Honda "Urban" EV - nearly done, new info

[cluelessgenius]

2 hours ago, justpoet said:

Since you asked about styling.  I personally loved my 2000 ZX2,... 

yeahh... i have to say thats gonna be tough sell for me personally. and i drive peugeot 307 which isnt famous for great design either. but at least i recognize thats its not that great lookin. 

1 hour ago, VanayadGaming said:

 

It's like saying why buy a mansion when a 1 bedroom apartment is at the same price? Uhm...because it is better? 

Don't get me wrong, I understand the need for small urban vehicles, but if they are priced in the model 3 category, and offer no advantage over it ...why would you buy it? Expect because it is smaller. 

It is the same story with the Nissan Leaf which is around 40k euros here. Compared to the entry model 3, it has worse range, it is not as safe, has worse battery longevity (how many charge cycles you can have), it performs worse in winter, it doesn't have any auto pilot features etc... Sure, if it would be 20k, I'd understand... but otherwise... for me, it doesn't make sense.

so the model 3 basic range veraion no extras at all is 47 k and the performance version STARTS at 67k. if this thing turns out to be 28k or lets say 25 for the most basic version... yada yada yada.. etc.... your point is invalid. 

[suicidalfranco]

Frankly for compact urban car, I think the design of the Audi A2 was one of the bests and still holds up to this day

[Bananasplit_00]

I think it's pretty decent, it's not the concept but nothing really ends up like the concept because reality is a thing. I think it would look a lot better in something that's not high vis yellow

[cluelessgenius]

Just now, suicidalfranco said:

Frankly for compact urban car, I think the design of the Audi A2 was one of the bests and still holds up to this day

yeah but it was also all aluminium body which is great for rust prevention but an absolute bitch to repair. and so noone wanted to pay the high prices and they just used normal steel to replace damaged parts and bipbapbup thats how you introduce rust. 

[suicidalfranco]

Just now, cluelessgenius said:

yeah but it was also all aluminium body which is great for rust prevention but an absolute bitch to repair. and so noone wanted to pay the high prices and they just used normal steel to replace damaged parts and bipbapbup thats how you introduce rust. 

Sure, still looks good though

[mihailc]

  

[3 Lions]

It looks like the modern day equivalent of the Hillman Imp...

 

 

[kokakolia]

1 hour ago, suicidalfranco said:

Frankly for compact urban car, I think the design of the Audi A2 was one of the bests and still holds up to this day

I like some of the newer compact urban cars a lot. I love the new Renault Twingo. The Suzuki Ignis is a close second for me. The Opel Adam is a beauty. 

 

The Citroen C3 and Suzuki Swift are beautifully designed as well, but bigger. 

 

IMHO, cars became overly aggressive and ugly with too many sharp lines around 2011. The Hyundai Accent is the worst offender. And it’s only recently that cars are becoming cute and pretty again. 

[VanayadGaming]

1 hour ago, cluelessgenius said:

so the model 3 basic range veraion no extras at all is 47 k and the performance version STARTS at 67k. if this thing turns out to be 28k or lets say 25 for the most basic version... yada yada yada.. etc.... your point is invalid. 

The post mentioned that the price might be in the range of 35k+ $, where the model 3 starts. That's what I was comparing. 

[poochyena]

I love seeing so many new electric cars being released and for decent pricing too. I hope to see more larger SUV type electric vehicles in the future for people like me who travel a lot.

[williamcll]

As long as it's better than the Nissan leaf its Good.

[kokakolia]

20 hours ago, floofer said:

I'd rather defecate into my hands and clap then buy this car. 

For people like you (your reaction is absolutely ridiculous, but I digress):

The Hyundai Kona EV is your typical "crossover" (i.e. a basic hatchback with extra plastic cladding for "ruggedness")... now in EV! The Kona EV and the Honda Urban EV should be priced around the same. 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, kokakolia said:

For people like you (your reaction is absolutely ridiculous, but I digress):

The Hyundai Kona EV is your typical "crossover" (i.e. a basic hatchback with extra plastic cladding for "ruggedness")... now in EV! The Kona EV and the Honda Urban EV should be priced around the same. 

How is my reaction ridiculous? Why would anyone pay the same amount for the Honda, with last-gen range and power? Hyundai are also behind. It’s not about the size of the car, but the dated tech. 

