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TrainFan2019

Why is the notch so hated by everyone?

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i actually like the pre-iphone X phones, with the somewhat large top and bottom bezel

 

the notch just screams "ur rich af" to me


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Its all about perspective.  Like anything from choosing a car, to a life long wife / husband / partner to as this discussion... a phone with a notch.

You weigh up the pros and cons of features v aesthetic and decide what you can live / put up with and what you can't.

 

I came from a Samsung Galaxy S8 Plus with curved screen and no notch which in the last week was replaced with an Iphone 11 Pro Max and initially found the notch quiet distracting

 

However I quickly got used to it / realised that the benefits of lightening fast face-id for example, fit very well into my usage scenarios.  

I dropped my s8 because I was reaching round to the rear fingerprint reader to login to online banking and boom, dropped it!

 

Sure I had to make some adjustments with the iPhone, like make more use of dark mode and darker wallpapers which for the most lessen the impact of the notch.

 

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Some failed to realized the notch used to be a bezel, so I don't get why some are complaining about it so much.


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Have you heard of "dead pixels" before?  It's where one or more subpixels on your display become unable to turn on or off, resulting a permanently black or coloured spot on your screen.  Most manufacturers won't cover it under warranty until there's a few, which many people find frustrating as even a single one can be quite annoying, but by the time there's 4 or 5, I think most places will let you send it in.  This is because manufacturers, although they want to maximize profit and avoid frivolous returns, understand that a non-functional dot on your display could be very annoying, as would a crack, scratch, dust spec, etc.  It distracts from the content you're trying to view, and may even obscure important information.  After all, one of the most deeply rooted and essential axioms in computing is that every display is a complete and unaltered rectangle and nothing will ever interfere with that.  If it did, it would take a colossal amount of software support to work around it, and even if you did, some content would always be problematic (games, videos, etc.) - you'd have to choose between shrinking the content so it appears unmolested by the deformed display, or accept that some of the content would be cropped and lost.  That's a horrible experience that no one in their right mind would want to deal with, and so a lot of care is put into binning and testing panels so dead pixels are unlikely to occur.

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7 hours ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

Have you heard of "dead pixels" before?  It's where one or more subpixels on your display become unable to turn on or off, resulting a permanently black or coloured spot on your screen.  Most manufacturers won't cover it under warranty until there's a few, which many people find frustrating as even a single one can be quite annoying, but by the time there's 4 or 5, I think most places will let you send it in.  This is because manufacturers, although they want to maximize profit and avoid frivolous returns, understand that a non-functional dot on your display could be very annoying, as would a crack, scratch, dust spec, etc.  It distracts from the content you're trying to view, and may even obscure important information.  After all, one of the most deeply rooted and essential axioms in computing is that every display is a complete and unaltered rectangle and nothing will ever interfere with that.  If it did, it would take a colossal amount of software support to work around it, and even if you did, some content would always be problematic (games, videos, etc.) - you'd have to choose between shrinking the content so it appears unmolested by the deformed display, or accept that some of the content would be cropped and lost.  That's a horrible experience that no one in their right mind would want to deal with, and so a lot of care is put into binning and testing panels so dead pixels are unlikely to occur.

rojas4.png.23f37d050fc56f0eb45081e43c9a3c9b.png :P 

 

I guess you don't like the notch? ;) 

 

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3 hours ago, Graham Carter said:

rojas4.png.23f37d050fc56f0eb45081e43c9a3c9b.png :P 

 

I guess you don't like the notch? ;) 

 

Definitely not.  Despise it with a passion.  It's an unacceptable and obsolete workaround to a problem that doesn't even exist.

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The notch is a transition between having larger bezels and having a camera either in screen or in another location. Its an in-between technology that is hated. It seems like a very poor compromise to what should be changed. It is hated that since screens have existed they have either been square or rectangular for the most part. All content is created with this in mind and programming for it is very easy as dimensions are set. Once you introduce a strange anomaly where dimensions now have extra parts can really cause issues. 

