Motherboard VRM Tier List v2 (currently AMD only)

Sambill · February 17, 2020

Hi!

What do you guys think about combining MSI X470 GAMING PRO with Ryzen 7 3700X and Corsair 16GB (2x8GB) 3200MHz CL16 Vengeance ? Would it be okay? Maybe you have some suggestions ? Thanks for your help ! :)

Jurrunio · February 17, 2020

30 minutes ago, Sambill said:

Hi!

What do you guys think about combining MSI X470 GAMING PRO with Ryzen 7 3700X and Corsair 16GB (2x8GB) 3200MHz CL16 Vengeance ? Would it be okay? Maybe you have some suggestions ? Thanks for your help !

there's a chance that the board needs a BIOS update before working with 3rd gen, which means needing an older CPU.

TrueTeddy · February 18, 2020

Hey guys!

So due to budget constraints I can either choose between a Ryzen 7 3800x w/ X570 Aorus Elite, or Ryzen 9 3900x w/ MSI B450 Tomahawk Max.

I'm leaning more on the Ryzen 9, but wasn't sure what my mileage would be with the board.

Any help / suggestions are greatly appreciated!

Jurrunio · February 18, 2020

19 minutes ago, TrueTeddy said:

Hey guys!

So due to budget constraints I can either choose between a Ryzen 7 3800x w/ X570 Aorus Elite, or Ryzen 9 3900x w/ MSI B450 Tomahawk Max.

I'm leaning more on the Ryzen 9, but wasn't sure what my mileage would be with the board.

Any help / suggestions are greatly appreciated!

what will you use it for? Rest of the specs? Budget? PC build can't be judged without seeing the whole situation

TrueTeddy · February 18, 2020

1 minute ago, Jurrunio said:

what will you use it for? Rest of the specs? Budget? PC build can't be judged without seeing the whole situation

Mainly for CPU intensive games like KSP, Cities Skylines etc, and also School work (Solidworks, VMware, and may need to potentially run simulations and emulations in the future). Will be upgrading my ~5 year old PC, but will be reusing the parts that are marked as purchased. Budget is $2300 CAD.

I'm not the kind of guy who is constantly using the full potential of my computer, but similar to my current build right now (Build ~5 years ago with a stock 4790k, and have only upgraded the gpu from an R9 380 to a 1070), I'd like my new build to last quite some time. Honestly a big factor in why I am upgrading is because I would like to re purpose my current build as a Home Server.

PCPartPicker Part List

Jurrunio · February 18, 2020

1 hour ago, TrueTeddy said:

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 3.8 GHz 12-Core Processor ($649.00 @ Canada Computers)
CPU Cooler: Corsair iCUE H115i RGB Pro XT 63 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($189.99 @ Canada Computers)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX ATX AM4 Motherboard ($149.99 @ Best Buy Canada)
Memory: G.Skill Trident Z RGB 64 GB (4 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 Memory ($527.08 @ Newegg Canada)
Storage: Samsung 970 Pro 512 GB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($219.99 @ Mike's Computer Shop)
Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($169.99 @ Best Buy Canada)
Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 1070 8 GB Video Card (Purchased For $0.00)
Case: Phanteks Evolv X ATX Mid Tower Case ($254.99 @ Canada Computers)
Power Supply: Corsair HX Platinum 1000 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (Purchased For $0.00)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan (Purchased For $0.00)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan (Purchased For $0.00)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan (Purchased For $0.00)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan (Purchased For $0.00)
Case Fan: Corsair ML140 PRO RGB (2 pack w/Lighting Node PRO) 55.4 CFM 140 mm Fans ($129.99 @ Corsair)
Keyboard: Logitech G915 Lightspeed Wireless Gaming Keyboard (Purchased For $0.00)
Custom: CableMod PRO ModMesh C-Series AXi, HXi & RM Cable Kit (Black/White) (Purchased For $0.00)
Total: $2291.02
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-02-17 21:38 EST-0500

