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seee the state im in nooow

Intel Concedes HEDT, Practically slashes pricing in half with Cascade Lake X

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Posted · Original PosterOP

giphy.gif

 

via: are you kidding?! everyone started livestreaming this news!

https://www.anandtech.com/show/14925/intel-cascade-lakex-for-hedt-18-cores-for-under-1000

 

So after suffering an embargo breach (thanks to videocardz), Intel announced their entire 10th gen Cascade Lake X HEDT lineup, which is still on X299 and 14nm for the moment.

kinda interesting considered that I quite recently watched Level1Tech's commentary on how Intel should slash prices of existing 9th gen CPUs and drop the 20XX socket for HEDT (instead opting for the... 36XX socket thing)

Spoiler

 

 

Quote

Anandtech:

This pricing is a significant shift in Intel's strategy, and a number of fingers will be pointed at AMD as having made this happen. Next month AMD is set to launch its 16-core Ryzen 9 3950X at $749, which will offer 16 PCIe 4.0 lanes for slots (+4 for M.2, +4 for chipset) and support for 128 GB of DRAM. So Intel needed something similarly speedy, but with more PCIe lanes and more memory support that they could offer for just a bit more, leading to the 10980XE for $979. Ultimately, the on-shelf price is often just slightly higher than tray price, so don't be surprised if retail prices land at around $1000. 

if anything, this still falls under "intel cuts prices of X299 CPUs", so I'm glad intel is now starting to face the music (despite being 1 or 2 generations too late)

 

Quote

 

 

so the quick rundown on numbers:

Quote

 

  core Base nC Boost 1C Boost Price $/C
10 980XE 18c36t 3.0 3.8 4.8 979 54.38*
10 940X 14c28t 3.3 4.1 4.8 784 56*
10 920X 12c24t 3.5 4.3 4.8 689 57.41*
10 900X 10c20t 3.7 4.3 4.7 590 59*
 
TR 2970WX 24c48t 3.0 unequal 4.2 1299 54.12
TR 2950X 16c32t 3.5 unequal 4.3 899 56.18
TR 2920X 12c24t 3.5 unequal 4.4 649 54.08
R9 3950X 16c32t 3.5 unequal 4.6 749 46.81
R9 3900X 12c24t 3.8 unequal 4.7 499 41.58
 
9 980XE 18c36t 3.0 unspecified 4.5 1979 109.94
9 940X 14c28t 3.3 unspecified 4.5 1387 99.07
9 920X 12c24t 3.5 unspecified 4.5 1189 99.08
9 900X 10c20t 3.5 unspecified 4.5 989 98.9

* tray pricing. retail may be higher

 

and for reference: EPYC 7002:

  core Base nC Boost 1C Boost Price $/C
EPYC 7402P 24c48t 2.8 unspecified 3.35 1250 52.08
EPYC 7302P 16c32t 3.0 unspecified 3.30 825 51.56
EPYC 7272 12c24t 2.9 unspecified 3.35 625 52.08

 

aaaaand sorted by core count

    core Base nC Boost 1C Boost Price $/C
  EPYC 7402P 24c48t 2.8 unspecified 3.35 1250 52.08
  TR 2970WX 24c48t 3.0 unequal 4.2 1299 54.12
10 980XE 18c36t 3.0 3.8 4.8 979 54.38
  9 980XE 18c36t 3.0 unspecified 4.5 1979 109.94
  EPYC 7302P 16c32t 3.0 unspecified 3.3 825 51.56
  R9 3950X 16c32t 3.5 unequal 4.6 749 46.81
  TR 2950X 16c32t 3.5 unequal 4.3 899 56.18
10 940X 14c28t 3.3 4.1 4.8 784 56
  9 940X 14c28t 3.3 unspecified 4.5 1387 99.07
10 920X 12c24t 3.5 4.3 4.8 689 57.41
  9 920X 12c24t 3.5 unspecified 4.5 1189 99.08
  EPYC 7272 12c24t 2.9 unspecified 3.35 625 52.08
  R9 3990X 12c24t 3.8 unequal 4.7 499 41.58
  TR 2920X 12c24t 3.5 unequal 4.4 649 54.08
10 900X 10c20t 3.7 4.3 4.7 590 59
  9 900X 10c20t 3.5 unspecified 4.5 989 98.9
 
Quote

Anandtech:

There is no 16-core in this stack, with Intel's official reasoning being that they assess the market with each generation and they don't believe there's a suitable price point for such a part when the 14C and 18C parts are so close. Most people will point the finger and say that no-16 core Intel part means no direct comparison with the Ryzen 9 3950X, which is something to think about.

