How Much Should You Back Up Your Data and What is the Likelihood of Drive Failure?

[SSD Sean]

Ummm, $100 out of the year for a 5TB backup device isn’t a whole lot. That’s $2 a week. And given it hasn’t been an issue for you to have your storage needs met previously, I suspect you really wouldn’t need much space at all. If you’re talking about running a business, this is a drop in the bucket. Lol

[avrona]

43 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Only an idiot thinks s/he doesn't need backups! Sorry to be so blunt and it's not my intent to insult you but facts are facts. Read these articles in these links for facts on the dangers of not having backups:

 

https://consoltech.com/blog/10-common-causes-of-data-loss/

 

https://smallbiztrends.com/2017/04/not-prepared-for-data-loss.html

 

https://www.dobson.net/4-reasons-why-businesses-need-to-regularly-back-up-information/

 

I could have posted dozens of links like this here but these three pretty much cover it. Also, what applies to businesses also applies to individuals.

 

Your "unintentional backups" are not particularly reliable, especially if using free or cheap cloud storage.

How exactly are the unreliable though, and again, why, despite the extremely low chances of anything happening, are you branding anyone with a different opinion on this matter is an "idiot"?

18 minutes ago, SSD Sean said:

Ummm, $100 out of the year for a 5TB backup device isn’t a whole lot. That’s $2 a week. And given it hasn’t been an issue for you to have your storage needs met previously, I suspect you really wouldn’t need much space at all. If you’re talking about running a business, this is a drop in the bucket. Lol

That's still a lot, especially for me, and especially because there are way more important things money can go to in a PC, like things that affect performance. At this point I have plenty of things that would need backing, meaning I'd need quite a large hard drive, not to mention the fact that my PC can't even support another drive without switching out a PSU. Plus the business is being started out from whatever money I already have, not from a loan.

[SSD Sean]

16 minutes ago, avrona said:

How exactly are the unreliable though, and again, why, despite the extremely low chances of anything happening, are you branding anyone with a different opinion on this matter is an "idiot"?

That's still a lot, especially for me, and especially because there are way more important things money can go to in a PC, like things that affect performance. At this point I have plenty of things that would need backing, meaning I'd need quite a large hard drive, not to mention the fact that my PC can't even support another drive without switching out a PSU. Plus the business is being started out from whatever money I already have, not from a loan.

I disagree. You have 1x SATA 110GB SSD and 2x 1TB HDDs. A 2TB external drive is $57, less when on sale. That's nothing. Not to mention that buying used, you can get drives for half that. But, you don't care about your data, so for you, it doesn't matter. 

 

And your backups are unreliable because, do you know for sure the last time those files were updated? Do you still have account passwords and emails to any web host? What if someone steals/deletes your cloud data without you knowing? A SD card you have could corrupt randomly.  I just had someones HDD die two weeks ago out of nowhere. Now its costing him $900 to recover what data they can off of it because he didn't backup recently. 

[avrona]

10 minutes ago, SSD Sean said:

I disagree. You have 1x SATA 110GB SSD and 2x 1TB HDDs. A 2TB external drive is $57, less when on sale. That's nothing. Not to mention that buying used, you can get drives for half that. But, you don't care about your data, so for you, it doesn't matter. 

 

And your backups are unreliable because, do you know for sure the last time those files were updated? Do you still have account passwords and emails to any web host? What if someone steals/deletes your cloud data without you knowing? A SD card you have could corrupt randomly.  I just had someones HDD die two weeks ago out of nowhere. Now its costing him $900 to recover what data they can off of it because he didn't backup recently. 

I must have not changed that list for a while as I replaced the 110GB SSD with a 1TB and that is half-full already, and for me even $57 is an extremely large amount of money, and seeming a bit wasteful seeing how there are other parts of my PC that could be upgraded with that money that could make a bigger difference. And an SD card all of a sudden deciding it needs formatting before working again was actually my only data loss in my life, but thanks to unintentional backuping like I said earlier, all of those files were on my PC.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

"$57 is an extremely large amount of money" and you're trying to start a business? 

