Google Stadia in desperate need of promised "negative latency" mode

[The King of the Undead]

in b4 "when you move but the algorithm thought you should go the otherway" meme

[TechyBen]

Sales guy: You should [Pays £100/$100 a month for 5GB internet and £30/$30 a month to "save money" on a gaming console/PC to a streaming service + game costs]

ME: Buys PC for a 10th of the cost over 3 years. Has Internet for less than a 3rd the cost, and gets games in sales.

[Monkey Dust]

3 hours ago, SADS said:

I don't really think that you will ever get a better experience than running a game on your machine locally that pretty much responds instantly to your inputs.

 

I understand that these companies want to make money. And credit to them for trying. But this method has tried and failed before and to be honest, even if it was low latency, it's still not faster than running the game on my machine... and I probably still wouldn't want it.

 

Not everything has to be 'servicified'...

I don't want to be milked of my wage every month thanks... even if every business these days sees me as a cash cow.

 

I heard about piracy being on the rise recently because there are so many companies offering services now, people are having to pay-up way too much every month for a number of services that have exclusive content on and the user only wants a small portition of that service.

Yeah, subscription fatigue. And that's before you lose your job, or have a big saving push, for say a mortgage. It's nice to have stuff you've already paid for you can use whenever. Most of these amounts are small, but they mount up really quickly.

 

 

[GoodBytes]

1 hour ago, TechyBen said:

Sales guy: You should [Pays £100/$100 a month for 5GB internet and £30/$30 a month to "save money" on a gaming console/PC to a streaming service + game costs]

ME: Buys PC for a 10th of the cost over 3 years. Has Internet for less than a 3rd the cost, and gets games in sales.

Well the reality of things, is that for many people, the only thing they really need is a decent GPU (assuming the PSU has a PCI-E power connector), and they are ready to game.

Sure they might have a Core i5 Quad Core, or even i3... but it is plenty to have a nice enough 60fps experience at medium high settings with a decent GPU (assuming they are on a desktop). They don't need to get a GeForce 2080 Super Ti Duper GDDR6 MX SE Plus+ FTW.

 

And remember, that RedDead Redemption 2 and Destiny 2 are limited to 1080p resolution with Google service (not to mention image is compressed, even on the games that runs at 4K) as noted by Digital Foundry; you are not getting a better experience with Stadia in comparison of just buying a med range GPU.

 

[Bombastinator]

-Does it work with a very high bandwidth very low latency connection?  Apparently yes.
-what is the cutoff before it becomes effectively impossible?  Pretty high. Higher than a high bandwidth cellphone service can reliably provide it seems.

- What percentage of customers even have access to that sort of thing let alone having it already?  In the US not very many.  Iirc the majority of the geographic US (area not population) is on dialup still.

 

 There are countries other than the US this might work better in.  Maybe those are the actual targets?  

[Tech_Dreamer]

i get the project was aimed at being a progress & a competition to the existing NVIDIA service to kick em off the market, but damn! they f'd up!

[Letgomyleghoe]

On 11/18/2019 at 11:26 AM, Ryan_Vickers said:

Even if it sticks around though, providing a much worse experience for much higher prices has never rarely been a successful business model. 

*cough cough* i-mac *cough*

[Taf the Ghost]

37 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

-Does it work with a very high bandwidth very low latency connection?  Apparently yes.
-what is the cutoff before it becomes effectively impossible?  Pretty high. Higher than a high bandwidth cellphone service can reliably provide it seems.

- What percentage of customers even have access to that sort of thing let alone having it already?  In the US not very many.  Iirc the majority of the geographic US (area not population) is on dialup still.

 

 There are countries other than the US this might work better in.  Maybe those are the actual targets?  

Tokyo Metro Area and most of South Korea. That's really the only markets this should have launched in. Then roll it out to LA and San Fran. Because the actual market for these products are literally people that would already own a console (or 3) if they were inclined.

[TheRandomness]

On 11/18/2019 at 7:20 PM, Velcade said:

Can't wait for you Stadia boys to show up in the Crucible!  

 

Can't wait to get shot in the head anyway in momentum!

[RejZoR]

Oh boy, tell me I didn't say I've seen this coming. A lot of systems has issues running things smoothly on local devices and someone somewhere expects huge amounts of video data paired with expected timely input to work over huge distances? LOL? Stadia is a failed project. Companies tried it before and it never took off. Just because Google is trying it now, they can't magically disregard the laws of physics just because it's Google. Not to mention there is raw input latency paired with latency where game action needs to be first accepted (input), rendered, encoded and pushed to the user to reflect the input action. You can't disregard that fact. Stadia can't render and encode things ahead of your actions, which means there will always be relatively high latency gap from that alone no matter how much they promote negative latency bullshit.

[Bombastinator]

43 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Tokyo Metro Area and most of South Korea. That's really the only markets this should have launched in. Then roll it out to LA and San Fran. Because the actual market for these products are literally people that would already own a console (or 3) if they were inclined.

Yet it appears they are attempting a national US launch anyway.  Is it a world launch or US only?    IF worldwide They could be expecting to lose money in the US but gain it back in areas that can actually support the tech.

 

Take home I think is there are only a few areas in the country that might support this thing; and apparently even fewer turn out to be able to than hoped.

[MysticLTT]

Remember, remember, the OnLive of November

[Taf the Ghost]

16 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

Yet it appears they are attempting a national US launch anyway.  Is it a world launch or US only?    IF worldwide They could be expecting to lose money in the US but gain it back in areas that can actually support the tech.

 

Take home I think is there are only a few areas in the country that might support this thing; and apparently even fewer turn out to be able to than hoped.

USA and chunks of Western Europe.