Just an example of the cost of RGB

PCPartPicker Part List

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD Ryzen 9 3950X 3.5 GHz 16-Core Processor	$1004.99 @ PC-Canada
CPU Cooler	ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II 280 72.8 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler	$149.99 @ Memory Express
Motherboard	Asus TUF GAMING X570-PLUS (WI-FI) ATX AM4 Motherboard	$229.00 @ Canada Computers
Memory	G.Skill Ripjaws V 64 GB (4 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 Memory	$426.99 @ Newegg Canada
Storage	Crucial MX500 2 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive	$269.99 @ Amazon Canada
Video Card	Asus GeForce GTX 1070 8 GB Video Card	Purchased For $0.00
Case	Cooler Master MasterBox NR600 (w/o ODD) ATX Mid Tower Case	$103.87 @ Amazon Canada
Power Supply	Corsair HX Platinum 1000 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply	Purchased For $0.00
Case Fan	Noctua NF-A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan	Purchased For $0.00
Case Fan	Noctua NF-A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan	Purchased For $0.00
Case Fan	Noctua NF-A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan	Purchased For $0.00
Case Fan	Noctua NF-A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan	Purchased For $0.00
Case Fan	Noctua NF-A12X15 PWM CHROMAX.BLACK.SWAP 55.44 CFM 120 mm Fan	$31.95 @ Amazon Canada
Keyboard	Logitech G915 Lightspeed Wireless Gaming Keyboard	Purchased For $0.00
Custom	CableMod PRO ModMesh C-Series AXi, HXi & RM Cable Kit (Black/White)	Purchased For $0.00
	Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
	Total	$2216.78
	Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-02-17 23:34 EST-0500

SATA SSD there because workloads you listed don't need high speed storage. I tried Solidworks and games with an HP EX920 (PCIe 3.0 x4) and Samsung 840 Pro (SATA), and there's no meaningful difference.

Anyway with your shiny but not the fastest for its price list, the Tomahawk is sufficient as long as you don't overclock the CPU, which you shouldn't because it's plenty close to maxing out at stock settings.

Uzrathixius · February 18, 2020

So, I'm about to pull the trigger on a 3600 build but I'm not sure which mobo to get. I was planning on a B450 Tomahawk Max, however, if I go with a B450 Aorus Pro Wifi, I can save 50 bucks. I do plan to overclock, however I'm unsure if I'll need or want to go beyond PBO (I still have to read into AMD overclocking). Though, I've read there isn't much to gain from overclocking, and it's more about undervolting on Zen 2?

Thoughts?

Parts:

Ryzen 3600

G.Skill Ripjaws V 3600

Sambill · February 18, 2020

On 2/17/2020 at 10:23 AM, Jurrunio said:

there's a chance that the board needs a BIOS update before working with 3rd gen, which means needing an older CPU.

So I should buy better mobo with x570 chipset, like Gigabyte X570 GAMING X, Gigabyte X570 AORUS ELITE or MSI MPG X570 GAMING PLUS ?

Jurrunio · February 18, 2020

10 hours ago, Uzrathixius said:

So, I'm about to pull the trigger on a 3600 build but I'm not sure which mobo to get. I was planning on a B450 Tomahawk Max, however, if I go with a B450 Aorus Pro Wifi, I can save 50 bucks. I do plan to overclock, however I'm unsure if I'll need or want to go beyond PBO (I still have to read into AMD overclocking). Though, I've read there isn't much to gain from overclocking, and it's more about undervolting on Zen 2?

Ryzen 3600

G.Skill Ripjaws V 3600

It's more about overclocking the memory for Zen 2, undervolt increases efficiency and improves thermals, not necessarily performance.

What about cheaper MSI B450 ATX boards? the A Pro and Gaming Plus still has the same power delivery

4 hours ago, Sambill said:

So I should buy better mobo with x570 chipset, like Gigabyte X570 GAMING X, Gigabyte X570 AORUS ELITE or MSI MPG X570 GAMING PLUS ?

If you go with X570, Asus X570-P and X570 TUF are better choices. MSI's entry level X470 boards are no better than B450 boards as they share the same power delivery without BIOS flashback function, so on the cheap B450 is the way

Satan_Prometheus · February 18, 2020

At this point it feels to me like there are very few instances in which buying an X470 board makes sense.

Uzrathixius · February 18, 2020

2 hours ago, Jurrunio said:

What about cheaper MSI B450 ATX boards? the A Pro and Gaming Plus still has the same power delivery

Oh do they? They do have an A pro available. I need to look into the feature set, but is there any reason to not go with it and go with the Tomahawk?

They also have a Gaming Pro Carbon, not sure what the difference is. (For overclocking etc)

Jurrunio · February 18, 2020

24 minutes ago, Uzrathixius said:

Oh do they? They do have an A pro available. I need to look into the feature set, but is there any reason to not go with it and go with the Tomahawk?