 

Companies currently like to have a yearly phone release and have small incremental upgrades. This causes them to try and fit in non finished technology so they can be the first one out with it. There is a difference between being on the bleeding edge of technology and buying a limited Galaxy Fold and having every new phone have a notch that will go away very quickly as camera companies learn how to put a camera behind the screen. So instead of having the same phones out for a few years where they will perform 100% ok they release small incremental updates every year and to make it look different every year but keep their same overall look is difficult where adding a notch increases screen size and lets them brag about having a bigger screen. This is why I believe there is so much hate for a notch. 

 

If you want something to hate on please open a thread about how every phone is made to be very delicate and everyone puts these big ass bulky cases on them. Why cant they be built to last and have a delicate version instead of watching everyone buy this breakable piece of technology and put ugly AF cases that make the phone 3X bigger. 

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Whilst the technicalities of the notch make for interesting reading / discussion and certainly fuel this thread, its not just that one sided.  Granted its an "in-between techonolgy" but then there are dozens of devices which employ in-between technology... 5g been a good example of this

 

Samsung are another good example of in-between technology and rushed out the beneath screen fingerprint sensor on some phone, however from all of the reviews I have read, its slower and less accurate than traditional sensors.

 

I'd like to bring the focus back on the "hatred question" - ok so its not and ideal solution, but then I personally have found it a refreshing change from the sea of uniformly shaped rectangualr slabs.  

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look at first "notch" LG V10, its just beautiful.

notch disrupts the aspect ratio, covers the screen, irritating under any full screen apps 

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I guess I should go into more specifics on my reasoning.  It is multi-faceted.

 

1. It's done wrong.

This is perhaps the biggest reason because everything else hangs off of this.  I actually wouldn't be opposed if it was done correctly, but I have not yet seen proof that any phone has managed it.

 

I'm thankful that the word "notch" has caught on to describe it because that is indeed what it is, a notch out of the screen.  This is, for what I would hope are obvious reasons, very stupid.  In case they are not obvious, hopefully my other points will explain that, but I digress.  This is the opposite of what it should be.  You are not taking away from the screen, you are adding to it.  Screens with a "notch" should be programmed and used such that all content is displayed on and has access to only the "core rectangle", and the two extra little bumps beside it are reserved for the clock and system icons.  This lifts those things out of the main area, allowing you to get a bit more screenspace for everything else.  Functionally, it would be not different to having a traditional normal display, and two tiny secondary screens - maybe they could even be a different tech like e-ink so your notifs and time are always visible with no drain on battery and no risk of burn in.  This is something I could get behind.

 

Unfortunately, this is not how it's done from what I can tell.  The manufacturers and OS devs and whoever else is to blame treat the outer rectangle - the bounding box - as the normal display, and fill it with video, games, etc. so you end up with a notch cut out of your content.  I cannot fathom to whom this would ever be acceptable, but it would seem by sales figures that no one seems to care.  Perhaps they should just move the "hole punch" into the middle of the screen so you always are looking into the camera in selfies without having to take your eyes off the display.  People would love that.

 

As for why having a chunk out of your screen is bad, as if that needs explaining, see my previous post.

 

2. It's a hack / cheap workaround / admission of failure and lack of courage.

Forever now we've had phones with a bezel that holds the important components which couldn't be shrunk further or put behind the display.  Over time, they've been getting smaller and smaller to the point where on some well designed phones, they're hardly even there anymore and I highly doubt most people would find them bothersome.  But, innovation never stops, so the next step is to get rid of them completely.  There are two ways to do this:

  1. Put them under the display
  2. Move them somewhere else

We're seeing progress with #1 already - Xiaomi is working on a phone with an under screen camera, and while it is not yet known how well that will work, it's certainly very "next gen".  The more immediately practical solution though is to go with option #2.  Make the phone and/or cameras slide, or pop up, or flip up, etc.  There are even advantages to this over a traditional setup:

  1. You can use the superior main cam as a selfie cam, thus increasing quality and reducing cost since you're not including additional cameras
  2. You don't have a camera pointed at you at all times.  People often tape their laptop webcams but for some reason always seem to forget about their phones.  Strange.

