[EOL] PSU Tier List rev. 14.8

[tosentm]

Hello,

 

With a wattage device, my pc pulls 150watts while browsing internet and around 400watts when playing a game at 144fps. I have a 3700x CPU with a 1080ti GPU.

 

I currently have a silent pro CM bronze80  1000w power supply which is 7-8 years old which I believe the efficiency isn't the same as it was when I bought it, and I was wondering if buying the Antec HCP platinum80 850w power supply (ranked S tier) will be a smart choice as in better efficiency and maybe pull less wattage? Local store has it for $119, they also have a seasonic focus px platinum80 650w (ranked A tier) for $89. 

 

Thank you

[Constantin]

I really wonder how come you don't have the Seasonic at the top of the least, as they make PSU's for Corsair top end and for the half of those brands

[Juular]

1 hour ago, Constantin said:

I really wonder how come you don't have the Seasonic at the top of the least, as they make PSU's for Corsair top end and for the half of those brands

Yet again.

First, we have methodology, with current it's version two topmost tiers require multi-rail, no Seasonic units are multirail but that doesn't make Seasonic units bad because of that since you will find their high-end units in tier A which is just a notch lower than tier A+.

Second, if manufacturer makes designs for other brands that doesn't make it inherently good just because of that. CWT, FSP, Super Flower are other manufacturers that you will find supplying designs for other brands exactly as often as Seasonic. Everyone makes mistakes, older Seasonic Focus Gold had issues, EVGA G3 by Super Flower had issues, EVGA G5 by FSP has issues, CWT, uh, i'm not aware of any high-end designs with any significant issues (other than probably insanely high OTP on Corsair RMx), and in fact, additionally to high-end Corsair units, it's also used by very acclaimed Bitfenix units (among others), so maybe it's CWT that is the best ? No, because it's not about the brand or manufacturer but the performance of each specific unit in question.

Third, Seasonic makes just one current Corsair lineup IIRC - AX, pretty much all other Corsair high-end ones are CWT.

[Sumolizer]

3 hours ago, LukeSavenije said:

60a or lower/rail

no early shutdowns

 

so basically not too much, but also not too little current.

 

there are likely other parts that come to the exact implementation, but i can't name them at this moment

Are the CXM's of 2011/2012 too much bad?

I mean i want to pair it with a system having around 250-300w Power consumption.

And i found a really good deal on a CX500m

[Prof. Lucifer]

Is the hdplex 400w a good PSU? (Or at least a good half PSU)

 

I want to try build a PC in an xbox one s and Linus used the hdplex 400w in his Xbox of build

[LukeSavenije]

1 hour ago, Sumolizer said:

And i found a really good deal on a CX500m

think about it first... would a budget psu from 8 years ago, eol by corsair still be good?

 

the answer is no, and the tier list indicates it clearly. due to group regulation the 5v can easily get out of specifications on it

1 hour ago, Juular said:

i'm not aware of any high-end designs with any significant issues

maybe lower wattage whisper and formula having some shutdown issues according to consumers, but that's about from what I've heard (450w-550w only)

[LukeSavenije]

3 hours ago, tosentm said:

focus px platinum80 650w (ranked A tier) for $89. 

can you show the link or a picture of the one they sell?

 

also, both are very good PSUs, you're perfectly fine if it turns out to be the 2019 version to grab either

[tosentm]

3 hours ago, LukeSavenije said:

can you show the link or a picture of the one they sell?

 

also, both are very good PSUs, you're perfectly fine if it turns out to be the 2019 version to grab either

https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16817151192

 

That seasonic came out in 2019. Is there also a 2019 version of the Antec HCP platinum80? 

 

I wrote it wrong above, local store has the seasonic for $95, but the Antec is sold on eBay for $119.

 

The UPC of the product on his eBay page is 761345239103. Not sure if that can help knowing it's a 2019 version and not a old version? 

 

And based on my needs, should I be getting something else? Or go single rail instead (like the seasonic)? What I hope the most is to see less wattage usage of my pc, since I really believe my current 1000w bronze80 7-8 year old power supply isn't working as efficient as it used to be. 

 

 

[LukeSavenije]

9 minutes ago, tosentm said:

Is there also a 2019 version of the Antec HCP platinum80? 

there isn't... it's based on the delta GM platform, which has been changed twice, of which once was on the hcp. the older version had a split pcb, the third "version" is the new v-platinum

 

if the seasonic is the one you linked, it's all good, the 2019 version without the ripple issues

[Vejnemojnen]

I'd be still interested in decent SFX PSU options. My original question was here above.

 

Basically, Corsair SF450 or SS SGX 450 are my two potential candidates, though I like EVGA GM as well. Any remarks about either of recommended SFX units would be welcome. It would go into a NZXT H200 ITX case, if that matters (I believe, the CPU cable of the Corsair is kind of short...)