Non max boards have smaller capacity BIOS chips so with 3rd gen-compatible BIOS you won't get the fancy user interface, instead just a basic one from 2010. This includes the standard Tomahawk btw

43 minutes ago, Uzrathixius said:

They also have a Gaming Pro Carbon, not sure what the difference is. (For overclocking etc)

Carbon is still the same platform of the other ATX boards, just with wireless support out of the box.

Uzrathixius · February 18, 2020

3 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

Non max boards have smaller capacity BIOS chips so with 3rd gen-compatible BIOS you won't get the fancy user interface, instead just a basic one from 2010. This includes the standard Tomahawk btw

Found a couple of google sheets with some great comparisons here and here. Seems like the biggest difference besides R G B is a bit smaller VRM heat sinks; which shouldn't really matter for a 3600. And yeah, I meant A pro - MAX.

Got to say, I'm surprised micro center is coming in so much cheaper for this build, taxes included.

Prof. Lucifer · February 21, 2020

Just curious, why did the x570i strix and crosshair vii move to A tier? I remember them being is s tier. I'm have an x570i strix with an alphacool lt240 waiting for the sidearmd t1 to release

Jurrunio · February 21, 2020

8 minutes ago, Prof. Lucifer said:

Just curious, why did the x570i strix and crosshair vii move to A tier? I remember them being is s tier. I'm have an x570i strix with an alphacool lt240 waiting for the sidearmd t1 to release

Was in S minus, the Impact and X570-I basically followed the TUF in rating since there's still no actual testing data. the TUF's data arent the best either since it's tested with 3900x and not 3950x, so expect further changes on the high end. I would rather underestimate than overestimate though

euviridis · February 23, 2020

looking for a b450m mobo for my r7 2700 build, still can't decide between steel legend or mortar, sadly tomahawk is not available here

here's the pcpp list

PCPartPicker Part List

Type	Item	Price
CPU	AMD Ryzen 7 2700 3.2 GHz 8-Core Processor	$154.43 @ Amazon
CPU Cooler	Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler	$29.99 @ B&H
Motherboard	ASRock B450M Steel Legend Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard	$84.99 @ Newegg
Memory	Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3000 Memory	$72.98 @ Amazon
Storage	Western Digital Black NVMe 500 GB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive	$109.99 @ Amazon
Video Card	XFX Radeon RX 570 4 GB RS XXX Video Card	$119.99 @ Newegg
	Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts
	Total	$572.37
	Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-02-22 21:58 EST-0500

Jurrunio · February 23, 2020

22 minutes ago, euviridis said:

looking for a b450m mobo for my r7 2700 build, still can't decide between steel legend or mortar, sadly tomahawk is not available here

mATX or ATX? because Tomahawk is ATX while the others are mATX, they are not comparable if you specifically need the smaller one (B450M = B450 mATX)

euviridis · February 23, 2020

10 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

mATX or ATX? because Tomahawk is ATX while the others are mATX, they are not comparable if you specifically need the smaller one (B450M = B450 mATX)

my bad, i didn't research it through, I thought there's matx version of tomahawk, so that's why I couldnt find it..

anyway i'm looking for mATX board

Jurrunio · February 23, 2020

22 minutes ago, euviridis said:

my bad, i didn't research it through, I thought there's matx version of tomahawk, so that's why I couldnt find it..

anyway i'm looking for mATX board

Mortar is the better board, even though Steel Legend would do the job

but at this point why 2700? For gaming not like the 2600 will be any worse, games doesnt use the extra cores. The cooler though could see an upgrade, the Hyper 212 Evo has the funky scissor mount and old fan that's updated in the Black. Arctic Freezer 33/34 are also good options on the cheap

euviridis · February 23, 2020

7 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

Mortar is the better board, even though Steel Legend would do the job

but at this point why 2700? For gaming not like the 2600 will be any worse, games doesnt use the extra cores. The cooler though could see an upgrade, the Hyper 212 Evo has the funky scissor mount and old fan that's updated in the Black. Arctic Freezer 33/34 are also good options on the cheap

I'm not only gaming but I'm gonna code on this too, so that's why I went for the higher core,

anyway is the mortar worth spending about $20 extra from steel legend?

