Apple is misundertanding the "pro" market

[Drak3]

6 minutes ago, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

It's kinda part of my job

So you keep claiming.

 

I can claim to rule the world, doesn't make it true.

6 minutes ago, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

you know?

Actually, we don't. There is zero reason to believe it.

[Evanair]

I dunno where you're getting you're figures from, but this isn't even half of what Apple is offering in terms of spec.

[Riccardo Cagnasso]

7 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

So you keep claiming.

 

I can claim to rule the world, doesn't make it true.

Actually, we don't. There is zero reason to believe it.

Fine, believe what you want.

I'm here lying about the fact that workstation grade computers have ~25% discount from list pricing from wholesale suppliers.

I think that it would be the most boring trolling ever, but fine. I cannot prove it of course because these are somewhat relatively confidential information.

So, whatever.

[Drak3]

Just now, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

I'm here lying about the fact that workstation grade computers have ~25% discount from list pricing from wholesale suppliers.

Some of us know that. But you seem so insistant that

1. These third party suppliers don't have Apple selling equivalents
2. Apple doesn't do corporate discounts

Both of which, are wrong. Not only that, but in an apples to apples comparison, first party vs first party, Apple is right in line as far as costs go.

3 minutes ago, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

these are somewhat relatively confidential information.

Convenient.

[Riccardo Cagnasso]

Just now, Drak3 said:

Some of us know that. But you seem so insistant that

1. These third party suppliers don't have Apple selling equivalents
2. Apple doesn't do corporate discounts

Both of which, are wrong. Not only that, but in an apples to apples comparison, first party vs first party, Apple is right in line as far as costs go.

Convenient.

I never said that third-party suppliers don't sell apple. Two of my three suppliers sell apple stuff and I have bought some in the past. I never said that Apple doesn't do corporate discount. I've said that for what I can see, discount on Apple hardware is "negligible", < 10%, up to tens of units. Don't know about hundreds.

And if you know how the whole wholesale business work, you know perfectly well that I cannot just take a screenshot of the listing prices and post it here. So, convenient or not, this is the truth.

[imcaspar]

9 minutes ago, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

Fine, believe what you want.

I'm here lying about the fact that workstation grade computers have ~25% discount from list pricing from wholesale suppliers.

I think that it would be the most boring trolling ever, but fine. I cannot prove it of course because these are somewhat relatively confidential information.

So, whatever.

I do fully believe you. But it doesn't change anything about this discussion.

 

The prebuilt systems from Dell or Lenovo or HPE for the same userbase and task as the Mac Pro don't cost less.

 

Yes, it is easily possible to have better performance for a lower price - but this isn't how Enterprise Compute Markets Work.

[Drak3]

2 minutes ago, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

never said that third-party suppliers don't sell apple. Two of my three suppliers sell apple stuff and I have bought some in the past. I never said that Apple doesn't do corporate discount. I've said that for what I can see, discount on Apple hardware is "negligible", < 10%, up to tens of units. Don't know about hundreds.

You've repeatedly dismissed the notion of Apple having corporate discounts. You also effectively said that Apple's prices aren't comparable because of third party suppliers.

 

4 minutes ago, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

And if you know how the whole wholesale business work, you know perfectly well that I cannot just take a screenshot of the listing prices and post it here.

That's a load of bullshit. Maybe, maybe, one or two companies work this way. It's not an industry wide thing.

 

5 minutes ago, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

So, convenient or not, this is the truth.

No reason to believe you. At all.

[Riccardo Cagnasso]

 

 

1

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

You've repeatedly dismissed the notion of Apple having corporate discounts. You also effectively said that Apple's prices aren't comparable because of third party suppliers.

Lol no. I have said that apple corporate discount are neglibile. That means that I acknowledged they exists. 

You are here accusing me of lying and yeat you don't really seem to have read what i'm saying.

[Curious Pineapple]

This forum gets better every day

[Drak3]

4 minutes ago, Riccardo Cagnasso said:

Lol no. I have said that apple corporate discount are neglibile. That means that I acknowledged they exists. 

You are here accusing me of lying and yeat you don't really seem to have read what i'm saying.

You copped out AFTER someone had said that Apple does have corporate discounts.

Before that:

 

[Riccardo Cagnasso]

 

 

 

32 minutes ago, Evanair said:

I dunno where you're getting you're figures from, but this isn't even half of what Apple is offering in terms of spec.

 

I'm comparing to the LOWEST mac pro.
A Lenovo Thinkstation with a Xeon W-2133, 32 GB ECC, 512 GB SSD, Quadro P4000 8GB (which should be quote more powerful that the Radeon Pro 580X) is 2500$.
Le'ts throw in 500$ for the new, same level xeon of the mac pro (which will probably come at the same price, but whatever).
It's 3000$ for the same machine! From the lenovo site.

Even if I'm lying about the fact that lenovo workstation have better discount wholesale, it's still 2000$+ less that the identically specced macpro.

[Riccardo Cagnasso]

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

You copped out AFTER someone had said that Apple does have corporate discounts.

Before that:

 

 

 

Yeah. Meaning that apple won't do 25-30-35-40% discounts on their hardware. The sentence was ambiguous and then i corrected it.
Your point?

[Curious Pineapple]

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

You copped out AFTER someone had said that Apple does have corporate discounts.

Before that:

 

Maybe, just maybe he meant that wholesale suppliers don't have discounts for Apple products.

[Drak3]

Just now, Curious Pineapple said:

Maybe, just maybe he meant that wholesale suppliers don't have discounts for Apple products.

In which case, he still doesn't know what he's talking about in regards to Apple's corporate discounts.

[Riccardo Cagnasso]

1 minute ago, Drak3 said:

In which case, he still doesn't know what he's talking about in regards to Apple's corporate discounts.

Or, as I just said, my mind didn't consider the apple discount relevant because it's negligible.
So I didn't mention it and when someone pointed to it later, I explained it. 
Again, your point?

[WkdPaul]

* Thread locked *

 

Unfortunately, the discussion turned to useless bickering. Since I participated in the discussion, I will leave the moderation to the other mods (apart from this thread lock).