[leadeater]

2 hours ago, williamcll said:

As long as it's better than the Nissan leaf its Good.

The newest gen leaf is actually rather good on a technical level, still horrible looking though.

[ARikozuM]

Why is Honda making a Volkswagen Passat?

[cluelessgenius]

14 minutes ago, ARikozuM said:

Why is Honda making a Volkswagen Passat?

youre mixing something up. those 2 coudlnt be further apart

[ARikozuM]

5 minutes ago, cluelessgenius said:

youre mixing something up. those 2 coudlnt be further apart

I wouldn't say so. Looks pretty similar to me. 

 

Spoiler

 

[cluelessgenius]

26 minutes ago, floofer said:

How is my reaction ridiculous? Why would anyone pay the same amount for the Honda, with last-gen range and power? Hyundai are also behind. It’s not about the size of the car, but the dated tech. 

well some times "dated" means its been tested enough to be a solid reliable solution now. the bleeding edge of technology often times also means that youll get all the childhood sicknesses (dont know if that translates from german i mean early adopters problems and bugs). when its come to cars i need to be able to rely on mine to work. e.g. a bunch of audi etrons just recently had to be re-called cause of production problems in the battery pack leading to possible water damage and even "spontanious" combustion. and thats just the most recent example i could go on and on 

[cluelessgenius]

1 minute ago, ARikozuM said:

I wouldn't say so. Looks pretty similar to me. 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

? 

thats a totally different class of cars. the passat is a wagon. the honda is more the size of the polo. and design wise i dont see any thing similar at all

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, cluelessgenius said:

well some times "dated" means its been tested enough to be a solid reliable solution now. the bleeding edge of technology often times also means that youll get all the childhood sicknesses (dont know if that translates from german i mean early adopters problems and bugs). when its come to cars i need to be able to rely on mine to work. e.g. a bunch of audi etrons just recently had to be re-called cause of production problems in the battery pack leading to possible water damage and even "spontanious" combustion. and thats just the most recent example i could go on and on 

It’s tech from 2017 boss, been 3 years. This is Nissan not Audi. My dad has the Nissan since it came out and no problems at all. They are now used as Taxis for a reason. 

Have to have some cooling and wiring problems to keep the battery hot. Don’t forget these cars are designed and tested year(s) in advance.

[cluelessgenius]

6 minutes ago, floofer said:

It’s tech from 2017 boss, been 3 years. This is Nissan not Audi. My dad has the Nissan since it came out and no problems at all. They are now used as Taxis for a reason. 

Have to have some cooling and wiring problems to keep the battery hot. Don’t forget these cars are designed and tested year(s) in advance.

first off lets not make this into a thing alright? so dont call me boss. im not your bro, dude.

Secondly i work in the automotive industry. i see first hand on a daily basis what goes on at these companies. they are developed years in advance but testing alone isnt years. also they had pretty regular schedules with ICEs but with every manufacturer ive seen the whole electric plattform is done very fast and things get overlooked regularly. 

so excuse me if your dad had one without issues. of course that makes you the most knowledgable person in the room on this topic. im not saying anything against nissan.

im saying id rather drive a more grown plattform then the newest shit available. and right now... no manufacturer of electric vehicles has their shit fully figured out. its just to early for that. 3 years is nothing. development on a car takes huge amounts of time and again i rather get iteration 6 or 7 instead of mark 1.

 

in the long run i think none of this is gonna matter anyway. voices from the industry suggest that electric isnt the main goal. maybe for small city cars like this honda the technology is gonna stay but for everything else all signs point to hydrogen fuell cells. i would guess as early as 2025 in europe. look at asia they are already doing it. europe and especially germany just has a plug up its but because some big battery manufacturer put it there. not gonna name anyone. 

 

but again im not gonna get gen 1 of those either. or 2 or 3. that shit needs to be ripe first.

[TechyBen]

23 hours ago, starcoaster said:

this isn't an open road car, it's a city car designed for the traffic-light grand prix. you wouldn't take a smart car on country roads and expect to enjoy it

I use to take a Smart Car out on country roads... I use to "enjoy" it. 

 

 

(Ok, I use to scream for my life... it's like flying by the seat of your pants... those pot holes/humps in the road could take you into the sky!!!)

