Navi/Ryzen 3000 launch Megathread

[mr moose]

14 minutes ago, D13H4RD said:

To be honest, even this showing is quite strong for me.

 

Did AMD kick the pants off Intel? Well, not entirely, but it made further gains at its strongest attribute and also nibbled at the difference between it and the equivalent Intel competition.

 

All-in-all, I think a price-drop from Intel might be on the cards, given that the only pedestals they can really stand on right now are clockspeeds (plus overclocking) and raw gaming performance (even that is becoming less significant).

And maybe a few very specific scenarios like some adobe workloads.  

 

 

[porina]

Intel have the brand and ability to charge more than AMD, in a similar way that nvidia does. They can't rest on that forever but I don't see them needing to do a short term adjustment as a direct response. That of course doesn't exclude they may choose to adjust pricing at any time, which is business as normal.

 

What AMD has to do is keep the hype up and get into the minds of ever more people. Not the enthusiast space we inhabit, but the masses are what they have to reach and there is still more work to be done there.

[mr moose]

7 minutes ago, porina said:

Intel have the brand and ability to charge more than AMD, in a similar way that nvidia does. They can't rest on that forever but I don't see them needing to do a short term adjustment as a direct response. That of course doesn't exclude they may choose to adjust pricing at any time, which is business as normal.

 

What AMD has to do is keep the hype up and get into the minds of ever more people. Not the enthusiast space we inhabit, but the masses are what they have to reach and there is still more work to be done there.

I can see Intel doing it simply to keep stock moving.  A minor adjustment to maintain everything else. 

[dgsddfgdfhgs]

i was really hoping they will have a 6c12t APU with gtx1060 perf lol

[porina]

7 minutes ago, mr moose said:

I can see Intel doing it simply to keep stock moving.  A minor adjustment to maintain everything else. 

It will be interesting to see what does happen. Does the 10nm production of mobile CPUs take some pressure off their fabs for 14nm parts? I don't know, are they still in constraint? Pricing certainly has relaxed somewhat. On a parallel note, I wonder what AMD's production capability is of their CPUs. It is still early days but I've yet to see stock of anything other than the 3600.

 

As a more wild thought, could we even get to a similar situation with DRAM/flash? The over-under supply cycles causing pricing to go up and down. 

[ZXR]

21 minutes ago, dgsddfgdfhgs said:

i was really hoping they will have a 6c12t APU with gtx1060 perf lol

That would be really sweet as a jumping off point before you can upgrade gpu.

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, CarlBar said:

And the bit you quoted from 12:59 is relevant to the reddit article how? The reddit article is explicitly about how it boosts to 4.6Ghz in workloads where it can do that, i.e lightly threaded. So how and why it boosts in a heavy all core load isn't especially relevant information to that discussion.

Because we don't actually know how lite it needs to be, the frequency over time graphs on GN show CPU cores hitting 4.6GHz then shortly after that dropping down. So yes in games the cores can hit 4.6GHz right now, briefly. Is that how it's supposed to be? Dunno.

 

What this information is saying is that 4.6GHz is not and has never been an all core turbo figure.

 

There is the 4.6GHz boost working, maybe or maybe not how it is supposed to but it's not not achieving 4.6GHz in games.

 

3 hours ago, CarlBar said:

What your saying about binning contradicts literally everything i've seen everyone else ever say on the subject...

No it doesn't, everyone correctly says what it is right until talking about server CPUs then proceed to assume server CPUs need the highest binned dies without actually thinking if this is the case and necessary. There are specific high clock variants of Xeons for example which cost more than SKUs with significantly more cores, why is that? Because those SKUs do require higher binned dies because they are significantly higher clocked and there are less high binned dies without memory controller faults or other issues specific to the requirements of a Xeon i.e. ECC. No matter how good or bad a die is if it fails ECC validation but passes everything else then it's fine for any non ECC SKU, if it's an appropriate die of course because HEDT doesn't use the HCC Xeon dies.

