AMD’s 64-Core Threadripper 3990X, only $3990! Coming February 7th

[Gorgon]

4 hours ago, leadeater said:

Yea but that only covered things that can run on GPU, I'd be looking for the best mix with the CPU also fully utilized which would eat in to the 2kw power budget. Systems that would be highly useful for both folding month and BOINC pent.

 

Since you can power cap the CPU there must be something that is the best at like 150W or 100W, also would dual CPU give the best total combined or single CPU. I think 2kw is a fair amount so would be more than one system but then again that 8 GPU server I was using could do that itself... not that I'm looking to do that lol.

I run a Ryzen 7 2700 with 1 thread dedicated to each GPU and the rest running BOINC (WCG). The folding machine has 2 Corsair RM750x power supplies, only one of which is on a UPS for now so I can’t calculate the system overhead dynamically and extrapolate the CPU power usage.

 

I currently am running 5 EVGA RTX 2070 Super XC Hybrids in the Folding machine and am drawing 700W from one power supply and 500 from the other.

 

If I was to build another machine and I had a 2kW power budget I’d likely use dual 1200 or 1300VA power supplies and and a 8 GPU mining frame with non Hybrid cards but I’d still likely just go with x570 and an 3950 over a threadripper but using a threadripper with the m.2 to PCIe adapters would also work.

 

As for which GPUs definitely at least RTX 2070 Supers but if the budget permitted 2080 Supers or ‘Tis they would work but some tuning of power limits on the GPUs May be required to fit the power budget.

[porina]

7 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Yea I have a current clap and they are actually pretty cheap, the scope I can borrow but there are some actually really good ones you plug in to a PC for cheap which means you can also do data logging, should look in to it yourself.

It was more that you have some level of interest in electronics beyond the typical PC tech enthusiast I found interesting. I can borrow this stuff from work, but even then, I don't find myself motivated to do so.

 

7 minutes ago, leadeater said:

But the power monitoring from PSU's are pretty bad btw, like often so far off to not actually be useful if you need anything at all accurate. My EVGA NEX1500 has it and it's a joke when you compare it to something proper.

While I wouldn't want to do anything really scientific with it, in the limits of my use of them they're "close enough" for indication. I'm talking like, within 10%... as long as comparisons are like for like, it is sufficiently indicative. Probably not even that bad.

[xtroria]

8 hours ago, Jeppes said:

The comparison is quite obvious as the price of Mac pro is so ridiculous in comparison. You could pay 1000 dollars for someone to build a tr system for you and get 300 dollars per year tech support and mac would still be more expensive. Support your local small businesses and spend on stuff that puts money into circulation instead of buying overpriced products from hundred billion dollar companies.

I guess you simply dont understand that professional requires their devices to work ALL THE TIME

 

if paying 150% or even more means they dont need to care about contacting tech support at all, they’ll do it

 

TR system doesnt cost 1000 dollar anyway, i thought we are talking TOTL system for high end professional usage why are you saying TR system cost $1000

[Deli]

10 hours ago, MageTank said:

This is a challenge I'll gladly undertake. Sadly I only have a 3970X on hand and a Gigabyte TRX40 board that I have never used in my life. Do I get bonus points for pushing 3800mhz?

You need to make 256GB running at 3800MHz CL14.

[leadeater]

1 hour ago, xtroria said:

I guess you simply dont understand that professional requires their devices to work ALL THE TIME

 

if paying 150% or even more means they dont need to care about contacting tech support at all, they’ll do it

 

TR system doesnt cost 1000 dollar anyway, i thought we are talking TOTL system for high end professional usage why are you saying TR system cost $1000

I think that $1000 was for Time and Materials fee charged to build the system, not anything to do with parts. Which is crazy high fee but I also think that was the point.