[Olaf6541]

1 hour ago, avrona said:

despite the extremely low chances

Its not about the chances, its about the consequences when something happens....

The chances of getting into a car accident are also very low, but people often die in car crashes. Thats why you put on a seatbelt: in case it goes wrong. For many companies loosing all of their data would mean pretty much the end of the company, thats why they spent an unreasonable amount of money on backups if you only would look at the 'chance' of something going wrong...

[avrona]

1 hour ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

"$57 is an extremely large amount of money" and you're trying to start a business? 

Yes it is an extremely large amount for me and yes I am starting a business. 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

5 hours ago, avrona said:

Yes it is an extremely large amount for me and yes I am starting a business. 

Apparently, you missed my eyeroll. If you can't afford $57 for an HDD, your business is doomed before you even get started.

[avrona]

13 hours ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Apparently, you missed my eyeroll. If you can't afford $57 for an HDD, your business is doomed before you even get started.

No I didn't miss it and actually it's looking up already so I don't know where you got all of that from.

[Zodiark1593]

I'm in a bit of a pickle myself. Most of the data that would be difficult to replace is already stored across several cloud vendors. For very large video files (anime, movies, etc), I usually have the originals anyway. Everything is mirrored onto a separate external drive and stored several towns over. 

 

However, since I've picked up photography, storing the RAWs is becoming an increasingly pressing issue that I'm trying to figure out without dropping lots of money. I already have the PC, and an offsite drive, but only two copies isn't adequate, and also, 2 TB is also proving very cramped. I need more storage in my PC, but I also need additional storage for the offsite backup, and I also need an onsite backup solution. 

 

I don't really have any reasonably sized spare drives to put into any other system, so I'm feeling there isn't really a way out of dropping several hundred dollars at minimum. Need to start selling photos. 

 

[RayLeech]

On 9/7/2019 at 3:35 PM, avrona said:

"unintentional backups"

I'm unclear what the term "unintentional backup" actually means. I've never heard anyone intentionally use that term.

 

You accidentally copied a file to the wrong folder on the same drive and left it? You replaced your hard drive last year and just left the old files on it?

[Lady Fitzgerald]

38 minutes ago, RayLeech said:

I'm unclear what the term "unintentional backup" actually means. I've never heard anyone intentionally use that term.

 

You accidentally copied a file to the wrong folder on the same drive and left it? You replaced your hard drive last year and just left the old files on it?

He (she?) defined it as files that he uploaded to cloud storage sites so he could access them remotely. Considering how big a deal he is making over spending $57, I'm reasonably sure he is using free cloud storage sites which are notorious for being unreliable (they frequently disappear with little or no warning, taking any data on them with them) and/or are very insecure due to poor security measures and/or encryption (if they even do any encryption), making them easy to hack, or actually spy on the files uploaded to them (Google is notorious for that).

[Lady Fitzgerald]

2 hours ago, avrona said:

No I didn't miss it and actually it's looking up already so I don't know where you got all of that from.

Frankly, I don't see how you are going to succeed with a business if you can't even afford $57 for a very basic backup. And don't throw your "unintentional backups" back at me. Those are going to be very iffy at best. I've run my own businesses in the past and licensing fees, bonding, taxes, etc. alone will kill you if can't afford $57 for a backup (unless you are illegally running one under the radar; even then, the lack of a backup will most likely come back and eventually bite you in the butt unless the law shuts you down first).

[Zodiark1593]

1 hour ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

He (she?) defined it as files that he uploaded to cloud storage sites so he could access them remotely. Considering how big a deal he is making over spending $57, I'm reasonably sure he is using free cloud storage sites which are notorious for being unreliable (they frequently disappear with little or no warning, taking any data on them with them) and/or are very insecure due to poor security measures and/or encryption (if they even do any encryption), making them easy to hack, or actually spy on the files uploaded to them (Google is notorious for that).

For important documents or files that aren't mine, I tend to encrypt locally before moving them to the cloud. 7-Zip is pretty useful for this purpose.