[Fitz000]

All the items I've clicked on in the top 2 tiers show no pricing history in your pcbuild links.

Why are you showing us links to black holes?

[Juular]

On 1/24/2020 at 11:03 PM, Vejnemojnen said:

EVGA units only have 1-2 years in-store warranties.

They come with 7 years warranty too. Any of those you've mentioned would do but since EVGA GM are cheapest one i'd go with it.

1 hour ago, Fitz000 said:

All the items I've clicked on in the top 2 tiers show no pricing history in your pcbuild links.

Why are you showing us links to black holes?

Those links point at units with arbitrary wattage, choose the one that you need, most of lower wattage versions have better availability but since tier S units are very high-end ones, usually they are very expensive either way, you'll be completely okay with tier A\A+ units instead, they're cheaper.

[Vejnemojnen]

39 minutes ago, Juular said:

They come with 7 years warranty too. Any of those you've mentioned would do but since EVGA GM are cheapest one i'd go with it.

Those links point at units with arbitrary wattage, choose the one that you need, most of lower wattage versions have better availability but since tier S units are very high-end ones, usually they are very expensive either way, you'll be completely okay with tier A\A+ units instead, they're cheaper.

Thanks! Though checked Hungarian prices, and, the corsair costs roughly the same as Focus SGX, former with seven, latter with ten years IN STORE warranty. The Evga GM is more expensive than either of those, and only comes with 1-2 years STORE warranty (though I am aware, that the manufacturer's warranty is seven years )

 

Focus seems best bang for buck, though it only has one PCI-E cable. : )

[LukeSavenije]

3 hours ago, Fitz000 said:

All the items I've clicked on in the top 2 tiers show no pricing history in your pcbuild links.

could just be you? i do get them

 

for problems with pcpp, you have to go to them, not me

[Juular]

2 hours ago, Vejnemojnen said:

Thanks! Though checked Hungarian prices, and, the corsair costs roughly the same as Focus SGX, former with seven, latter with ten years IN STORE warranty. The Evga GM is more expensive than either of those, and only comes with 1-2 years STORE warranty (though I am aware, that the manufacturer's warranty is seven years )

 

Focus seems best bang for buck, though it only has one PCI-E cable. : )

For the same price i'd go with Corsair, it's quieter and smaller.

[Sapphiree]

If you allready moved ROG Strix you should do the same with all other's FocusPlusGold platform based psu's including FocusFX too.
I see more and more people see that favoring multi-rail psu's (only in this tier list) is extremely stupid, i fully agree with previous comments about it.

[Juular]

1 hour ago, Kaygooo said:

If you allready moved ROG Strix you should do the same with all other's FocusPlusGold platform based psu's including FocusFX too.
I see more and more people see that favoring multi-rail psu's (only in this tier list) is extremely stupid, i fully agree with previous comments about it.

Can you contribute to discussion about that with smth other than 'it's extremely stupid' ? This isn't your first post here and all of them were the same, you're not helping. ROG Strix were moved (i assume) because there were some review with testing overload ripple which may mean that it's newer revisions are based on Focus GX or there were some modifications that allowed it to perform better than base Focus FX platform (unlikely) or that this sole review with high overload ripple were performed on faulty unit, but since there were no other reviews of Focus FX with overload ripple testing we can't confirm the last version so only ROG Strix were moved. Regardless, this has nothing to do with it being single-rail and older Focus FX revisions had other problems other than high ripple so since it was phased out by Focus GX there are really no reason to move it back to tier A, if you want Seasonic Focus, buy newer, GX revision.

[Mezoxin]

 

my biggest problem with the tier list isn't its algorithm of ranking , i have my differences though regarding  giving priority to 12v ocp with its current method of implementation as stated previously 

the biggest flaw in my opinion  has more to do with the quality of the data that you base your judgments upon ,I see judgments made based on data from reviews  regardless of the competence and reputation of the reviewer and his lab equipment and does he even calibrate these equipment 

You can be the best Cardiologist in the world , and following the clinical practice guidelines of the American college of cardiology , but without having proper calibrated equipment all your hemodynamic parameters ( Blood pressure , Heart rate , ...etc) and blood analysis ( cardiac enzymes , electrolytes , ...etc) would be inaccurate and cause you to misdiagnose your patient

 

 

[Pedroski]

A build with ryzen 5 3600x + rtx2070 is considered mid end or high end?

I've been thinking on getting a corsair cx650m, would it be good?

[GoldenLag]

9 minutes ago, Mezoxin said:

I see judgments made based on data from reviews  regardless of the competence and reputation of the reviewer and his lab equipment and does he even calibrate these equipment 

can you point to one of these judgements instead of saying "i see" without presenting examples?

9 minutes ago, Mezoxin said:

i have my differences though regarding  giving priority to 12v ocp with its current method of implementation as stated previously 

are you reffering to the pre alpha points method being tested for feasibility, or multirail being used for the highest tiers as those are supposed to be the "workstation" tiers of hardware?