The main knock against this approach is simply that it uses moving parts, and while I agree that they are something to be avoided at all costs, based on what I have seen from JerryRigEverything's tests on numerous motorized popup cameras, they are very durable and should not pose any issue to lifespan (this of course with a caveat that every device is different ant just because most are good doesn't mean they all are.  I know of at least one that is indeed garbage).  Some people may raise the question of water resistance but depending on the design that should be a non-issue.  People forget the kinds of devices that have had high grade IP ratings in the past.  Manufacturers have bet on a combination of people having short memories and people being susceptible to believing what ever BS they're told in order to make you think that an unrepairable featureless glass slab is the only way to get water resistance.  Reminder: the S5 from 2014 had a removable battery and a headphone jack and still managed an IP67 rating.

 

The notch is a cop-out - a way to pretend like you're ready to move on from bezels without actually being able to do so yet, either because you lack the technology, or simply the will and courage to innovate.  These other options exist, which brings me to my next point...

 

3. It's unnecessary.

There are other ways to build a phone that avoid this atrocity.  Either stick with bezels until you can get rid of them properly, or take on one of these other more modern solutions and actually get that full screen display you're after.  Thin bezels made thick bezels obsolete.  No bezels made the notch obsolete.  It's time to move on.  If random Chinese brands selling devices for half as much can figure out how to do it, then big names like Google and Apple should be able to as well. It's just embarrassing at this point.

 

4. It's ugly.

Obviously this is subjective, but this whole list is why I personally hate it, so it's just as valid as anything to include imo.  I hated it from the moment I saw it and it's only gotten worse since then because at least when it was new, it was ugly but new.  Now it's ugly and obsolete.  When I see a phone with a notch it conjures up the same mental feeling you might get now seeing a dedicated stand-alone PhysX card from before nvidia bought it, or a 3D TV, or one of those 4 subpixel TVs with the dedicated yellow, or a Juicero.  Things that seemed like they were gonna be huge at the time but very quickly died off and make you just go "oh no, you poor bastard, you fell for that?"

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After using a phone with a Notch, It does not really bother me at all. You just get used to it after some time.

The only trend I'm worried about is the Motorized camera thingy, I don't like having a pop-up camera at all.

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1 hour ago, MagnumOpus said:

After using a phone with a Notch, It does not really bother me at all. You just get used to it after some time.

The only trend I'm worried about is the Motorized camera thingy, I don't like having a pop-up camera at all.

Same here, but for pop up camera as we go bezel less; it'll be interesting on how phone makers will develop a front camera.

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On 10/4/2019 at 12:34 PM, TrainFan2019 said:

I don't get why everyone seems to hate the notch so much. What's so bad about it? And where else are they supposed to put the face camera?

I've said this before on other threads but I'll say it again here - something like the G6 from LG proved that you can have very thin bezels, maximizing screen real estate, and still fit all your sensors that you need for your cameras. Granted, sensors nowadays do a little more room but still, I think the aesthetics of that phone has yet to be topped by anything on the market to date. I think people's biggest issue with the notch, as others have eluded to, is simply how jarring it is and how it impedes on the screen real estate. I liked what @Ryan_Vickers said in it's overall execution, or lack thereof, and how basically pointless it is as a whole.

 

I will always trade somewhat thicker bezels for a more rounded design, rather then go for something like a notch, even if it is just a teardrop one. It's personal preference really. In the same vein, so called all screen displays are also quite stupid. But that's for another thread ;)


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22 hours ago, DarkShame2 said:

Same here, but for pop up camera as we go bezel less; it'll be interesting on how phone makers will develop a front camera.

I actually don't mind having some bezels on the phone tbqh. I'll be fine with small bezels like the one on the Note 9 or the upcoming Pixel 4(Excluding the forehead, But hey I don't mind it)

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I hated the idea until I ended up upgrading to a notch🙃 I think the hate for me was that it just didn't really seem like an advancement in technology. A notch isn't really a step towords a full screen display, it's a poor engineering stopgap until something better comes along (and arguably already has!) Having said that, now that I've been using a notched display, I quite like it! For most games, it doesn't get in the way and I have "more" screen. For browsers and most apps, the notifications live up there either side of the notch and everything seems quite happy. I barely watch videos on my phone, save for a few podcast style videos so that's not an issue for me. It has pretty much become invisible to me at this stage.

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