Watch it, you GIMP - Glimpse project founded to avoid branding that some find offensive

[poochyena]

20 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

Because the term means something that is "crippled" - in this case the software, but the only reason they can use it in that manner is because it meant "crippled" people first.

well yea, but thats not what I asked. I asked how often you hear it used towards a person who has a limp in a derogatory way. Thats the definition you gave and said you hear often.

[dalekphalm]

3 minutes ago, NumLock21 said:

I'm glad their are sticking to their name and not change it because those selected few only see the bad meaning behind it. Those people can either man up or take a hike.

They actually don't have to do either of those things - because they did exactly the right thing already: forked the project and will create a new version with different branding.

3 minutes ago, poochyena said:

well yea, but thats not what I asked. I asked how often you hear it used towards a person who has a limp in a derogatory way. Thats the definition you gave and said you hear often.

That's an incorrect statement. I did give the definition, but I did not say that I hear it often. I heard it often as a kid - in the 90's people would say that all the time.

 

As an adult, people tend to be more mature, and therefore tend to use insulting or offensive language less often, so I don't hear it much anymore. That, of course, doesn't change it's meaning.

 

Someone calling software "gimped" because it lacks features is a direct extension of people calling someone "gimped" because they have a limp, or are disabled, etc. To claim otherwise is naive at best.

[NumLock21]

Let's change every brand out there them PC crowd gets offended with. And do you know what happens when brands cater to them PC crowd, they don't care. They just move on to the next to get offended with,  and now brands are stuck with a stupid name. This not only happens to  brands but also public announcements.

I heard that in NYC the announcement system for public transit use to go like this

 

Ladies and Gentlemen blah blah blah, thank you for riding MTA NYC Transit. After the PC crowd got involved it they're force to change it and now it's like this

Hello everyone, blah blah blah, thank you for riding with us. 

[dalekphalm]

3 hours ago, NumLock21 said:

Let's change every brand out there them PC crowd gets offended with. And do you know what happens when brands cater to them PC crowd, they don't care. They just move on to the next to get offended with,  and now brands are stuck with a stupid name. This not only happens to  brands but also public announcements.

I heard that in NYC the announcement system for public transit use to go like this

This really isn't a big deal. It's only a big deal because you're making it a big deal.

 

GIMP still exists. They're forking the project. If the fork succeeds and the original project dies? Well I guess more people agreed with the name change than didn't.

 

And if that happens? Welcome to how things should happen.

 

If GIMP continues to survive, nothing for you will have changed.

Quote

Ladies and Gentlemen blah blah blah, thank you for riding MTA NYC Transit. After the PC crowd got involved it they're force to change it and now it's like this

Hello everyone, blah blah blah, thank you for riding with us. 

How does that small change negatively affect you in even the slightest?

[Nowak]

3 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

How does that small chance negatively affect you in even the slightest?

It doesn't but people are mad about it anyway.

[Trik'Stari]

On 8/29/2019 at 10:05 AM, PCGuy_5960 said:

Urban dictionary somehow always manages to turn every single word into a sexual reference. lmao

 

On this topic, is every single word offensive at this point? Like wtf.

I'm offended by their being offended by the name, I demand they change it back and whoever wanted it changed be labeled a mentally challenged land whale.

 

The only proper way to deal with this crowd of constantly offended moral busy bodies is to tell them to kick rocks, go suck an egg, or any other euphemism for "go fuck yourselves" and go on about your day. Sure they'll protest and be angry, and sooner or later they'll find something else to screech at because they've never overcome real hardship in their lives, and as a result are wracked with self doubt, anxiety, and depression.

[mr moose]

5 hours ago, poochyena said:

none of those examples are being used towards a person with a limp. Its being used to mean that a product is being reduced in quality.

I know, that's what the word lame means.  Gimp refers to a lame person, so when used to describe a product they are saying the product is lame. it is less of a product.

 

 

[Blademaster91]

4 hours ago, NumLock21 said:

Let's change every brand out there them PC crowd gets offended with. And do you know what happens when brands cater to them PC crowd, they don't care. They just move on to the next to get offended with,  and now brands are stuck with a stupid name. This not only happens to  brands but also public announcements.

I heard that in NYC the announcement system for public transit use to go like this

 

Ladies and Gentlemen blah blah blah, thank you for riding MTA NYC Transit. After the PC crowd got involved it they're force to change it and now it's like this

Hello everyone, blah blah blah, thank you for riding with us. 

Exactly, I doubt the people offended over this even use the software. And according to wikipedia the GIMP program has been around for 23 years, people are suddenly offended over it now?

Sure you could say this doesn't affect you, but it does as it's still censoring words because someone got offended enough for it to be changed.

[it_dont_work]

On 8/29/2019 at 5:10 PM, Master Disaster said:

Those "IT Idiots" will all be very well aware of what GIMP is and does.

Except for the fact they did not. 

[FezBoy]

4 hours ago, Trik'Stari said:

I'm offended by their being offended by the name, I demand they change it back and whoever wanted it changed be labeled a mentally challenged land whale.