[GoldenLag]

3 minutes ago, Pedroski said:

A build with ryzen 5 3600x + rtx2070 is considered mid end or high end?

I've been thinking on getting a corsair cx650m, would it be good?

cxm =//= cx.. you only need 550, as such the cx550 would be fine. 

 

depending on the region there might be other offerings. 

[Mezoxin]

@GoldenLag. This my problem with how multirail 12v  ocp is currently implemented and why it shouldn’t be that much of a priority to make a psu tier A+ 

On 1/24/2020 at 12:37 PM, Mezoxin said:

12vOCP is good to have , but its not a priority  

there is a reason why Aris doesn't give high priority for 12v OCP , because its not implemented properly and probably will be worthless in most scenarios , 

12v OCP is usually set at 40A , now look at the PCIe cables , the bottleneck when determining the maximum  sustained current it can withstand would be the pins at the back of the PSU , with most cables you would have 3 live wires with 3 pins , each pin is rated for a maximum sustained load of 8A  , that means it's only good for 24A  while the OCP is set at 40A , so that OCP won't protect your cable against damage unless the only reason you would exceed 24A would be some sort of resistive load that formed due to pinched wires or broken connectors that would cause your current to spike above 40 A , but in any use case that you will find yourself operating at a sustained load between 24A-40A you are damaging your cables without having your protections kick in 

now what happens if you overload your molex cables with pcie  adaptors ? would the 12vOCP help ? no it wont because again that cable would be rated for a maximum of 8A since it has a single 12V pin 

this is an rmi 850 

HX1200

 

As for the data sources ,I wouldn’t trust any reviewer except Aris  as he is the only reviewer i have seen who is currently active and has the competence to know what he is talking about , proper calibrated lab equipment , consistent testing methodology and most importantly he tests protections.

[grmaster]

I agree in merging tier a with tier a+.

trying to tier them by performance and quality seems too much, if someone wants to know why txm is cheaper than rmx they should read a review. This list needs to stay simple, just add more psus, more info, more sources...

[GoldenLag]

5 minutes ago, Mezoxin said:

As for the data sources ,I wouldn’t trust any reviewer except Aris  as he is the only reviewer i have seen who is currently active and has the competence to know what he is talking about , proper calibrated lab equipment , consistent testing methodology and most importantly he tests protections.

Any reasoning to not trust other reviewers? Or any examples as to only trust Aris?

 

6 minutes ago, Mezoxin said:

GoldenLag. This my problem with how multirail 12v  ocp is currently implemented and why it shouldn’t be that much of a priority to make a psu tier A+

For the time being, this is likely to remain unchanged, tho description of the tiers might change to better represent them. 

 

I do understand why people dont entirely agree with the approach. 

[Mezoxin]

@GoldenLag the short answer would be , it's not cheap nor is it easy to have a state of the art lab , with equipment that are calibrated properly and periodically, and have the competence to know how to perform measurements and the importance  of a consistent methodology when doing reviews to have proper judgments

the only one i see who fits this profile and is currently active now is Aris , he is an electrical engineer with a PHD and decades of industry experience , he is even the only one who properly tests protections.

the examples for not trusting other reviewers are endless , i have seen contradicting results over the years with many reviewers that are well known , the latest i have seen was from zardon who stated that the Riotoro enigma g2 shutdown at 107% overload ,also when he tested the focus plus he reported the same ( This shows you he has a consistent flaw when taking measurements when testing for shut in load) , now that is a reviewer who has a pretty expensive lab and decent experience , but not expertise in PSU testing

https://www.kitguru.net/components/power-supplies/zardon/riotoro-enigma-850w-g2-power-supply-review/5/

https://www.kitguru.net/components/power-supplies/zardon/seasonic-focus-plus-gold-fx-850w-psu-review/5/

 

this is a pretty low value , and inconsistent with how OPP is normally set   above 125% by almost all manufacturers to allow for transient spikes when operating within its nominal capacity , and also inconsistent with the real values of the seasonic fx ( all models)  that has  its opp at 137% , as Aris has stated and many  other foreign reviewers have stated as well 

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/seasonic-focus-plus-gold-850-psu,5247-6.html 

 

BTW , you have decided to set the ritoro g2 in tier A based on Zardon faulty OPP measurements , as you have thought that it had its OPP is set below 120% Which you believe is when these 268mv dangerous ripples happen  according to the results of another review from PCeva that no one has ever  reproduced 

well then it neither has its OPP at 107% and guess what , another random reviewer says that it worked till 140% and then died , What to do now ? are we going to chase random reviewers to the rest of our lives ? or maybe make a  tier list of PSU reviewers ?

 

https://www.hardwareluxx.de/index.php/artikel/hardware/netzteile/46223-riotoro-enigma-g2-850w-im-test.html?start=1