Epic, Tencent and China

[msknight]

OK, so it's no secret ... Tencent is an investor in Epic Games. - https://www.investopedia.com/news/how-tencent-changed-fortnite-creator-epic-games-fortunes/

 

Quote

Tencent bought a 40 percent stake in Epic at a valuation of about $825 million back wen “Fortnite” was still in the early stages of development. The Chinese investment holding conglomerate’s roughly $330 million outlay was used by Epic as a platform to bankroll some major changes.

 

But TenCent investment is said to be responsible for pushing Chinese political propaganda, most obviously in TopGun 2 where the patches on the back of the famous leather jacket were changed - https://americanmilitarynews.com/2019/07/controversy-did-chinese-company-censor-top-gun-2-flags-from-tom-cruises-bomber-jacket/

 

Quote

He wrote, “There’s a new Top Gun movie coming out. And Maverick is wearing the same leather jacket – only this time it’s Communist Party of China-approved, so the Japanese and Taiwanese flag patches are gone (screenshot on right is from the new trailer)…”

 

We already know that games are changed to be sold in China - https://www.abacusnews.com/digital-life/no-blood-no-gambling-four-ways-games-are-changed-china/article/2176140

Quote

“Pow! And I spit out a mouthful of green blood,” one gamer said.

Why green blood? It’s because they fear the China-only version of Steam will have a very limited lineup of approved games, and the games that are there will be heavily censored -- hence, green blood, because red blood looks too violent.

It’s one of a number of changes that developers are forced to make if they want to officially release their games in China. Let’s run through them!

So what's the odds that we're going to see Chinese political influence in games coming from Epic, and what's the odds that all this pressure is going to be so far behind the scenes that we're never going to see it... especially in new titles so that we've got no measure of any changes (unlike what happened with TopGun2)

 

Me? I'm crying off anything Chinese backed. There's enough out there for it to be proven, in my mind, that where Chinese money goes, the propaganda soon follows. Goodbye Epic. At least zombies can legitimately spit green blood... maybe.

[vanished]

imo there were already enough reasons to avoid them that this doesn't make a difference

[dgsddfgdfhgs]

people, think twice if you really want to finance terrorism 

[wasab]

1 hour ago, dgsddfgdfhgs said:

people, think twice if you really want to finance terrorism 

How's the protest in HK? Any tanks rolling onto the street yet?

[dgsddfgdfhgs]

1 minute ago, wasab said:

How's the protest in HK? Any tanks rolling onto the street yet?

soon. every where is spammed with white terror and being treated unethically

[Guest]

Breaking News: Investment company makes large investment based on current trends. 

 

Why does China always have to be the bad guy? Stop pretending there is always an agenda. Maybe more censored comical games sell more due to a large audience?

[minibois]

29 minutes ago, floofer said:

Breaking News: Investment company makes large investment based on current trends. 

 

Why does China always have to be the bad guy? Stop pretending there is always an agenda. Maybe more censored comical games sell more due to a large audience?

Tecent is one of the companies that is trialing the Chinese social credit system. That is not a system I agree with - nor do I think anyone should agree with it - so that makes them not really good guys for me.

I hate when people say everything from a singular country is bad, but I think there is a real reason to distrust a company like Tencent (and thus you could say you distrust Epic.. I dislike them for more reasons, but the whole Tencent thing is one of those reasons).

[mr moose]

China is a behemoth that we should be scared of, but it is also a behemoth that is scared of itself.  Majority of the things it does it does for stability and control, not to overthrow other nations.

 

 

[msknight]

57 minutes ago, floofer said:

Breaking News: Investment company makes large investment based on current trends. 

 

Why does China always have to be the bad guy? Stop pretending there is always an agenda. Maybe more censored comical games sell more due to a large audience?

Because China IS the bad guy. And it DOES have an agenda. Rewriting history and pushing communist propaganda... unless you like living in that sort of world.

 

Games should have a choice about blood and gore... sure... an option in the menu to tone down the blood, as many games do. But for those that like these things, they won't have the choice.

