DIY or buy an APC backup power

[aradioactivesquirrel]

I need more Power! 

So plugging my desktop into the wall is not enough when i'm gaming with my overclocked pc. Power keeps shutting of at random becuase my dad has wiring that will make you cringe...

so....i need an APC power backup that will sustain my 750 watt when the power shuts off. Alot of people who have power backups say their pc shuts down immediately. I need an APC that will give me power even when their is no power in my house. No delay but a constant "i got you continue gaming" power backup supply for a expensive OC Desktop is needed. 

 

Should i Make my own using a power inverter a battery and a battery charger?

 

Input anyone?

 

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Regards,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                 :)

 

[Curious Pineapple]

You'll get nowhere making your own with a battery charger

[aradioactivesquirrel]

why is that Mr.Pineapple?

[mariushm]

You'll need an always on UPS ... it's an UPS that basically powers the inverter inside always from batteries and using the input AC voltage just to top up the batteries.

At the very least, you'll want Line Interactive UPS but the best solution for you is Always On

 

Figure out how much power your system actually consumes, if you have a 750w psu, it doesn't mean your PC consumes 750w when you're gaming. 

 

If your PC truly consumes 750w, you'd need at least a 1200-1500VA UPS which are more expensive.

[aradioactivesquirrel]

i found one just like that but without a battery for 50$ I am good with IMR batteries. What if i buy the APC and put a Bank of IMR batteries. Perhaps i should buy that unit and get a new battery replacement.

 

https://www.pcliquidations.com/p15050-apc-bx1500-back-ups?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cse&utm_term=15050&r160164167166161&gclid=Cj0KCQjw9JzoBRDjARIsAGcdIDU05KcHg_8jRjl8MIaBulv-oom2Au07u3uYGzjfzZI2BJsgGAq0c9QaAhu_EALw_wcB

[kpluck]

I have been using APC UPSs for years and never had a computer that was connected to one shutdown during an outage.

 

-kp

[aradioactivesquirrel]

what APC are you using? Just curious.

[Curious Pineapple]

25 minutes ago, aradioactivesquirrel said:

why is that Mr.Pineapple?

You need at minimum 100 AMP available, that's one big ass battery charger.

 

You could have an old server power supply connected to batteries and then to an inverter. One of them 2.2KW hotswap HP ones may do it. When supply fails it will run from batteries. It will never fully charge them though so lifespan will be shortened.

[aradioactivesquirrel]

WHy such a big charger if i see these very small all in one APC's rated at  900 watts. they include battery battery charger all inside the unit.

[Curious Pineapple]

Just now, aradioactivesquirrel said:

WHy such a big charger if i see these very small all in one APC's rated at  900 watts. they include battery battery charger all inside the unit.

Depends on the voltage of the batteries. They may be able to output 900w, but if running off a 12v battery thats 95 amp peak. Even a large car battery will give you 15-20 minutes most at that current draw.

[mariushm]

The UPS you linked to is a line-interactive UPS .... it can only power the system from batteries for a limited time, which varies depending on the total capacity of the batteries.

 

The transformer inside such a UPS is designed to charge up the batteries at a slow pace, it's a small, cheap transformer.  For example, let's say your computer consumes 500w while you're playing games and your mains power fails - the UPS will start using the batteries to produce AC voltage and will discharge the batteries in around 10-20 minutes.

When power comes back, it will take up to 10-15 hours for the batteries to recharge to full capacity.

 

That BackUPS you linked to says it can do up to 865w  but the battery that comes with I think it's only 9Ah one - at something like 500-600w it will discharge fully in less than 3-5 minutes.

As the description says, it will then take around 6 hours to charge up that 9Ah battery.

With such UPSes it's debatable if you can actually increase the battery capacity by a huge amount, like replacing the smaller battery inside with those two bigger batteries on the outside.

The reason is to save costs, that transformer that tops up the batteries is often undersized, not designed to charge batteries for very long times. For example, they know the absolute maximum charge time is around 7 hours or so and they also know most of the time the batteries will not be fully discharged (you get a power loss for around 10s..1m discharging the batteries to around 80%, and the UPS only has to charge from 80% to 100% in around 1-2h), so they use wires thick enough, insulated well enough that the transformer can survive being overheated for let's say 10-12 hours.

If you install much bigger batteries, the transformer could stay hot for much more than 6-8 hours, much more than even 10-12 hours, and eventually that undersized transformer could burn up.

 

 

You can make something like  AC voltage -> 12v or 24v power supply (that can produce as much as what your computer needs PLUS around 10-20%) -> batteries -> DC to AC inverter to produce AC for the computer.

You can wire your batteries in series to have 24v and you'll need around 26v for the batteries (a 24v power supply can be produced to output a bit more)

You can find inverters that work using 24v, so you can convert 24v back to AC.