 

Zen2 doesn't have to worry about memory controller or other areas for the core complex die.

3 hours ago, CarlBar said:

This isn't just about how they OC but the stock power draw. if you go back to the chart from GN 3600 video where seeing stock draws of:

 

3600: 79.2

3700: 87

3900:147.6

 

From the 3600 to the 3700 the jump is waaaay lower than it should be, (same base clock, 33% more cores/threads and 4.7% boost clock jump but only 9.8% power usage jump).

 

Whilst the jump from the 3700 to 3900 displays weird behaviour too, (69% power spike for 50% more cores threads, a 5.5% higher base clock and a 4.5% higher boost clock).

This is correct and matches the TDP difference between those products. 3600 and 3700X are both 65W TDP and the 3900X is 95W. Two products with the same TDP and PPT limit will have the same power draw if both products are capable of hitting their maximum defined limits, the 3900X limits are set higher than both of these so will naturally be significantly higher because it's allowed to be.

 

I think what you want to see is a 3800X review, that's the 8 core 95W TDP part and may be more capable of achieving 4.6GHz in games due to more power headroom for each core compared to the 3900X and 3950X when that comes out.

[Shogunluffy_1982]

[That Franc]

The 65 watt 3700X made great SFF builds possible: it looks like it's sufficiently powerful, should perform well without overclocking, and can probably be cooled by a good 47mm tall air cooler. Looking forward to getting that thing, along with the Dan A4 case.

[dfsdfgfkjsefoiqzemnd]

5 hours ago, RejZoR said:

but how is my rather ancient 5820K at 4.5GHz on all cores stacking up against 3900X in games mostly?

No idea about games, but in synthetic benchmarks the Has-E is getting slaughtered. 

 

Kyle ran Cinebench R20 on his 3900X and got a score of 7168

I then ran R20 on my 5930K (@4.2GHz) and my score was 2750.  Granted, I can crank mine up to 4.6GHz if needed, but that's only going to give me 100 to 150 points extra. 

[leadeater]

17 minutes ago, Captain Chaos said:

No idea about games, but in synthetic benchmarks the Has-E is getting slaughtered. 

 

Kyle ran Cinebench R20 on his 3900X and got a score of 7168

I then ran R20 on my 5930K (@4.2GHz) and my score was 2750.  Granted, I can crank mine up to 4.6GHz if needed, but that's only going to give me 100 to 150 points extra. 

And I'm still on Ivy-E lol. 3800X I really want to see some reviews of.

[ThePD]

37 minutes ago, Captain Chaos said:

No idea about games, but in synthetic benchmarks the Has-E is getting slaughtered. 

 

Kyle ran Cinebench R20 on his 3900X and got a score of 7168

I then ran R20 on my 5930K (@4.2GHz) and my score was 2750.  Granted, I can crank mine up to 4.6GHz if needed, but that's only going to give me 100 to 150 points extra. 

Then there is me on a 5920K that won't go higher than 3.7 on all core without blue screening.

[D13H4RD]

3 hours ago, porina said:

Intel have the brand and ability to charge more than AMD, in a similar way that nvidia does. They can't rest on that forever but I don't see them needing to do a short term adjustment as a direct response. That of course doesn't exclude they may choose to adjust pricing at any time, which is business as normal.

 

What AMD has to do is keep the hype up and get into the minds of ever more people. Not the enthusiast space we inhabit, but the masses are what they have to reach and there is still more work to be done there.

Wouldn't be surprised if the rumored pricing adjustment for the desktop parts end up being the case

[dfsdfgfkjsefoiqzemnd]

12 minutes ago, ThePD said:

Then there is me on a 5920K that won't go higher than 3.7 on all core without blue screening

darn.  Oh well, at least you don't have to go through the same mess I'm dealing with right now. 

 

I did my run yesterday with Firefox, Skype etc open.  So when @leadeater quoted me half an hour ago I decided to kill all unnecessary tasks and gave it another run, resulting in 2842. 