[cluelessgenius]

2 minutes ago, TechyBen said:

I use to take a Smart Car out on country roads... I use to "enjoy" it. 

 

 

(Ok, I use to scream for my life... it's like flying by the seat of your pants... those pot holes/humps in the road could take you into the sky!!!)

exactly. i would compare it like this. there is a fiat 500 thats a 60 Hp town car to get groceries but theres also an abarth 595 with in some cases 200+ HP in the otherwise almost same chassis. and that thing i absolutly want to take out on the road. i just really hoped somebody would make the electric version of that but instead all we get are fiat 500's and huge SUVs. those arent any fun on the back road.

[Guest]

45 minutes ago, cluelessgenius said:first off lets not make this into a thing alright? so dont call me boss. im not your bro, dude.

It’s not a thing, meant nothing by it. Colloquialism, my apologies. Tbh I don’t say ‘bro’ or ‘dude’. Actually makes me a bit riled, but it’s a different story.

45 minutes ago, cluelessgenius said:

Secondly i work in the automotive industry. i see first hand on a daily basis what goes on at these companies. they are developed years in advance but testing alone isnt years. also they had pretty regular schedules with ICEs but with every manufacturer ive seen the whole electric plattform is done very fast and things get overlooked regularly. 

so excuse me if your dad had one without issues. of course that makes you the most knowledgable person in the room on this topic. im not saying anything against Nissan.

I know I’m not the most knowledgeable person about this, never said I was. I’m not saying you aren’t smart either, sorry if it came across that way. However certain standards are applied differently for each manufacturer, with a different design process. Batteries are hard to get right and Nissan have more r&d, it’s simple as that. Nissan aren’t new, neither are electric cars, and recalls have happened. 

45 minutes ago, cluelessgenius said:

im saying id rather drive a more grown plattform then the newest shit available. and right now... no manufacturer of electric vehicles has their shit fully figured out. its just to early for that. 3 years is nothing. development on a car takes huge amounts of time and again i rather get iteration 6 or 7 instead of mark 1.

I think the first leaf came out in 2010, and electric motors are nothing new, it’s the 110Kw and 35kwh (which is debatable) that are old specs, and certainly nothing impressive. You’d only buy this car for looks and comfort, and that’s certainly needing to be tested buy the reviewers on launch. 

45 minutes ago, cluelessgenius said:

in the long run i think none of this is gonna matter anyway. voices from the industry suggest that electric isnt the main goal. maybe for small city cars like this honda the technology is gonna stay but for everything else all signs point to hydrogen fuell cells. i would guess as early as 2025 in europe. look at asia they are already doing it. europe and especially germany just has a plug up its but because some big battery manufacturer put it there. not gonna name anyone. 

Electric is 100% the future. It’s simply the access is already there, many other companies are catching onto the trend, the money is there for the market, and that’s what will drive it. 

45 minutes ago, cluelessgenius said:

but again im not gonna get gen 1 of those either. or 2 or 3. that shit needs to be ripe first.

The 2020 leaf, hopefully released this year is the fourth generation. But I get your point, the range of current gen is too small to be viable for many situations and the hydrogen fuel cell is a great idea, but electric cars are the way forward, simply due to the market, of course however no one can see the future, but almost everywhere there’s an electric car fast charger coming etc, and new ads on tv, even electric cars going up in price due to demand in some countries. 

 

I don’t want you to get me wrong on this, I do like cars, I am passionate, but I can be very blunt, stubborn and defining quite rude, and I do apologise. I do appreciate the op and replies and fully understand the concept of a cool wee hatch with a little pep. This won’t be a bad car, far from it, but they could do a lot better. It’s a cool design and the people who are into the 90s civic would especially like it, there’s still a few floating around and they can be quite cool with no power or performance. Just not for me.

[cluelessgenius]

56 minutes ago, floofer said:

Batteries are hard to get right and Nissan have more r&d

nissan is actualy one of the few companies i dont get to work with. do they do their own batteries. seeing the rest of the industry im having a hard time believing that. everyones sourcing them right now. some companies of course are too cheap about it and are working on opening their own manufacturing since battery manufacturers have obviously used the situation to their advantage and increased prices alot.