Yeah the cooler was a placeholder, arctic is not available in my country though, do you have other recommendations? I'm looking for the quietest possible air cooling

Jurrunio · February 23, 2020

23 minutes ago, euviridis said:

I'm not only gaming but I'm gonna code on this too, so that's why I went for the higher core,

anyway is the mortar worth spending about $20 extra from steel legend?

Yeah the cooler was a placeholder, arctic is not available in my country though, do you have other recommendations? I'm looking for the quietest possible air cooling

Code compilers are often single threaded, you better check that first.

Yes

Big thermalright and scythe coolers?

euviridis · February 23, 2020

4 minutes ago, Jurrunio said:

Code compilers are often single threaded, you better check that first.

Yes

Big thermalright and scythe coolers?

gonna run IDE, lots of browser tabs, and vm, so I'm better safe than sorry

So I guess I'm gonna go with either Cryorig H7 or Cryorig R1, it's generally available and seems like the performance is good enough

uko · February 24, 2020

Hi, i actually have build an SFF in Raijintek Metis Plus case but i live in Spain and the weather is almost the hell most part of the year, so i was thinking about switch to another case with better cooling like Cooler Master MasterBox Q500L is mATX case but support ATX mobos (found just for 50€) i still have some days to replace the components without lose money. My recent build is this one...

Case: Raijintek Metis Plus (61€)

CPU: Ryzen 3600 (170€)

MOBO: MSI B450i Gaming Plus AC (130€)

GPU: Asus Dual RX 580 OC 8GB (160€)

COOLER: Noctua NH-U12S (60€)

SSD M2: Sabrent Rocket NVMe 512GB (28€)

RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX 3200 C16 2x16 32GB (100€)

PSU: Sharkoon SilentStorm SFX Gold 500W (80€)

1xFAN: Noctua F12 (20€)

Total build: 809€

I want to save some money (money "is not a problem" but i dont want to spend money in unnecesary expensive components), and my untouchable are cpu, ssd and ram:

CPU: Ryzen 3600 (170€)

SSD M2: Sabrent Rocket NVMe 512GB (28€)

RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX 3200 C16 2x16 32GB (100€)

Now i need to find the rest in a perfect "best value" build.

Case: MasterBox Q500L (50€)

PSU: TXM 650W 80+ Gold (57€)

Total atm: 405€

Still need gpu and mobo (this is the reason why i came here across google) and cpu cooler, my intentions are OC (between 4.0 or 4.2 ghz) but not sure if just stay stock and let the system auto boost, the use of the computer will be mainly work (games & software development, cybersecurity studies (will need some vmwares) and some days will play some games (mostly cs:go and lol, easy to get more than 144fps in low and mid settings for max performance)). So... which mobo do u think will be enough for me and maybe which cpu cooler? I have reading almost whole google about b450 different mobos, and what i have learn is to buy an msi (not sure if thats the correct answer...) but i can buy msi mobos for this prices...

Gaming Plus Max - 75€ a friend who bought and never used (104€ new)

Bazooka V2 - 92€ new

Tomahawk Max - 115€ new

I am totally open to some other recomendation... thanks in advance!

Jurrunio · February 24, 2020

@uko Just get an ITX case with proper airlfow, say the NZXT H200/210 or the Fractal define nano s. No need for an ATX system.

btw I wanted to say the Cooler Master H100, but how did you get that graphics card to fit in the Metis in the first place?

uko · February 24, 2020

@Jurrunio Asus Dual RX 580 fits in the Raijintek without problem, i have actually an Asus Dual RTX 2060 with fits removing the front USB panel of the case, but i have to return the GPU because sometimes it shows some white dots in the image, still have to reinstall drivers and try a bit, but i am almost sure i have to return it.

I built with Raijintek Metis Plus because it was so small (i think i paid too much with 130€ for mobo b450i, because if an 80€ mobo can satisfice my needs...) if i have to replace the case, prefer to build an ATX or mATX (in smallest case possible) and save some money in PSU, MOBO, COOLER and EXTRA FANS.

Other reason why i want to change the case, its because in the future, the gpus will be bigger and this case cant fit these sizes. I am planning to buy an RX 5700 / XT / 1660 Ti, not sure... have to find some good deals.

Which build can u recommend to me to fit my untouchables (3600, sabrent rocket, vengeance ram)? Mobo + Cpu cooler + Case (and maybe which GPU?) Should i use manual oc or let auto boost?

I can search too in second hand market, lot of offers in my town.

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Motherboard VRM Tier List v2 (currently AMD only)

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