 

Another point to note is that Intel has stopped this stack at the 10 core and no lower. This means that there will be no cross over between Intel's consumer processor stack and the HEDT stack, with users needing to spend just a little bit more from the Core i9-9900K/KF to reach up to the Core i9-10900X. It will be interesting to see where Intel's Core i9-9900KS fits in, although that still only has dual channel memory and 16 PCIe 3.0 lanes.

... interesting. still pretty safe to second guess that intel trying to produce less stuff on their 14nm fabs to manage themselves on capacity. but as of now they have their point of... not seeing the point of the omitted processors

Quote

Anandtech:

These CPUs will have the same security mitigations as the Cascade Lake Xeon processors, with updated hardware mitigations for a number of side channel attacks. We are waiting to hear from Intel if the firmware that supports these processors will also have additional fixes in for Zombieload by default.

 

One question about this launch is surrounding Intel’s 14nm capacity. Within the last week, there have been reports that despite Intel’s best efforts and promises to match demand, and that Q3 and upcoming for Q4 is going to be busier than expected. We reached out to Intel last week for clarification, and the company said that the bulk of its capacity is focusing on the high-end processors in the market: the Xeon Scalable, the Core i9, Core i7, and Core i5. It will be interesting to see if launching another family of products is going to put additional strain on Intel’s capacity and demand.

 

now:

tIkz93Y.png

(... also dinosaur comics)

 

on CLX and X299:

it's still a platform right at the tail end of its life, just in terms of how much it can offer vs X399, but for those seeking a more familiar/stable platform, they've now got the astronomical price cut everyone wants.

if Intel really wanted to compete, then they should have redone the layout and at the very least match what threadripper has to offer in terms of downstream devices and IO (c'mon, 60 usable lanes vs 40/44), but i guess they've overstretched themselves to be able to out an entirely new platform this year, so there's the consolation.

 

on CLX vs TR2K and Ryzen 3K:

seeing that CLX is finally matching TR2K in price per core, I'd bet that they might be in the "favourable alternative" position when TR3K hits the shelves. Seriously, considering the prices of EPYC 7002 stuff, i seriously doubt AMD would be able to see intel's pricing move and go "LOL JEBAIT" again ._. (go compare the 3900X with the 7272P)

 

as for buying a dual-die ryzen desktop vs a 10 to 14-core intel HEDT part, it still boils down to PCIe utility, but considering there're heavier teething issues on ryzen (which should be ironed out soon actually), and intel's promise of a flat all-core boost within the ballpark of Ryzen 3K's single-core boost, I'd reckon it's stiiiiiiiiill a safe buy for intel there

 

on my next rig:

I probably have mentioned that I'm looking to get anything from TR3K for the release price of the 2950X, but seeing the prices on CLX, I'd be lying if I were to say that I'm not swayed. the all-core boost of the X940X 10940X frankly would match the 2950X (in my rough guesstimates), although that would all be moot when TR3K hits the shelves and wipe most leaderboards clean again

in that aspect, AMD can probably price higher just from price-to-performance pricing (that was a hard sentence to attempt to adjust), so I'll still be keeping tabs on comparisons with TR3K vs a 2950X and a 10940X.

 

 

my choice between TR3K and CLX is simple:

 

can I get an mATX board on them?

 

I might have made a choice earlier in life that have started to bite me in that aspect.

 

,_,

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Call me when we can run the Enterprise D off of a single chip. Until then I'm happy with my R5 2600 ?


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29 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

EPYC 7402P 24c48t 2.8 unspecified 3.35 1250 52.08

EPYC 7302P 16c32t 3 unspecified 3.3 825 51.56

EPYC 7272 12c24t 2.9 unspecified 3.35 625 52.08

arent there specific boards where you can overclock these?