I figured I'd see if I could hit 3K, so I rebooted into my BIOS and changed voltage and multiplier to what I know works just fine at 4.5GHz.  Unfortunately Win7 still had a pending update and that fails to install.  I ran a very thorough Disk Cleanup yesterday, perhaps that has something to do with it. 

Can't even boot into safe mode as that also hangs.  So much for this install.  Currently in Mint (yay for dualboot!) backing up my game files, not going to download 100+GB again. 

[porina]

20 minutes ago, D13H4RD said:

Wouldn't be surprised if the rumored pricing adjustment for the desktop parts end up being the case

I wasn't aware there was any rumour going around there.

 

Look at my sig. That's a lotta Intel CPUs I have, and not many AMD ones. Zen 2 I think is going to be the switching point for me, subject to testing for my specific use case once I get my hands on one... so I haven't been looking at Intel much recently. Since we're not expecting anything new on desktop any time soon from team blue, the only way they could keep my interest in the short term is if they can drop Cascade Lake into HEDT at lower than historic HEDT pricing, without crippling ram channels.

[Heesleemer]

Well time to upgrade from my x99

[porina]

This could be a major spoiler when combined with the half bandwidth writes. The testing I need to do just got a lot more complicated.

[Taf the Ghost]

2 minutes ago, porina said:

This could be a major spoiler when combined with the half bandwidth writes. The testing I need to do just got a lot more complicated.

The memory write bandwidth is going to be an interesting thing to explore. It was probably done for heat/power reasons (to keep the interconnect power down), but whether it was done at the design level or it's a binning choice (and thus Epyc will have symmetric bandwidth) remains to be seen.

[RejZoR]

1 hour ago, Captain Chaos said:

No idea about games, but in synthetic benchmarks the Has-E is getting slaughtered. 

 

Kyle ran Cinebench R20 on his 3900X and got a score of 7168

I then ran R20 on my 5930K (@4.2GHz) and my score was 2750.  Granted, I can crank mine up to 4.6GHz if needed, but that's only going to give me 100 to 150 points extra. 

Yeah, but that's just compute because of the multithreading. We all know games don't scale that way.

[CiBi]

Does 3800x and below only have one chiplet or do they use 2 with not al cores enabled?

[COTG]

17 minutes ago, CiBi said:

Does 3800x and below only have one chiplet or do they use 2 with not al cores enabled?

They use 2 chiplets

[porina]

50 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

The memory write bandwidth is going to be an interesting thing to explore. It was probably done for heat/power reasons (to keep the interconnect power down), but whether it was done at the design level or it's a binning choice (and thus Epyc will have symmetric bandwidth) remains to be seen.

Statement from AMD rep, taking from overclockers.com review:

Quote

“This is an expected result. Client workloads do very little pure writing, so the CCD/IOD link is 32B/cycle while reading and 16B/cycle for writing. This allowed us to save power and area inside the package to spend on other, more beneficial areas for tangible performance benefits.”

 

[Doobeedoo]

Neat. I've ye to see everything though. But so far what I've seen it's looking amazing. New build planned soon. 

[TVwazhere]

@LukeSavenije

 

Some more videos

Spoiler

Pauls Hardware:

 

GN separately Reviewed the 3900x (and will also do so for the 3700x, I'll let you decide if you want to include that or not)

 

After watching many of these videos, I've come to this conclusion:

 

Intel? Still best for gaming. But (now more than ever) if you do anything else on top of gaming; if you use photoshop or premire (surprisingly, premire works good on AMD now), if you stream, if you do CAD work (hi), if you work in a data center, if you like having money either to spend on other things or just save up for things like retirement, student loans, bills or whatever else life has to make you give them money, if you sneeze in between gaming sessions, then my recommendation is Ryzen 3000 (Especially that 3600. I agree with GN, best value in a CPU by far)

[rcmaehl]