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Phill104

The end of lightning is nigh, possibly.

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35 minutes ago, pas008 said:

same thing today

 

 

Not really. I took same care of those back then and they got crippled. Never had microUSB cable do this. And I still have cables from first phones from many years ago still in use today.

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22 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Not really. I took same care of those back then and they got crippled. Never had microUSB cable do this. And I still have cables from first phones from many years ago still in use today.

same here cables become shit after awhile

even ports going bad on phones or tablets also

not sure what you smoking

 

but I still have my old school nokia 3310 chargers lol

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
42 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

You mean like what has happen to electric cars? I have seen 3 separate charging cables at least. Though there adapters that converts between standards. 

It is frustrating, very frustrating. However, there is an evolution involved. Do we simply adopt the first popular connector that arrives then realise when everyone has jumped aboard it is a pile of vista? Or do we let evolution take hold, a format war of sorts and hopefully end up with something decent? In the early days of any new concept we go through this no matter what the product from cassette to car etc.

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28 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Not really. I took same care of those back then and they got crippled. Never had microUSB cable do this. And I still have cables from first phones from many years ago still in use today.

You’re highly unusual.  I’ve had microUSB2 cables go bad on me in as little as a month.

The issue it seems is there is a loophole in the spec that allows for cheap cable manufacture, and the design itself isn’t good with being yanked on and wiggled about.  So particularly bad for phones and other things that are frequently plugged in and treated roughly.

 The phone makers hated the system so much they pressured the ISO to bring usbC out early.


Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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7 minutes ago, pas008 said:

same here cables become shit after awhile

even ports going bad on phones or tablets also

not sure what you smoking

 

but I still have my old school nokia 3310 chargers lol

 

I'm not smoking anything, just wondering if people shove phones up pigs butts and charge them while they are there and pigs are flying. Only way to fuck up things in ways people say they fuck up...

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1 minute ago, Phill104 said:

It is frustrating, very frustrating. However, there is an evolution involved. Do we simply adopt the first popular connector that arrives then realise when everyone has jumped aboard it is a pile of vista? Or do we let evolution take hold, a format war of sorts and hopefully end up with something decent? In the early days of any new concept we go through this no matter what the product from cassette to car etc.

The theory I am guessing is that they are calling the format war already won.  I’m not sure it’s a great idea quite yet myself.  As I’ve stated earlier though I don’t think it is why it is actually being done.  The justification is stated but I suspect the actual reason is still hidden.  


Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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Just now, RejZoR said:

I'm not smoking anything, just wondering if people shove phones up pigs butts and charge them while they are there and pigs are flying. Only way to fuck up things in ways people say they fuck up...

I take your point but it seems much easier to do than that, particularly if the cables are loophole cables.


Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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6 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

I'm not smoking anything, just wondering if people shove phones up pigs butts and charge them while they are there and pigs are flying. Only way to fuck up things in ways people say they fuck up...

yeah

you are right everyone treats their devices like shit and thats how cables and ports go bad

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Just now, pas008 said:

yeah

you are right everyone treats their devices like shit and thats how cables and ports go bad

Only some of them.  Enough for it to be a problem.


Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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6 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

Only some of them.  Enough for it to be a problem.

no matter the connector and cable there will always be issues

everyone of them has fixes from search results to videos

 

problem is needing over 9000 different types of connectors and cables

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People are stupid enough to have problems with regular power connectors. Literally two metal rods sticking out of a connector, several millimeters of thick metal and people find a way to fuck it up.

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2 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

People are stupid enough to have problems with regular power connectors. Literally two metal rods sticking out of a connector, several millimeters of thick metal and people find a way to fuck it up.

There’s a famous World War Two era story about that one. Had to do with triangular pegs and square holes or something.  It’s a major reason usbC is symmetrical.  Solves that issue. Steve Jobs actually thought two buttons was too complicated.  Humans are humans though. Got to work with what is available.


Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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3 hours ago, poochyena said:

explain to me how the early 2000s situation with charging cables is better for anyone.

 

2 hours ago, comander said:

A bit off topic but Mini USB wasn't THAT bad. In some ways I prefer mini USB to micro-USB. 

Micro-USB is REALLY finicky. 
 

The difference between lightning and USB-C isn't very big. 
If we had a blank slate where no one has any adapters or other devices and individuals had to choose several options:
1. mish-mash of adapters
2. USB-C
3. lightning (with USB-3 support and some other extras it doesn't have)

 

I STRONGLY suspect that option 1 would be universally detested and that there'd be A LOT of indifference between option 2 and 3. 