 

like derbauer overclocked their 32 core 1st gen Epyc CPUs. while technically not officially supported, there are boards that should be able to do it. 

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Intel is back! They've finally woken up and smelt the coffee. (Couldn't resist)

 

The question though is..will it be enough? AMD can now respond to this and price the 24 core how they want. They price that 24 core at $1000 or even $1050-1100 and Intel is still in trouble. The 24 core is an absolute monster of a chip and will wipe the floor with Cascade Lake X in the performance charts.

 

From what I've seen, Cascade Lake X has a nice clock increase..but in terms of IPC there isn't much, and it's still 14nm. Power consumption certainly won't look pretty on these parts either. I wouldn't be surprised if the 24 core consumes less than even something like the 12c and 14c parts.

 

But fair play to Intel. They knew $2000 wasn't going to cut it this time around. This a big moment. Intel is now going to come back with a vengeance in the next few years. For now, Zen3 should be enough to fend off Intel's next wave of CPU's..but after that AMD is going to need to brace for impact cause when Intel means business, they don't hold back.

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted · Original PosterOP
4 minutes ago, GoldenLag said:

arent there specific boards where you can overclock these?

 

like derbauer overclocked their 32 core 1st gen Epyc CPUs. while technically not officially supported, there are boards that should be able to do it. 

feels like a super bodgy method though o_o not sure if der8auer was using this one

https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/overclock-your-amd-epyc.23422/

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so it's 14+++ now?


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Still have no reason to go with Intel as an upgrade. Not really seeing anything that's truly new from them.


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Posted · Original PosterOP
1 minute ago, Dabombinable said:

Still have no reason to go with Intel as an upgrade. Not really seeing anything that's truly new from them.

definitely doesn't make sense for existing SKLX and SKLX refresh owners ._.

for those still on the intel side of the fence that don't already own one, I'd say it's the same advice as people still (for some reason) on the fence on buying a 1050ti (i.e. just buy the 1650)

 

I'll still be waiting on TR3K. it's not like my PC would die before then (inb4 jinx)

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7 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

definitely doesn't make sense for existing SKLX and SKLX refresh owners ._.

for those still on the intel side of the fence that don't already own one, I'd say it's the same advice as people still (for some reason) on the fence on buying a 1050ti (i.e. just buy the 1650)

 

I'll still be waiting on TR3K. it's not like my PC would die before then (inb4 jinx)

Mine might not last that long. At least not without the board having something else die.


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We do not sell cosmetics. We just blind animals."

 

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34 minutes ago, williamcll said:

so it's 14+++ now?

Skylake

Kaby Lake

Coffee Lake

Cascade Lake

 

14++++ by my count.


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56 minutes ago, MeatFeastMan said:

Intel is back!

...snip...

I'm sorry but what a load of complete drivel. Intel aren't back at all, they've had to slash pricing because they're getting slaughtered across the board. Cascade Lake X is nothing new, it's a refinement of Skylake, still 14nm and Intel knew that to even try and compete they had to cut prices because people are switching to Zen on mass.

 

A company cutting prices to try and survive does not mean they're back, it means they're getting their asses handed to them on a plate.

 

As soon as TR3 launches Cascade Lake X will be nothing but a speck of dust in the ocean. I mean it's got more cores, higher IPC, PCIe 4.0, more PCIe lanes and will probably be around the same price if not cheaper.


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5 minutes ago, Master Disaster said:

As soon as TR3 launches Cascade Lake X will be nothing but a speck of dust in the ocean.

Rule 2 still stands. 

 

Other products more or less do the job that skylake X does, but either faster or cheaper. 

 

And TR3 really can be mad if Epyc 7002 pricing is anything to go by. 

 

Lets not forget the memeworthy power envelope that the 9990xe presented or even the 9980xe. While custom Cooling is fun, you start to reach something that is too hard to deal with (and half the boards really cant handle)

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I'm only halfway through my morning coffee (lake), but this is my take on it:

 

Cascade Lake-X vs Ryzen 3000:

CLX has more PCIe lanes, AVX-512 support, more ram bandwidth. The monolithhic nature may help in some workloads.

Zen 2 has power efficiency in its favour, more L3 cache overall but more segmented. For "normal" people Zen 2 is probably the safer choice, but for heavy hitting loads CLX will still run away.