 

This way you basically make your own Always On UPS.

 

But it's important to figure out exactly how much your computer actually consumes, as I explained.

If your computer only consumes up to 300-400w when gaming, then maybe you can use only a 500-600w 12/24v power supply to charge the batteries or power the inverter, instead of spending money on a higher wattage power supply or transformer.

 

 

[mr moose]

12 minutes ago, aradioactivesquirrel said:

WHy such a big charger if i see these very small all in one APC's rated at  900 watts. they include battery battery charger all inside the unit.

Because the charger needs to power the inverter and trickle charge the batteries at the same time if you want always on,  smaller UPS's usually kill the batteries over few years (due to poor charging and drain cycles) and can only power a 900W load for 5 minutes at best (that's why they shut down the PC straight away).

[aradioactivesquirrel]

i have money and i really want to build my own. I need a list of parts. So i need a power inverter, a battery(Or battery bank via IMR), and a charger....

 

Here is a 24v power inverter. Think its good/

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Portable-Car-LED-Power-Inverter-WATT-DC-12V-24V-to-AC-110V-Charger-Converter-Lot/202541156890?hash=item2f2864ca1a:m:mf8mWbXMw-VjxVsmTCPVEMA

[mariushm]

They're generally shit.

The cheaper ones have simulated sine wave output, which is a way to cheaply produce AC voltage. A lot of modern computer power supplies don't like such AC output so it's best to go with slightly better inverters which output pure sine wave AC.

 

With those cheap inverters, expect one rated for 500w to not output more than 300w continuously.

 

Don't expect a decent inverter rated for 500w or more for less than 100$.

 

 

[aradioactivesquirrel]

then i can use a voltage stabilizer

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ge-9T91B4090-Voltage-Stabilizing-Transformer-30va-95-130v-ac-120v-ac/292825968453?epid=1158050269&hash=item442dc9af45:g:hd0AAOSwVEFb9H~4

[scottyseng]

I'm also going to say you should get a UPS unit...you need to be able to switch from live power to battery power instantly to not have the connected devices turn off.

 

I use an Eaton UPS myself, but cyberpower makes great bang for the buck units.

[mariushm]

27 minutes ago, aradioactivesquirrel said:

then i can use a voltage stabilizer

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ge-9T91B4090-Voltage-Stabilizing-Transformer-30va-95-130v-ac-120v-ac/292825968453?epid=1158050269&hash=item442dc9af45:g:hd0AAOSwVEFb9H~4

A voltage stabilizer won't help and it doesn't do what you think it does.

A voltage stabilizer basically constantly monitors the AC voltage and switches between multiple secondary taps of a transformer inside so that you'll always have around 110v AC on the output. It doesn't improve the waveform of the AC output. In addition to that, cheap "voltage stabilizers" can only handle an amount of power, like for example the one in the link above is rated for 30VA which is more or less around 15-20w of usable power in the world of power supplies. It's enough for a clock, a radio/cd player, maybe a laptop, that's about it. 

Also, computer power supplies DON'T CARE about maximum voltage, they're designed to work with wide input range, like 90v .. 250v AC, but they don't like the SHAPE of the AC output.  Here's something i made in a few seconds in paint to explain what i mean.

Most modern power supplies take the input energy and convert it inside to something like 400..420v DC anyway, and then convert that to 12v or other voltages... but they don't like as much the jaggies, the stair effect below...

 

 

 

[aradioactivesquirrel]

im just going to buy this:

https://www.google.com/shopping/product/12176223363689325718?lsf=seller:7933,store:13786900072090849173,s:h&prds=oid:6363226702029305889&q=apc+battery+backup&hl=en&ei=TBoIXbO4O9K50PEPjNWk6AM&lsft=cm_mmc:PLA-_-Google-LIA-_-1596097357-_-9817382-VQ6-303400250326-VQ16-c-VQ17-pla-VQ18-local-VQ20-464313711107-VQ21-940&lsft=gclid:Cj0KCQjw9JzoBRDjARIsAGcdIDUKIoWhzmr41TnGP14LTZ9s5AdAOU9_Cno02lusoSuq7VGMYX3ySbwaAmU5EALw_wcB,gclsrc:aw.ds

[kpluck]

18 hours ago, aradioactivesquirrel said:

what APC are you using? Just curious.

 

Currently, a APC Back-UPS 900. I have been working from home for a couple of years (work for a printing company) and my main system is an iMac, it doesn't have a big draw. At the plant we use a variety of their UPSs.

 

I have also used a CyberPower unit which I never had any problems with although it was a number of years ago and I don't recall ever going through a power loss with it.

 

-kp