.1 modems only being 32x8. So there is a lot of equipment to choose from. Not all ISP's support all the modems and most ISP's dont give you a standard modem, at least in the US and many other parts of the world. You get a gateway (Modem/Router). 

Just a minor point of OCD for me - modems are analog devices that MOdulate and DEModulate digital data into an analog signal and back out of it, and please correct me if I'm mistaken here but as far as I understand how cable internet signals work they are digital throughout the entire process. Haven't had DSL since 2003 but I'm unclear on if those are modulated-demodulated signals either.

I bring that up for 2 reasons, first to clarify that the main reason folks started calling cable "interface devices" (what are they actually since they are not by definition modems?), and secondly how to we fix this marketing-based misnomer?

/rant

-----
To the OP though - in some ways any house wired with fiber is almost that easy. I moved into a new-to-me house 6 years ago that already had a fiber run and fiber interface box installed, so all I had to do for service was call up the service provider and have them reprovision the interface box for me.


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1 minute ago, Kalm_Traveler said:

digital throughout the entire process.

Cable internet uses RF. So that has to be converted and the boxes that do that is called DING DING DING a cable modem. The fact still remains, you have to have a cable or DSL modem to convert from the ISP connection to Ethernet and WiFi if you use a gateway. 

 

3 minutes ago, Kalm_Traveler said:

marketing-based misnomer?

You cant. Most people are tooo stupid to know the difrence between a modem, a router and a gateway anway. 

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56 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

Cable internet uses RF. So that has to be converted and the boxes that do that is called DING DING DING a cable modem. The fact still remains, you have to have a cable or DSL modem to convert from the ISP connection to Ethernet and WiFi if you use a gateway. 

I think you missed what I was asking... a 'modem' is by definition a device which modulates and demodulates. The thing you connect to your cable company to get internet access does not modulate or demodulate anything. 

I'm not sure what your objective with the snarky reply was, but it literally didn't address the question and just came across as pointless internet rudeness.

 

Anyway, hope whatever brought you to choose that in life improves, friend. :) 


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3 hours ago, Kalm_Traveler said:

I think you missed what I was asking... a 'modem' is by definition a device which modulates and demodulates. The thing you connect to your cable company to get internet access does not modulate or demodulate anything. 

 

Quote

A modem – a portmanteau of "modulator-demodulator" – is a hardware device that converts data into a format suitable for a transmission medium so that it can be transmitted from one computer to another (historically along telephone wires). A modem modulates one or more carrier wave signals to encode digital information for transmission and demodulates signals to decode the transmitted information. The goal is to produce a signal that can be transmitted easily and decoded reliably to reproduce the original digital data. Modems can be used with almost any means of transmitting analog signals from light-emitting diodes to radio.

 

Quote

A cable modem is a type of network bridge that provides bi-directional data communication via radio frequency channels on a hybrid fibre-coaxial (HFC), radio frequency over glass (RFoG) and coaxial cable infrastructure. Cable modems are primarily used to deliver broadband Internet access in the form of cable Internet, taking advantage of the high bandwidth of a HFC and RFoG network. They are commonly deployed in the Americas, Asia, Australia, and Europe.

Cable modems are modems because they are RF based technology even if modern deployments today are digital transmissions mediums it's still converted back to RF at the customer modem endpoint then converted again to ethernet. It's these RF signals that are being modulated and demodulated.

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6 hours ago, leadeater said:

 

 

Cable modems are modems because they are RF based technology even if modern deployments today are digital transmissions mediums it's still converted back to RF at the customer modem endpoint then converted again to ethernet. It's these RF signals that are being modulated and demodulated.

Makes more sense, thank you. I guess the part that I was focused on is that last sentence of the description "Modems can be used with almost any means of transmitting analog signals from light-emitting diodes to radio."

 

Since the cable signal is still digital (as is broadcast TV) that meant to me that it isn't being modulated-demodulated but I'm far from an expert in radio technology.


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On 1/25/2020 at 3:03 AM, intertan said:

I know nothing about wifi/networking but I pay X dollars and I should have X speed and coverage regardless if I am 2 ft away from the modem or 50 ft on my 2nd level.

The last part of that statement truly emphasizes the first.

 

That's like saying I really love 98.9 FM, but as a loyal fan I should have coverage in Nicaragua regardless of any properties of physics or real life variables.


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