Forcing one instransigant company to make a relatively minor change is relatively light touch. 

 

You're confusing personal experience and opinion on connectors with the core argument that innovation comes from freedom to implement and test new technology.

 

It doesn't matter if USB C and lightning are similar or how well micro USB can last if 30 other types of even better connectors have not even been trialed in house because companies aren't allowed to use them on their products.

 

It's a double edged sword and one opinion doesn't trump the other.   Sure having every phone use the same connector is better for the consumer in many ways, but it is also not good for the consumer in that we have no choices and companies aren't given any incentive to develop something better.  


QuicK and DirtY. Read the CoC it's like a guide on how not to be moron.  Also I don't have an issue with the VS series.

Sometimes I miss contractions like n't on the end of words like wouldn't, couldn't and shouldn't.    Please don't be a dick,  make allowances when reading my posts.

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29 minutes ago, mr moose said:

but it is also not good for the consumer in that we have no choices

why do you keep asserting that less choice = bad? This isn't opinion, its objectively worse for consumers when there is no charging standard. It costs the consumer more in time and money. "choice", alone, is not an advantage.

 

31 minutes ago, mr moose said:

companies aren't given any incentive to develop something better.  

??????????
Creating a better product = more sales, no? How could it even be any better?

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37 minutes ago, mr moose said:

You're confusing personal experience and opinion on connectors with the core argument that innovation comes from freedom to implement and test new technology.

 

Lightning isn't exactly new technology. Its alternative isn't either and it's tried and tested. 
 

37 minutes ago, mr moose said:

It doesn't matter if USB C and lightning are similar or how well micro USB can last if 30 other types of even better connectors have not even been trialed in house because companies aren't allowed to use them on their products.

If Apple wants to release two variants of their product, one with lightning and one with USB-C, I wouldn't get in their way. 
As it stands they aren't giving consumers a choice which is arguably best for them. This wouldn't be feasible if Apple didn't have a dominant market position that they could abuse. 

 

37 minutes ago, mr moose said:

It's a double edged sword and one opinion doesn't trump the other.   Sure having every phone use the same connector is better for the consumer in many ways, but it is also not good for the consumer in that we have no choices and companies aren't given any incentive to develop something better.  

As stated, Apple could conceivably have two different variants. 
Also there are incentives to adopt new standards and standards are usually developed through a consortium. 
As it stands thunderbolt is an old, openish standard in a different form factor. 
Using a standardized form factor stop companies from extending a data or power transmission standard. USB-C supports many different features but many are optional. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_Implementers_Forum

Quote

The founding companies of USB-IF were Compaq, Digital, IBM, Intel, Microsoft, NEC and Nortel. Notable current members include Hewlett-Packard, NEC, Microsoft, Apple Inc., Intel, and Agere Systems.

 


R9 3900x; 64GB RAM | RTX 2080 | 1.5TB Optane P4800x

1TB ADATA XPG Pro 8200 SSD | 2TB Micron 1100 SSD
HD800 + SCHIIT VALI | Topre Realforce Keyboard

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if they phased it out i would stockpile on lightning to usb c to lightning adapters and EL-8 cipher cables because they sound awesome and their prices will plummet.


.Waiting for intel 7nm, navi 23, zen 11...

.

.

Updated: Too long ago

Alienware 17r5

3700x/1080

500D SE/3600/1060 STRIX VERTICAL/AG352UCG6 120hz 1440p gsync ultrawide / TOO MUCH RGB

A few negligible workstation builds

Gaming Routers are Stupid

I have a RGB Problem

/pcmasterrace /widescreenmasterrace

 

Audiophile, EL8 Titanium go to drivers for weight to performance ratio.

Music Setup Cubase 10 PRO, Adam A8X, Adam Sub8.

 

I dont ask stupid questions, I just word them stupid so you think its stupid.

im not stupid your stupid calling me stupid stupid

Why are you still reading this this is prob all wildly outdated as i just found out how to change signature and ill prob never be bothered again hahahahhahahahaa.

 

The word "Gaming" and anything around it is cringe. E.G

 

I'm a gamer les go play fortnite. In cringe 9 year old voice.

I want a Gaming Computer to play fortnite. In cringe 9 year old voice.

 

Gaming is dumb enthusiast is cool.