 

Quote

“Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past.” - George Orwell

All media we consume, plays a part in how we think. The propaganda is coming out of China and entering our world through the games we play and the media we consume. That's why it's a problem.

[wasab]

4 hours ago, msknight said:

Because China IS the bad guy. 

Yeah sure. Every countries that pushes an ideology that isnt a western style capitalists liberal democracy is a bad guy.

 

Very childish thinking. 

[msknight]

1 minute ago, wasab said:

Yeah sure. Every countries that pushes an ideology that isnt a western style capitalists liberal democracy is a bad guy.

 

Very childish thinking. 

Not childish thinking at all. Look at the ideology that they're pushing. 

[Flying Sausages]

Me no like China communist reigm

 

Me like the smell of freedom than the smell of filthy communist reigm

 

Me is why avoid Epic Games Store and Fortnite altogether.

[wasab]

8 minutes ago, msknight said:

Not childish thinking at all. Look at the ideology that they're pushing. 

Look, I read the articles your provided in your links. The games were modded because of sensitive issues involving Taiwan. That is just part of the regional geopolitics. It has nothing to do with China's ideology. Frankly, you will see the same result regardless if china is communists, fascists, or country of freedom loving anarchists hippies. 

 

 

[msknight]

16 minutes ago, wasab said:

Look, I read the articles your provided in your links. The games were modded because of sensitive issues involving Taiwan. That is just part of the regional geopolitics. It has nothing to do with China's ideology. Frankly, you will see the same result regardless if china is communists, fascists, or country of freedom loving anarchists hippies. 

 

 

What about the TopGun 2 jacket?  The majority of reports are paywalled, but here's one that's free - https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/dec/07/china-plan-for-global-media-dominance-propaganda-xi-jinping

Quote

But over the past decade or so, China has rolled out a more sophisticated and assertive strategy, which is increasingly aimed at international audiences. China is trying to reshape the global information environment with massive infusions of money – funding paid-for advertorials, sponsored journalistic coverage and heavily massaged positive messages from boosters. While within China the press is increasingly tightly controlled, abroad Beijing has sought to exploit the vulnerabilities of the free press to its advantage.

 

[shaz2sxy]

NO country is good they are all bad and have there own agenda and pus it.

 

the good old US of A - they have propaganda in Hollywood,

 

The British with the taking over half the world.

 

The middle east is in the condition it is now due to "western" intervention.

 

they all at it, the sooner everyone thinks less of borders and there own ideolgy the better.

[wasab]

27 minutes ago, msknight said:

What about the TopGun 2 jacket?  The majority of reports are paywalled, but here's one that's free - https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/dec/07/china-plan-for-global-media-dominance-propaganda-xi-jinping

 

Doesn't every country with power, influences, and too much money in their pockets do these things? 

 

I can say games like call of duty is a propaganda piece as well. 

[msknight]

3 minutes ago, wasab said:

Doesn't every country with power, influences, and too much money in their pockets do these things? 

 

I can say games like call of duty is a propaganda piece as well. 

Games like call of duty, etc. are changed to appease the laws of the country they are sold into. 

Now you're just trolling.

4 minutes ago, shaz2sxy said:

NO country is good they are all bad and have there own agenda and pus it.

 

the good old US of A - they have propaganda in Hollywood,

 

The British with the taking over half the world.

 

The middle east is in the condition it is now due to "western" intervention.

 

they all at it, the sooner everyone thinks less of borders and there own ideolgy the better.

This is mostly history and has been mostly apologised for and reparations made.

The hollywood propoganda (and others like games, etc.) are altered before receiving official sanction in the destination country. Companies trade these days mostly under their own influence... eg. if you're in China and buy Apple, you know what you're getting.

China is using its money to buy influence in media companies within other countries...and use that influence to change our own messages to our own people. That is a step too far.

[wasab]

19 minutes ago, msknight said:

Games like call of duty, etc. are changed to appease the laws of the country they are sold into. 

Now you're just trolling.

This is mostly history and has been mostly apologised for and reparations made.

The hollywood propoganda (and others like games, etc.) are altered before receiving official sanction in the destination country. Companies trade these days mostly under their own influence... eg. if you're in China and buy Apple, you know what you're getting.