 

Quote

The Founder’s Edition will launch in United States, Canada, the United Kingdom, Ireland, France, Germany, Italy, Spain, the Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Sweden, Norway, and Finland. It retails for $129.99 in the United States; full country-specific pricing can be found on the G-Store, which is the only place Google is selling it.

https://www.polygon.com/2019/6/6/18655088/google-stadia-release-date-us-canada-europe

 

Took me a while to find an actual list. Everyone, even Google's own pages, say "14 countries" without listing them. So it's basically founding NATO members + some extra Nordic countries. Minus Luxembourg. 

[Bombastinator]

53 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

USA and chunks of Western Europe.

 

https://www.polygon.com/2019/6/6/18655088/google-stadia-release-date-us-canada-europe

 

Took me a while to find an actual list. Everyone, even Google's own pages, say "14 countries" without listing them. So it's basically founding NATO members + some extra Nordic countries. Minus Luxembourg. 

Odd.  “The west”. The Wealthy countries but not all of them.  I don’t know what the connectivity situation is in the various nations of the EU.  If there’s fiber buried everywhere like in South Korea it could win.  Pretty sure they’re not all like that though

[CarlBar]

2 hours ago, Bombastinator said:

Odd.  “The west”. The Wealthy countries but not all of them.  I don’t know what the connectivity situation is in the various nations of the EU.  If there’s fiber buried everywhere like in South Korea it could win.  Pretty sure they’re not all like that though

 

Varies country t country, some do have really good fibre connections everywhere, others like the UK are still in rollout phase, (though a good percentage of the country is allready upto spec)..

[Bombastinator]

12 minutes ago, CarlBar said:

 

Varies country t country, some do have really good fibre connections everywhere, others like the UK are still in rollout phase, (though a good percentage of the country is allready upto spec)..

The US would have been in rollout stage as well but the bill to push internet into rural areas was blocked some years ago.  Iirc it was an Obama thing.  Makes me wonder how old the Stadia plan is.  It might have been made originally under the assumption that there would be more  infrastructure available than there is.

[The1Dickens]

Welp, this can't be good news: Granted, take it with a grain of salt, because internet.

http://imgur.com/gallery/GCD74pm

 

In case it gets deleted/hidden/removed: Basically, someone using Leo 'Gatsby' meme to say they quit (image title is Google Stadia Support). They respond to 'what happened' with: "Google fudged the launch of Stadia and all support was pretty much taken offline due to all the angry Founders. Bad day for support!"

[Bombastinator]

5 minutes ago, The1Dickens said:

Welp, this can't be good news: Granted, take it with a grain of salt, because internet.

http://imgur.com/gallery/GCD74pm

 

In case it gets deleted/hidden/removed: Basically, someone using Leo 'Gatsby' meme to say they quit (image title is Google Stadia Support). They respond to 'what happened' with: "Google fudged the launch of Stadia and all support was pretty much taken offline due to all the angry Founders. Bad day for support!"

From the sound of things there was a lot of fudgeups in the entire process.

[The1Dickens]

Just now, Bombastinator said:

From the sound of things there was a lot of fudgeups in the entire process.

Yeah, but that's when you'd expect them to double-up Support, no? To me, it sounds bass-ackwards.

[Adam Conn 1]

What did you expect from a souless corporation that just wants your money? You're a fool if you think they want to change the world for the better. It's always a game of releasing technology to be under their thumb. Unless you're a millionaire, even then I heard billionaires look down upon them now, there will always be strings, there will always be a price. Just know what horse you're backing and what you give up. 

 

[Bombastinator]

13 minutes ago, The1Dickens said:

Yeah, but that's when you'd expect them to double-up Support, no? To me, it sounds bass-ackwards.

 bassackwards.  The place from whenst the fudge emerges.  
 

they might do that if they knew that there was zero tech support could do because the product didn’t work to begin with and they knew it but they launched it anyway 

[Bombastinator]

2 minutes ago, Adam Conn 1 said:

What did you expect from a souless corporation that just wants your money? You're a fool if you think they want to change the world for the better. It's always a game of releasing technology to be under their thumb. Unless you're a millionaire, even then I heard billionaires look down upon them now, there will always be strings, there will always be a price. Just know what horse you're backing and what you give up. 

 

It’s been a long time since anyone has accused google of being anything but soulless. They actually removed their “don’t be evil” motto.

[Adam Conn 1]

6 minutes ago, Bombastinator said:

It’s been a long time since anyone has accused google of being anything but soulless. They actually removed their “don’t be evil” motto.

I'll give you that it's been a while since I've been back online. I'm slowly finding my voice online again and I was naive to think it would get better. 

 

[Bombastinator]

1 minute ago, Adam Conn 1 said:

I'll give you that it's been a while since I've been back online. I'm slowly finding my voice online again and I was naive to think it would get better. 

 

Huh?  You sound fine to me.  Did I come across as judging your comment?  Sorry.  I was trying to agree with it.  Argh.  I’m annoying everyone without meaning to today it seems.

[vanished]

Update:

 

Gamers Nexus has now taken a look at the whole stack, and here's the TL;DR:

• The service is outright not working for them at all - never mind latency, there are bigger issues at play here.
• If you have a corporate G-suite account like LTT and many other businesses, you are able to use it to buy Stadia, but not to actually play it.  They had to make a new normal Google account to actually try using the service.
• Their activation codes have gotten "lost in the mail", which is particularly odd since it's Google all the way down, from email service to the product itself.
• You need a Pixel phone to download the app to register even though a Pixel is not necessary to use the service.
• The controller is extremely difficult if not impossible to non-destructively disassemble.  This is not only unnecessary but in this case also problematic since the Li-ion battery is inside and as we all know, batteries wear out over time.  One reason I still like good ol' AAs on any device that it's still practical to use them with, but I digress.