 

The only proper way to deal with this crowd of constantly offended moral busy bodies is to tell them to kick rocks, go suck an egg, or any other euphemism for "go fuck yourselves" and go on about your day. Sure they'll protest and be angry, and sooner or later they'll find something else to screech at because they've never overcome real hardship in their lives, and as a result are wracked with self doubt, anxiety, and depression.

https://github.com/DuckHP/Limp https://github.com/naodesu/GIMP https://github.com/w3bb/CRIPP

[Thaldor]

8 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

How does that small change negatively affect you in even the slightest?

That small change is the thing. They get through one small change, they move to another and then another just because they feel a little bit offended and when you put that part of the modern behavior and count in that in the past many words have had offensive meanings and even worse, many words will have offensive meaning in the future and the worst that there are so many words that have some offensive meaning in some small geographical area or some very exclusive human group. And the worst part is the proportions; People are offended because a software has been called GIMP for over 20 years? Like that's the most important thing they can find to be publicly offended by and someone should make it their priority to do something about it? Like yeah, you can talk about it but really going that far as starting to port a whole program just to change it's name to be less "offending" when the developers have disagreed to change the name of the program (like they must have WAY too much time in their hands, they could probably do something actually worth of the time and be productive with it also).

 

"If people can't control their own emotions, then they have to start trying to control other people's behaviour." ~Robert Skinner (heard from John Cleese talking about political correctness)

[JoostinOnline]

29 minutes ago, Thaldor said:

That small change is the thing. They get through one small change, they move to another and then another just because they feel a little bit offended and when you put that part of the modern behavior and count in that in the past many words have had offensive meanings and even worse, many words will have offensive meaning in the future and the worst that there are so many words that have some offensive meaning in some small geographical area or some very exclusive human group. And the worst part is the proportions; People are offended because a software has been called GIMP for over 20 years? Like that's the most important thing they can find to be publicly offended by and someone should make it their priority to do something about it? Like yeah, you can talk about it but really going that far as starting to port a whole program just to change it's name to be less "offending" when the developers have disagreed to change the name of the program (like they must have WAY too much time in their hands, they could probably do something actually worth of the time and be productive with it also).

 

"If people can't control their own emotions, then they have to start trying to control other people's behaviour." ~Robert Skinner (heard from John Cleese talking about political correctness)

Thank you for a slippery slope fallacy.

 

It's not like GIMP is going anywhere. Complaining is ridiculous. A new branch doesn't hurt you or anyone else.

[mr moose]

37 minutes ago, Thaldor said:

That small change is the thing. They get through one small change, they move to another and then another just because they feel a little bit offended and when you put that part of the modern behavior and count in that in the past many words have had offensive meanings and even worse, many words will have offensive meaning in the future and the worst that there are so many words that have some offensive meaning in some small geographical area or some very exclusive human group. And the worst part is the proportions; People are offended because a software has been called GIMP for over 20 years? Like that's the most important thing they can find to be publicly offended by and someone should make it their priority to do something about it? Like yeah, you can talk about it but really going that far as starting to port a whole program just to change it's name to be less "offending" when the developers have disagreed to change the name of the program (like they must have WAY too much time in their hands, they could probably do something actually worth of the time and be productive with it also).

 

"If people can't control their own emotions, then they have to start trying to control other people's behaviour." ~Robert Skinner (heard from John Cleese talking about political correctness)

 

Apart form being a slippery slope argument, this is a horse and cart problem, everyone thinks the goal is to avoid offending people.  It is not, the goal is to avoid the name deterring people from using the product because to them it is offensive. 

 

There is a very distinct difference in the approach, one is protecting the product the other is protecting the people.   It does not seem as though the community cares about people, but they do care that their product could be more widely used if it had a different name.    Which is actually much more mature way to deal with the situation given it hasn't arisen from any form of intentional social attack or lobby group.

[poochyena]

9 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

Someone calling software "gimped" because it lacks features is a direct extension of people calling someone "gimped" because they have a limp, or are disabled, etc.

well right, its no longer used as a slur. Its not being used to attack a certain demographic of people.

 

[mr moose]

5 minutes ago, poochyena said:

well right, its no longer used as a slur. Its not being used to attack a certain demographic of people.

 

Who said it was no longer being used? 

 

regardless, it is a word that people use to denigrate others, a word that people use to denigrate products and a word that has generally a negative connotation that is maybe being used less in society. Can you blame them for not wanting that kind of association with their product?

 

 

[Blademaster91]

20 minutes ago, mr moose said:

 

Apart form being a slippery slope argument, this is a horse and cart problem, everyone thinks the goal is to avoid offending people.  It is not, the goal is to avoid the name deterring people from using the product because to them it is offensive. 

 

There is a very distinct difference in the approach, one is protecting the product the other is protecting the people.   It does not seem as though the community cares about people, but they do care that their product could be more widely used if it had a different name.    Which is actually much more mature way to deal with the situation given it hasn't arisen from any form of intentional social attack or lobby group.