 

1 hour ago, floofer said:

I think the first leaf came out in 2010, and electric motors are nothing new, it’s the 110Kw and 35kwh (which is debatable) that are old specs, and certainly nothing impressive. You’d only buy this car for looks and comfort, and that’s certainly needing to be tested buy the reviewers on launch. 

exactly my point . sure the motor are not the biggest liability right now. although there is room for improvement. right now though batteries are more of a concern and that why i would prefer this basic model over those that try to crank the last bit of performance out of them. but then again with basic models they are always trying to cut corners and cheapp out on parts as much as possible so there that risk again.

i guess im waiting for something mass produced. like once they sell vw golf levels then i might trust them. but ultimativly i think i might stay away from batteries completly and just wait for fuel cells. 

heres a little insight right from my work desk that theoretically is public knowledge if you know where to look so i hope im not imcriminating myself here

right now the whole industry is working on splitting up ecu software into as much litllte services as possible. moving from can and flexray communication protocols to automotive ethernet kinda already suggested that. so in the future seperate parts of the software can be upgraded. heres the kicker. you know how every bigger car manufaturer tries to do everything themselves? sure now they are slowly moving to android auto and apple carplay for example but remember how they all had/have their own stupid implementation of a navigation system or voice recognition and shit like that? well there will come a time where you buy a car and then subscribe to the performance package for a monthly fee and if you dont they just kill that part of the softwtware or replace it. almost all new cars come with always online tracking modules anyway so updates on the fly like tesla does are no problem anymore. you want extra HP ? sure pay your bills. you want AC? sure pay your bills? basically car manufacturers are dreaming of doing to cars what EA does to video games for years now.

at that point i think i might just stick with the regular dumb cars

1 hour ago, floofer said:

Electric is 100% the future. It’s simply the access is already there, many other companies are catching onto the trend, the money is there for the market, and that’s what will drive it. 

ok i think i phrased that wrong. electric yes. batteries no. the infrastructure isnt there yet. theres no way to charge a car in most cases around here. i think my city (which isnt that small) has maybe 2 public charging stations and anyone living in an apartment building has to rely on the land lord to install chargers which they dont and honestly cant because installing even 20 chargers would need major involvement from the local energy provider and still not even be close enough to covering all people in the building. so going 100% electric i think just isnt feasable with todays technology. 

fuel cells on the other hand would allow for re-using the existing gas station network because hydrogen gas (im not exactly sure thats what that translates to but you knwo what i mean) is pumpable almost just like normal gas now. its also very easy to make with just water and energy and right now we have tons of energy wasted becasue its not need every single moment from for example wind turbines which theres a ton of around here. so we could just have them use the excess in energy to produce fuel around the clock. its basically just a way of transporting the power from the plant to the car by binding it in water. and in the car youd have a motor closer to the traditional ICE that unbinds the power from the water and power the ELECTRIC motor BUT no batteries. no people dying in lithium mining. no battery degradation for the customer. and no exhaust gases at all ...well water but like...come on

1 hour ago, floofer said:

but electric cars are the way forward, simply due to the market,

nah they are a middle ground. a stepping stone to make people more simpathetic too alternative ideas. to make them understand that new can also be fun. but getting everyone on batteries just isnt feasable. by that i mean the delivery to the car. electric motors sure. but not by pumping current from the plant into your car. the amount of power line upgrade alone... at least the biggest manucterers here like audi and mercedes and those are all just doing the bare minimum that the state requires them to do to comply with regulations. most brands have like 1 big e car and then maybe another ultra small version for the city. they need to somehow lower the emissions across their whole lineup so they kinda have to go electric right now. i mean look at ...who was it again...i believe fiat recently joined into some weird alliance with tesla where they pay tesla a bunch of money and for that they now act under one umbrella and are allowed to count teslas e cars into fiats emission track record so their numbers look better. tesla is basically selling emission points.

1 hour ago, floofer said:

This won’t be a bad car, far from it, but they could do a lot better. It’s a cool design and the people who are into the 90s civic would especially like it, there’s still a few floating around and they can be quite cool with no power or performance. Just not for me.

yeah again for me this goes more agianst the vw polos of this world and i would have also really loved to have them rival the golf gti's out there. 

 

also no hard feelings at all. im just a bit sensitve nicknmes and shit because i feel like no matter how friendl they are ment theres alwas also an undertone of disrespect.

again we cool i didnt mean to be mean and i didnt take anything you said to be mean spirited. we good.