China is using its money to buy influence in media companies within other countries...and use that influence to change our own messages to our own people. That is a step too far.

Look,  every country does it, especially USA during the cold war era. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

 

And often, countries do it indiscriminately regardless of ideology and political alignment as long as it serves their geopolitical interests.

 

Oh, Iran is a democracy but pro Soviet? Let's have CIA and MI6 plot a coup and have it overthrown in the 1953 coup and replace it with a human rights abusing absolute monarchy. Oh china is communists but have a beef with the Soviet Union? let's normalize the relations and buddy up with them under president Richard Nixon.

 

It is all just a game of geopolitics. There is no such thing you are evil and we are good. Thinking it this way means you are simple minded and naieve just like a child who can only comprehend issues of morality and ethics as something that's only two sided, that of black and white. 

 

 

[msknight]

16 minutes ago, wasab said:

It is all just a game of geopolitics. There is no such thing you are evil and we are good. Thinking it this way means you are simple minded and naieve just like a child who can only comprehend issues of morality and ethics as something that's only two sided, that of black and white.

 

Geopolitics are open. When in Rome, do as the Romans. That's respectful. Trying to change the Romans from the inside without them knowing about it... changing their values by subterfuge is bad, no matter what country is doing it. This time round, it's China. We should be aware of it, call it out when it happens, and make our choices appropriately. We can't make educated decisions about our own futures and ethics if we can't see the little whisperings in our ear. And quit with the "simple minded naive" chatter... that's attempting to shoot the messenger rather than address the message, and those kind of tactics went out long ago.

[wasab]

2 minutes ago, msknight said:

Geopolitics are open. When in Rome, do as the Romans. That's respectful. Trying to change the Romans from the inside without them knowing about it... changing their values by subterfuge is bad, no matter what country is doing it. This time round, it's China. We should be aware of it, call it out when it happens, and make our choices appropriately. We can't make educated decisions about our own futures and ethics if we can't see the little whisperings in our ear. And quit with the "simple minded naive" chatter... that's attempting to shoot the messenger rather than address the message, and those kind of tactics went out long ago.

What's your point.... Are you still on the notion that china is an enemy and out to get you? Come on. Tencent's main market is china itself it would be stupid for them to publish contents that offend the Chinese public or it's government. 

[Stroal]

It's not just Epic games, it's also: 

Riot Games

Activision Blizzard

Ubisoft
Paradox interactive

Supercell

 

So hopefully all of you will not just boycott Epic, but also all the other companies Tencent has major steaks in. 

[msknight]

34 minutes ago, wasab said:

What's your point.... Are you still on the notion that china is an enemy and out to get you? Come on. Tencent's main market is china itself it would be stupid for them to publish contents that offend the Chinese public or it's government. 

The fact is that China is doing this, and it's doing it now.  Attempt to argue things like, "Meh, every body's done it throughout history," and other such arguments don't alter that fact; and only try to water down the facts of what happening.

[lewdicrous]

How many companies/studios is tencent investing in? Can you really avoid them, or any other investment company for that matter, at this point?

[wasab]

1 hour ago, msknight said:

The fact is that China is doing this, and it's doing it now.  Attempt to argue things like, "Meh, every body's done it throughout history," and other such arguments don't alter that fact; and only try to water down the facts of what happening.

I did not say everyone had done it, I said everyone is doing it, in full present tense. 

 

Thinking otherwise is naieve. 

[Guest]

9 hours ago, msknight said:

Because China IS the bad guy. And it DOES have an agenda. Rewriting history and pushing communist propaganda... unless you like living in that sort of world.

 

Games should have a choice about blood and gore... sure... an option in the menu to tone down the blood, as many games do. But for those that like these things, they won't have the choice.

 

All media we consume, plays a part in how we think. The propaganda is coming out of China and entering our world through the games we play and the media we consume. That's why it's a problem.

America does this quite a lot too. Most countries have propaganda. Even New Zealand, ever see an advert for a clean, green country, or 'pure NZ'? load of shit.