 

CLX vs TR3K is going to hurt for Intel. They (probably) can't match core counts, ram bandwidth, and PCIe lanes too. I was kinda hoping they would use Cascade Lake AP not SP as basis as they then could keep up. AVX-512 is about the only significant differentiator, and if it is used by your workloads, it could still swing it in those cases. When Intel said they were going to offer double the bang per buck, I was kinda hoping they would also extend upwards with that. Sadly not the case.

 

I recently swapped my 7800X for a new 7920X I saw going cheap (comparable to a 3900!) so CLX doesn't really offer much more than that. Even 12 cores is more of a "because I can" thing than a "need" for me.


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9 minutes ago, porina said:

I'm only halfway through my morning coffee (lake), but this is my take on it:

 

Cascade Lake-X vs Ryzen 3000:

CLX has more PCIe lanes, AVX-512 support, more ram bandwidth. The monolithhic nature may help in some workloads.

Zen 2 has power efficiency in its favour, more L3 cache overall but more segmented. For "normal" people Zen 2 is probably the safer choice, but for heavy hitting loads CLX will still run away.

 

CLX vs TR3K is going to hurt for Intel. They (probably) can't match core counts, ram bandwidth, and PCIe lanes too. I was kinda hoping they would use Cascade Lake AP not SP as basis as they then could keep up. AVX-512 is about the only significant differentiator, and if it is used by your workloads, it could still swing it in those cases. When Intel said they were going to offer double the bang per buck, I was kinda hoping they would also extend upwards with that. Sadly not the case.

 

I recently swapped my 7800X for a new 7920X I saw going cheap (comparable to a 3900!) so CLX doesn't really offer much more than that. Even 12 cores is more of a "because I can" thing than a "need" for me.

Skylake-X was always a good product that was over priced and ran quite hot if you wanted good performance out of it. Cascade Lake-X, now at a much lower price, is a good product at a good price in certain workloads. You're still going to need at least 100USD in cooling, just to be comfortable, but Intel finally blinked in one of the CPU spaces. Intel will keep a lot of market share in the HEDT space because it gets to use all of its entrenched advantages and it's competitively priced. Intel just had to not be 2x per core compared to AMD to keep market share.

 

Still, AMD should be rolling out a whole new set of platforms handling up to 32c on HEDT. And the 24c is probably going to cost 999USD. Somehow, the stiffest competition in the CPU space is going to be 1k USD parts. haha

 

Unmentioned, but this pretty much renders the 9900k worthless. Get the 10c Cascade Lake-X part over it, if you're building a high-end system. Clocks will be similar, you're on a better platform and the costs will be pretty similar. 

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2 hours ago, GoldenLag said:

arent there specific boards where you can overclock these?

 

like derbauer overclocked their 32 core 1st gen Epyc CPUs. while technically not officially supported, there are boards that should be able to do it. 

problem is you need extra hardware to do it, he use his own ic2 controller to change the vrm's settings 

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1 minute ago, cj09beira said:

problem is you need extra hardware to do it, he use his own ic2 controller to change the vrm's settings 

Welp, that puts it outside the realm of consumers. 

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59 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Yes, actually. Maybe even 14nm++++, though Intel gave up trying to name things that way because they keep tweaking things. They're on P & R steppings of Skylake dies, at this point.

Pretty sure Cascade Lake X is still 14nm++. Comet Lake was supposed to be the next step last I knew making it 14nm+++.

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1 minute ago, schwellmo92 said:

Pretty sure Cascade Lake X is still 14nm++. Comet Lake was supposed to be the next step last I knew making it 14nm+++.

Intel mixes & matches, and they keep rolling out minor tweaks. At this point, there's no real logical sense to the + naming scheme.

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36 minutes ago, VegetableStu said:

you know, for intel's good, I kinda wished they called them i9 1080XE, i9 1040X, i9 1020X, etc. since the second 9 in 9980XE just says it's an i9 ._.

(even if there's a GTX 1080. so long as the next one isn't i9 2080XE)

Lets just hope we dont get some midrange called the 1650XE. Because its closer to 2080XE than it is to 1080XE, but its not 1080XE

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