 

Also a well built system by a professional isn't going to require any more support than an Apple Mac Pro, there isn't any reason to think there is. Neither can guarantee no parts failures or issue as you actually have very little control of that, everything will fail and failure rates are similar between most electronics as they get manufactured by the same group of companies that do it i.e. Foxconn. There are better choices on the market but that's what you are paying for when you go to the dedicated workstation building system integrators (Like Puget Systems).

 

Warranty lengths being equal you will get better support from a local SI than Apple if you have that option, turnaround time will be much shorter than what Apple can offer. When you compare the support of other big names like HP what Apple offers isn't good at all, HP you can pay for support options from as little as next day parts to same day 4 hour response onsite tech with complete system replacement as necessary.

 

Ultimately you buy an Apple for Mac OS and that ecosystem, they don't offer anything anyone else cannot and are not the best at the things that matter to professionals in the hardware department and support of that.

[xtroria]

1 hour ago, leadeater said:

I think that $1000 was for Time and Materials fee charged to build the system, not anything to do with parts. Which is crazy high fee but I also think that was the point.

 

Also a well built system by a professional isn't going to require any more support than an Apple Mac Pro, there isn't any reason to think there is. Neither can guarantee no parts failures or issue as you actually have very little control of that, everything will fail and failure rates are similar between most electronics as they get manufactured by the same group of companies that do it i.e. Foxconn. There are better choices on the market but that's what you are paying for when you go to the dedicated workstation building system integrators (Like Puget Systems).

 

Warranty lengths being equal you will get better support from a local SI than Apple if you have that option, turnaround time will be much shorter than what Apple can offer. When you compare the support of other big names like HP what Apple offers isn't good at all, HP you can pay for support options from as little as next day parts to same day 4 hour response onsite tech with complete system replacement as necessary.

 

Ultimately you buy an Apple for Mac OS and that ecosystem, they don't offer anything anyone else cannot and are not the best at the things that matter to professionals in the hardware department and support of that.

Well that’s what I’m talking about generally. 

 

Windows requires so much of what linus would call “crap management” even I need to take care of my windows OS way more than my mac.

 

Each OS has their own use as there are software that simply work better on mac or mac exclusive in the first place.

 

Most people simply look at the price and say “OVERPRICED” without having trying it first.

 

I mean just go to silicon valley and you’ll find many software developer use macbook that people are yelling as “overpriced”. Are we gonna call them uninformed sheep?

[leadeater]

22 minutes ago, xtroria said:

I mean just go to silicon valley and you’ll find many software developer use macbook that people are yelling as “overpriced”. Are we gonna call them uninformed sheep?

Tbh a lot of software developers don't know a damn thing about hardware but w/e, who really cares what someone prefers to use. I still like old school Lenovo/IBM business laptops, as well as MacBook Pro 2013 era running Windows.

 

Btw soon as you start putting Mac OS on a network the management swings way the other way, way way over the fences. Mac OS and managed networks just don't jive, best comparison of the difference I can make was a school that had  roughly 150 iMacs/MacBook Pros and 300 Windows PCs, was about 5 to 1 support time required for Mac OS due to the ongoing and ever changing issues with Mac OS. If you want to keep your sanity use Macs standalone with no network management (yes that doesn't scale but fml).

[Kilrah]

6 hours ago, xtroria said:

I mean just go to silicon valley and you’ll find many software developer use macbook that people are yelling as “overpriced”. Are we gonna call them uninformed sheep?

Yes. Most SW devs have no clue at all about the hardware side of things, for them it's just a box. Sometimes they are even poor users of software they didn't write or outside of their niche and require technical support for basic stuff. And they'll get a macbook because everyone else around has one and it's a "status symbol requirement". 

[descendency]

6 hours ago, huilun02 said:

Is Xeon in the HEDT segment?

How much RAM does Epyc support?

HEDT is specially sub 'workstation' class components. Mainstream -> HEDT -> Workstation -> Server (in terms of general cost)

 

I've seen claims some EPYC servers handle 2TB of RAM, but not more. 

