Rockstar North - Gets UK Subsidies & Avoids Paying Tax

[Anomnomnomaly]

So it seems that Rockstar North, based in Edinburgh Scotland got financial aid from the govt to the tune of £42 million, which is equal to 19% of the entire relief paid to the entire UK industry since it began in 2009... A relief scheme that is 'supposed' to be target at small medium sized businesses to support the UK's burgeoning games sector... specifically titles identified as culturally British'.

 

Tax Watch director George Turner told The Scotsman: "It is outrageous that the UK taxpayer is being asked to shell out tens of millions of pounds in subsidy to the developers of Grand Theft Auto, when at the time that the game's developers put in their tax credit application Grand Theft Auto V had already generated several billion dollars in sales and profits. The video games tax relief was designed to help developers of games with a cultural content that would struggle to sell in the international market. That such a large amount of that relief is going to the developers of Grand Theft Auto clearly shows that it is not working as intended."

 

Not only have they reaped in £42 million in tax relief/subsidies between 2015 & 2017... they paid £0 in corporation tax between 2009 and 2018... on revenues of £6 billion since 2013 on GTA V alone

 

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2019/07/29/rockstar/

 

 

The UK Video Game Tax Relief Scheme  https://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/03/28/games/

 

 

A report from investigate group Think Tank Watch  https://www.taxwatchuk.org/reports/gaming-the-tax-system/

 

 

So far Rockstar have refused to comment.

 

 

 

Now... given that this company has just announced that they are introducing the ability to spend real world cash in an in game casino... but cannot withdraw that money (if they win) to avoid laws in some countries (namely the UK, I can't be certain about others) that classify gambling as having 'real world value'... and also given that there is a growing backlash against tech companies who avoid taxes (by exploiting loopholes). I find this completely unacceptable, this is the worst kind of corporate greed and more akin to EA.

 

But the law as it stands allows these kinds of loopholes here in the UK....and I don't really want to start a political debate on how it's encouraged by certain political parties

 

 

I said in another post (regarding the gambling in casino thing) that Rockstar were rapidly becoming an equal to EA in terms of gaming companies you want to take out back and put out of their misery for the good of all gamers.... I'd like to adjust that statement a little... They are no different to EA anymore.

[jiyeon]

As a person who LIVES in Edinburgh, I am fuckin' fumin'.

 

Rockstar have become scum in the past couple of years thanks to their millionaire golden cash cow Grand Theft Auto Online...

 

Seriously, Rockstar North needs a swift kick in the ass, but props to them for just taking advantage for the disgustingly expoitable loopholes inside the Scottish Government...

[Totallycasual]

I blame the government and the laws for this kind of thing, corporations will always structure their activities for maximum profits and minimal tax exposure within the law and they will always take advantage of every subsidy under the sun.  Don't get me wrong, i hate what Rockstar has become since they abandoned the single player game and sold their soul for GTA Online profits but they're just doing what corporations do. 

 

It's on the government to close up these types of things and force corporations and super wealthy individuals to pay their fair share.  

[yolosnail]

I have absolutely no problem with what they're doing, if only because if I was in their situation I would do exactly the same thing.

What you have to remember is just because Rockstar North had a hand in making GTA V, doesn't mean that they'll be getting the money for it. If anything, Rockstar will be 'outsourcing' development to Rockstar North, and be putting the bare minimum into the company to cover the wages of the developers and nothing else. There is no 'loophole' to close, it's just the way their company is structured

And don't forget, those developers will be getting a fair few quid as well, which a fair bit will be paid as income tax

[greenhorn]

As @Newenthusiast said, the big problems here are the loopholes those companies are using. I also agree that doing this is despicable, but I am sure if the people who are responsible for the company's finances don't take advantage of those loopholes, they are very likely to get fired by the management for costing the company a lot of money (regardless of which course of action is ethical and which isn't)

[Anomnomnomaly]

No company should be able to get 'subsidies' or 'tax relief' that is equal to or greater than the corporation tax they pay. That just seems like common sense to me.

[ivan134]

"Free market" working as intended 

[Beskamir]

One could say they've pulled off a grand theft :P

[PlayStation 2]

That's called "working around broken tax laws".

They're written by corporations to rape the taxpayer but not the companies that could be contributing to it. Not a shock that R* is exploiting them to hell.

[Tristerin]

Also me in this thread:

3 minutes ago, Dan Castellaneta said:

That's called "working around broken tax laws".

They're written by corporations to rape the taxpayer but not the companies that could be contributing to it. Not a shock that R* is exploiting them to hell.

 

[Bcat00]

I don't see the issue here. If the fact that Rockstar could take such a huge sum shows that the country have almost no other developer so kudos to them for being smart. It's not like the other game companies couldn't apply, they just didn't or didn't even know about the program. if anyone is to blame its the government or department in charge of this program.

[CarlBar]

12 minutes ago, Bcat00 said:

I don't see the issue here. If the fact that Rockstar could take such a huge sum shows that the country have almost no other developer so kudos to them for being smart. It's not like the other game companies couldn't apply, they just didn't or didn't even know about the program. if anyone is to blame its the government or department in charge of this program.

 

From reading the article the EU is largely to blame. They ban any kind of subsidising of non-struggling industries. So they had to limit it to UK centric games. GTA squeaks in from what i cna see because it rather famously first started here in the UK, it;s effectively a UK brand even if the setting isn't UK.

[Noctus]

On 7/30/2019 at 2:27 PM, Anomnomnomaly said:

I said in another post (regarding the gambling in casino thing) that Rockstar were rapidly becoming an equal to EA in terms of gaming companies you want to take out back and put out of their misery for the good of all gamers.... I'd like to adjust that statement a little... They are no different to EA anymore.

@topic that is quite sickening, 42mil and 0 tax. Wish i had sort of free aid...

 

@quote, Not quite. They still actually make good games. Give it time i guess? I hope that doesn't happen =/

[mr moose]

Remember when aide was a charity donation to help people?   Now it's a tax loophole...