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Cora_Lie

“Everything as a service” is coming—but we’re not there quite yet

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5 minutes ago, mr moose said:

 

 

Nearly every article you read about tech and consumer software services is an opinion piece because they all rely on a personal definition of what the consumer law is and how the tech is used.

 

The reason these discussions take off and go in all directions is a combination of those differences in understanding of product/service/consumer law and the fact that we genuinely have little power to control this market, so a certain amount of fear drives the discussion into all sorts of places.

If Microsoft let's say release a press release their next release of Windows OS will be subscription based then it's news. But if a person writes about Microsoft going subscription based while Microsoft themselves mentions nothing about it, then it's an opinion piece.
The author is trying to tied "everything as a service" with "Cloud", which I can't seem to see any connections between them.

For me I don't like subscription base service is because of cost. I don't use the program often, so why do I have to pay a monthly fee for it.


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1 minute ago, NumLock21 said:

If Microsoft let's say release a press release their next release of Windows OS will be subscription based then it's news. But if a person writes about Microsoft going subscription based while Microsoft themselves mentions nothing about it, then it's an opinion piece.
The author is trying to tied "everything as a service" with "Cloud", which I can't seem to see any connections between them.

I think the idea being proposed is that companies or facilities resort back to the old mainframe style of system using the cloud as the mainframe and all the onsite network infrastructure becomes simply an internet sharing connection to client ends and nothing more.  This way IT departments don't manage software licenses, storage, domain handling or even to a degree security.  It is all done by the cloud service provider.

 

Again that is based on the opinion of the author that such a system is viable.  If MS offer a service like this (which they could) then you are right that would be news, but all the articles surrounding it that infer a particular outcome or motive will be largely opinions pieces based on their own concepts of what it all means.

 

 


QuicK and DirtY. Read the CoC it's like a guide on how not to be moron.  Also I don't have an issue with the VS series.

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1 hour ago, NumLock21 said:

It seems the author of the article is trying to tie cloud and subscription together, but subscription has nothing to do with the cloud. A person can have a subscription service for Adobe CC where they pay a monthly fee, but they don't have cloud storage, they save their work on their own computer.

Do they, though? I didn't sit through the entire thing because it's a bit of a dull read, but it seemed more like a discussion about the general direction in IT recently being the excessive (and sometimes unnecessary) transition of physical infrastructure in enterprises to cloud services like AWS or Azure, and the problems that are following. I didn't really see anything talking about consumer software and their move to subscription based services, this all seems to be talk about enterprise.

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

Nearly every article you read about tech and consumer software services is an opinion piece because they all rely on a personal definition of what the consumer law is and how the tech is used.

My problem isn't so much that it's an opinion piece, it's that the discussion being had in this thread is about consumer software services and privacy concerns. That's not what the article is about. As I mentioned above, it seems more about enterprises shifting physical infrastructure to the cloud. The first reply mentioning user privacy absolutely startled me, for example, when the user complained about it being a major concern. If the user were fully aware of what the article is discussing and was still being honest (as well as all of those "agrees"), then they're insinuating that they'd trust Joe Schmo's infrastructure and security over Amazon or Microsoft's. I don't, personally, especially since I've watched Amazon close public S3 buckets that responsible companies didn't bother to acknowledge as a problem.


anime sucks

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2 hours ago, Suika said:

 

My problem isn't so much that it's an opinion piece, it's that the discussion being had in this thread is about consumer software services and privacy concerns.

That's because surprisingly few of us on this forum have any real commercial IT experience.  Most of our fears and discussions are going to center around the consumer side.

 

2 hours ago, Suika said:

That's not what the article is about. As I mentioned above, it seems more about enterprises shifting physical infrastructure to the cloud. The first reply mentioning user privacy absolutely startled me, for example, when the user complained about it being a major concern. If the user were fully aware of what the article is discussing and was still being honest (as well as all of those "agrees"), then they're insinuating that they'd trust Joe Schmo's infrastructure and security over Amazon or Microsoft's. I don't, personally, especially since I've watched Amazon close public S3 buckets that responsible companies didn't bother to acknowledge as a problem.

 

About the only way I can see privacy being an issue in cloud related services for business is in the fact that the cloud operators have access to anything not user encrypted in the cloud.   I.E there are instances where MS staff may access user data to investigate an issue with their services (it's in their ToS).  I assume the same is with amazon and google.   But you are still right, it is different to consumer side privacy concerns. 


QuicK and DirtY. Read the CoC it's like a guide on how not to be moron.  Also I don't have an issue with the VS series.

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3 hours ago, mr moose said:

That's because surprisingly few of us on this forum have any real commercial IT experience.  Most of our fears and discussions are going to center around the consumer side.

I can expect that, but what I'd expect more of is users trying to give the article the slightest amount of time in the day to understand that this thread isn't applicable to the discussions they've put forward. The most reasonable comment I've seen was somebody admitting they didn't understand the article at all, and leaving it at that.

3 hours ago, mr moose said:

About the only way I can see privacy being an issue in cloud related services for business is in the fact that the cloud operators have access to anything not user encrypted in the cloud.   I.E there are instances where MS staff may access user data to investigate an issue with their services (it's in their ToS).  I assume the same is with amazon and google.   But you are still right, it is different to consumer side privacy concerns. 