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, descendency said:

I've seen claims some EPYC servers handle 2TB of RAM, but not more. 

Each EPYC2 CPU supports 4TB per CPU so 8TB per dual socket system, older EPYC1 supports 2TB per CPU.

[spartaman64]

10 hours ago, huilun02 said:

Is Xeon in the HEDT segment?

How much RAM does Epyc support?

xeon is considered server/enterprise the x series like i9 9980xe is HEDT for intel which was one of the things that made it so riddiculous. intel's top end HEDT processor is trading blows with amd's top end consumer processor 3950x while amd's top end HEDT which is the 3990x completely blows it away

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, descendency said:

HEDT is specially sub 'workstation' class components. Mainstream -> HEDT -> Workstation -> Server (in terms of general cost)

Only Intel uses a distinction between HEDT and Workstation and that's really mostly recently in any meaningful way, Intel created that terminology. Companies like HP have under their workstation product range Z Series Z2 which uses standard Core i CPUs as well as Xeons of the same socket up to the Z8 which uses the full blown server chipset and socket with dual CPU and allows you to pick all the way up to Xeon Platinum.

 

So really HEDT is only an Intel thing for their X series chipsets and CPUs, which Intel doesn't really have a strategy for at all. A workstation can quite literally be anything, 9700 with 64GB and a Quadro is just as much a workstation as a dual 8280 with 512GB and 4 Teslas.

 

Outside of Intel's own bubble HEDT = Workstation, both simply mean a highly spec'd computer. So just to be clear HP, nor Dell or Lenovo, have product ranges with the name HEDT only Desktop or Workstation.

[MageTank]

17 hours ago, Deli said:

You need to make 256GB running at 3800MHz CL14.

So I need to find my current DIMM's but in a larger capacity?

 

I think that is easier said than done. If I win the lottery, G Skill's 4000 C18-22-22-42 32x8GB kit might work assuming it scales decent with voltage. A 200mhz underclock won't buy me C14, but voltage scaling is normally really poor on large DIMM's. https://www.gskill.com/community?cls=1502239313&id=1574739775 

[descendency]

6 hours ago, leadeater said:

Only Intel uses a distinction between HEDT and Workstation and that's really mostly recently in any meaningful way, Intel created that terminology. Companies like HP have under their workstation product range Z Series Z2 which uses standard Core i CPUs as well as Xeons of the same socket up to the Z8 which uses the full blown server chipset and socket with dual CPU and allows you to pick all the way up to Xeon Platinum.

 

So really HEDT is only an Intel thing for their X series chipsets and CPUs, which Intel doesn't really have a strategy for at all. A workstation can quite literally be anything, 9700 with 64GB and a Quadro is just as much a workstation as a dual 8280 with 512GB and 4 Teslas.

 

Outside of Intel's own bubble HEDT = Workstation, both simply mean a highly spec'd computer. So just to be clear HP, nor Dell or Lenovo, have product ranges with the name HEDT only Desktop or Workstation.

What I meant was that an 8 core CPU intended for mainstream users is less expensive than one intended for "HEDT" users, which is less expensive than one put in Workstations, and less still than Servers. 

[Deli]

4 hours ago, MageTank said:

 

 

I think that is easier said than done. If I win the lottery, G Skill's 4000 C18-22-22-42 32x8GB kit might work assuming it scales decent with voltage. A 200mhz underclock won't buy me C14, but voltage scaling is normally really poor on large DIMM's. https://www.gskill.com/community?cls=1502239313&id=1574739775 

Do you have work load that requires 256Gb RAM? That G SKILL set probably will cost more than my entire PC.

 

On the other hand, I probably should get my lazy bones move and find a stable setting for my 64GB running at 3600Mhz CL16.

[leadeater]

2 hours ago, descendency said:

What I meant was that an 8 core CPU intended for mainstream users is less expensive than one intended for "HEDT" users, which is less expensive than one put in Workstations, and less still than Servers. 