The software has been named GIMP for years and no one really seemed to take offense to it until recently? That sure seems to be the goal, fork the product and see if people aren't offended by Glimpse instead.

And no I think the community cares, its just people should find more important things to do than about than whining about the acronym of an open source image editor.  I also doubt a name change alone would really cause much more widespread use, any professional is going to be using something more well known such as Photoshop because it's what they're more familiar with.

29 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

Thank you for a slippery slope fallacy.

 

It's not like GIMP is going anywhere. Complaining is ridiculous. A new branch doesn't hurt you or anyone else.

Right and you completely ignore their point and go back to the argument of "it doesn't hurt you so just stop complaining".

[mr moose]

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

The software has been named GIMP for years and no one really seemed to take offense to it until recently? That sure seems to be the goal, fork the product and see if people aren't offended by Glimpse instead.

How do you know it has only been a recent thing and there has been an ongoing question of uptake due to the name?

 

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

And no I think the community cares, its just people should find more important things to do than about than whining about the acronym of an open source image editor.  I also doubt a name change alone would really cause much more widespread use, any professional is going to be using something more well known such as Photoshop because it's what they're more familiar with.

Companies invest hundreds of thousands of dollars researching names,  a name can make or break a product.   There is no doubt in my mind that the name has more effect on how many people look at it than you realize.

 

 

[poochyena]

1 hour ago, mr moose said:

Can you blame them for not wanting that kind of association with their product?

yes

[mr moose]

5 minutes ago, poochyena said:

yes

then indeed this is what is wrong with the world,  someone wants to take reasonable steps to look after their product (without effecting anything else I might add) and people go around blaming them of social dishonesty.    

[JoostinOnline]

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

The software has been named GIMP for years and no one really seemed to take offense to it until recently?

Your own ignorance is not a defense. Gimp has always had a negative connotation, and has always made using the software awkward. Imagine if Microsoft Office was named Dildo. Hopefully, you can see why that might be a little harder to promote. I'm tired of people thinking of the rapist from Pulp Fiction when I talk about using GIMP.

 

1 hour ago, Blademaster91 said:

Right and you completely ignore their point and go back to the argument of "it doesn't hurt you so just stop complaining".

I didn't ignore his point. I exposed it as a logical fallacy. The name isn't even being changed, that's what so many people don't seem to get. This is just a duplicate project with a different name. It's like getting angry that a car comes in both black and white models, because you think it should only be available in black.

 

And for the record, I pointed out that it doesn't hurt ANYONE. There's no downside.

[Red :)]

These days anything can be found offensive.

[WereCatf]

4 hours ago, FezBoy said:

https://github.com/DuckHP/Limp https://github.com/naodesu/GIMP https://github.com/w3bb/CRIPP

Hah, I love the irony in someone forking the fork just to rename it back to GIMP

[Vode]

18 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

Who is “we” in your context? If you mean “we” the OSS community? No... the insult “gimp” entered common language in the 1920’s. 

Why do you think I’m offended by this, simply because I corrected your “joke” with factual information?

 

I do always find it humorous when people who claim to be against getting offended... well... act offended when offered counterpoint information. 

 

Does it bother you that I posted another

definition that gives credibility to the people who want to fork the program?

Wasn't directed towards you, was intended as a general statement. I doesn't bother me. :)

[Blademaster91]

3 hours ago, mr moose said:

How do you know it has only been a recent thing and there has been an ongoing question of uptake due to the name?

 

Companies invest hundreds of thousands of dollars researching names,  a name can make or break a product.   There is no doubt in my mind that the name has more effect on how many people look at it than you realize.

 

 

I agree with you, we don't know if it was recent or something ongoing, but the program being an open source project people would have been free to fork their own version with whatever name they like. Maybe the name has an effect, I don't know how common the term is as an insult, maybe an even better reason to change it then? It doesn't bother me if they decide to change the name to "glimpse"  certainly if a new naming scheme increases the popularity.

[mr moose]

23 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

I agree with you, we don't know if it was recent or something ongoing, but the program being an open source project people would have been free to fork their own version with whatever name they like.

Which is what they have done.   I don't think because it wasn't done earlier that it means the problem is new, it may have taken the better part of a decade to get enough people interested in the fork to make it possible.  

 

23 minutes ago, Blademaster91 said:

Maybe the name has an effect, I don't know how common the term is as an insult, maybe an even better reason to change it then? It doesn't bother me if they decide to change the name to "glimpse"  certainly if a new naming scheme increases the popularity.

 

It's fairly common in my generation,  but more so for insulting groups (like organizations) rather than individual people.  I think that might be why it is so popular as in insult to products or services in tech like gameworks and anything MS.  

 

Personally I think the name gimp is cool, but then being an Autistic I can separate G.I.M.P from a gimp, just like I can use the word retard grammatically without thinking about insulting people with intellectual conditions.   I also understand the desire to fork it and release something with a different name.  It will be interesting to see if they are identical products and how well the product with the different name does.