[Pyramiden]

On 9/13/2019 at 7:49 PM, avrona said:

Because I don't need one, I'm actually in the process of starting up a whole new business and I most likely won't even have a backup for anything related to that, simply because there isn't a need for it, and the money isn't there to fund all that storage either. And some types of unintentional backups are rather popular, especially storing things in the cloud for the purpose of being able to access it from several locations, which in one form or another is becoming increasingly popular, and it's usually also the user's most important files being sent to the cloud as that's what they need to have access to the most, so it's a win-win.

Please take our advice and don't be this stubborn regarding back-ups. Everyone agrees on this topic that back-ups are important. You almost make yourself sound like some kind of vaccination denialist.

And about starting your own business, continuity is not a joke. It is important, and something you should secure for your business to keep being in business for an extended period of time.

[RayLeech]

22 hours ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

defined it as files that he uploaded to cloud storage sites so he could access them remotely.

Then congrats, they've "unintentionally" done their first off-site backup! <sarcasm off>

 

Quote

Frankly, I don't see how you are going to succeed with a business if you can't even afford $57

We all know they're not the first, and certainly not the last to try!

 

We can speculate, but without knowing what business has less than $57 available capital, maybe it doesn't matter. For all we know, it could be a grass cutting business in a spreadsheet. In that case, print a copy and you're still in business when the computer crashes.On the other hand, if the house burns down, you probably have bigger fish to fry than which of my three client's lawn has to be mowed on Wednesday.

 

[Lady Fitzgerald]

1 hour ago, RayLeech said:

Then congrats, they've "unintentionally" done their first off-site backup! <sarcasm off>

 

We all know they're not the first, and certainly not the last to try!

 

We can speculate, but without knowing what business has less than $57 available capital, maybe it doesn't matter. For all we know, it could be a grass cutting business in a spreadsheet. In that case, print a copy and you're still in business when the computer crashes.On the other hand, if the house burns down, you probably have bigger fish to fry than which of my three client's lawn has to be mowed on Wednesday.

 

Have you ever run a business? Even a grass cutting business still requires permits and/or will be taxed by the city, county, State and Feds  (although it's not hard to run illegally under the radar as long as transactions are always cash only). Then there is the cost of the mower and it's amortization, rakes, trash bags, oil (and its disposal), etc. you need to keep track of for taxes (and, believe me, you had better have good records of all that when tax time comes around).

[Lady Fitzgerald]

On 9/13/2019 at 12:04 PM, avrona said:

How exactly are the unreliable though, and again, why, despite the extremely low chances of anything happening, are you branding anyone with a different opinion on this matter is an "idiot"?

That's still a lot, especially for me, and especially because there are way more important things money can go to in a PC, like things that affect performance. At this point I have plenty of things that would need backing, meaning I'd need quite a large hard drive, not to mention the fact that my PC can't even support another drive without switching out a PSU. Plus the business is being started out from whatever money I already have, not from a loan.

Sigh! You still don't even understand what backups are. You do not ever want a sole backup to be on a drive in the computer. Backup drives need to be air gapped from the computer to protect them from the same dangers that could take out the drives in the computer. To air gap a backup drive, it must be kept disconnected from the computer, powered down, and stored out of site from the computer. This can be accomplished by using external drives that have their own PSU or regular HDDs with an external, self-powered dock. Ideally, you need at least both an onsite backup drive and an offsite backup drive but even just one onsite backup is better than nothing or your ridiculous "unintentional backups".

 

Just what kind of business are you trying to start anyway?

[RayLeech]

12 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Have you ever run a business?

I think you missed the <sarcasm> tag.  A grass cutting business with three clients and not $57 is probably a 12yo's summer job.

 

And yes, I run 4, all with "intentional" (and real) backups.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

1 minute ago, RayLeech said:

I think you missed the <sarcasm> tag.  A grass cutting business with three clients and not $57 is probably a 12yo's summer job.

 

And yes, I run 4, all with "intentional" (and real) backups.

You're right, I missed the well delivered sarcasm.