Well sort of because you'll find most workstations don't actually use Intel's Xeon-W CPUs at all, they are either Core i, X series or just straight Xeon. Intel makes a lot of CPUs that nobody actually uses or the one and only OEM that asked for them does i.e. Apple. Intel can label and target their CPUs as much as they like but it doesn't actually translate directly to any real workstation products on the market because Intel's product segmentation doesn't actually make any sense.

 

Doesn't really matter what Intel intends or wants it's not actually how it happens. Like the HP example Z2 is Core i and entry Xeon, Z4 is Core X and Xeon-W, Z6 and Z8 are Xeon Scalable yet all are purpose built and targeted workstations but the two highest models in the range use the server Xeons not Xeon-W because Intel is not the definition of a workstation.

 

If someone is talking about the HEDT segment they aren't using Intel's definition, simply any computer with high specifications used for professional or similar workloads that isn't a server and generally excluding server CPUs (Xeons/EPYC). A CPU doesn't decide what something is and never has, Xeons have been in workstations for a very long time so they are in that market segment however that is due to being CPUs that meet the requirements of design for the system. If Intel had more suited products then they would get used, Xeon-W doesn't fit that requirement. Xeon-W is Core X with ECC RDIMM support originally limited to 512GB ram then upgrade to 1TB with Cascade Lake, still limited to 4 channel and single socket. As far as it looks to me Intel has a strategy of making everything they can think of and throw it at the wall and see what sticks, thing is the things that are sticking are Intel's traditional core products because they actually make sense.

 

You can just as easily design a workstation around Xeon Scalable as Xeon-W and both offer high clock SKUs and high core counts but only 1 has 6 channel and multi socket support. You can also make motherboards for Xeon Scalable with a single socket, which means for a SI and OEM you can create a wide range of products using a common chipset and socket which costs less to do. Cost is similar, there's just so many factors that make Xeon-W actually irrelevant hence why they are rarely found in workstations over the more compelling Core X or Xeon Scalable.

 

What I mean by all this is it's actually far more important to actually look at the workstation market and analyse that.

 

TL;DR nobody cares what Intel says is HEDT and workstation, they are the same thing to everyone but Intel and likewise has no impact on what people buy.

[NumLock21]

Not sure why my brain kept thinking 3990 is the number of cores it has, and for the price of $3990 where the cores are $1 each is a epic deal.

[CarlBar]

On 1/11/2020 at 12:56 AM, NumLock21 said:

Not sure why my brain kept thinking 3990 is the number of cores it has, and for the price of $3990 where the cores are $1 each is a epic deal.

 

Give them a few years and we should get there at this rate.

[NumLock21]

5 minutes ago, CarlBar said:

 

Give them a few years and we should get there at this rate.

I hope it’s not 3990 years!

[TechyBen]

On 1/10/2020 at 8:16 AM, Kilrah said:

Yes. Most SW devs have no clue at all about the hardware side of things, for them it's just a box. Sometimes they are even poor users of software they didn't write or outside of their niche and require technical support for basic stuff. And they'll get a macbook because everyone else around has one and it's a "status symbol requirement". 

I know a graphic designer who got his macbook just so he got the job. As "everyone will laugh at me if I get a PC laptop", his macbook sat on the desk, never used, as he spent all the money on the macbook, and could not afford photoshop/Adobe etc. Though he did get the job (I wonder why ) so could use the software at work. Most expensive MP3 player ever.

 

[MageTank]

On 1/10/2020 at 4:33 PM, Deli said:

Do you have work load that requires 256Gb RAM? That G SKILL set probably will cost more than my entire PC.

 

On the other hand, I probably should get my lazy bones move and find a stable setting for my 64GB running at 3600Mhz CL16.

Nope. I don't even have a workload that requires a 3970X either. I just happen to have a sample to test with. Sadly none of the RAM I have on hand are considered high density. Only have 16GB DIMM's available, so I'd cap out at 128GB.