 

Whitebread > Brownbread

Coffee>Tea

PoachedEgg>FriedEgg

Idk how many lines this is im not counting im prob breaking rules #rebel

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10 minutes ago, poochyena said:

no charging standard.

A standard cable is not a charging standard. How many wireless standards exist? How many fast charging standards? Doesn’t address those issues. 


You ever notice that many establishments have a sign that as "No Shirt, No Shoes, No service"? They never say anything about pants............ You know what that implies. You dont have to wear pants. 

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5 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

A standard cable is not a charging standard. How many wireless standards exist? How many fast charging standards? Doesn’t address those issues. 

Well for wireless there WiFi, there’s Bluetooth, and there’s a pile of proprietary dongle stuff that people generally hate but put up with because they’re cheap.


Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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Just now, Bombastinator said:

Well for wireless there WiFi, there’s Bluetooth, and there’s a pile of proprietary dongle stuff that people generally hate but put up with because they’re cheap.

I’m talking charging standards!


You ever notice that many establishments have a sign that as "No Shirt, No Shoes, No service"? They never say anything about pants............ You know what that implies. You dont have to wear pants. 

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10 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

I’m talking charging standards!

Oh!  Then there’s just one: Qi.


Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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here comes mama Eu again screaming afraid someone hurts their knee, this is not the job of the government 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
2 hours ago, poochyena said:

why do you keep asserting that less choice = bad? This isn't opinion, its objectively worse for consumers when there is no charging standard. It costs the consumer more in time and money. "choice", alone, is not an advantage.

 

??????????
Creating a better product = more sales, no? How could it even be any better?

So when should the EU have stepped in? A lot of people loved the round Nokia charge cable, should that have been the point and a connector we are still all using now? What about microUSB, or 30pin Apple, or that terrible Ericsson thing. And that is the point, at the time some of those connections looked like the future, they looked like they were the best and nothing better would ever appear. Looking back they were terrible. I remember a time where every stereo maker had a blooming Apple dock on them, and supplied a box of silly plastic adapters to drop I. So different Apple devices would fit. They have all ended up in landfill as that amazing connector to end all connectors is consigned to the history of poor crap. In time USB C will go the same way but how long could we be stuck with it if legislators forced it to become a standard?

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3 hours ago, Bombastinator said:

h!  Then there’s just one: Qi.

AHHH. No there are competing standards. Qi is just popular but its not the only one. 


You ever notice that many establishments have a sign that as "No Shirt, No Shoes, No service"? They never say anything about pants............ You know what that implies. You dont have to wear pants. 

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23 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

AHHH. No there are competing standards. Qi is just popular but its not the only one. 

heh.  Comparing physics to copywrite.

 

How about this? Are they Compatible or incompatible?  If they are not compatible are they designed for the kind of wireless charging used by such things as phones? 
 

 it’s radio.  The concept for wireless power was invented by tesla.  The entire thing has been uncopywritable for a hundred years.  Are there much much bigger ones?  Sure.  People have built model planes powered by wireless power, designed to have ranges of hundreds of feet and it was totally different from Qi.  There just isn’t much that can be done.  5v over 1/8th of an inch means antennas of a certain size.  Flatness requires them to be a certain shape.  This isn’t data, it’s just electricity.  If a device is compatible is it really different?  What makes lightning connectors incompatible is shape.  Thunderbolt3 is compatible with UsbC and has the same kind of connector.  People plug UsbC stuff into thunderbolt3 ports all the time.  That’s data.  A thunderbolt3 port is different in that while it provides the same power it’s data capacities are different.


 Wireless power doesn’t do data.  This is like the difference between ibm and ibm compatible.  I have a PC. It doesn’t know a thing about IBM.  It’s still a PC though.  This is a distinction without a difference.

 


 

Edited by Bombastinator
Addition for clarity of point

Life is like a bowl of chocolates: there are all these little crinkly paper cups everywhere.

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1 hour ago, Phill104 said:

So when should the EU have stepped in?

any time

1 hour ago, Phill104 said:

A lot of people loved the round Nokia charge cable, should that have been the point and a connector we are still all using now?

sure

1 hour ago, Phill104 said:

And that is the point, at the time some of those connections looked like the future, they looked like they were the best and nothing better would ever appear. Looking back they were terrible.

so we upgrade as get better tech
 

1 hour ago, Phill104 said:

In time USB C will go the same way but how long could we be stuck with it if legislators forced it to become a standard?

for as long as its needed, like the other connectors mentioned.

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