[avrona]

45 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Sigh! You still don't even understand what backups are. You do not ever want a sole backup to be on a drive in the computer. Backup drives need to be air gapped from the computer to protect them from the same dangers that could take out the drives in the computer. To air gap a backup drive, it must be kept disconnected from the computer, powered down, and stored out of site from the computer. This can be accomplished by using external drives that have their own PSU or regular HDDs with an external, self-powered dock. Ideally, you need at least both an onsite backup drive and an offsite backup drive but even just one onsite backup is better than nothing or your ridiculous "unintentional backups".

 

Just what kind of business are you trying to start anyway?

I do know what they are, and I am aware of the odds of anything bad happening are extremely low, and some of the stuff I've seen on the topic are just some extremely illogical approaches, such as making sure to backup your data in case you get robbed? Wouldn't it make more sense to invest instead in making your house more burglar-proof then if that's a big possibility in your neighbourhood? With the amount of good equipment for that on the market, that can even be all used from your phone, you can essentially pull a 1984 on any potential burglar and that way not only are you protecting your data but also pretty much everything else that's valuable in your entire house. 

 

And then even when you have backups on your PC, that decreases the chances of anything happening even further, as the chances of both drives going are way lower than just a single one going. And if my untintentional backups get the job done of protecting my data then what's the issue? I got a copy of all my photos on both my PC and SD card, and actually even 2 other SSDs as leftovers from just copying over system files, important files I need to access often are on my PC and then either on Google Drive or just my Gmail account, and I have other important files spread over different drives I use just from having to copy them for some reason or another some time in the past. And the business is a PC building business. So even if $57 isn't super extremely expensive, it's just expensive for something that's not that useful, maybe it's just me but backuping seems more like this luxury, as I'd rather spend that money towards the company, which by the way here you don't have to have it registered or pay any tax unless you earn above a certain threshold a year from it, or spend it on things that actually impact my PC's performance.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

1 minute ago, avrona said:

I do know what they are, and I am aware of the odds of anything bad happening are extremely low, and some of the stuff I've seen on the topic are just some extremely illogical approaches, such as making sure to backup your data in case you get robbed? Wouldn't it make more sense to invest instead in making your house more burglar-proof then if that's a big possibility in your neighbourhood? With the amount of good equipment for that on the market, that can even be all used from your phone, you can essentially pull a 1984 on any potential burglar and that way not only are you protecting your data but also pretty much everything else that's valuable in your entire house. 

 

And then even when you have backups on your PC, that decreases the chances of anything happening even further, as the chances of both drives going are way lower than just a single one going. And if my untintentional backups get the job done of protecting my data then what's the issue? I got a copy of all my photos on both my PC and SD card, and actually even 2 other SSDs as leftovers from just copying over system files, important files I need to access often are on my PC and then either on Google Drive or just my Gmail account, and I have other important files spread over different drives I use just from having to copy them for some reason or another some time in the past. And the business is a PC building business. So even if $57 isn't super extremely expensive, it's just expensive for something that's not that useful, maybe it's just me but backuping seems more like this luxury, as I'd rather spend that money towards the company, which by the way here you don't have to have it registered or pay any tax unless you earn above a certain threshold a year from it, or spend it on things that actually impact my PC's performance.

All your arguments are based on gross fallacies. Good luck with your little business; you are going to need it!

[avrona]

4 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

All your arguments are based on gross fallacies. Good luck with your little business; you are going to need it!

How exactly are they though?

[Lady Fitzgerald]

14 minutes ago, avrona said:

How exactly are they though?

You've already been told many times by many people already but are either incapable of "getting it" or are just too stubborn to accept it. But just go ahead and blow off all the excellent advice you have received from people here, including  Sean Webster, who is an authority on the subject and makes a living off his knowledge of drives and backups. You richly deserves whatever disaster may befall your data.

[avrona]

27 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

You've already been told many times by many people already but are either incapable of "getting it" or are just too stubborn to accept it. But just go ahead and blow off all the excellent advice you have received from people here, including  Sean Webster, who is an authority on the subject and makes a living off his knowledge of drives and backups. You richly deserves whatever disaster may befall your data.

I deserve to lose my data because I am aware of how extremely low chances of it happening are?