The way I see it is if the company isn't responsible enough to encrypt user information in the cloud, and leave their data public, they're not going to configure their own infrastructure any better. Between the option of personal infrastructure and the cloud is that at least the cloud providers can shut down companies that are irresponsible with user data, but as a whole, companies still need to take user privacy and security much more seriously than we've been seeing.


anime sucks

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1 hour ago, Suika said:

 

The way I see it is if the company isn't responsible enough to encrypt user information in the cloud, and leave their data public, they're not going to configure their own infrastructure any better. Between the option of personal infrastructure and the cloud is that at least the cloud providers can shut down companies that are irresponsible with user data, but as a whole, companies still need to take user privacy and security much more seriously than we've been seeing.

Agree, especially with last bit.

Maybe most do encrypt, we know though that there is least a good percentage who don't and companies like apple and MS still have access to all cloud stored consumer data.   The whole thing isn't quite as cut and dried as the conversation would lead us to believe. 


QuicK and DirtY. Read the CoC it's like a guide on how not to be moron.  Also I don't have an issue with the VS series.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
53 minutes ago, Suika said:

I can expect that, but what I'd expect more of is users trying to give the article the slightest amount of time in the day to understand that this thread isn't applicable to the discussions they've put forward.

I wonder...

Did you "read" what I wrote here:

On 9/11/2019 at 9:57 AM, Cora_Lie said:

A few weeks ago I posted a news about "subscription fatigue", and now... welll seems that "subscription as the norm" is almost there...

Or so they say on Ars Technica

Maybe the fact that some people here comment about that here may relate to that? Do you think that it is a possibility?

 

 

53 minutes ago, Suika said:

 

The most reasonable comment I've seen was somebody admitting they didn't understand the article at all, and leaving it at that.

The way I see it is if the company isn't responsible enough to encrypt user information in the cloud, and leave their data public, they're not going to configure their own infrastructure any better. Between the option of personal infrastructure and the cloud is that at least the cloud providers can shut down companies that are irresponsible with user data, but as a whole, companies still need to take user privacy and security much more seriously than we've been seeing.

There is that, I do agree.

But for me there is a much more structural problem... By always considering some vital systems for a company as "services" and so not investing in some physical and in-house management, by deferring all this day to day management to external companies with the idea that "if the service doesn't work for me I'll simply change" then it will on one part reproduce the error that you can, as a company truly defer the day to day management of your informatin system network, when in fact a company NEEDS to always be in control of it, and as such be the one who understands and knows what is where and how easily they can access it.

And to be able to do that you need to have an in-house IT service... You can't externalize it.

And I'm not even touching to the security and encryption of information here.

 

The root of the problem is, as I see it, that as always there is the problem of "control is power". In-house Managers often feel/felt that IT service had too much power for a vital aspect in a company that they do not understand. And it's an area that costs! A LOT!

So let's take back the power and let's "cut the costs" by hiring a company who will do the same but who we can cut the contract with as we want or need to (aka IT "as a service"), so "we" are back in control!

Which truly is not the case as the managers know and understand even less how it works as they don't have in-house specialists (the IT people) anymore who can explain it to them.

But... It's a regular cost, the management has the illusion that they can planify more easily the costs and investments without the human costs.

And again, not talking about the security of information part. And the leakage of information, and the management of effective storage... Depending where it's going to be stored, legal aspects are different, etc.

And the ultimate argument at the end... That one is the most "magnificent" imo: either you reduce human's hability to "mess with the system" or you completely abandon the management to AI's, as the systems becomes more and more complex and so it will clash with the needs and reactivity hability of human beings to deal with the new problems and constraints coming from the complexitiy of the new structure that is coming from the "cloud" infrastructure...

 

Now... It's an opinion piece, you say (and not you alone). But... Of course it's an opinion piece! It's an article! In a magazine! So it's written by someone who is going to give you some information and then his/her opinion about that given information.

I don't see what your point is here. The idea is to discuss the opinions given and to share your own opinion with the other readers. To discuss it...

 

So... I still do not understand what the problem is exactly with it being an "opinion piece"... Everything is an "opinion piece"...

 

 

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On 9/12/2019 at 10:23 PM, mr moose said:

That's because surprisingly few of us on this forum have any real commercial IT experience.  Most of our fears and discussions are going to center around the consumer side.

I think thats a fair assessment.  The bigger thing from the commercial side I see as a threat (depending where you are) is this idea that somehow using the "Cloud" will cut costs.  In some cases certainly particularly with elastic storage but boy if you are migrating to a centralized data center that serves everyone and their mother you better have money in the bank and expect it to take far longer than you initially plan.  It gets worse when you have underpaid helpdesks with high turnover trying to serve many more users now that everything is in one datacen...I mean "Cloud".  

 

It becomes a pennywise foolish game of actually losing productivity and money because end users can't get business applications that either require complex changes properly installed.  You end up on maybe saving money on in-house IT (and in actuality losing more due to the complexity of creating a new environment) and losing way more on the actual work you are doing.

 

 


"Your next line is..."

 

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